Sosuave Lunatics

[JdelaSilviera]

Too bad these guys never met a decent hot girl (and there are many, and I could also explain why this happens much more often that you might think), that likes you because of your character , it´s just shows how weak your social knowledge is.

F283000 you are one of the most reasonable/smart guys here, but I wouldn´t consider strangers that want to add you on facebook, as options. If you were to put things in that perspective than everybody has options.

I do know girls that don´t have ANY guy pursuing them, who are always asking me to meet my friends.

Anyway this thread is about guys that repeat themselves every post they make with big lies. Next time you see don, nismo or megaman, who always write the same stuff, independently of the subject, you can come back to this thread and read the first page.

When people grow up, and I´m telling about serious LTRs, not college one night stands, there are many many factors, that are more taken into account than looks, and it´s not fame or money.

And for you I can also say, that I´ve seen with my own eyes, a soccer good looking celebraty from Real Madrid being rejected by an average girl (my cousins friend). Most women are much more worthwhile than you think.

 

[perseverance]

There is so much bitterness, pessimism and misogyny that anyone asking for advice is pretty much screwed.

The sweeping generalisations on this forum are disgusting and not only that it brings my mood down just by reading a few of the topics.

I'd rather be an AFC anyday than a bitter, old, misognist who hates himself, his life and everybody else.

Not all women are the same, just as not all men are the same. This entire site and all the articles on it apart from Pook's is a load of crock. Useless.

I wouldn't recommend this site to anyone having problems with women. It's the same BS churned out time after time by the same people who have forgotten how to live life.

 

[zekko]

What is bad are the men's reactions to the assertation that women ARE hypergamous. Many just flat out refuse to acknowledge that fact.

Look, if guys actually believe women are Disney princesses, they get what they deserve. Nothing else in life is like a Disney movie, why should women be?

I don't mean guys who are on their first love or something, who don't have any experience, I'd cut them some slack. But beyond that it shouldn't take long for cold hard reality to smack you in the face.

By the way, yeah I post too much on here too. I suppose there are worse bad habits to have. I live with my girlfriend of eight years, so no field reports from me either. My plate spinning days are long behind me, but I've always found the topic of attraction and how it works fascinating, so that's why I spend time here. Even though I'm not actively gaming and have never considered myself a superstud, I think I must have learned a thing or two from my experiences with women over my 50 years.

Really, for myself, I usually find field reports incredibly dull. It's usually stuff like "I was grinding with this girl in the club, but it was too loud, and she left before I could get her number. I then opened this three set. An HB7 wanted me to buy her a drink but I told her she had to buy me one first".
Bleh. I'd rather hear about the underlying principles honestly.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

Wow, this thread is almost right on time. You see, at least once, sometimes twice a year the "Sosuave-has-gone-to-hell" thread makes it's predictable appearance. I will admit, we're a little early this year. Last year it was on the 4th of July. So lets pick it up again shall we?


NEO: "There's no going back now is there?

MORPHEUS: "No. But if you could, would you really want to?"

Was ignorance bliss before you sought out this community? No person both frightens and disgusts me more than one who understands truth, but willfully opts for denial. It's not the desire to do so that disgusts me, I understand the desire, it's that there is no going back. Even if you never read another post or blog and regressed back to your old ways, you'll still make the associations, see the signs of what others have analyzed in your own periphery, in women's and the world's behaviors and motivations, and you'll be reminded of that truth (or at least the uncomfortable push to get at the truth). You will only get what you've gotten if you keep doing what you've done. There is no going back now.

Don't wish it were easier. Wish you were better.

There comes a point of conflict (or revulsion if you want) after a guy has been unplugged from the Matrix long enough where he begins to doubt himself and what he's seeing go on around him. All of the gender dynamics and the complex, but discreet, interplay between the sexes that's been such a mystery for so long starts to become apparent to him. The Neg Hits he never would've dreamed of attempting in his AFC days become so predictably reliable at sparking interest that it becomes depressing. A backhanded compliment shouldn't work; it goes against everything any girl has ever told him will endear him to a woman, but once he musters up the courage to experiment, he finds that they do.

