Poor social skills = 90% of the problem? Now what do I do?

[MrJibbles]

Ever since I was in junior high, I have been a very shy, introverted kid. Throughout my high school and early university years, I was always very withdrawn, unpopular, and had few friends. I have zero sexual experience with the opposite sex.

Eventually it reached the point where I realized I needed to break out of my shell and learn to focus outward. I tried taking all sorts of advice from people about my horrendous social skills. For example, I took up a job as a cashier at a grocery store. This forced me to make small talk with customers and interact with more people, in general. Even after months of working there, my social skills were still pretty bad. Later, I got a job as a salesman. People said this would force me to talk to people more. It did, but my social skills still remained poor. I can make small talk with people for a few minutes, but that's about it. I have no idea how to establish rapport and trust with people and connect with them on a deeper level.

I don't know how to maintain a friendship. I don't know how to set up times to hang out with people, "fit in", etc. This problem is especially bad with women. The only date I've ever been on was with a girl in high school. It was very awkward the entire time, and the girl ended up friendzoning me.

I have tried positive reframes, affirmations, "seeing myself as the prize", and all these other types of PUA gimmicks. I have read The Game, Book of Pook, Mystery Method, etc. I'm afraid to say they're all very gimmicky and haven't worked for me. If anything, they just make come off as an incongruent, "fake", overly self-assured douche with narcissistic tendencies. The last girl couple of girls who I tried to pursue called me a "nice guy", friendzoned me (obviously), and one of them said she liked talking to me because she found me "weird." I tried seeking help from family, so some of my female cousins tried helping me out by introducing me to their friends. From that, I met many girls, but my lack of social skills prevented the interactions from going anywhere. My relations with women just seem to never naturally progress or escalate.

My entire family thinks I'm "weird" too. They have stopped talking to me and distance themselves from me whenever they can. I once sent some inappropriate messages to girls on facebook, and everyone who I'm socially connected to found out. Now all my cousins think I'm messed up. I tried to talking to girls on facebook, online, etc., but all to no avail. I have been rejected by over 50 women in the past three months or so.

I've been on anti-anxiety meds. Didn't work. Been on 5 different brands of antidepressants. Didn't work. Tried drinking at parties. Worked great the first few times, until I became an alcoholic and just killed my confidence even more. Tried weed. Made the anxiety worse. Tried psychotherapy. Made me feel good after "venting", but the feelings were temporary and only helped feelings of depression for a few hours, but didn't help with my social skills in the long term. Tried stage acting and performing music in front of live audiences. Boosted my confidence in the general sense of the word, but didn't contribute to my social skills whatsoever.

Women seem to smell my awkwardness from miles away. I went to a party a couple days ago. My female cousin introduced me to some of her friends, and one of them, who never met me before, immediately gave me a "high five" instead of shaking my hand. Ouch. I get friendzoned by chicks even before I talk to them.

I am honestly ready to give up at this point. I don't know where else to get help. I have exhausted all resources. I think about suicide more than I should. Sure, a positive attitude could benefit me, but how do I remain positive when most of my social reality has resulted in tremendous failure, especially with girls? Despite all the people I've met since I've moved here, I still have no real friends (just mere "acquaintances"), never had a girlfriend or even kissed a girl, and, of the people I do know, many of them mock or talk sh** behind my back when I'm not around.

At this point, I have stopped blaming other people for my problems. The only person who can help me is myself. I understand that. But after many attempts, I'm still stuck in this deep hole and can't seem to salvage myself. There must be something else I'm missing or not quite fully grasping. I need insight or something. Anything.

Advice?

 

[cremasta7]

Ok, you'll hopefully get lots of good advice, but here's one that worked for me...

Stop trying to get your message across, or sending out your opinion on everything.

When you meet people, focus on them. Treat it like a project that you want to find out as much as possible about them. This is good for two reasons:
1. People generally like it when you are interested in them and what they do,
2. It will give you something to bounce off and create other conversation threads.

I don't mean that you should interrogate them, but push the focus of the conversation towards the other person.

