Sales

[Tempest]

hey,

i'm 18 and am currently working a $9/hour job at a car dealership. i've been talking to quite a few of the salesman at my work, and they've been telling me about their experiences with sales. this one salesman has inspired me to get into it. not necessarily as a car salesman, but to start out in sales by selling suites, or some kind of retail such as computers, vacuums, or whatever.

do any of you guys have experience with sales jobs?

where have you worked? what information can you tell me about it? where should i start?

i've heard that commision jobs totally kick wage jobs ass.

this is something i'm really interested in doing. not only that, but i find it VERY beneficial. i will get the opportunity to meet new people, interact with people, learn how to communicate and develop my social skills.

what do you guys think?

thanks in advance.

 

[CapiCrimini]

If you do go into sales look into NLP and stuff like that... it can help you out a lot... my other post about cults... in the little research I did almost every cult leader of succesful legal cults was a salesmen at one point or another...


Body Language is also nice...

I think if you enjoy it it would be a great career

 

[Tempest]

yeah, i'm definetly willing to get into NLP. i'm just curious to know what kind of sales fields there are. which is the best to get into? which is the best to start out as? HOW do you start out, without having any experience?

 

[Sato21m]

yeah me 2 i started working at a jelewry store selling gold diamonds and very good watches i want some tips on this as well

 

[MackJr]

Originally posted by Tempest
yeah, i'm definetly willing to get into NLP. i'm just curious to know what kind of sales fields there are. which is the best to get into? which is the best to start out as? HOW do you start out, without having any experience?

just watch out for the NLP people themselves. they're pretty nasty, having the ability to manipulate people, and they are a cult, though not really a religious one.

 

[Gangster Of Love]

My suggestion is that you find out what type of sales training your emloyer offers. Make sure you are with a reputable company that invests money in their people. When you are in training, learn from the material presented. Do not try it your own way, at least not at first, until you have become very good and it comes natural.

Sales is a great carreer where only the sky is the limit as to how much money you can make. It can also be very rewarding if you are a people person. There are several fields. You can get into car sales, real estate, kitchen ware, loans, etc. The key is to get very good at what you do. If you are qualified, as long as you enjoy it, you will do good.

I also suggest you pick up a few sales programs on audio and some self-help material to get you going. Search for stuff on Ebay. Jim Rohn, Brian Tracy, Tom Hopkins, Denis Waitley, Anthony Robbins, Jay Abraham, they all have programs on persuasion and sales. As suggested, some NLP can help you learn a lot about people.

I have done sales type of jobs and have found them very rewarding. I have also studied many of the experts' materials, done seminars, etc. If you have any questions, just email me or PM me.

 

[diplomatic_lies]

Look at the company and their employees. If they employ deadbeats, then the commission can't be that good....(or their product sucks, or the market is saturated, etc).

Commission-based sales is improving in terms of ethics (no more slick willy, although Clinton's doing well selling his biography).

 

[splinterkb]

My dad sells dental supplies, and works on commision. He pulls in about 110k a year.

 

[Pook]

Don't listen to these people talking about NLP to improve 'sales'. And many people think they are in 'sales' by sitting at a counter. That isn't sales.

Trying to improve my own 'financial education', I took up sales. Like many, I had the impression that salesmanship is something similiar to 'nlp' or slicky little tricks. I never could have been so wrong.

Sales is about work ethic. You must see so many doors. I remember one day I sold NOTHING. I went to 50 doors that day. NOTHING! I decided to do 'one more' and I sold on 51.

What type of sales was I doing? Well, let's just say the Fortune 500 companies were outsourcing their sales. At&T, Wells Fargo, Nike, etc. etc. etc. My target was the small business owner (ugh! Small business owners think they are rocket scientists. No wonder they outsourced to us. No sane person would want to deal with these people on a regular basis. They all think they are 'perfect').

But I would have my own territory and drive to it. You have to make lots of cold calls, lots of 'catch the decision maker' and so on. And it was all on commission. If you don't sell, you don't get paid.

Gangster of Love is absolutely correct. Sales is the blood of business. If you get good at sales, you can do literally anything. I've seen ads looking for people with even less than a decade experience in sales to leap up to vice president in a company. Everything in business revolves around sales.

Salesmanship is not about being slick and wily. It is really about the work ethic and (dare I say) helping people. The best people to sell to are other sales people because they know how tough the job is. (And there is a reason why when you meet a true salesman that they are 'laughable' and always seem to know everyone's names.)

So why did I quit sales? You will hear lots of ads and people say you can make lots of money in sales. This is very true. But my problem with sales was the time. I was working 10 hours a day, standing and walking around all day, driving city to city (in my own car), in Texas August heat on the streets. Then came the roadtrips and other things the company threw at me.