What's depressing isn't that a well delivered neg could actually generates interest, it's the principle behind the neg - the reason why it works - that prompts the conflict. Are women, generally, more like this than not? So he experiments a little more, and tests other theories, and discovers that with some minor variations, yes, for the most part the principles are valid. This then becomes a real tough pill to swallow, especially when you consider ideas like feminine hypergamy. It's very hard to measure oneself up and adjust to a new understanding of how women operate. He can't reconcile what he'd been told and conditioned to believe before (the soul mate myth, pedestalize her, just be yourself, etc.) with this new paradigm. So either he learns to live with this new understanding, benefit from it and grow into a new role for himself, or he rejects it and vilifies it wholesale.

"Women are really not as bad as these misogynists, these bitter, burned men would all have us believe. They're shallow and soulless to think women are all out to get them. They over-analyze everything when they should all just be themselves and let fate or some divine force pair them up with their soul mates. I pity them, really I do."

I've heard all of these regressive rationales from boys as young as 14 to men as old as 75. It's a comfortable ignorance to believe that things are just unknowable and beyond one's control or efforts to really understand. And to make matters worse, there's a long established system of social conventions ready to reinforce and affirm these rationales; ready to reinsert him back into the Matrix and tell him he's unique and special ("not like other guys") and will be rewarded with female intimacy for rejecting it.

 

[JdelaSilviera]

Let´s cut the crap, this site is filled with guys that are unsuccessful with women, most have been unsuccessful and will continue to be if their mindset doesn´t change.

It strikes me that anyone believes that the guys who have less success, are the ones who understand women better, and everyone else is living in disney fantasy world

Women are hard, (as men) with weak minded people, shy, aproval, seeking guys. I don´t care if you think you were ****y and funny, your face, and the tone of your voice, most probably showed the panic and fear of being rejected. Before you get to women, you must learn to socialize with man also, wich probably many don´t.

So we have this scenario: a social awkward guy, that comes here regularly and realized he has problems with women, approaching women he doesn´t know, and delivering a neg or to, while being totally incongruent with his body language. This for cold approach.

Now, we have also guys, that will try to hook up with a friend (wich is said hereto be mission impossible while the world says otherwise), or a colleague from work. He won´t be in the moment, he will always be thinking on sosuave and how hard is to get women, he will be thinking that he must act cool and neg her, even if she does random sh*t that everyone does, it is always a sh*t test, trying to remove his alphaness....

MOST GUYS HERE are like that, so no wonder you fail, because you become completly paranoid.

Now let´s look at how bad women are:

- they are attracted to men who neg them
If the neg works, not only shows there is a lack of self esteem and mental balance, as also the relationship will fail. And many guys don´t know other way to get women, besides negging, being ****y etc.. it won´t last long.
But what about men, many men are also attracted to women who neg, reject, play hard to get etc.. there is zero difference-

- Women are hypergamous
Men are worse, men are poli and hypergamous, because everyone in theory wants the best he can get. But life plays trick on us, and you fall in love (yeah guys love exists), with the person you least expect, many, many times.

- Women have more power of choice
Women may have more guys, pursuing them, but the reallity is that you can approach 300 girls if you want, while they have to chose between those who are after them, because they lack courage to approach, this is really well known.

And no their life is not easier, because they also have compete with other women that can steal their guys.They can´t play you for so long because they know there are a lot of girls out there, so they must be careful.

 

[JdelaSilviera]

Jdela,

I don't think anyone disagrees with most of your post.

But as you warn of making sweeping presumptions of women, one should also be careful of making sweeping presumptions of men on this site. While I do agree that the majority have trouble with women (christ, that is how they found this site).....It is a huge error in judgement to assume that all cannot get women. Or to even assume that people who have a large number of posts or few FR's are incapable of getting laid.

Also, while I often state how women are hypergamous, that is not meant as a negative moniker and something to hate them for. Therefore it is meaningless to come back with a childish "well men are like....blah blah blah".

The point of stating and recognizing the hypergamy is so that men can adapt and treat them accordingly.

Hi Danger, so much has been written, that I didn´t even read your previous posts, so this was not for you.

I know there is some decent advice here, and some guys are good with women, but that´s just about 1% of the users.

About hypergamy, whenever I read it, always comes with a tone of victimization... that´s why I made a comparison with men in general.

 

[Solomon]

Hmmmm. Over 1000 posts and no FR's for probably 2 years and yet, I have a great girlfriend who is begging me to marry her.

Nice attempt at shaming though. The old fallback method.....If you disagree with what they say, then insult them.

Hey If arguing about if women are shallow, or not that bad or whatever crap you guys are arguing about is helping you be successful or get laid then kudos

But I don't see anyone posting solutions to any issue just flaming, and their 4 other threads in the main discussion with the same crap. No one is supporting the guys who truly need the support out on the field, instead crap threads like these get the most views and replies while guys who are trying to get better get ignored.

