People are simply blind to the truth of gender pay scales...

[speed dawg]

I had a discussion with a co-worker today. First, let me say that I sent him statistics that showed that the unemployment rate did not include people not actively looking for a job. Quite predictably, he changed the subject to gender pay scales and the massive injustices done to women, because a closed study said so. He spouts that women make 78% of what men do. I show him stats that say the real numbers are more like 96% when you take into account maternity and lost time. Then we hit a wall for moment.

I ask him why we should use time, money and resources for a problem that affects 4% of America? He says, well it will never be fixed, we just need to be aware of it. I then say, it's a chicken/egg type deal. I said, let's get down to the TRUTH, and ask questions that every is afraid to ask. Is it REALLY a massive injustice being done, or is it simply that women may not be WORTH as much as men, in the job market on average. I said this is a point that we have to examine to find the truth.

He...got.....PISSED. He was just like, "WOW......just.....WOW! Really?? I can't believe you would even go there....." and left.

What is it about truth? Why can people not even entertain this line of questioning? Why can't people accept that men on average gravitate towards higher risk jobs that command more value in the marketplace? Ever wondered why Georgia Tech has such a terrible ratio of women to men? An institute of higher learning like that is very likely liberal, so they aren't discriminating. IT'S BECAUSE MEN GRAVITATE TO MATH/ENGINEERING MORESO THAN WOMEN! Why is this so taboo?

Before someone says, "Well I knew a chick who was super smart lulzz", I'm not talking about on an individual basis. We are talking macro, big picture, averages over the whole population. You can apply general facts to this.

Either way, this little exercise in conversation illustrates two liberal tactics: The subject shaming switch, and the outright shaming denial. And those two things illustrate that liberalism is based on manufactured ideals rather than facts. Carry on.

 

[dasein]

The wage gap is a myth that has been debunked time and time again, even by the government. Give this link to your ignorant feminist friend, he will go a googling, and will come back with supposed "problems" with the study. Don't let him get away with this. Those proposing a wage gap for equal quality and experience of work have the BURDEN, not anyone else, to PROVE such a gap in the context of all the factors in that study and in the following link. They never do, and this puts the lie to this particular narrative.

http://consad.com/content/reports/Gender Wage Gap Final Report.pdf

Warren Farrell, the only man ever to be on the board of NOW (who got drummed out of mainstream feminism for not toeing the party line) wrote a book about it, and speaks to the wage gap myth at this Cato talk and elsewhere:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VAZx07rOKU

Moving on to fair pay laws, we have had laws, effective laws, since the 60s that mandate equal pay for equal work. The left never even acknowledges such laws in its never ending quest to distort facts and spew propaganda.

Some interesting facts about the BLS/DOL numbers used to concoct the wage gap lie:

1. They account anyone working 30 hours of work as "full time." Men work more overtime, usually due to pressures associated with being the primary breadwinner. So the upshot here is that two people in the same job working across cubicles are accounted the exact same when a man is working 60 hours a week and a woman 35 flextime.

2. The job categories used are necessarily broad and general. This means that many types of different jobs are classified as the same job for statistical purposes. For example, a commission salesman with no salary and intense production pressure can be accounted the same as a sales assistant working on salary who sits in the office all day answering the phone and taking orders.

3. The numbers do not adjust for experience over time, meaning that three people in the same job, one who took two years off to work on their golf swing, one who took a year off to have and raise a kid, and the person who remained while they were away and not gaining experience, are accounted the same.

There are other problems with the basic numbers, but suffice it to say that just like every single leftist talking point, underlying facts are cherrypicked out of context, massaged and then crafted into inaccurate soundbites towards political results. The wage gap myth is a stellar example.

Thank goodness for the net that allows these lies to be dragged into the light of day.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

Regarding unemployment, the CEO of Gallup today published an article saying what a con the numbers are.

Next time you come up against that tired old argument (women make 75% less than men) play along for a bit. Set the hook.

A: Really? Women make 76% of men?

B: Yep.

A: For doing the EXACT SAME job?

B: Yep.

A: Has that been proven?

B: Yep. There's statistics and everything.

A: Wow, there must be some kind of CEO conspiracy.

B: Yep, sure is.

A: I mean that's just crazy. They can get a 25% DISCOUNT on labor, since women do the same work as men, but for 25% LESS, meaning they could increase profits, increase stock prices, increase their OWN WEALTH, but they hate women so much they'd rather:

1) Pay them less

2) NOT Hire them

3) make more money themselves.

ALL because they hate women so much!

 

[dasein]

What's more is that there are several studies that demonstrate a pay gap in women's favor. Google em up and don't let them keep perpetuating this lie.

 

[Mike32ct]

Exactly. If companies really can and do pay women less, then we don't need affirmative action for women. Economics alone will ensure that more women than men are hired.

 

[Stagger Lee]

Males who sympathize with and defend feminism are the lowest. These guys don't really give a crap about women. They just carry the victim card for women as a weapon against other men.

I suspect the reality is if anything that women are overpaid and get the cushier jobs at the expensive of men. It's absurd to believe that any employer would pay a male more and a woman less. Employers pay the bare minimum they believe they can for a job.