I don't mind being someone's leverage (for now) but it became ridiculous. I value my time more than my money (since I can always make more money, I can't make more time).

Pharmaceautical sales probably is the most involved. Not only do you have to sale, you must research the products at night. Sounds fun? I've sold and dealt with many doctors and I disklike dealing with their stupid egos. But you'll have to face that if you go that route.

Real Estate sales means you MUST work on the weekend. Sounds fun? No.

You can make a lot of money in sales (because most people aren't willing to do it). But the price of it is time. You'll have to gauge which one is more important to you.

 

[legolas]

Pook, are you saying that you actually took Kiyosaki up on his teachings and went to do sales or is that your profession? Because if you did, WOW hats off to you man!!! At least someone doesn't just read them, if you know what I mean

 

[diplomatic_lies]

Ergh, the worst part is selling to the larger city companies. You have to get through a billion channels before getting to the right person, and half the time someone along the way can easily stop you with a no.

Or worse is if you make a great pitch to someone, they're sold on your product, but then they need to check with their superiors to see if they can get the funding for it!!!!

The only thing that pulled me through was knowing I got 100% commission.

 

[Tempest]

again, thanks for all the useful tips.

it's been about a week now and i'm still interested in doing this!(glad it wasn't a one-day thing).

anyways, for Pook:

how was the money? i'm not exactly sure if i'm interested in getting into door-to-door sales, yet, but depending on the money and time, i'll look into that. ones of the salesmens at my work was telling me that his son is 21 and goes door-to-door selling beauty supplies rakes in about 45k a year.

i may be leaning more towards electronic sales, or retail stores. they do all the advertising for you. they're already lured in once they step foot inside the store. the items basically sell themselves.. it's not much selling, actually, heh. i was at FutureShop (top canadian electronics store), and spent time just talking to all the salesmen. some of them enjoyed their job, some didn't. they all told me basically selling the warranty/guarantee on the items is what keeps their jobs. one guy told me that he makes $15 an hour on his BAD days, and he was speaking really badly of the job. i'm not sure if that's good money or not, but it's not bad for my age. he recommended to NOT get into sales, and to go to school. his heart wasn't into it.

there are several aspects of the field that i like.

1) the commision - like someone mentioned, there is NO LIMIT to how much you can make. it all depends on how motivated you are.

2) many opportunities - there are selling clothing, electronics, cars, real estate, hearing aid, vacuums, etc... many different things that you can get into, depending on what you're interested in.

3) beneficial - it benefits you in EVERY aspect of your life, i'm sure. you learn how to talk to people. how to read body language. how to develop rapport. build your communication skills and approaches. surely i'll get the opportunity to meet some great people along the way. and as far as i'm concerned, the communication part is what i'd like to improve in my game.

4) no required schooling - i'm sure you probably need experience, but the no-schooling factor is pretty cool.

these are a few of the things that are keeping me into this field. in fact, i don't see many downsides. pook mentioned that the time was an issue with him. yeah, i'm sure it was.. but what about getting into car sales, or electronics, or whatever? crappy pay?

another thing that i like about it is you can get into management, as well. work at a big company for a few years and eventually they'll promote you to manager or a higher status. not sure if you'll necessarily make more money, but i'm sure it's easier work.

any thoughts?

 

[Pook]

legalos said,

Pook, are you saying that you actually took Kiyosaki up on his teachings and went to do sales or is that your profession? Because if you did, WOW hats off to you man!!! At least someone doesn't just read them, if you know what I mean

Yup. By Nature I am more of an 'artistic' type of person (plays, music and all that). So I had the mentality that being a salesman was 'beneath me' or not meant for me. Lots of artistic oriented people think that way about business orientations (such as sales). It also seems to go the other way, business oriented people may thumb their nose on the artistic oriented.

Ever notice that Kiyosaki also says to start your own business in your free time (and not quit your day job)? Yet, Kiyosaki quit his day job to make his businesses.

What I learned (maybe this pertains just to my own experience) was that sales does not leave much free time. I don't see how its possible to start a business while doing sales, as sales can be so draining.

I believe Kiyosaki reccomends going into sales mostly because of the work ethic sales demands. You also have to work with people constantly (in my case, 100% of it was cold selling).

diplomatic_lies[/b[

Yeah. Playing 'catch the decision maker' is not fun. But what really got old to me were the attitudes some of these small business owners had (when I mean small, I am talking about a privately owned shop). Some of them are nice. But most of them believe they are ROCKET SCIENTISTS and were perfectionists. I also got tired of the COWS (Can't Operate Without Spouse). Many male business owners have their wives handle all the finances and they are COMPLETELY whipped. They can't even make a decision on THEIR company without her approval. (And then they wonder why their business plan isn't BOLD enough! Amazing!)