KBJing at it's finest!

"The Glory days of SS"

That you old timers harp about had guys who would post theories then test them out on the field guys like Master Of the Universe, Xblitz, The Shezzler, JakeThesteed, MicrophoneFiend, SexPDx, Slickster, The experiment, Fingz, just to name a few.

The truth is lot of guys have deeper issues then women and if their honest with themselves they have other stuff to improve on.

p.s. if your girl is that great why not marry her? Why bother coming on this site if you got this "handled"? I'm curious, no flaming

There is so much bitterness, pessimism and misogyny that anyone asking for advice is pretty much screwed.

The sweeping generalisations on this forum are disgusting and not only that it brings my mood down just by reading a few of the topics.

I'd rather be an AFC anyday than a bitter, old, misognist who hates himself, his life and everybody else.

Not all women are the same, just as not all men are the same. This entire site and all the articles on it apart from Pook's is a load of crock. Useless.

I wouldn't recommend this site to anyone having problems with women. It's the same BS churned out time after time by the same people who have forgotten how to live life.

This is the difference between guys who are successful with women and guys who aren't. Go check out The RSD forums field report section, tons of guys getting laid, working on their business, traveling the world, having a blast in college etc. Rarely do you see negative threads(even in the main forum) and if you do it's not even comparable to this forum.

The guys are actually field testing their experience

THE truth is their is no magic pill you gonna have to experience life and figure out shyt for yourself sometimes through trial & error

That's how you improve and grow as a person

This is why I take a break from the forum every 6 months so i don't rely on it as a crutch

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

JDELA, from what I read of you, your understanding comes from imposing a male perspective onto women's perspectives. Case in point:

If the neg works, not only shows there is a lack of self esteem and mental balance, as also the relationship will fail.

From a male perspective, this would make complete and rational sense. If a man were to Neg you or another man, the most rational response would be to interpret that as disrespect and take offense. Now lets say that the guy getting Negged, not only accepts it, but becomes intrigued and friendly with the guy negging him. Would you have any respect for either one of them? Probably not. You'd say the guy doing the Negging was being an ass-hole and the guy getting Negged suffered from a"lack of self-esteem and mental balance."

What you're doing is casting what you'd expect a woman's response to be in the male perspective. The most common complaint read on any dating site (SS to Love Shack) comes from guys who are dumbfounded that women consistently opt for the Bad Boy Alpha Jerk instead of him and his NIce, loyal, respectful, dependable self. As bourn out by the experiences and observations of women's behavior from countless millions of men for centuries, what we as men would expect to be the most logical, rational and pragmatic choice of action women could make is rarely proven by the ones they do make.

Don't get lost in the details; this isn't a debate about whether or not Negs work or the frequency with which women opt for a Bad Boy. It has everything to do with the fact that men base most of their actions, their beliefs, their personal investments, etc. upon deductive reasoning and predictable outcomes from what they believe is reliable information. So when all you ever hear from women is that they "want a guy with a good heart" or someone sensitive, respectful, humorous, etc. on down the list it would be cause for some considerable confusion when women consistently overlook guys like this in favor of one who is the opposite of her stated desires. Either the data is flawed, our interpretation of it is flawed, or the one relating it is flawed - and probably all three.

So in light of such a consistent conflict of purpose, we have to conclude that what women say and what women do are often at odds with each other. Negs work on women. There's certainly an art to, and it's not a one-size-fits-all, but they do work with enough consistency that you can generally predict an outcome. So the question is this: do the vast majority of women suffer from a lack of self-esteem or are we expecting them to act as men would?

It's very easy to write off the women who'd opt for the Bad Boy as low-quality, but what do you do when your hi-quality woman does the same? You can shoot an arrow, paint the target around it, and get a bullseye every time, but you can't ignore the incongruency.

 

[Solomon]

no beef

Do a search on my posts and you will see me helping guys out. Solomon, I've watched your posts and you are a good contributor. Pay attention man.

I don't follow every poster man you gotta understand their thousands of posters mate. i do like your dark thread cause I can relate to it
Regarding my woman, I am actually going to move in with her in a few months and will get her a ring if I decide she deserves it.

I come to this site because attraction interests me and I like helping people. And to help people, sometimes you have to do some flaming. But again, you would know that if you did a quick search on any recent posts that I have made.

