Should I keep persisting? am I being too ****y, whether she's interested, etc

[BigSmooth]

I'm pretty sure I know what the problem is.

I agree with everyone else's advice in this thread, but I'll differentiate in a new direction a little bit here.


The problem is that you set the wrong frame with this girl. In her mind, you're just "one of the bros"...a harmless, could-never-be-attracted-to-unless-something-extraordinary-happens male friend.

Now, from her perspective, this "friend" of hers is suddenly acting very strange. He goes from behaving normally to suddenly being overly ****y...and not very funny. She doesn't know what to think, but she's obviously not getting that attracted. He is her friend though, so she stays cordial.


If you want to make her attracted, less talk and more action.

Go do something with her. Interact with her in person. Do an activity together. If you continue down this path, she's just going to keep thinking you're weird and she might eventually directly call you out on it.

 

[fmfan08]

I would have earlier but the problem was getting her to be confident to meet earlier on. She told me at the start she wanted to make sure she got used to me over text/calls first.

Btw, I sent her that "Maybe" reply but I think it was the wrong idea. 10 minutes after she saw it her tweet was "Some things never change".

Would it be bad to send a second facebook message but starting with "but" or "although" so it looks as if i'm carrying on the previous message? Then ask something personal?

 

[fmfan08]

Screw it I did, asked what she got up to last weekend. Got to take a risk and not play games now, hoping it isn't too late.

Hoping things get back to how they were and she doesn't see me as immature etc like you all said, then i'll arrange to see her.

 

[Harry Wilmington]

Okay, listen carefully now, 'cause I want what I'm about to say to stick in your head...

STOP LISTENING TO WOMEN WHEN THEY TELL YOU WHAT THEY THINK WILL WORK ON THEM.

Her: "I want to make sure I get used to you over text/calls first." Yeah, because seeing a bunch of digitalized words from you is going to get their panties sooooo wet that they'll have no choice but to want to go out with you. It's BULLCRAP, my friend, pure BULLCRAP.

However, the request is really a trick from her to see who you're going to let run the show. And, judging from the fact that you agreed to it, she knew it was HER running the show, meaning she lost interest. You think just because this girl is messaging you means she likes you? I can message her and four other chicks at the same time right NOW, and not like any of them or have any real desire to meet up with them.

In reality, you should have just asked her out, and if she gave you the answer she gave you, you should have been funny - "yeah, maybe our words can go out for a meal sometime" - and then asked again. I've had girls online who initially were like "don't you think we should talk more on here first or on the phone?" and my response is always the same: "we could... but realistically, we're not going to get to know each other until we meet up. Besides, we'll be meeting in a public place, so why not?" You have to SELL the girl on the idea that (a) meeting up with you won't be dangerous, and (b) she'll have a good time when she does. If you're not able to, you need to work on your pitch.

And come on, guy! You must have instincts that work, so you KNOW what it means when a girl boils her answers down to just one word. I have yet to be in a messaging convo with a girl where one-word responses meant she was really interested in me. Instead, it usually means she's either (a) mad, (b) in a meeting, or (c) has lost interest. Something else you need to know: when a girl is disinterested, she won't usually just tell you to go away - instead, she'll do things like, oh, I don't know, become less available, make comments that are snarkier and more sarcastic, or GIVE YOU ONE-WORDED MESSAGE RESPONSES.

Bottom line: this girl's not feeling you and wishes you would stop messaging her. But hey, you're not losing anything - you never even met her. Just act like it was a dude that started treating you like and @$$hole and drop her. Hope this helps!

 

[fmfan08]

Either way I'm useless at this. Hardly get female attention as it is and when I do I end up wrecking it. She still didn't respond anyway but continued to update her Twitter.

So i'm gonna leave it until after the weekend and tell her straight that I don't want to play games with her, be straight about what I want to do about meeting up, at least taking it away from silly messaging.

Whether that's the wrong thing to do, i'm just going to take the risk anyway. It's better than not doing anything at all and remaining quiet, not knowing. Worst comes to worst, I dig myself into a deeper hole and I move on. Not as if I have to worry about embarrassing myself anyway, don't know her in person.

 

[Harry Wilmington]

Sooooooo.... you send a girl a message. Not only does she not respond, but she probably sees the message, then updates her twitter to let you know she's online but purposefully not responding to you... and your decision is to whine to her about it by telling her to "stop playing games" and "please talk to me, pretty please?!?""