Tempest

Go ahead and give it a try. You'll never know unless you try. And even though the sales experience I had wasn't for me, I learned more from that then years in college.

I didn't do residence sales. It was mostly small business door-to-door sales. But the same themes apply.

I will give you this tip, that will certainly guarentee you to be hired for sales anywhere.

During the interview, you WILL be asked, "Why do you want to go into sales?"

If the company is about cars or beauty supplies, you DO NOT say "Because I like cars" or "Because I like beauty supplies."

You say this:

"Because I want to make money."

Chaching! A light will come in interviewer's eyes. If he asks you about sales management, as a future possibilty, you basically focus your answer on gathering as much money as you can from a territory.

another thing that i like about it is you can get into management, as well. work at a big company for a few years and eventually they'll promote you to manager or a higher status. not sure if you'll necessarily make more money, but i'm sure it's easier work.

They told me that the same. If I stayed with the job, within 9 to 13 months I would be making 100k as salary.

They are, of course, trying to sell and close you. They want you to be interested.

In sales, the field is always the focus. Even in sales management, you must still have that connection to the field. You will probably go out with young struggling recruits and help them out. Even as sales manager, you have to teach and still be enthusiastic about what you're doing. The field is still the focus.

What happened with me is that I began to dislike my particular job in the field. It's not selling, I disliked, it was that it wasn't my product and I just got bored with it all.

If you like the sales and the field, go for it. But if you don't, don't think that you'll be 'promoted out of it'. As sales manager, you must keep a connection to the field. And how can you teach other people about the field if you are unenthusiastic about it?

Bottom line: if you like it, great! If you don't like it, don't think sales manager will let you lose that connection to the field. It won't.

Here's a sales experience you might find helpful and illuminating.

http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying/articles/42962/article.html

 

[Sato21m]

do you guys have anything for sales in jewelers

 

[CapiCrimini]

THere's a song by the Monkees called salesman... just rang to mind...

I do agree with Pook about NLP not being important to being in sales mainly because if your in sales long enough you learn it on your own by what works and what doesn't... BUT... being able to understand body language and what a person is thinking doesn't hurt...

Sales is a long and hard buisness too... takes a lot of rejections to get one yes...

 

[legolas]

Originally posted by Pook
legalos said,

Yup. By Nature I am more of an 'artistic' type of person (plays, music and all that). So I had the mentality that being a salesman was 'beneath me' or not meant for me. Lots of artistic oriented people think that way about business orientations (such as sales). It also seems to go the other way, business oriented people may thumb their nose on the artistic oriented.

Ever notice that Kiyosaki also says to start your own business in your free time (and not quit your day job)? Yet, Kiyosaki quit his day job to make his businesses.

What I learned (maybe this pertains just to my own experience) was that sales does not leave much free time. I don't see how its possible to start a business while doing sales, as sales can be so draining.

I believe Kiyosaki reccomends going into sales mostly because of the work ethic sales demands. You also have to work with people constantly (in my case, 100% of it was cold selling).

Well if you read his books, and I have read quite a few of them, he explains that he worked at Xerox as....guess what....a salesman. He also says that every entrepreneur is a salesman at heart. I've never been in hardcore, comission-driven sales, but I have done some low-key sales at Sears. Not the same thing, but close enough. The rejection is not nearly as hurting, since you get mostly pre-qualified leads. I'm actually surprised that you DID something instead of continuing to read his books. I have a thing with taking action I don't want to get into.

And the thing about starting a business part-time, I think what he wants to say is that you've got to play it safe at some level, but he does mention getting a job to learn a skill not just to collect a paycheck.

 

[Pook]

Originally posted by legolas
Well if you read his books, and I have read quite a few of them, he explains that he worked at Xerox as....guess what....a salesman.

Yes. But he had to quit his job as sales rep and sales manager in order to start businesses. Why? Because sales, from I've learned, can deliver you lots of money but it takes lots of time.

You don't hear about too many small businesses being start up by sales reps in their spare time. Because they don't have any spare time.

It would be fascinating to find out the timeflow, of how rich people use their time, both when they are successful and when they were starting out. How they invested their time seems to be more critical then how they invested their money.

 

[legolas]

Originally posted by Pook
You don't hear about too many small businesses being start up by sales reps in their spare time. Because they don't have any spare time.