Good luck

 

[zekko]

I was very shy and withdrawn growing up, although I was determined not to be. You're not going to get anywhere with women without any social skills, so you should work on that. What I did was took every opportunity to socialize that I could, so I could practice. It wasn't always easy, but I conquered my anxieties.

For example, I tried to get invited to every party that I could. Sounds like you have a built in advantage with these cousins of yours, you can hang with them and they can take you places, but you should learn to get out from under their wing also.

Unfortunately, it sounds like you have some deeper problems. Like becoming alcoholic so quickly? It's going to be hard going to parties at your age without drinking. Some people do it, but it's another thing that will set you apart.

The cashier idea sounded good. Also, just because a girl high fives you, that doesn't mean you're in the friendzone. In fact, it probably wouldn't hurt you to strike up some friendships with some girls. Sometimes you have to walk before you can run.

I'd work on your social skills (and some of your other problems), and forget about the DJ principles for awhile. Half of them are BS anyway.

 

[FairShake]

Be friendly and be open.

Honestly if you are these two things most people don't care about your awkwardness as long as it isn't annoying or obnoxious.

Edit: And seriously, alot of that PUA bullsh!t is just that. Bullsh!t. At the very least you need to be confident in your social ability to experiment with that stuff so make a few friends first. Be nice, friendly, and open.

 

[corrector]

The OP has tried everything to the point that I don't think social skills is the problem. I think it's seduction skills which is a different category. He can engage in small talk, he's interacting with women, and he's complaining about being "friendzoned". He can't control how women respond to him, but kudos for trying. Whatever is happening is rubbing off the ego very badly.

This leads to a question of "looks". He'd have to post a pic of himself on here and people would have to give him feedback, and also if he can record his voice so people can feedback how he sounds. Should have got some play by now with all the effort he's put into this so I don't think it is social skills.

 

[st_99]

No, you're overthinking it. You don't even need social skills to get laid. You just need a simple 3 step process.

Talk ("Hi, how is your day?" is all you need)
Touch (Rub an elbow, touch lower back, etc..)
Follow up (Get a number, ask out on date)

Wash rinse repeat and let the numbers game play out. Thats it!

 

[SamTheHobit]

Women are the problem not your social skills.

 

[Bernoulli]

If you seriously want to improve your results with women, I think you need to deal with your depression first. If you're depressed, succeeding with women is going to be difficult, particularly from your background (shy, introverted, no sexual experience). You need to figure out what you can do to get yourself out of depression. Focus on things that are important to you. As an example, in my life if I'm not advancing towards my main goal (which is get my degree) I'll be feeling down. If I didn't do well on a test, it'll hang over my head.

Figure out what's important for YOU. Is it going back to school, getting a degree etc? And work towards that. As men, we feel positive emotions when we take action and advance towards the goals we've set for ourselves. And take care of yourself. Work out, eat healthy, sleep well all that good stuff.

Finally dude, don't kill yourself. You deserve more than that.

 

[corrector]

If you seriously want to improve your results with women, I think you need to deal with your depression first. If you're depressed, succeeding with women is going to be difficult, particularly from your background (shy, introverted, no sexual experience). You need to figure out what you can do to get yourself out of depression. Focus on things that are important to you. As an example, in my life if I'm not advancing towards my main goal (which is get my degree) I'll be feeling down. If I didn't do well on a test, it'll hang over my head.

Yes, but what if the cause of the depression is women itself? If there is no healthy outlet then this could become an issue even when studying to get a degree. You'll start noticing all the ladies in the lecture, sitting beside someone and trying to work the nerve to talk with her right and that becomes distracting in itself. Maybe you'll get a oneitis right while you are studying and start fantasizing and wait until the end of the whole class to muster enough courage to ask her out to find out she either already has a boyfriend or is not interested. Life really sucks if you don't have this area handled.

Figure out what's important for YOU. Is it going back to school, getting a degree etc? And work towards that. As men, we feel positive emotions when we take action and advance towards the goals we've set for ourselves. And take care of yourself. Work out, eat healthy, sleep well all that good stuff.