:crackup:

Dude - she's NOT playing games with you. That's just your ego talking. The reality is, SHE'S JUST NOT THAT INTO YOU. You can send her whatever you'd like, but it's not taking a "risk" - it's feeding her ego and/or annoying her by trying to get her to respond to a person she doesn't want to respond to. Girls aren't this complicated, guy - if they like you, they respond and agree to hang out with you, and if not, they don't. Don't let your ego get the best of you - just take it as a loss and focus on the next girl.

 

[plate's_empty]

So i'm gonna leave it until after the weekend and tell her straight that I don't want to play games with her, be straight about what I want to do about meeting up, at least taking it away from silly messaging.

IMHO, at this point, you have no chance. Leave it alone. Anything other than walking away from this right now, is only going to hurt you. You may get a sympathy reply from her but that's about it. Otherwise, you've reached her do not respond list....next stop creeper list.

Maybe, just maybe, if you DON'T CONTACT HER, she'll get a wild hair up her ass and throw a feeler your way sometime in the future. But for now....let it go. Seriously

 

[fmfan08]

I get your point, but last week things were going fine. It's until I started acting a bit too ****y and she said "Is that what you'd prefer? Because you seem to be making everything difficult lately, you've got dead ****y!"

The thing is, it isn't what I prefer and she was fine until I acted like that. I guess the things in my personal life that's hit me recently, I've compensated to my attitude.

She was off with me like this one time before and gave me short answers, silent treatment. It was my fault because i took something out of context and removed her. I ended up leaving it a week and saying "How's grumpy guts been lately? Don't be angry with me, because I reckon you can raise me one better with a smile! (They look like this btw --> ) I don't wanna argue or fall out over something stupid with you. You game with that?"

She ended up replying with "me grumpy? i think it's you that went on the deleting spree. don't call me grumpy because you're aware it was you in the wrong now. but here's the smile you're after x

So I don't know if it's worth doing the same, maybe I should have kept her removed last time as it was probably a boost to her ego.. but if it works then fine, I'll cut the crap and meet her in person. If she makes up an excuse, next.

Or should I cut my losses and remove her? If she responds to it, ignore or reply?

 

[fmfan08]

Okay guys, you were right about waiting. Two days later, no reply. Tweeting a few things on my phone, then I get a pop up from a text message with her name saying '' so I was right to trust my instinct and assume she was still slightly interested. She could have just left it and carried on ignoring.

What I don't get though, is she called me out on being ****y and making things difficult lately, gives me one words, then silence. Then two days later texts me '' at half 10 in the morning. I take it was some kind of test, but I thought she'd be pissed off at me.

Been up all night and going to get an hour or two sleep. I'll reply later on once I can think better. I don't want to play games now, but I kind of am slightly by not responding too soon. Usually I wait 10 or so mins, but will wait couple or so hours after some sleep to shoe I haven't been waiting for any contact, which I haven't

 

[fmfan08]

fm,

Pat of the problem is that you are completely incongruent.

You are acting "****y" (not very well actually, and I'm not trying to insult you but much of your statements are try-hard_), but then being reactive and deleting things, and also sending beta smileys.

I can understand why she is confused and acting this way.

Long story short, I think you need to spend more time reading any Pook entries, and checking out Heartiste's site as well.

You are started down the right path, but you need to iron out some wrinkles.

Thanks, tends to be me all over that, I make a rough job but have to work on some bits.

Was it "try hard" because I overdid it? I've tried to lower the ****y side, use it very sparingly and just be myself, making it interesting of course. Not saying I'm uninteresting naturally

Two days after ignoring me, she sent a smiley this morning, I sent one back. She said "Alright trouble?", I said "I'm great, just need to work out how to wake up properly. Any ideas?". Her response was "Cold shower? Quick swim? Naked lap around the garden?". I said "That last one worked a treat. So, what have you been up to?".

My problem is, my last response seems a bit boring, I don't know. Most likely you'll say I went about the conversation all wrong ha.

I'll follow that guide you said, seems odd we're following guides though. People 100 years ago seemed to cope

Btw, what do you mean "being reactive and deleting things, and also sending beta smileys?". Not sure on the delete thing, unless I'm missing something? And beta smileys, do you mean in regular conversation with words, or just the "" in reply to hers?