Why not ask why Jophil, or Guru, or Rollo or Cordon or any other members come to this site. C'mon man, you of all people should be smarter than that.

Danger you quoted me mate, so I responded in kind, I have no issues with you and I know you contribute, but the truth is that this site needs to go back to guys applying theory. If your in a happy relationship mate kudos. But their lot of guys struggling.

In terms of the other esteemed members you posted, I posted a thread not long ago

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/archive/index.php/t-178278.html

Either the other members read it and don't care or didn't see it. Everytime I PM Rollo I never get a response i.e. my "if she lets you hit it on the first date" thread got closed because of concordon and another guy doing a flame war.

Like you I'm here to help people but most importantly learn hence I posted a FR(MORE SO A write up on a date) in the mature mens section which got lot of views and also replies. Even after 3 years I still have lots to learn

http://sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=185263&page=2

The truth is a lot of the members who got the most "reps" really don't care for FR's or LR's. Which is a shame cause those are the guys taking actions to try and improve their situations, those are also the same guys who prove if their theories are right or not. Not some guy who just registered on the site looking for a "quick fix" with his low IL girlfriend

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

As much as I'd love to read more FRs and follow ups (which I do agree are important) the simple fact of the matter is that you're relying on whatever it is any one poster is telling you. I could very easily go on the RSD boards and fabricate a very believable story about how I managed a 4 way with some HB 9 swimsuit models using using a direct approach or any number of PUA techniques. There'd be guys who'd virtually pat me on the back and ask how they could repeat it themselves because they want to believe it. There'd be another set who'd believe it, but take the faux-pity position and say I was wasting my life away in meaningless orgies with the 'low quality' centerfolds they wish their LTR girls looked like. Finally, there'd be the nonbelievers who'd accuse me of making it all up, not because it was too fanciful a story, but rather they think all women are just smarter than to be suckered into an instant porn movie with a random guy - only to be disappointed after watching another amateur porn movie.

Even when PUA gurus go to the trouble of making as anonymous and as inconspicuous videos of themselves showing their approach techniques, the first thing anyone says is it was staged. And unless he could someway get a camera secretly into his bedroom after the successful pull, there will still be an element that will think it was arranged, or they'll be another element that say the girl is just a slut so of course it worked.

Now as bad as all that sounds, I think FRs definitely have their place as field testing experiments doubters or not. Just bear in mind, you will never filter out that situational bias. Observing a process will change that process.

What's interesting is this constant, perceived conflict between "theorists" and "practitioners". IMHO I don't believe you can separate them. All the tools a guy will have at his disposal to practice don't amount to much if he doesn't understand why those tool work in the first place. Similarly all the theory in the world is useless until you develop an application of it by trial and error. Now, add to all that the situational bias I just described - what do you tell an AFC who's stuck on Matrix conditioning "try using negs" or here's why Negs work? What do you tell JDELA?

 

[OC Speedball]

Ace Magnamus: I have seen a few posts on here where people have said, "A hot girl has a hundred guys just like you in her phone."

And the people posting this BS on this site usually say that a hot girl has MULTIPLE guys she is sleeping around with.


You think I have an archive of every post where this stuff is said? No, obviously I do not. But you and I both know that exagerrated numbers are thrown around on this site.

Here's an example I came across just today in a thread about girls knowing what they want:
"A female will just go F all her other options if you stop trying to F her."
This post is an example of the sort of stuff I am referring to.

 

[Alex DeLarge]

I know plenty of 8's and 9's that DO NOT sleep around. They exist! I also know plenty of 8's and 9's that DO sleep around. So what? You cannot become jaded on promiscuous women. If you do not agree with how they live whether promiscuous or not, then forget them!

Everyone chooses to live different lifestyles no matter how attractive or unattractive they may be. Why let it affect you? Go live your own life. Pursue your dreams. (And I hope you all have other goals in life besides finding the girl of your dreams or getting laid every weekend!).

 

[Energy25]

I'm done taking this site seriously because of the reasons stated at the begging of this thread....

Also, read this thread created a long time ago by Master of the Universe....Good stuff that clears up this BS that many posters are trying to convince others of.

Overall, the "experts" here are OVERCOMPLICATING everything, and hold such a negative view of all women it is disgusting and sad at the same time. I feel sorry for them. They will be alone in life.

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=29081

 

[Amazing]

I'm done taking this site seriously because of the reasons stated at the begging of this thread....

