Read this becker & others, need opinion!!!

[Brasco]

Their is this girl that I hang out with but best friends by far, she calls me up to invite me to her place or she pops in to visite me, this happens at least once every week to week and a half. I moved here 1 year ago and started talking to her then but she was already seeing I guy so I stayed back, they got serious and then I didnt see her till 2 months ago, she started her visits and phone calls again, the wierd part is that she is still going out with buddy. I already talked about this girl in a previous post with becker, it was moved into "DJ tips" called "why the friends thing can work". you can go there for more detail on the situation if you are interested.

This friday I was invited to a friends camp. Normaly I go to my home town on weekends because this little town is so small their is not even a bar. I do know a couple of people and one of them was having a party at his camp friday so I decided to stay down instead of going home. This girl that I am talking about in the first paragragh sees that I am home for the weekend and calls me from her work to see what I was doing tonight, this is saturday after the friday night camp party. I was not home when she called so she left a message, this is the first time she ever calls me from work to invite me to her place, her boyfriend is from out of town about 2 hours out she only invites me over when he is not around. She used the hockey game that was on TV for an excuse to invite me over. She is not a big hockey fan.

She told me to call her at her place after 5, if i was going so I called her at 6:30 and said that i would go. I was not there 5 minutes and this is what she asked me " " Where were you friday night? I was on my way back from work and I seen your car was home then i stoped to the store for something and when i came out i was going to pop in to say hello but you were gone, I figured you were just gone to your home town for the weekend but then i seen your car was back saturday morning on my way to work" " you could tell it really buged her that i was up to something down here and she didnt know with who. I told her I went to a friends camp, didnt say a name or if it was male or female. "Ohh" she said "who's camp?" Then when I seen that she really wanted to know who I was with and not where i was at i told her who's camp it was and that it was a party. She almost looked a bit relieved when she knew i was not out on some date.

What would you think of that? Plus that friday night when she said she was going to pop in but I was gone, is bull**** because her boyfriend was down friday night i seen his car there on the way to the party. She never comes around me when he is around. So that was just a reason to ask me where i was at.

 

[phloyd]

does her bf know she hangs out with you when he's not around?
put yourself in his position

is this the kind of girl you would want to be with?

 

[becker]

Hey Brasco, I can see what phloyd is saying, and that's the usual argument here. I don't know if the advice you seek is whether you should make a move or not, but here's the situation. You have a girl who shows interest in you, but you don't want to make a move because she's involved. On the other hand, she's probably not going to dump her BF either until she knows that you're interested. Its that whole difficult web thing that you're entangled in.

You seem to have 2 options, depending on the type of guy you are. You can either keep waiting and just be patient while doing other things, and just let her know that you can't get involved with her because she has a BF, and see if she dumps him.

The other option is to be up front with her and tell her "look, it seems to me like we're doing too much stuff together in light of the fact that you have a BF, which makes me uncomfortable". See how she reacts to that. If she really likes you, she'll probably dump him for you. If not, at least you know that she was just playing games.

 

[Brasco]

Thanks for your opinions phloyd & becker. Normaly I would agree with you phloyd, if me and her BF were two from the same pile I would agree but we are two totally different people. He is a big time chump, i am more of a CCC (cool, calm, collective) and funny at times when i am in the mood. Even a friend of hers was telling me one day that she can't see why she is going out with the guy because even him and her are two opposites. I didnt bring up the conversation with her friend, she just started talking to me about him one day. She just started seeing him before I moved there so she didnt know me that well when they actually hooked up. To answer your question phloyd, the BF doesnt know we hang out when he is gone.

Very good options becker, i was thinking last night about the whole situation before I wrote this post. I was thinking about telling her that i feel uncomfortable hanging out alot while she has a boyfriend, but we don't really hang out all that much maybe once every week or 1 1/2 weeks sometimes two weeks.

So now I am thinking about the first option you told me. Some how I am going to work on a conversation that will leed to cheating or going after someone thats taken. Then I will say something like " I don't like to get involved with a girl when she has a boyfriend, not until she dumps him " . I think she would read between the lines and figure it out. If not then i am just going to forget about the whole thing but keep talking to her when she comes around and see what happens.

Its a hard situation, she is showing signs of interest. Saturday night when she asked where and who I was with, to me that is a sign of interest, don't you think?

 

[MrNiceGuy]

How much do you know about her relationship with her boyfriend?
How much does she talk about him too you?
Do they aruge?
Does she ever complain about him?

If you dont know anything ask a few casual questions, just about how they're getting on or something. Its a subtle sign that you're interested in her but not at all too comitting.