 

[Harry Wilmington]

(Sigh) Another case of "Texting KILLS Relationships."

Except in this case he doesn't even have a relationship with her, lol. I'll save you some time, guy: the "smiley face with no message" was sent because you went NC on her and she wanted to make sure she was still on your mind. She still has no desire to actually meet up with you, but she DOES like the idea of a guy out there in text-land thinking about her.

You didn't go about the conversation wrong; it's just that you shouldn't have been having the conversation to begin with. TEXTING KILLS RELATIONSHIPS. And she's not agreeing to meet with you in person because she's not trying to have a relationship with you in the first place!

But hey, we get it. We've all been there, when you have no other options coming to you, it's easy to obsess about one random girl who's kind of showing you a little bit of attention. And if getting sporadic attention from an uninterested girl who will only contact you when her ego needs boosting is something you need right now to keep your own ego afloat, more power to you. Sure, the rest of us know it's a waste of time, but hey - at lease she's sending you those digital smiley faces, right? Granted, it was after 2 days of ignoring you, which we ALL know shows a clear HIGH level of interest on her part... :crackup: :nono:

 

[floydb25]

Not to sound mean or cruel:

You're over-analyzing, caring too much, and trying too hard over a ***** you never even met. This is serious desperation at work. Even the fact that you keep posting about it... Everything you and her say, if she responds, what she said before, the manner in which she said it, how she's speaking to you now, how you should react, if you're trying too hard... You won't just let it go, and keep trying - which, in effect, answers your question on if you're trying too hard. You have serious one-itis with a text *****, and someone of slight potential interest.

You're making things out to be WAY more serious (and harder for yourself) than they are - without even dating her! This is pedestalization of women & dating. Like, you've never talked to girl, had her show interest in you, or vice versa. Even if this is true - it's NOT how you want to be perceived. Chicks don't dig stereotypical "nice guys", and you're acting quite like one... Being kind has nothing to do with it. Most NG's aren't even kind to begin with. But they are weak, needy, desperate, passive-aggressive, approval-seeking try-hards. They try to fit into any mold - including acting like they're bad and ****y - simply to be accepted.

People can see right through the charade of trying to be ****y, aloof, and cool - when you're really just a desperate try-hard who's over-eager, clingy, and of an approval-seeking nature. Believe that... I've been there before. Didn't work at all.

Imagine if you actually started dating... you'd most likely be analyzing, worrying, and asking about everything. As well as trying to do everything proper, and seeking her approval throughout... always going back for more, and trying to keep things straight - no matter how much **** is thrown your way. Maybe you'd present a fake challenge initially - while waging her interest level throughout (since deep down, you CARE too much) - then rush in at full speed when she started backing off... because it's all an act.

You want to be naturally content, indifferent, confident, independent, etc. Your true colors are going to show eventually, and people aren't dumb. Even if you started acting arrogant, boastful, douchey, etc - people would still see through the charade, and tear you down like no other.

This isn't something to be respected, but IS a tool used to walk all over you. DESPERATION kills relationships, and people can sense weakness.

You gotta kill the insecurity, desperation, co-dependancy, and other underlying issues. Stop caring what other people think, or if they like you.

But like Harry said, we've all been there.

 

[TillTheEndOfTime]

1) With a new girl you need to meet FAST and SOON.

2) You're overdoing the technique to death man. It should be part of your personality, not a repertoire you fall back on all the time. You come off as robotic when you do that sh1t too often. Just have normal conversations without technique stuck in the back of your head all the time.

 

[fmfan08]

(Sigh) Another case of "Texting KILLS Relationships."

Except in this case he doesn't even have a relationship with her, lol. I'll save you some time, guy: the "smiley face with no message" was sent because you went NC on her and she wanted to make sure she was still on your mind. She still has no desire to actually meet up with you, but she DOES like the idea of a guy out there in text-land thinking about her.

You didn't go about the conversation wrong; it's just that you shouldn't have been having the conversation to begin with. TEXTING KILLS RELATIONSHIPS. And she's not agreeing to meet with you in person because she's not trying to have a relationship with you in the first place!

