Poker

[Murk]

I want to play poker for a living.

I've been playing poker for 14 years, mostly online or with the boys (rarely), and casinos.

I've placed in a few tournaments online over the years, I actually won £9500 in my first Poker Stars tournament in 2004 when I was 18 which started my love of poker. I've always just been a background hobby to my life that tbh nobody really knows about or the stakes I got up to 25/50/100. I'm seriously considering building my business for the next 3-5 years and then selling it to play poker full time/investments/property/retirement.

I've played in live cash games in casinos and it's always easier to win money there than online, but I can't dedicate 3-7 hour sessions.

I'm interested to know anyone's experiences with poker

 

[jimwho]

I'm going to hijack this thread already for a fun story "sorry". Many years ago the boys would play poker, lots of beers & smoke. Scott drank like a fish but was well liked and had a great sense of humor. We dug out the Aces from other decks and we each had two Aces each under the table accept Scott. For an hour when it came to Scott calling a hand we would pass aces under the table and he would lose to five Aces "wild-card" every time.

Freaking hilarious we were laughing our asses off. Finally we had his opponent pull out seven Aces and he looked like a
Puppy confused with the tilted head. He was like Haaayy WTF? Serious sting operation for laughs. Of course we all got our money back & started over. Had to share..

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Just be aware that doing it for a living is going to bring you into a whole other level of competition. You won't be playing against scrubs anymore, you'll be playing against the best of the best.

 

[Reyaj]

I don't think it's a career that can be sustainable due to variance. Even top players have swings where they go broke (Tom Dwan, Gus Hansen just to name a few)

I really believe the marketed players you see on TV are able to do it because of endorsements, many which pay their tourney entries....

 

[BackInTheGame78]

I don't think it's a career that can be sustainable due to variance. Even top players have swings where they go broke (Tom Dwan, Gus Hansen just to name a few)

I really believe the marketed players you see on TV are able to do it because of endorsements, many which pay their tourney entries....

Yeah it would be tough if you did that with your own money...

 

[EyeBRollin]

How will you handle tilt? Tilt is inevitable.

I wouldn’t attempt this unless you have enough residual income from other sources to support yourself.

I’m a huge fan of blackjack- can count the cards and everything. But the tilt is real and it will break you.

 

[andreihaha]

Gambling isn't designed to win you money.
Yeah, it's about skill, I know...I was telling myself the same thing. Really all it takes is 1 loosing streak, hell, even a single hand, and you're done. All your life's savings gone. But it's not usually just one streak, there's plenty.
While when you win, no matter how much, you'll always want more. Until that bad beat comes.

Save yourself a life of misery and realize that nothing good comes without work. And no matter how many hours you spend at the poker table, that ain't just work, it's also luck.

I lost money, women, the trust of my family and more at the tables. In reality, the only way to beat "the house" is to stop playing. And it's one of the most rewarding things I've ever done with my life.

 

[Murk]

Gambling isn't designed to win you money.
Yeah, it's about skill, I know...I was telling myself the same thing. Really all it takes is 1 loosing streak, hell, even a single hand, and you're done. All your life's savings gone. But it's not usually just one streak, there's plenty.
While when you win, no matter how much, you'll always want more. Until that bad beat comes.

Save yourself a life of misery and realize that nothing good comes without work. And no matter how many hours you spend at the poker table, that ain't just work, it's also luck.

I lost money, women, the trust of my family and more at the tables. In reality, the only way to beat "the house" is to stop playing. And it's one of the most rewarding things I've ever done with my life.

That's where bankroll management comes into play, you can only lose your stack (buy-in) in poker, and that stack you should be able to cover X amount of times (about 20) before moving up and playing at that stake.

Yes guys like Tom Dwan, even Ivey "go broke" but it's not really broke, it's a run of bad losses, they can go online and dominate or they also play other games (PLO, Baccarat etc). Most money they win is online and they do have endorsements and backers taking a piece of their action.

I'm aware Poker draws in thinking minds, the only person I know IRL playing poker is probably just below or at my intelligence level. It's tough, but there are many weak players punting off cash for fun or soft games in live casinos you can make money.

I played 2 hours in my local casino Saturday afternoon and won £650. Yeah it's not much, but it's so easy. Maybe I'll just keep it as a hobby to win money from lower/mid tier opponents.