Now if it does sound like either the relationship is on the rocks or that she's bored of him you should definitely try and move in, I can't say how, (depends on far too many things) but make some moves next time you're alone together, it sounds like shes definitely interested.

A friend of mine got together with one of her male friends when he came round to see her after a bust up with her old boyfriend, he offered a sholder to cry on and now they've been together almost 2 years..

 

[phloyd]

This is a hard situation. What are you looking for from this girl exactly? It seems to me (from reading your other posts) that you want something more than just a friend.

The main problem I see is that ( this has happened to me a few times) if a girl will cheat on her bf with you, she will have no problem cheating on you with someone else.

Now I realize that nothing sexual has happened yet (as far as you have said) however, could it?

I agree with becker in that you need to find out where you stand with her (and you need to do it ASAP). Ask her about the boyfriend. Don't waste too much time analysing and wondering when or if she will break up with him.

I'm not trying to bring you down, but I wish someone would have told me before I had to get burned the hard way.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

I sort of agree with the point about if a girl will cheat on her bf to go out with you then whats to stop her cheating on you?
Well nothing of course, but this sort of negative attitude gets you nowhere, not being an AFC seems to be all about taking risks, not wondering "what if she rejects me/cheats on me/laughs at me" etc.

To take the argument to extremes, you could say its not worth getting in a ltr or getting married because your partner might die before you and the grief would be terrible. Everything has to come to an end sometime, just try and do your best to enjoy it while it lasts.

Also, the sad fact is, girls are like monkeys, they won't let go of one branch before they've got hold of another, there seems to be a lot of stigma attatched to being single if you're a woman and it seems (sadly for us single guys) that a lot of women are happy to stick with a mediocre relationship than run the risk of being single for a while, while they look for a really good one.

 

[Brasco]

Thanks guys, first I will answer Mr niceguy questions in one answer. She NEVER talks to me about him, NEVER!!! That should sum it up. I am thinking about asking a few questions about their relationship, since she is asking me questions about my pass times, like what I done last friday.

Nothing sexual happen between me and her yet, just alot of eye contact, I would catch her looking at me alot saturday night when we were watching the hockey game, out of the corner of my eye. Every once in a while I would look her straight in the eye when I caught her looking at me. She would keep the eye contact for a few seconds then look back at the TV. I think something could happen even with her still going out with buddy but I won't go that far, not until she breaks it up, if she does.

Your right Mr niceguy, you can't run away from a posible relationship just because she might do the same to you. Thats life, it can happen with any girl. Every relationship is an experience and with experience comes wisdom. I am still young, 27. I think she is just one of them chicks that likes to hang on to that branch until she knows she has a safe branch in the other hand. I am the other branch she is holding but she doesnt know how safe it is yet. Maybe its time to let her know its safe.

 

[becker]

Brasco, MrNiceGuy basically summed up a lot of what I was going to say. I'll just say it again that in the end, there really is no way to predict whether a girl will ever leave you for another guy, even if she has never done it before. The probability probably doesn't change significantly unless you're just the absolute love of her life. It's like tossing a coin. Just because you got heads 20 times in a row doesn't mean the 21st time is definitely going to be heads again.

After reading my last post again, I think that definitely you should probably go with making it clear that she has a BF, so there's no chance you're going to even go there. Then make sure she understands that. This puts the ball in her court, and she has to actually make the decisions and lets her know that you're not just blowing her off because you're not interested. Somtimes showing too little interest just turns a person off completely, unless they're totally desperate.

I'm in the same position now, except that I'm not hanging out with the girl too much at all. Not even to the extent that you're hanging out with this girl, which is not very much. I don't think this girl has as high IL for me as this girl does for you, since the girl I know has been involved for 4+ years, which is almost like marriage. I just back off there.

 

[Brasco]

Your right becker, I think its time to let her know that if she wants to get to know me better she has to dump buddy. She is starting to call and pop in more often, it seems now I hear from her at least once a week sometimes twice a week. I was over to her place saturday night and I seen her today at the store and she asked what i was doing tonight I told her I was not up to too much, she said she will pop in to visite me, today is only tuesday. The same happen last week. I am thinking her BF must of finaly found a job, because he aint around as much. I am going to ask her tonight if he found a job yet. Depending on the vibes I get from her tonight I might even go as far as to ask her how things are going between them.

I will give you another update tonight when she leaves, to tell you how it went. Stay tuned, hahaha!!!!

 

[Brasco]

hmmmmmmmm........its 7:30 PM and she never called yet, she said she might come over it was not for sure, maybe something came up, like her BF. She might show up later, doesnt really matter to me.

 

[becker]

Too many games, I hate that. You should probably let her know that you like to be up front with people and don't like people who play games, just in case she thinks that you're trying to play games with her. Make it sound as if you don't care whether she actually likes you or not, but just spare the game playing.