But hey, we get it. We've all been there, when you have no other options coming to you, it's easy to obsess about one random girl who's kind of showing you a little bit of attention. And if getting sporadic attention from an uninterested girl who will only contact you when her ego needs boosting is something you need right now to keep your own ego afloat, more power to you. Sure, the rest of us know it's a waste of time, but hey - at lease she's sending you those digital smiley faces, right? Granted, it was after 2 days of ignoring you, which we ALL know shows a clear HIGH level of interest on her part... :crackup: :nono:

I haven't asked her though. But what if ignoring her is the wrong decision? What if for once, someone goes against the norm? And sporadic, no. This has been the first time she's been like this, the rest she's most of the time replied quickly, give or take if she's been on facebook at the time or not. I've seen relationships work off texting and messaging, but it's hard if we're not around each other. Btw, I forgot to say but we have called too, it hasn't JUST been messaging.

So, I be straight with her about meeting up. If she gives me an excuse, then you're right. But sometimes girls don't always follow what those guides you read say.

 

[fmfan08]

Not to sound mean or cruel:

You're over-analyzing, caring too much, and trying too hard over a ***** you never even met. This is serious desperation at work. Even the fact that you keep posting about it... Everything you and her say, if she responds, what she said before, the manner in which she said it, how she's speaking to you now, how you should react, if you're trying too hard... You won't just let it go, and keep trying - which, in effect, answers your question on if you're trying too hard. You have serious one-itis with a text *****, and someone of slight potential interest.

You're making things out to be WAY more serious (and harder for yourself) than they are - without even dating her! This is pedestalization of women & dating. Like, you've never talked to girl, had her show interest in you, or vice versa. Even if this is true - it's NOT how you want to be perceived. Chicks don't dig stereotypical "nice guys", and you're acting quite like one... Being kind has nothing to do with it. Most NG's aren't even kind to begin with. But they are weak, needy, desperate, passive-aggressive, approval-seeking try-hards. They try to fit into any mold - including acting like they're bad and ****y - simply to be accepted.

People can see right through the charade of trying to be ****y, aloof, and cool - when you're really just a desperate try-hard who's over-eager, clingy, and of an approval-seeking nature. Believe that... I've been there before. Didn't work at all.

Imagine if you actually started dating... you'd most likely be analyzing, worrying, and asking about everything. As well as trying to do everything proper, and seeking her approval throughout... always going back for more, and trying to keep things straight - no matter how much **** is thrown your way. Maybe you'd present a fake challenge initially - while waging her interest level throughout (since deep down, you CARE too much) - then rush in at full speed when she started backing off... because it's all an act.

You want to be naturally content, indifferent, confident, independent, etc. Your true colors are going to show eventually, and people aren't dumb. Even if you started acting arrogant, boastful, douchey, etc - people would still see through the charade, and tear you down like no other.

This isn't something to be respected, but IS a tool used to walk all over you. DESPERATION kills relationships, and people can sense weakness.

You gotta kill the insecurity, desperation, co-dependancy, and other underlying issues. Stop caring what other people think, or if they like you.

But like Harry said, we've all been there.

I never depended on advice at first, i've been myself until recently. I wouldn't be over-analysing everything in person, I've had girlfriends before and relationships have worked out, I've just been too reliant on other people's advice of late.

So do you mean I shouldn't dally about and just be confident in making a move? But obviously, make my own decisions, etc.

What you've seen is a small portion of the conversations we've had. It's these of late that I've relied on other people in wondering how to act and so on.

 

[fmfan08]

fmfan,


First off, don't ever send smileys. Ever.

Second, you are too wordy with her. Way too wordy. That is what appears to be "try hard".

Third, It's not all about being C+F. You are overgaming. Just be that a bit, but not all of the time. This is actually a very common mistake for those who are new to this.

How come no smilies? Need explanation on that bit, because in person I wouldn't act emotionless like a robot. I've used smilies briefly before to girls prior to being in relationships with.

Yeah, I am too wordy. I know that really I should be matching her level of interest such as matching the length she puts into the conversation.

At your third point, what should I do inbetween? I've asked personal questions, but without being too revealing of my own life, keep some mystery. I found on the phone to her, I was more jokey because it was easier to tell a funny story that had happened to me.

And guys, I appreciate all your advice, if I'm questioning it it's just because I'm intrigued in learning and wanting to grow better at this.

 

[fmfan08]

1) With a new girl you need to meet FAST and SOON.

