Sandra Bland Arrest

[Stagger Lee]

In the state of Texas, failure to signal is an arrestable offense. I'm no fan of police overstepping their authority, but I believe the cop in this case was legally within his right to ensure his own safety during this arrest. The suspect was acting weird, even belligerently. She was angry. The cop in this case, I think, was totally within his rights to ask the suspect to put out her cigarette, as she had been pulled over for an arrestable offense. Legally speaking, even a non arrestable offense would give the offcier a right to demand that the suspect comply with whatever reasonable steps he deems necessary to ensure his own safety. In the hands of an irate suspect or someone on drugs, a cigarette could potentially be used to burn the officer.

Most shootings of cops happen during routine stops, and the cops generally have a lot of discretion in order to ensure their own safety when pulling over suspects. I don't think the officer in this case overstepped his bounds: the suspect was acting erratically and was refusing to comply with simple requests that the cop in this case reasonably believed were meant to ensure his own safety. To me, the fact that this woman killed herself over a routine traffic stop confirms this officer's suspicion that she was not playing with a full deck of cards and he acted reasonably in trying in ensuring his own safety during this stop.

That's how I see it too. Sure the officer could've let her rant and act erratically and maybe issued her the warning or ticket, but he didn't have to coddle her. And she could've acted differently and would not have gotten arrested.

 

[Jaylan]

Lol the cop targeting her, pulled a u-turn to follow her...was speeding behind her, and baited her into merging without signaling.

Even public officials down in Texas have said their officer didnt behave properly. Even logicallefty, the ONLY officer here (real life experience) has said the officer behaved unprofessionally.

Texan taxpayers are gonna have fun paying off this lawsuit. We know there will be one.

 

[Boxer00]

It is different. I have witnessed this behavior in other officers as I articulated above pretty much from the start. Both departments I have worked for have been city departments. I have observed that County Sheriff's Deputies, in general, tend to act more like cowboy cops. Again, that's a generalization. Where as other city departments, our State Troopers in Illinois, and the Feds I have worked with all seem to, in general, be better behaved. Another factor I have sat back and thought about is that the one Sheriff's Department around me who IMO is the worst of all, they are represented by a very strong Union. That means they know they can get away with misbehaving. And they have the media eating the corn out of their poop, which means they know that said misbehaving won't go public. All the media ever writes about them is how great they are. It's sickening. I personally know of inmates in their jail who died in jail and it never got to the media. And inmates who have been tortured in there as well. They have deputies who have been DUI in squad cars, wrecked them, and still kept their jobs..

All that being said, I love the department I work for now. Couldn't ask for a better place and better fellow officers.

I would figure the Sheriff's would have a Good 'Ol Boy mentality where they can get away with stuff not being held accountable. It seems like a lot of sh1t goes down that isn't made public. Thanks for being frank and honest Lefty. I respect the work you do upholding the integrity of your job. Too bad more officers ween't like you and your department. Hopefully more will start becoming that way in the future.

 

[Stagger Lee]

Lol the cop targeting her, pulled a u-turn to follow her...was speeding behind her, and baited her into merging without signaling.

You leave out a lot bad conduct of the motorist. The trooper was probably going to turn around anyway, but she rolled right through a stop sign when she pulled out in front of him and appeared to be speeding down the road before he turned around and took pursuit. Then she merges over without signaling when he appeared to be around 100 ft behind her. Only someone loony would do all that right in front of an officer.

Even public officials down in Texas have said their officer didnt behave properly. Even logicallefty, the ONLY officer here (real life experience) has said the officer behaved unprofessionally.

Who cares? Others see it differently.

Texan taxpayers are gonna have fun paying off this lawsuit. We know there will be one.

Yeah we know there'll be one, but the taxpayers don't owe the family squat for their mentally unbalanced relative committing suicide who they apparently didn't even try to bail out or anything. Now they're coming with their hands out.

 

[Tenacity]

This case is very sad, I remember being a kid riding with my Mother and she actually would rant to Cops similarly to the way Sandra did. I felt that my Mother was stupid then and Sandra was stupid "now" when this happened.