What's important about getting a degree? It is getting a good job. What's important about getting a good job? That means you are earning money, can become independent, and most importantly, can become the perfect beta-provider and at least have some appeal to have a relationship, even if you are being used while she's banging other alpha dudes behind your back. It all boils down to the same thing - it's all about getting laid. Without women in the equation, who cares about getting a degree or a good job?

 

[BigSmooth]

It all boils down to the same thing - it's all about getting laid. Without women in the equation, who cares about getting a degree or a good job?

Huh? No, it is not all about getting laid. Are you serious?


First of all, this kid is putting getting laid on a pedestal already. Telling him that "getting laid" is all that matters only intensifies his helplessness even more. He needs to stop worrying so much about getting laid so bad because it is affecting his mindset.


Getting laid should never be your sole focus in life. It obviously seems like your are desperately trying to get with a girl and you are putting all your efforts into this. Stop. Stop right now.

Stop focusing on the girls. Start focusing on you. Improve yourself. Of course the advice about "becoming the prize" and "being more alpha and more confident" didn't work for you. You don't have the pedigree and the real life experiences to back that mentality up! You'll never truly feel naturally confident and "alpha" if you know deep down inside you are a fake who is just pretending to be someone you aren't. Start improving yourself. Start working out. Start dressing better. Start focusing on other things in life instead of just trying to get with girls all the time. You need to build YOU. As the famous Pook said, you will never find the woman of your dreams until you become the man of your dreams.

Getting a good degree and getting a good job is part of being successful in life. I'm not saying that it is for everyone, or that EVERYONE that is successful in life has a degree, but it provides you with many things you want to enjoy. The world opens up to you when you have the means to enjoy it. Especially if you enjoy your job and the people you work with, it is a great feeling.

What do you enjoy in life? Ask yourself that. If you don't feel satisfied with your answer, go and try new things. Go join some clubs. Do anything. Just get out there. Your problem isn't just interacting with girls. Your problem is that you don't know who you really are, which is why you have never felt comfortable talking with other people. Go and discover yourself. Once you've done that, talking to girls will be the least of your problems. You will one day realize that their opinions don't matter for 5hit, there are millions of women out there so who cares what ONE thinks about you. You know who you are, you are a man who has harnessed the true zest in life through the accumulation of life's experiences and meeting new people and seeing new places and feeling more emotions.


Killing yourself is the easy way out. A man is not a quitter. Don't quit. Only the weak quit. And you are not weak. Your are a fvcking Gladiator, and you will fight your way out. It never comes easy, so embrace the fight. When you wake up in the morning, tell yourself you are a warrior. Whether it is physically, mentally, or emotionally, everyone faces a war sometime in their life. The strong survive. Do you want to be strong? Is the man of your dreams strong? Well then, you must embrace your inner strength. Everyone has it. Unfortunately some people give up way too soon. Never be that person. Many potentially great warriors were lost because they failed to fight just ONE MORE TIME. They quit too early. If you want to succeed, keep pushing.

 

[Who Dares Win]

I would suggest you to find the reason of your present state and remove them.

Many guys simply exploded once far from their demotivating oppressive family or bully peers, others needed to see themselves in a better way and changing their bodies through gym did it.

Before taking action (which you have to), you have to find the cause of your problems and act accordingly.

And regarding your cousins introducing you their female friends, dont be concerned of your failure since you were most likely to start the race with a broken leg.

How do you think your female cousins introduced you prior to the meeting with their female friends? if they introduce you as "weirdo material", the female sheep mentality will automatically put you in the "weirdo zone".
Imagine something like this:

"Hey kelly come to meet my cousin, he is a strange guy who doesnt have any friend and I would like him to have some party at least tonight"

Which one could be the singular possible outcome out of it?

Most of all dont take advince on women from women, we explained the reasons countless times in here.

 

[Bernoulli]

What's important about getting a degree? It is getting a good job. What's important about getting a good job? That means you are earning money, can become independent, and most importantly, can become the perfect beta-provider and at least have some appeal to have a relationship, even if you are being used while she's banging other alpha dudes behind your back. It all boils down to the same thing - it's all about getting laid. Without women in the equation, who cares about getting a degree or a good job?