After so many years, pot odds, bet sizing etc is automatic, I can use this edge on the soft players and stay away from high stakes.

 

[EyeBRollin]

That's where bankroll management comes into play, you can only lose your stack (buy-in) in poker, and that stack you should be able to cover X amount of times (about 20) before moving up and playing at that stake.

Yes guys like Tom Dwan, even Ivey "go broke" but it's not really broke, it's a run of bad losses, they can go online and dominate or they also play other games (PLO, Baccarat etc). Most money they win is online and they do have endorsements and backers taking a piece of their action.

I'm aware Poker draws in thinking minds, the only person I know IRL playing poker is probably just below or at my intelligence level. It's tough, but there are many weak players punting off cash for fun or soft games in live casinos you can make money.

I played 2 hours in my local casino Saturday afternoon and won £650. Yeah it's not much, but it's so easy. Maybe I'll just keep it as a hobby to win money from lower/mid tier opponents.

After so many years, pot odds, bet sizing etc is automatic, I can use this edge on the soft players and stay away from high stakes.

What is your plan to handle tilt?

 

[Murk]

What is your plan to handle tilt?

I don't really know, at home I shout "fvck" like I have Tourettes and talk to the screen (phone/laptop) and people around, my previous gfs included, ask "are you ok?"

But in my personal life, I often replay or reimagine things that make me say "fvck" randomly and my gf always asks "what's wrong" whenever I'm asked by anyone the same "nothing" response, it might be a tick.

However in live cash games, I'm aware of my surroundings and not fully relaxed, so I handle things calmly, I'm very self-aware.

 

[andreihaha]

That's where bankroll management comes into play, you can only lose your stack (buy-in) in poker, and that stack you should be able to cover X amount of times (about 20) before moving up and playing at that stake.

Or losing a % of your budget and lowering the stakes (if you can).

My honest advice as a former player with serious wins (and even bigger losses) is to let the suckers gamble. The more you play, the bigger the chance to end on a loss(because of taxes/entry fees/rake/odds/whatever). The odds are always stacked against you.

Plus, you're not even a guy like the pros who receive endorsements and free entries.

You asked for our opinions, that's mine, take it or leave it.
In the end, if you're smart, you have to look at the worst possible scenario, not the best.
From my point of view(as a former gambler and an observer of others like me), frequent results include: loosing all your hard earned cash, loosing the relationship with the people you care about, ruining your relationship/marriage, ending up stealing to gamble, going to prison, throwing yourself off a building. If that's a chance you're willing to take (I'd estimate one of these happens to 80+% of gamblers and 100% of problem gamblers), then go ahead! Good luck!

I myself have found so many other better things to do.

Cheers!

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Liquor in the front...poker in the back

 

[EyeBRollin]

I don't really know, at home I shout "fvck" like I have Tourettes and talk to the screen (phone/laptop) and people around, my previous gfs included, ask "are you ok?"

You aren’t ready, my friend. Do not go down this path. Tilt will happen.

I played blackjack as a hobby for almost two years. I know the expected value of every hand and every situation. Shvt gets real when you lose. The sequence that broke my resolve I will never forget:

I was in a Vegas with a monster count (that means high saturation of face cards, 10s, and As remaining) towards the end of a six deck shoe. Dealer showed a 6 up card (weakest hand). Through a series of splits and resplits I ended up with ten hands on the table, 6 of which required a double down. Ended up with five 20s, four 19s, and an 18. Dealer flips a 10 and then a ****ing 5 and cracked every hand I had on the table. In just one round I lost over 25 maximum bets!

Shvt gets real when you lose. And the losses are always more devastating than the highs are rewarding. You are going to tilt, bro. Can you handle it?

 

[Snag87]

Been playing for a living for years. I don't recommend it. Women hate poker, no benefits (healthcare, 401k, etc). It suits my lifestyle (single male with no dependants who likes to travel). If you live a similar lifestyle it may be worth considering, but I'd still be inclined to advise against it.

 

[Reyaj]

I’m a huge fan of blackjack- can count the cards and everything. But the tilt is real and it will break you.