A couple of things to take away from this:

1.) There's way too many ill-trained cops on the street, period. As a cop you are there to keep order and restore order, not cause chaos. You are also not there to be trigger happy or try to exert force that's not required. Cops like this give all cops a bad name, most cops are not idiots like this.

2.) Understand when you get pulled over by Cops, you might get a nice one like Logical Lefty, or you might get a total a.sshole like the one Sandra got. In ANY CASE, you need to remain cool, professional, and calm with the cop EVEN IF you feel as though your rights are being violated, you were pulled over for no reason, or the ticket being written is obsessive. You are NOT going to kick the cop's a.ss, you are not! Screaming about "your rights" to an a.sshole cop is just going to accelerate the probability of him kicking your a.ss, tasing you, or flat out shooting your a.ss. You will see how many "rights" you have when you are laying in a damn casket, compliments from the a.sshole trigger happy cop that pulled you over. So when being pulled over, just shut the hell up and comply, period.

3.) Report cops that you believe are obsessive to the local authorities after the situation, as well as seek legal representation for a lawsuit. Keep your damn MOUTH SHUT and remain professional while the Cop is there, when the situation is over and you drive away, get your Attorney on the phone and THEN seek to fight his a.ss through the system.

Trying to fight him on the damn street is stupid as hell and it boggles my mind on why these people keep doing this shyt. He has a gun, a taser, a nightstick, a police dog, backup, etc. You are NOT going to kick his a.ss, and screaming about your "rights" means jack shyt to an a.sshole Cop.

I mean you would think this is common sense but apparently it's not.

 

[Stagger Lee]

This case is very sad, I remember being a kid riding with my Mother and she actually would rant to Cops similarly to the way Sandra did. I felt that my Mother was stupid then and Sandra was stupid "now" when this happened.

.

You bring up a good point. It's not smart and it's good to see that you adopted a different mentality. My parents certainly weren't perfect and did not like the way authority and those in power acted but they never disrespected authority.

My dad was an old school, independent minded and could be a very difficult, rough and tough man, but whenever a cop pulled him over he acted respectful. My mom is also old school and opinionated and mouthy but she would not be disrespectful if pulled over.

And what's with people getting all huffy when they know they violated traffic law and know they're just going to get a ticket or warning and soon be on their way? I can even remember when sometimes getting a ticket could take up half your day and had to be paid right away for you to be released.

When I was kid my family was driving up north on a summer vacation to visit a relative. A trooper stopped my dad on the interstate in Missouri I think it was. The speed limit was only 55 mph back then. The trooper had my dad come back to the patrol car ( sit in the front) while running a check, then we had to drive miles to the local courthouse and pay the fine in cash before we could travel on. Not once did my dad give the trooper any attitude through all that.

 

[Tenacity]

Stagger,

Right, plus the cop with Sandra (even though he was a total a.sshole) the guy didn't even write up a ticket, it was a warning. I have been pulled over countless times by Cops and I can tell you that most of the time I have gotten out of tickets when I was CLEARLY guilty. I'm talking about doing a flat out 100 on the highway, no seat beat, improper passing, all types of shyt.

If you are usually calm, cool and professional, too many times you are let off by the Cops and told to go on your way with a verbal warning.

I mean damn, colleges want to create wasteful courses on "Beyonce" (yes, there are actual college courses about Beyonce) how about they make some damn courses to teach people how to behave when pulled over by the Cops!

 

[Stagger Lee]

No doubt. I can agree the officer became an a-hole or played hardball, but that was after she ranted and escalated the situation. He was polite and fairly professional and was about to issue just a warning before that point.

Even that case in South Carolina with officer Slager, it started out polite and professional. Then the motorist takes off running and it just went really downhill from there. Both these cases could've been completely avoided had the motorist just acted sensibly when stopped.

 

[speed dawg]

Edit: I will be back here later tonight. If the bickering continues I will close this thread.

The only personal attack in this thread was made by Jaylan in his first post. Wouldn't it be easier to just ban HIM, rather than lock all the threads he ruins? The 'bickering' (what little of it there is) started this whole deal between Boxer00 and Danger which derailed half the thread. I don't know what else you mods need to see, in order to make this correction. 90% of all hostility would go away with him.