I think you've got the wrong end of the stick here. For me, getting my degree is most important to me because I am passionate about the subject I'm studying. Yes I want a good job of course, but girls have little to with it. Like BigSmooth said, life does become more richer with a degree. I mean come on, life is much easier to enjoy and feel good about yourself when you don't have to worry too much about meeting next month's rent. Getting an education should always be for you. Hell as a man, any major decision you make (education etc.) should always be for you (never for girls.)

OP, consider whether education would be a potential solution (not permanent of course, but a building block nonetheless) for lifting your depression. Like others have said, figure out what you enjoy. And increase your comfort zone gradually. For example you could start one day by just saying "Hi" to all your neighbours and acquaintances. Next day, extend your comfort zone by greeting everyone you come across with the exception of hot girls. Next day greet hot girls. You should eventually build up to approaching hot girls. Vary it if you want, but remember the whole gradual thing.

 

[corrector]

Huh? No, it is not all about getting laid. Are you serious?


First of all, this kid is putting getting laid on a pedestal already. Telling him that "getting laid" is all that matters only intensifies his helplessness even more. He needs to stop worrying so much about getting laid so bad because it is affecting his mindset.

He's putting it on a pedestal because he's a virgin and never had that experience. It never naturally happened to him yet and he's freaking out he'll be a 40-50 year old virgin.

Getting laid should never be your sole focus in life. It obviously seems like your are desperately trying to get with a girl and you are putting all your efforts into this. Stop. Stop right now.

It is when you are a virgin.

Stop focusing on the girls. Start focusing on you. Improve yourself. Of course the advice about "becoming the prize" and "being more alpha and more confident" didn't work for you. You don't have the pedigree and the real life experiences to back that mentality up!

...or the sexual experience.

Okay, I'm heckling here, OP, listen to this guy he knows what he is talking about.

I may not have anything really going on for me in life right now...but I can say that I enjoy going to church and bike riding on trails in my city. There is also volunteering that I may do. Church and volunteering (at church) provides opportunities to meet people and go into small groups.

Since I'm into bike riding, this has made me aware of the different trails that are in the city, either for biking or walking, that are all near "romantic venues" where you can take a girl and make it into a romantic sort of venue. If I don't have a girl then I just enjoy these activities itself because it's nature and it's fun and exercise. This is without having any "status" of anything going on other than just going out there and having fun.

It's okay being a virgin as well because sex is about sharing with someone else in a more intimate way. It should be the icing in the cake once you've already shared other aspects of yourself. If you understand that it's about "sharing" then the virgin doesn't mean much because that is just another thing that is shared when you are comfortable sharing everything else with a girl you really admire and she is sharing with you. This is another mentality than using someone, having a notch on your bed-post or having bragging rights, or going on an ego-trip.

There are probably plenty of trails or places you can walk or bike to clear your head. Stay away from drugs and do not commit suicide because you can't die and you won't want to know where you'll end up. Let's just say for you, life is better in this side.

 

[cstrife32]

Ever since I was in junior high, I have been a very shy, introverted kid. Throughout my high school and early university years, I was always very withdrawn, unpopular, and had few friends. I have zero sexual experience with the opposite sex.

Eventually it reached the point where I realized I needed to break out of my shell and learn to focus outward. I tried taking all sorts of advice from people about my horrendous social skills. For example, I took up a job as a cashier at a grocery store. This forced me to make small talk with customers and interact with more people, in general. Even after months of working there, my social skills were still pretty bad. Later, I got a job as a salesman. People said this would force me to talk to people more. It did, but my social skills still remained poor. I can make small talk with people for a few minutes, but that's about it. I have no idea how to establish rapport and trust with people and connect with them on a deeper level.

I don't know how to maintain a friendship. I don't know how to set up times to hang out with people, "fit in", etc. This problem is especially bad with women. The only date I've ever been on was with a girl in high school. It was very awkward the entire time, and the girl ended up friendzoning me.