Especially when that damn dealer has to flip cards which always seem to get 20 and 21 lol

 

[Xenom0rph]

It can't be done. At best, it can be a form of side income, but it can never replace a traditional 9-to-5

I used to play poker fanatically here in Los Angeles. Forget Las Vegas, forget Macau, LA is the poker capital of the world and some of the fiercest competition is right here.

Commerce Casino before the pandemic could easily host well over 200 poker tables of various buy-ins and limits. They also hosted a variety of games like Omaha Hi/Lo, Stud, and occasionally would host a PLO game. A weekend at Commerce Casino would be jam packed and you'd be put on a waitlist just to get in a game.

I've played all these games and even took 1st place a couple of times in tournaments, and I frequently would finished "in the money" at tournaments if I didn't make it to the final table.

It cannot be done.

There's an old saying that I think best explains this (I'm paraphrasing): "The best swordsman does not fear the 2nd best, he fears the worst since there's no telling what that idiot will do".

This is absolutely true in poker, because idiot amateurs do outrageous things and they might just get lucky and bust you in one hand. Now multiply that by 500 morons in Commerce Casino getting lucky on you, you'll see why it's virtually impossible to consistently win against an army of buffoons.

It makes no difference whether you play at the lower $2-$4 Limit Holdem games or a $500 NL Holdem game. It also makes no difference which game you choose (Holdem vs Omaha vs Stud vs PLO)....

You will always be outnumbered by morons getting lucky on you.

 

[Xenom0rph]

This thread reminds me of one of the worst bad beats I've dished out to another player:

It was a stud game. Stud games are generally lower volatility than Holdem. A 2 pair is a weak hand in Holdem, but it's a strong hand in Stud.

I had set of 2s (held three deuces in my hand). Then by some miracle I hit a fourth 2, which means I'm holding quads in my hand. This is EXTREMELY rare in a Stud game. The guy I was playing against was betting aggressively, and I aggressively re-raised and he aggressively re-raised me. Every street we maxed out the bets and re-raises.

Then he showed down with a Full House, which is an extremely rare hand in Stud... But I showed down quads which is even rarer.

Dude flipped out, he threw his cards at the dealer. Cussed out the dealer and then cussed me out. Security had to come over and restrain him and escort him out.

I'm sure he was thinking "how the fvck can something like this happen?"....

These types of bad beats can have a lasting psychological impact on you depending on how much money you lose.

I've taken some bad beats, but never in my life have I been beaten as badly as the way I beat this dude.

 

[Reyaj]

This is absolutely true in poker, because idiot amateurs do outrageous things and they might just get lucky and bust you in one hand. Now multiply that by 500 morons in Commerce Casino getting lucky on you, you'll see why it's virtually impossible to consistently win against an army of buffoons.

Variance is undefeated in poker...

 

[Snag87]

It can't be done. At best, it can be a form of side income, but it can never replace a traditional 9-to-5

I used to play poker fanatically here in Los Angeles. Forget Las Vegas, forget Macau, LA is the poker capital of the world and some of the fiercest competition is right here.

Commerce Casino before the pandemic could easily host well over 200 poker tables of various buy-ins and limits. They also hosted a variety of games like Omaha Hi/Lo, Stud, and occasionally would host a PLO game. A weekend at Commerce Casino would be jam packed and you'd be put on a waitlist just to get in a game.

I've played all these games and even took 1st place a couple of times in tournaments, and I frequently would finished "in the money" at tournaments if I didn't make it to the final table.

It cannot be done.

There's an old saying that I think best explains this (I'm paraphrasing): "The best swordsman does not fear the 2nd best, he fears the worst since there's no telling what that idiot will do".

This is absolutely true in poker, because idiot amateurs do outrageous things and they might just get lucky and bust you in one hand. Now multiply that by 500 morons in Commerce Casino getting lucky on you, you'll see why it's virtually impossible to consistently win against an army of buffoons.

It makes no difference whether you play at the lower $2-$4 Limit Holdem games or a $500 NL Holdem game. It also makes no difference which game you choose (Holdem vs Omaha vs Stud vs PLO)....

You will always be outnumbered by morons getting lucky on you.

This simply isn't true. You absolutely can play for a living.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Especially when that damn dealer has to flip cards which always seem to get 20 and 21 lol

Unless you are like those dudes in 21...