Talk about the very DEFINITION of politically correct.

 

[Maximus Rex]

The Larger Issue is Being Missed

As a police officer myself my first thoughts on this were "Why are some officers allowed to be officers?"

http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/21/us/texas-sandra-bland-arrest/

Ms. Bland did nothing wrong. Any officer with 1/4th of a brain even ones like myself who do not smoke know that smoking cigarettes CALMS people's nerves.. And that getting pulled over is very nerving for many people.

I'd much rather have someone I pull over show me the end of a cigarette hanging from their mouth as it calms their nerves, than the end of a gun barrel either shooting me or making me have to shoot them.

When I pull people over I give them all the flexability I can. If they want to smoke, they can smoke. If they take 15 minutes to find their insurance card, that's OK. If they want to call their spouse to ask where the insurance card is, that's OK. Hell I've even let some people get out and go pi$$ before, males and females.

These traffic stops like this blow my mind...

Apparently Officer logicallefty doesn't work for a department that doesn't see the general public as a source of revenue and as arrests as a means of measuring what a patrolman is doing during the course of his tour.

And that's the underlying that everybody is missing and nobody wants to address. Police and Sheriff Departments across America use police officers and sheriff deputies as quasi tax collectors. Also since the emphasis is placed on arrests so that local politicians can have a means of quantifying lower crime statistics. Also the officer has an incentive to make arrests to further his own career in the long term. If the officer doesn't get his three summons and arrests, he's subjected to punitive measures such as not being granted off days, undesirable shifts, and not getting holidays off.

This is where the President needs to step in and demand that police chiefs and sheriffs stop escalating situations that lead to summons and unnecessary arrests.

 

[SmooveMooves]

@LogicalLefty. Man, these incidents make me have sympathy for all the officers doing their due diligence. If I recall, you were a white guy correct? Do you find your job becoming stigmatized especially when dealing with minorities?

Frequent mass shootings & police brutalities. My inner conspiracy theorist tells me something else is at play here.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

how about they make some damn courses to teach people how to behave when pulled over by the Cops!

How To Not Get Your Ass Kicked By The Police

 

[Tictac]

How To Not Get Your Ass Kicked By The Police

__________

One of my favorite Chris Rock bits!

 

[speed dawg]

And that's the underlying that everybody is missing and nobody wants to address. Police and Sheriff Departments across America use police officers and sheriff deputies as quasi tax collectors. Also since the emphasis is placed on arrests so that local politicians can have a means of quantifying lower crime statistics. Also the officer has an incentive to make arrests to further his own career in the long term. If the officer doesn't get his three summons and arrests, he's subjected to punitive measures such as not being granted off days, undesirable shifts, and not getting holidays off.

This is where the President needs to step in and demand that police chiefs and sheriffs stop escalating situations that lead to summons and unnecessary arrests.[/b]

You honestly would rather believe in a conspiracy, rather than just accept the fact that a certain segment of the population are more hostile and violent, thus commit more crimes. Not much more can be said.

All you Black Lives Matter Warriors need to go live in Somalia for a while, and ask yourselves if that is the type of police force you want. Why is this a black issue you ask? Because it is 90% black people complaining about the police.

Mods, if you can't handle this type of truth, ban me. This is a VERY clear cut issue.

 

[Maximus Rex]

You Should Be Banned

You honestly would rather believe in a conspiracy,

A conspiracy implies cover ups, things done in secrecy, etc. This sh*t is done right in the open.

rather than just accept the fact that a certain segment of the population are more hostile and violent, thus commit more crimes. Not much more can be said.

Members of law enforcement seem to prove that on a daily basis.

All you Black Lives Matter Warriors need to go live in Somalia for a while, and ask yourselves if that is the type of police force you want.

Who said anything about "black lives matter." I'm talking about the manifestly corrupt and brutal behavior that seemingly goes unchecked in police departments across America.

Why is this a black issue you ask? Because it is 90% black people complaining about the police.