Also, read this thread created a long time ago by Master of the Universe....Good stuff that clears up this BS that many posters are trying to convince others of.

Overall, the "experts" here are OVERCOMPLICATING everything, and hold such a negative view of all women it is disgusting and sad at the same time. I feel sorry for them. They will be alone in life.

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=29081

Thank you for digging this up, there is nothing more to say, MOTU said it all. I feel for the guys who don't see why this is the only way and keep defending their egos as if you live in an ego world. I don't want to call people out, no matter how much it would make my ego feel good, because this is all about making people's lives better. Remember one thing, and this is the ultimate truth, whatever you convince yourself you've found other reasons or whatever else helps you get to 6000 posts. If you are still here, you are not living in the real world and dealing with THOSE issues.

People who are don't need to come back and read posts (unless they are unsure at some point of what to do, which is OK) - because they'd rather be reading about yachting, sky diving, cooking, house building, wine making, massage, etc.

Women lie, men lie, numbers don't lie. IF you aren't getting laid as much as you want, or are not in a great relationship YOU wanted, you are doing something wrong, and it usually is not realizing that it is ok for a man to be emotional - that the emotions ARE what connects people together, and that the whole point is to be a man and show that you have them, but control them well, and realizing that a girl will have them, and you can deal with hers too.

We are all human, we all want to be with other people at the core level. UNtil you can let go off your ego and are able to say "Wow, I think I really like you!" and "Can I kiss you?" you won't succeed. I am not telling you to say those things, I am talking about capacity to be honest and human enough to be able to say them. I know I couldn't for 8 years, my ego told me I was super awesome and I had to play the game to get a girl. I was doign it and I was getting laid may be once every 6 months because I thought I was "holding my standards high" - and I am a great looking guy in shape with many things to offer. It wasn't adding up and I knew something was wrong. I wasn't being myself. I was what I thought I was supposed to be - this alpha male puppet

Now that I am just myself, and I am emotional, and I share my secrets and I open up quickly with women I can get laid every day if I choose to. And now I can filter by exactly what I want. And those reading and shouting "Yeah right she will dump you right after!!" - may be, may be not, but the fact is if she dumps me she is dumping ME - who I am, meaning we weren't meant for each other. What's the point of pretending to be something else to keep a girl around - that to me is suicide of the soul. If a girl leaves you that means she wanted something else, let her go have it. If she comes back, that's when you know you have something. If she never leaves and every day reminds you that she wants to be with you - that's when you marry her.

Good luck guys. Read MOTU's post, be honest with yourself and ask "was I being me, or was I being who I thought I was supposed to be?" and get out of here for 3 months, be yourself, even if you suck at first at expressing what it is, and see how it goes.

 

[Solomon]

RESPONSES IN BOLD

As much as I'd love to read more FRs and follow ups (which I do agree are important) the simple fact of the matter is that you're relying on whatever it is any one poster is telling you. I could very easily go on the RSD boards and fabricate a very believable story about how I managed a 4 way with some HB 9 swimsuit models using using a direct approach or any number of PUA techniques. There'd be guys who'd virtually pat me on the back and ask how they could repeat it themselves because they want to believe it. There'd be another set who'd believe it, but take the faux-pity position and say I was wasting my life away in meaningless orgies with the 'low quality' centerfolds they wish their LTR girls looked like. Finally, there'd be the nonbelievers who'd accuse me of making it all up, not because it was too fanciful a story, but rather they think all women are just smarter than to be suckered into an instant porn movie with a random guy - only to be disappointed after watching another amateur porn movie.

The skeptics always say this "this is fake wah wah" even now with guys posting pics/vids and hell even audio recording(Phat Rabbit, Noob, myself etc guys who post on this site), haters still hate, and honestly it's a lame excuse. Mystery is considered to be the greatest PUA of all time. He posted FR's religiously his theory wouldn't mean anything if he didn't field test all the times he did and reported it . In the end It's up to the writer to discern if the information at hand is useful or not for the reader, and for the reader to discern what is useful and applicable for themselves. When I first started I didn't believe you could make out with a complete stranger, a women whom you just met. Now making out is the norm for me

Even when PUA gurus go to the trouble of making as anonymous and as inconspicuous videos of themselves showing their approach techniques, the first thing anyone says is it was staged. And unless he could someway get a camera secretly into his bedroom after the successful pull, there will still be an element that will think it was arranged, or they'll be another element that say the girl is just a slut so of course it worked.