I have tried positive reframes, affirmations, "seeing myself as the prize", and all these other types of PUA gimmicks. I have read The Game, Book of Pook, Mystery Method, etc. I'm afraid to say they're all very gimmicky and haven't worked for me. If anything, they just make come off as an incongruent, "fake", overly self-assured douche with narcissistic tendencies. The last girl couple of girls who I tried to pursue called me a "nice guy", friendzoned me (obviously), and one of them said she liked talking to me because she found me "weird." I tried seeking help from family, so some of my female cousins tried helping me out by introducing me to their friends. From that, I met many girls, but my lack of social skills prevented the interactions from going anywhere. My relations with women just seem to never naturally progress or escalate.

My entire family thinks I'm "weird" too. They have stopped talking to me and distance themselves from me whenever they can. I once sent some inappropriate messages to girls on facebook, and everyone who I'm socially connected to found out. Now all my cousins think I'm messed up. I tried to talking to girls on facebook, online, etc., but all to no avail. I have been rejected by over 50 women in the past three months or so.

I've been on anti-anxiety meds. Didn't work. Been on 5 different brands of antidepressants. Didn't work. Tried drinking at parties. Worked great the first few times, until I became an alcoholic and just killed my confidence even more. Tried weed. Made the anxiety worse. Tried psychotherapy. Made me feel good after "venting", but the feelings were temporary and only helped feelings of depression for a few hours, but didn't help with my social skills in the long term. Tried stage acting and performing music in front of live audiences. Boosted my confidence in the general sense of the word, but didn't contribute to my social skills whatsoever.

Women seem to smell my awkwardness from miles away. I went to a party a couple days ago. My female cousin introduced me to some of her friends, and one of them, who never met me before, immediately gave me a "high five" instead of shaking my hand. Ouch. I get friendzoned by chicks even before I talk to them.

I am honestly ready to give up at this point. I don't know where else to get help. I have exhausted all resources. I think about suicide more than I should. Sure, a positive attitude could benefit me, but how do I remain positive when most of my social reality has resulted in tremendous failure, especially with girls? Despite all the people I've met since I've moved here, I still have no real friends (just mere "acquaintances"), never had a girlfriend or even kissed a girl, and, of the people I do know, many of them mock or talk sh** behind my back when I'm not around.

At this point, I have stopped blaming other people for my problems. The only person who can help me is myself. I understand that. But after many attempts, I'm still stuck in this deep hole and can't seem to salvage myself. There must be something else I'm missing or not quite fully grasping. I need insight or something. Anything.

Advice?

Some good advice on this thread for you. I know you don't wanna hear this, but this is one of your biggest problems, and once you can turn this around things wills tart to pull together. Stop being negative about you and your environment. You have to realize that your thoughts about reality are not what reality actually is. Most people have a negative self-image and negative outlook on life because of how their parents brought them up. They've heard a lot of negative things from their parents and taken them and internalized them into beliefs about themselves...but that's not true. Just because your parents thought your stupid, doesn't mean you actually are. When you have a negative thought, tell yourself that's not true (i.e. If you approach a girl and fail and a negative thought comes through tell yourself: That's not true, I just had the balls to approach a girl, next I can work on adding some kino into the conversation.) Always look for the good in people and in the world around you.

If you wanna learn how to connect with people I'd recommend reading How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie. Its a little dated, but the principles still work. Best book on that topic. That will help you get past small talk and relate on a deeper level. Also I'd recommend reading Think and Grow Rich by Napolen Hill. This book will help you foster some sort of passion for something in your life and teach you what it takes to succeed. In a nutshell, you made women the focus of your life, but in reality women should be anything but the focus. Women are fun on the side, not the be all end all. Don't go out and improve yourself to get girls, improve yourself for YOU in the areas YOU want to, not in the areas you think girls will like. After you get out of your rut, you will find the girls will come a lot easier than before.

 

[zekko]

Stop being negative about you and your environment.

Great point. That negative attitude is killing you.
There is no situation you can be in which a negative attitude will make better. Don't tolerate it any longer. Replace it with some positive self talk.

If you wanna learn how to connect with people I'd recommend reading How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie

I was going to mention that book also.
It's very simple and basic, but the principles work if you put them to use.