Maybe it's because 90% (as you put it,) of black people are the ones that are overwhelmingly the people that are victims of savagely corrupt and murderous policemen.

Mods, if you can't handle this type of truth, ban me. This is a VERY clear cut issue.

That wouldn't be a bad idea.

 

[TheVirtualMind]

Apparently Officer logicallefty doesn't work for a department that doesn't see the general public as a source of revenue and as arrests as a means of measuring what a patrolman is doing during the course of his tour.

And that's the underlying that everybody is missing and nobody wants to address. Police and Sheriff Departments across America use police officers and sheriff deputies as quasi tax collectors. Also since the emphasis is placed on arrests so that local politicians can have a means of quantifying lower crime statistics. Also the officer has an incentive to make arrests to further his own career in the long term. If the officer doesn't get his three summons and arrests, he's subjected to punitive measures such as not being granted off days, undesirable shifts, and not getting holidays off.

This is where the President needs to step in and demand that police chiefs and sheriffs stop escalating situations that lead to summons and unnecessary arrests.

Logicallefty isn't the only officer on this site.

Stuff like what Maximus Rex posted is beyond stupid. At the place I work at, I could write 100 tickets a day and our agency sees 0% of any fees or fines collected. We also run short staffed all the time, so we try to avoid arrests as much as possible and would rather do a citation (that usually is thrown out in court, as the system here is a joke), so as not to screw over the other coworkers. When push comes to shove though, you'll get the cuffs.

Also, "quotas" are illegal to have. If an officer gets punished for "lack of paperwork," there can, and have been, legal ramifications.

You ever notice how the same people that yell out "f*ck the police!" and hate the law are the same ones that have 20+ arrests, or yell and scream when they get pulled over for doing 20+ miles over the speed limit, or are drinking that open beer right infront of the cop?

One big issue I have with the "Sandra Bland" case is that the main focus is the initial stop. She didn't die on the side of the road. She died at the jail.

Do I think the initial stop was legit? Yeah, she changed lanes without signaling. There are some days you pull over a lot of motorists in a certain area due to complaints, or looking for more than just the initial stop (looking for suspended/revoked/wanted drivers.) She didn't have her license with her either. Yet she was getting a warning. A "why I made contact with you, but you will have no record of this stop pop up when your name is ran" piece of paper. Did things escalate quickly? Yes. Nature of the job. I wasn't there, I don't know what the officer saw inside the vehicle as far as her movements. I'm not going to Monday Morning Quarterback it because there are literally hundreds of things that could have been going on. Logicallefty and I could go through the exact same scenario at the same time on two sides of the country and we will have two totally separate ways we handle it. Doesn't mean it is right or wrong. It just shows how no two officers, training, experience, knowledge, and perception are the same. Never will be.

 

[Stagger Lee]

The police tend to be heavy handed with anyone who is low class, acts aggressive and noncompliant or criminal whether they're white, black or 50 shades of brown. It's always been this way maybe worse in the past. And for the most part I don't have a problem with it. Some people need to be taught respect and behavioral modification. Progressives liberals defend bad behavior and criminals and attack free speech. That I do have a problem with.

One big issue I have with the "Sandra Bland" case is that the main focus is the initial stop. She didn't die on the side of the road. She died at the jail.

The way I see it, there's not much to talk about at the jail since all indications are she killed herself and there's nothing to talk about at the initial stop. What the agitators are really doing with regard to the initial stop is saying the police should coddle some people and just give them room to act improper. That's basically lawless.

Do I think the initial stop was legit? Yeah, she changed lanes without signaling. There are some days you pull over a lot of motorists in a certain area due to complaints, or looking for more than just the initial stop (looking for suspended/revoked/wanted drivers.) She didn't have her license with her either. Yet she was getting a warning. A "why I made contact with you, but you will have no record of this stop pop up when your name is ran" piece of paper. Did things escalate quickly? Yes.

In the dash cam video she appeared to run right through a stop sign without signaling and maybe sped down the road before the officer took pursuit.

 

[Tictac]

You moderate here.