I've posted over 25 FR's in the last three years here. Mostly with pics but also with audio, and video footage. I have gone above and beyond the call of duty of posting FR's. Most guru's would charge, high dollar for some of the stuff I've posted. Whether people choose to believe me or not isn't my problem. I use to be one of those guys who didn't believe FR's but after experiencing stuff(making out with chicks, 3 some, 2 minute open to blow job close, hand jobs on the dance-floor etc) in the field you realize this **** is real. The truth is Rollo for me personally, none of the theory or Pook's post resonated with me until after 1000 approaches (or a year later) after having more experience then post like "Be a man" made a heck of a lot more sense, and were more powerful then before I hit the field or dealt with certain situations. We all learn differently I had to hit the field first and learn hard and after 3 years and over 2,500 approaches I'm still learning

Now as bad as all that sounds, I think FRs definitely have their place as field testing experiments doubters or not. Just bear in mind, you will never filter out that situational bias. Observing a process will change that process.


Theories cause doubt as well but a lot of guys don't question it because they fall into the group think mentality here, its easier to believe something that "sounds good" then go out and test it yourself. I've opened girls with openers that guys here say would never work and have gotton great results ("oh my gosh you two are some sexy b*tches*), I've approached women dressed as a women and number close, and even got a day2 out of it etc . Anything can work that's the difference between a guy who is a beginner and a guy who is advanced. The guy who is advanced can manipulate the matrix to his bidding, he understands the rules but he can break them if he wants cause he understands the matrix i.e. Neo flying around!

What's interesting is this constant, perceived conflict between "theorists" and "practitioners". IMHO I don't believe you can separate them. All the tools a guy will have at his disposal to practice don't amount to much if he doesn't understand why those tool work in the first place. Similarly all the theory in the world is useless until you develop an application of it by trial and error. Now, add to all that the situational bias I just described - what do you tell an AFC who's stuck on Matrix conditioning "try using negs" or here's why Negs work? What do you tell JDELA?

They do go hand in hand AND I AGREE WITH YA! the problem is on this site the "theorists" don't support the "practitioners" at all. This is why their is a "conflict". Most of the respected members on this site would be considered the "theorists", yes most of them are married or in a relationship. However does that not mean they can't help the practitioners with their experience no? a lot of them say "well I don't care for FR's I wanna help the AFC with his girlfriend problem...". Yet it's the Practitioner or Field reporter as I say who is actually making active due diligence in his own improvement. While the AFC is looking for a "quick fix". Their is a reason why the term "KBJ" exists. If you "theorize" to much without field testing your theory then yeah you are a KBJ in my book. I have gone out with guys on this site Rollo, who knew the theory inside and out, read books, watched all the specials. Guys who knew "Game" at a better level then me. These guys would put your favorite poster or blogger to shame with their "theories" but guess what. They couldn't do shyt in the field. If going to the field was pushed as hard as learning the bible on this site, then yeah their wouldn't be such a "conflict"

Just my thoughts

 

[zekko]

What's depressing isn't that a well delivered neg could actually generates interest, it's the principle behind the neg - the reason why it works - that prompts the conflict.

I know you're talking about the chumpiest of the chumps here, but I don't see why the reasons negs work should be so depressing. Of all the reasons I've read, nothing strikes me as horribly sinister.

1. Girls like to be teased playfully
2. The girl thinks the guy isn't hitting on her, so she lets him talk awhile
3. The girl thinks the guy isn't impressed by her, so she tries to prove herself
4. The girl appreciates being approached in a different way than every other guy

Of course with this PUA stuff becoming more widespread, #4 may not be true much longer, if it is now.

Even if you do find any of this disturbing, the good news is you don't have to neg a girl to attract her. Guys were attracting women for thousands of years before Mystery came along.

So either he learns to live with this new understanding, benefit from it and grow into a new role for himself, or he rejects it and vilifies it wholesale.

"Women are really not as bad as these misogynists, these bitter, burned men would all have us believe.

Well honestly, they couldn't be. Some women are, certainly.
The point is you shouldn't be a naive pedestaling chump, but there's no reason to be such a bitter hateful guy either. There may not be any Disney princesses, but there are some decent girls out there, you just have to find them. And have enough value to attract them.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

ZEKKO, that's because you benefit from 50 years of experience and possess a capacity for abstract reasoning instead of relying on silly binary thinking that associates anything with the word "Neg" attached to it as universally meaning manipulative, misogynistic and insecure.