You have a point there Pook. I haven't heard of any sales reps starting businesses. If I remember correct, during the first season of The Apprentice, the sales rep who went all the way to the semis was anything but entreprenurial. All he knew about was selling hard, so Trump let him go to give the job to the REAL entrepreneur.

It would be fascinating to find out the timeflow, of how rich people use their time, both when they are successful and when they were starting out. How they invested their time seems to be more critical then how they invested their money.

This is very interesting indeed. I hadn't thought about it that way, but now I see that I tend to misuse my free time. I remember listening to Richad Bandler say that some millionaires actually gave themselves a job in order to structure their time. The whole point of getting rich is to get away from having to have a job

 

[Deep Dish]

I know of one sales rep who started his own company. He recruited me because I had known him a few years prior but I left after ten months. He was all style but no content. He grew his company to make half a million a year in gross profit but he seemingly operated with no business plan. He spoke with a double tongue and from day to day his "vision" of what the company was about and where he'd like it to go would change. He floundered money on totally unnecessary things, such as a $100,000 three-monitors-in-one computer system. Yes, he enthroned himself as a rocket scientist. When you questioned his decisions, he condescendingly spoke down to you like you were an idiot. He promised profit sharing but that always never materialized. Frustrated, I threw in the towel and was fired while I was looking for another job.

On the other hand, I have an uncle who is a self-made multi-millionaire who began life as a barber and then started his own pool store which grew to be a large chain of large pool stores in the Chicago area. His philosophy was to work hard and be frugal. For the past few decades he has traveled the world and basically whatever he wanted, but he still works. I don't know about now moreso than in the past since he's now of the retirement age.

 

[Snatchmaster]

Ok friends, if you want to know what a career in sales is like, watch "Death of a Salesman." Although it takes place in a different era, the lesson remains.

If you decide to pursue this type of job, remember: you are only as good as your last sale.

I spent many years in sales - had good years and bad. I've sold everything from credit card insurance (total scam) to cars to advertising to market research to politicians.

Now some advice for those of you just starting out.

If you want to be successful, you will work your ass off. The best years I had I was working 60-80 hours a week.

Be wary of easy money! There are lots of sales jobs out there that are bs. Avoid any job where they make you buy the product (MLM), or where they hire you solely upon your ability to pass a personality test.

I started selling cars when I was 22. It was an easy money, dead-end job. I showed up, people walked in, I made more money than I should have at that age. It had me living in the moment.

Think about what you want to be doing 20 years from now. Do you really want to be standing around a car lot all day and night, all year, year after year?

For that matter, do you really want a job that has you on the road away from your family 4-5 nights a week?

Tip: pick one area/industry to make your career in. After floating around, I became an expert in marketing. Then I started selling advertising and I was able to use my marketing expertise to become a consultant to my (potential) clients. My true love is politics, so I turned my marketing and sales skills to public speaking and promoting politicos and issues.

Research what is happening in the industry that interests you.

Cars: A used Isuzu is now more expensive than a new one. The US market is saturated in cars, yet the maunfacturers keep making more. A buyer's market kills you profit.

Real Estate: More people become real estate agents each year than houses go on the market. Can you be successful? Yes, but why enter a shrinking market?

Medical devices/Pharm sales: Yup, good money. Everyone wants in. Requires a BA with science and a Julio.

What??? Julio??? Haven't you ever heard the expression:

It's not what you know, It's Julio (who you know).

Stock broker/Insurance agent: Potential for very good money if you can handle making 50-100 cold calls a day. No reason a smart and ambitious sort couldn't make six figures if he takes the time to build his book. Requires BA

Fortune 500 companies: Nice money, good opprtunities for promotion, you know they can make payroll and they provide you with good benefits. Requires a BA.

Sears/radio shack/target: Look, I know they call this sales, and technically it is, but your upside is really limited. Same with any type of sales where you wait for customers to walk in the door. Even with commission, it's not that much better than upselling to the biggie size at McDonalds.

If you want to do inside sales, then get on a telephone where you can reach many and make some cash.

Now for something very important:

If you just want to do an 8 hour day, then DON"T do sales! You can make more money working in an office as a personal assistant than you can selling that set of jumper cables at Sears.

For you 40-hour week guys, learn to type. Also, avoid the jobs that have lots of women doing them - the pay will be less. Example: Public Relations - used to pay fairly well until lots of women went into the field. It drove the wage down. Remember, in the US women earn about .65c per every dollar that a man makes.

Bottom Line: A sales career should not be viewed as an alternative to University. While I have friends who are high school drop-outs that hustle the hard sell and make good money, they are few and they are tired.

Don't be like Willy Loman. Get the degree first. The options are better and the money will follow.