2) You're overdoing the technique to death man. It should be part of your personality, not a repertoire you fall back on all the time. You come off as robotic when you do that sh1t too often. Just have normal conversations without technique stuck in the back of your head all the time.

She's someone i've been in contact with for quite a while, no idea why. Just started off friendly and then got flirty, until now anyway with overusing the technique.

Today we had a normal conversation, it came out naturally and more witty rather than thinking too hard on what to say.

Thing is, all these things you have to learn or master to get someone seems kind of silly. I can understand you shouldn't act desperate, needy, clingy, etc but otherwise, shouldn't being yourself mean you find a girl who accepts who YOU are? Rather than reading a whole bunch of guides to change how you act? Contradicting myself, but my problem that you're seeing now is from reading too many guides and confusing myself. It's made me too reliant on them, rather than when I look at my earliest conversations with her, they were better. Probably because I had more confidence in myself then (i do suffer from depression, so confidence comes and goes). Correct me if I'm wrong, it's just we didn't rely on guides 100 years ago, yet many still got the girl.

Maybe more practice will be better for me. But for now, I'm just going to keep myself open to other girls, there is one I've seen about (we have the same friend) and keep in mind to be confident, say witty things when appropriate and get to know the girl. But not dally about on making the move to take her out somewhere.

 

[TillTheEndOfTime]

She's someone i've been in contact with for quite a while, no idea why. Just started off friendly and then got flirty, until now anyway with overusing the technique.

Today we had a normal conversation, it came out naturally and more witty rather than thinking too hard on what to say.

Thing is, all these things you have to learn or master to get someone seems kind of silly. I can understand you shouldn't act desperate, needy, clingy, etc but otherwise, shouldn't being yourself mean you find a girl who accepts who YOU are? Rather than reading a whole bunch of guides to change how you act? Contradicting myself, but my problem that you're seeing now is from reading too many guides and confusing myself. It's made me too reliant on them, rather than when I look at my earliest conversations with her, they were better. Probably because I had more confidence in myself then (i do suffer from depression, so confidence comes and goes). Correct me if I'm wrong, it's just we didn't rely on guides 100 years ago, yet many still got the girl.

Maybe more practice will be better for me. But for now, I'm just going to keep myself open to other girls, there is one I've seen about (we have the same friend) and keep in mind to be confident, say witty things when appropriate and get to know the girl. But not dally about on making the move to take her out somewhere.

I think you get it, but you need to approach your views on women & dating from a slightly different perspective.

Realize that looks matter. A lot. Is there something about yourself that you can easily change? I'm not talking about plastic surgery. Start with your clothing style. You wouldn't believe how much better you can look and how much more attention dressing well can do for you.

Take pride in your appearance. Not only will you attract more women physically, but you will also gain confidence. When you put work and effort into yourself like that and SEE the results, you will gain a sense of pride and that will turn into confidence. When I have a nice shave and put myself together right, I just feel right.

The next step is to realize that as good as you look, not all women will be physically attracted to you. Period. You can read as much sh1t as you want and learn as much more bullsh1t as you want, but you can't "talk" your way to physical attraction with a woman. It won't happen. Ever. You can do EVERYTHING right, but if she's not physically attracted, it's not going anywhere.

That last point will butthurt PUA's. They will talk about "the game" and that there is some magic secret. They will say there is some "technique" that will magically remove a basic human instinctual motive from the equation. That the BIOLOGICAL DESIRE for a woman to find the most genetically suitable mate will disappear because you peacock, or use NLP, or do C+F, etc, etc. Mother Nature ALWAYS wins. Every time. Looks matter. Evolution teaches us this point time and time again. Good looks (symmetry in the face) is the evolutionary signal for good genes.

Ever seen someone with one eye SLIGHTLY lower than the other? Ever wonder why it feels like you were HARD CODED to find that person unattractive? It is because you were. Evolution decided that you should not like that in a mate. No amount of behaviour on that person's part will change your GENETIC and INSTINCTUAL perception of symmetry. Ever.

Once you accept limitations, you won't obsess over outcome. Because you know you are never in 100% control. When you don't obsess over outcome, you won't be obsessed over finding some magic technique or C+F routine to get you 100% success. Because 100% success will never happen.

Just go with the flow and build on what confidence you do have. Keep the "easy come, easy go" mentality. Live free.