If your faggot coworker actually believes he makes 13% more than a woman would just for being a man and is so worried about it, why doesn't he demand to be paid 13% less. Or why doesn't he offer half of his 'ill gotten' gains to a female coworker? It's just like wealthy white liberals who claim non-whites are being shortchanged. Yet they don't give up their money or seat of power to the 'shortchanged'. No, they want some other white male to have to do it, probably someone less well off than are. They're really just using it as a weapon against their peers or competitors.

 

[VladPatton]

Regarding unemployment, the CEO of Gallup today published an article saying what a con the numbers are.

Next time you come up against that tired old argument (women make 75% less than men) play along for a bit. Set the hook.

A: Really? Women make 76% of men?

B: Yep.

A: For doing the EXACT SAME job?

B: Yep.

A: Has that been proven?

B: Yep. There's statistics and everything.

A: Wow, there must be some kind of CEO conspiracy.

B: Yep, sure is.

A: I mean that's just crazy. They can get a 25% DISCOUNT on labor, since women do the same work as men, but for 25% LESS, meaning they could increase profits, increase stock prices, increase their OWN WEALTH, but they hate women so much they'd rather:

1) Pay them less

2) NOT Hire them

3) make more money themselves.

ALL because they hate women so much!

Haha exactly. Lets eat some shrooms and get hallucinogenic for a bit, and say everyone can do an equal job in whatever market. You're a boss. You need 4 workers. 4 women would get $100 bucks a day, $2000 a week for you to pay. 4 guys would get $195 a day, $3900 for you to pay. Aren't the women cheaper? Financially it would profit you, the boss, and you'd hire nothing but women, so they'd profit in getting jobs. No one would even look at hiring men, right? There is fückery afoot. It's all fresh, steamy bullshıt.

 

[speed dawg]

Ha, some excellent points here. I went back to him with some of the links here and then, what do you know......suddenly he "doesn't want to go down this rabbit hole again".

So, I guess I can declare myself the winner, but does it matter? The problem is still there. His mind isn't changed and likely won't. How do you help someone who is brain-washed, but almost enjoys being brain-washed? We have plenty of these types here on this board, I guess there is no answer. Blatant disregard for facts.

 

[mrRuckus]

What is it about truth? Why can people not even entertain this line of questioning?

Start of a list of things most people believe are "obviously" true without ever having seen concrete evidence (mostly just speculation) in either direction.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_truth_effect
"The truth effect, the illusory truth effect or the illusion-of-truth effect is the tendency to believe information to be correct because we are exposed to it more times."

Diversity is good.
Recycling is an effective use of resources.
Eating fat is bad for you.
The races are equal.
Moms are more important.
Women being treated as objects is bad.
There's a god.
...Lots more...


Just a few things that are repeated to you from birth and since few people ever contradict these claims, few ever stray from them or even question "hey why do you we believe so and so?"

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

How do you help someone who is brain-washed, but almost enjoys being brain-washed? ... Blatant disregard for facts.

The trick is to understand how they were brainwashed, meaning which subconscious triggers were fired off.

For example, the "women are paid less" tends to be believed by guys who want to "save women."

In order to get rid of the brainwashing, you have to allow them to keep the "save women" idea while framing the facts to fit their deeper desires.

UNFORTUNATELY, one HUGE aspect of commonly held misbeliefs is the idea that the "believer" is somehow "better than the average person" because of their beliefs. ESPECIALLY if it involves (even in their imagination) some kind of public policy.

MANY beliefs held by the left are rooted in the idea that the believer is "better" than "common" people.

And since high social status is a deep desire, from literally MILLIONS of years of evolution (since before humans) it's tough to argue against a belief with that as its core.

SO...

If you truly want to dismantle the "surface structure" belief, you've got to phrase it in a way so they get to KEEP their "I'm better than everybody else" idea.

For example, with the guy who believes in the 75% nonsense, you may say something like this:

I've heard that stat before, and it's certainly been repeated over and over again, usually by people who don't understand statistics. So I did some digging and found out some things that most people don't know. When you separate out ALL the variables, including type of education, time on the job, qualifications, certifications, etc, women are actually paid a little MORE than men for the same job. Which is a shame, because with so many fools parroting the same tired old story without really looking at the data, women are really getting a raw deal, because they're being conned by men who want them to believe they are victims, when they really aren't.

 

[Stagger Lee]

Ha, some excellent points here. I went back to him with some of the links here and then, what do you know......suddenly he "doesn't want to go down this rabbit hole again".

So, I guess I can declare myself the winner, but does it matter? The problem is still there. His mind isn't changed and likely won't. How do you help someone who is brain-washed, but almost enjoys being brain-washed? We have plenty of these types here on this board, I guess there is no answer. Blatant disregard for facts.

I believe, as I posted earlier, guys like this are simply just hostile to their male peers. They first want to be oppositional and critical of other males and latch on to any information that supports that position.

I do believe the there's a lot of mostly liberal brainwashing and inevitably most people are at least somewhat brainwashed. But there is propaganda from the left and right and people choose their brainwashing to a large degree. When I see someone with strong liberal convictions, I assume they are anti-male and anti-white to begin with. If they weren't they couldn't stomach the propaganda and would ignore it and seek out opposing information rather than reject opposing info.