So you know that common sense and practical experience mean nothing to SJW keyboard jockeys who know better than everyone else.

They look at a video, drop the context, make their judgements and then spew.

Living on the thin blue line is not an easy career or life choice. I admire the men and women that do it. Yes there are some bad cops out there. But I trust law enforcement to be on the 'protect and serve' side of the line. And when I have interaction with law officers, I do my best put them at ease that I am not going to make their day a bad day.

The YouTube post of Chris Rock is funny. But it has the benefit of being accurate.

 

[TheVirtualMind]

The police tend to be heavy handed with anyone who is low class, acts aggressive and noncompliant or criminal whether they're white, black or 50 shades of brown. It's always been this way maybe worse in the past. And for the most part I don't have a problem with it. Some people need to be taught respect and behavioral modification. Progressives liberals defend bad behavior and criminals and attack free speech. That I do have a problem with.



The way I see it, there's not much to talk about at the jail since all indications are she killed herself and there's nothing to talk about at the initial stop. What the agitators are really doing with regard to the initial stop is saying the police should coddle some people and just give them room to act improper. That's basically lawless.



In the dash cam video she appeared to run right through a stop sign without signaling and maybe sped down the road before the officer took pursuit.

That's one part I didn't get to see. The video I saw started right before she got pulled over, right after going through the green light and then changing lanes.

 

[Maximus Rex]

You're Making Stuff Up

Logicallefty isn't the only officer on this site.

Stuff like what Maximus Rex posted is beyond stupid.
At the place I work at, I could write 100 tickets a day and our agency sees 0% of any fees or fines collected. We also run short staffed all the time, so we try to avoid arrests as much as possible and would rather do a citation (that usually is thrown out in court, as the system here is a joke), so as not to screw over the other coworkers. When push comes to shove though, you'll get the cuffs.

Also, "quotas" are illegal to have. If an officer gets punished for "lack of paperwork," there can, and have been, legal ramifications.

Again, what we have here is cop that's in denial of the brutally and corruption that goes on in police and sheriff departments across America. Who told me that claim is "beyond stupid," my legal documents professor who was a retired lieutenant with twenty years on the force. We all know that quotas are illegal, but why is it that police unions complain about officers are under pressure to produce those numbers.

PATRICK LYNCH, PBA PRESIDENT, SAYS ENDING NYPD QUOTAS, NOT ADDING MORE OVERSIGHT, IS THE ANSWER http://www.villagevoice.com/news/pa...t-adding-more-oversight-is-the-answer-6663242

Cop denied time off because of quotas http://nypost.com/2015/02/19/cop-denied-time-off-because-of-quotas-texts/

NYPD accused of destroying evidence showing cops issued bogus summonses to meet quota http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/exclusive-nypd-accused-destroying-summons-info-article-1.2282345

You ever notice how the same people that yell out "f*ck the police!" and hate the law are the same ones that have 20+ arrests, or yell and scream when they get pulled over for doing 20+ miles over the speed limit, or are drinking that open beer right infront of the cop?

What I do notice is that the police wants the general public to turn a blind eye to their corruption, brutality, and murder of innocent civilians, and when people try to hold the police to the same level of accountability that everybody else is held to you're suddenly accused of being anti-police.

One big issue I have with the "Sandra Bland" case is that the main focus is the initial stop. She didn't die on the side of the road. She died at the jail.

The initial stop is why she was in jail.

Do I think the initial stop was legit? Yeah, she changed lanes without signaling.

The cop was tailgating her, she switched lanes to allow him to pass.

She didn't have her license with her either. Yet she was getting a warning.

Where did you where that? I would I heard most of the stop, and never once was her lack of having her license on her ever mentioned.

Did things escalate quickly? Yes. Nature of the job. I wasn't there,

The d*ckhead cop escalated the situation and exponentially made it worse.

I don't know what the officer saw inside the vehicle as far as her movements. I'm not going to Monday Morning Quarterback it because there are literally hundreds of things that could have been going on.

Now you're making sh*t up. All of this happened because he didn't like her answer when she stated that she was irritated and when she had the audacity to question as to why she had to put out her cigarette in her car.