 

[Brasco]

Your right becker, its time to get things out in the open. When I passed by her place this morning on my way to work, I noticed her BF was down. Chances are she knew he was coming down, so that tells me she is playing mind games with me. A simple phone call to say she can't make it would have been good enough, I'm not going to think about it no longer, next time we meet up she will see a different side of me, I won't be a prick to her but she will know where I stand.

 

[phloyd]

I think you're on the right track Brasco. A similar thing happened to me last summer. There is this girl that I work with who had this boyfriend. However there was always a lot of flirting and kino action going on between me and her. Finally, she tells me that she broke up with her bf. We started to hang out more often and the kino at work started to get really out of control. Nothing sexual had happened yet, but I knew it was only a matter of time.

The wierd thing was that her ex bf was always popping up. One night me and her, her roomate and another guy from work went bowling. Well, her ex comes along as well. I felt a little akward about the whole situation but just had fun and made the best of it.

The next day I asked her what the deal was with this guy. She told me that that they had decided that they would never work out together but they were still sleeping together.( ******** for "we're fvck buddies")

At this point I quit giving her any attention or hanging out. I was pissed at first but at least I knew what was up. She kept asking what was wrong and I said "nothing, why?".

Anyway fast forward to now. She has a new bf and she still flirts with me. It's kind of a crazy kino experiment to me now, but she is definatly not ltr material to me.

You still may have a good chance with this girl. Find out whats going on and use your gut to go from there.

 

[Oscar Wilde]

Originally posted by phloyd


The next day I asked her what the deal was with this guy. She told me that that they had decided that they would never work out together but they were still sleeping together.( ******** for "we're fvck buddies")

At this point I quit giving her any attention or hanging out. I was pissed at first but at least I knew what was up. She kept asking what was wrong and I said "nothing, why?".

Anyway fast forward to now. She has a new bf and she still flirts with me. It's kind of a crazy kino experiment to me now, but she is definatly not ltr material to me.

You still may have a good chance with this girl. Find out whats going on and use your gut to go from there.

Women are bitches!

Gawddamn!

Oscar.

 

[becker]

Originally posted by phloyd


The wierd thing was that her ex bf was always popping up. One night me and her, her roomate and another guy from work went bowling. Well, her ex comes along as well. I felt a little akward about the whole situation but just had fun and made the best of it.

The next day I asked her what the deal was with this guy. She told me that that they had decided that they would never work out together but they were still sleeping together.( ******** for "we're fvck buddies")

Wow, that's a joke. If I were in that position, I'd just use the situation as a way to test different theories like how to get a girl to like you more or less. At best, I'd use her as a guinea pig to test the different DJ theories, since there's absolutely no way I'd ever get into a LTR with a girl like that.

 

[Brasco]

Thats very intersesting phloyd!! We don't get into any heavy kino, there has been a little bit but nothing worth talking about. She is way to secretive about her BF. She never and I mean never talks to me about him, that is very unusual for a chick. I have been friends and still am friends with a couple chicks with boyfriends and thats all they talk about, but I am cool with that because we are just friends.

I will know whats going on within the next week I hope. I just have to wait till she pops in again, never know it might be tonight.

 

[gt95ab]

I have a slightly different opinion........ I think you are totally being used by this women. She "knows" you want her and she is totally stringing you along. She has the best of both worlds, on one hand she has her boyfriend and then she has you, the surrogate boyfriend, the guy that gives her the things that the boyfriend doesn't. What tipped me to this was when you said on one of your later posts about "waiting" for her phone call. i.e. it's 7:30 and she hasn't called yet. What the h@ll is that, how is wondering whether or not she phones you being a DJ, to me that is borderline AFC. YOU are treating HER like the prize by waiting for her to dump this guy, and your totally being subtly manipulated. You said in your post that it didn't matter to you, but if it REALLY didn't matter to you, you wouldn't have wondered in the first place.

One last question, lets imagine that she dumps this guy and goes out with you and lets say you went home alone one weekend. Don't tell me that your not going to be thinking in the back of your head about what this girl is up to and who is she hanging around with and not telling you about. Your setting yourself up for a jealousy trap if anything happens with this girl. If you do go out with her, you are always going to wonder if she is "hanging" around some guy in the same way she is "hanging" around with you now when she has a boyfriend. Now think about that for a while and tell me what you think. Sounds like she is an camouflaged attention wh0re who is getting the attention from you that she is not getting from her boyfriend. I wish I could give you better advice, but I don't think this will work out in the long run, these things rarely do.

The ethical DJ - gt95ab

 

[Brasco]

Hello gt95ab, thanks for your input on the situation. I have to ask you a question regarding your post.

What makes you think that she "knows" I want her? I never call her , never pop in unless she invites me over, and treat her about the same way I would a male friend, except I am a bit more polite around her then I would be around a male friend. Well there was a little bit of kino between me and her but nothing serious, more just joking around. Sometimes I don't even except her offers to do something with her. If I have something planed when she calls I don't change my plans for her. I am not saying I don't want are friendship to become something more but I don't show my feelings towards her at all ( what little feelings I have towards her), not even bodylanguage signs, my friends call me "CCC" cool, calm & collective and thats no joke. I was cool just being friends with her because she is a cool chick to hang around with. She is the one that showed the signs of interest in me, thats what got me thinking that she might want something more. Maybe I am wrong, maybe she just wants to be friends with me. Read the very first post in this thread, about the friday night thing, now if that aint showing signs of interest, what is? I am talking to another chick in town and I think she got wind of it, that might be the reason she called me from work saturday afternoon to invite me over.

I don't recall me saying "waiting" for a phone call, she said she might pop in for a visite and she didn't, a phone call would have been nice because thats something I would do no matter who it is, female or male friend. I was not going anywhere anyway, it was on a tuesday night but she didn't know that. Maybe I would of gone somewhere if she would of called to say she wasn't coming over. Even if i was desperatly waiting for her to call, how would she know that?

I have to admit that it might look like I am in AFC mode by the way I talk on this forum, but for you guys to give opinions on a situation you have to know as much as posible. I am not struck on this chick, just puzzled on the way she acts.

Now that I got that out of the way I will get to the reason why I came to this post tonight. This evening I went to the gas station to fill up my car because I am leaving after work tommorow. I had a CD that belonged to her and i told her I would drop it off before the weekend came around, since I pass by her place to get to the gas station I poped in to drop it off. I seen her BF"s car was over there but I didn't care I poped in anyway. Her boyfriend knows we hang around once in a while because he showed up one time unexpected when I was over there. When I pulled in to the driveway her BF was outside waiting for the dog to pee. He didn't seem to happy to see me but he still talked to me. He told me he got a job today, its only a 1/2 hour from where she lives, so guess what? He will be permently moving in with her because he lives over an hour away from his new job. After he told me that she seen me outside talking to him so she came out and I passed her the CD. She did not seem comfortable at all seeing me and him talking also me being there. I didnt stay long anyway, I even left my car running when I pulled in.

So now that I know he is going to be around all the time now, I don't expect to see her much anymore. I don't want her to be around me much anyway. From what I seen tonight I don't think he wants me and her hanging out, well I guess you can't blame the guy. I don't mind being friends with chicks that have BF but when the BF is not cool with it I rather it not happen. Not that I am afraid of the guy, I could tare him apart in two seconds. If she does still pop in for her little visits I am going to tell her that I don't think we should be hanging out, that I feel uncomfortable. If she wants me she will break things off with him and if not, then the h@ll with it.

I am talking to another chick that is single, she is the shy type so I am still trying to figure her out a little before I make the move. Also I am going home this weekend (long weekend), I will be meeting up with a f*ck buddy, can't wait!! Later!!

 

[Brasco]

Well becker, its all out in the open now. I seen her yesterday outside of the store. When she seen me walking outside of the store she ran out behind me to talk to me. This is how it went.


Her: Hi Jack(not my real name)
Me: Hi Kim (hers neither)
Her: I havent been in to see you lately, been really busy.
Me: I've been really busy myself.
Her: I will try and pop in some day to say hi when I can get a chance.
Me: Don't bother taking time out of your busy schedual for me, I am doing my own thing. Plus your BF is living with you now and from the vibes I got from him when I droped that CD off to you, I don't think he wants you and I talking to one another. Maybe its best if we just don't hang out anymore. If you want to be with somebody thats that jealous then thats up to you but I don't want to be in the middle of it. Your a great person to be around Kim and its been fun. If you and him break up then your more then welcome to pop in, thats if I am still single.

Her: (does not know what to say) Well...........its to bad you feel that way Jack. Your right, my BF is a bit jealous and ask me what was going on between me and you. I told him nothing.
Me: I take it you telling him was not good enough, that should tell you something. I got to go, bye Kim!!!
Her: Byeee(with a really sad face)


I figured I would get her out of my mind, like I said from the start I was not love struck on this chick but I would of liked to get to know her better. I can't afford to spend any more time on her while she is still with him, now that he is moved in. Who knows maybe someday we will end up a couple but for now, NEXT.

Like I said becker, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesnt. In this case I didnt but it might work on the next one.