Paradox

[BackInTheGame78]

Not true. I have appied for free covid cheques faithfully every week and am in fact waiting for them to pass the bill to extend the benefits. You always appreciate free money, duh!

Not the same scenario

 

[zekko]

I'm getting amusement out of watching certain members search for that fine line (wanting to endorse the materials that they've read/believe, but also not wanting to come across as supplicating).

Yeah, I'm not saying don't cold approach or anything like that (although there have been posters here who argued you should let women approach you). But I've always noticed a contradiction in PUA theory. You're supposed to have a rock solid frame and DGAF about the girl, and don't supplicate. But then guys will completely remake their personality in order to please women (become attractive to women). "I'm going to become an @sshole and a sociopathic so women will be attracted to me. You're a beta cuck." It's hard to miss.

 

[Serenity]

Women supposedly hate it if the guy wants her more than she wants him (very bad for attraction).
But if a guy cold approaches, isn't that an indication that he wants her more than she wants him? She's certainly not the one wanting him here, he's the one who went up to her.

The statement is not applicable to the situation you describe, at least not immediately, but maybe eventually.

Paradoxes only exist when we consider ideas in a timeless vacuum. In the real world both sides of a contradiction can be true, but never at the exact same time regarding the exact same thing. A very basic example would be an object being both wet and dry, this is an impossibility at the same time, but with time taken into consideration it can be wet at one time and dry at another time.

 

[Blacksheep]

This is something in dating advice that has always bugged me. On the surface at least, it appears to be a contradiction, or a paradox:

Women supposedly hate it if the guy wants her more than she wants him (very bad for attraction).
But if a guy cold approaches, isn't that an indication that he wants her more than she wants him? She's certainly not the one wanting him here, he's the one who went up to her.

Obviously not talking about a situation where she sends him a thousand IOIs before he approaches.

What I see that works better is indirect games.

It takes some time... but some women like that. Being the different guy that doesnt hit her all the time. I had some occasions this happened and worked.

But also there is some girls I talk, and with some time, they start to show same interest level.

And to be honest, being good lucking + not showing to be desperate + having purpose, those are the best things in the aspect of attracting women.

The fact is... Nowadays, it's all the same sh1t. I start to recognize sh1t test, games and all those stupid things and this completely turn me off. So when this starts I just move away. Waste of time imo.

I would really like to find a more decent women to have a decent conversation and good time. But I still not being able to find it.

 

[zekko]

But also there is some girls I talk, and with some time, they start to show same interest level.

And to be honest, being good lucking + not showing to be desperate + having purpose, those are the best things in the aspect of attracting women.

I agree, girls can often slowly become attracted to a guy over time. This is contrary to the idea that the girl knows in the first five seconds if she's going to bang you or not. I've noticed I sometimes am not attracted to a girl, and I mean for years, but one day for whatever reason I look at her in a different perspective and think "Wow, she's pretty hot". It's an interesting phenomenon, and can happen both ways.

Better than having a purpose, is being successful at your purpose. That is even more likely to attract.

I also agree the game can be pretty tiring. It's boring and asinine. It can be fun if you're in the mood, but I find genuine connections to be much more interesting.

 

[AttackFormation]

Yeah, I'm not saying don't cold approach or anything like that (although there have been posters here who argued you should let women approach you). But I've always noticed a contradiction in PUA theory. You're supposed to have a rock solid frame and DGAF about the girl, and don't supplicate. But then guys will completely remake their personality in order to please women (become attractive to women). "I'm going to become an @sshole and a sociopathic so women will be attracted to me. You're a beta cuck." It's hard to miss.

This is generally true, but someone who is truly on the antisocial personality spectrum wont see it this way. They perceive "remaking their personality", meaning mirroring someone's preferences, as merely a method to extract what they want out of their targets. They relate to the world narcissistically, in a one-way direction like a parasite does, not in the way a healthy human brain does which is symbiotic.

 

[bat soup]

It’s an interesting topic this one. As a woman I choose from the men who seek me out, or who choose me. I was taught as a youth that this is what ladies do:

Be the best lady you can be and see what you attract....Choose from that...

That's a totally passive strategy, but it will work for a woman.

If a man does that he'll attract nothing, or maybe the occasional gay man.

 

[Blacksheep]

I agree, girls can often slowly become attracted to a guy over time. This is contrary to the idea that the girl knows in the first five seconds if she's going to bang you or not. I've noticed I sometimes am not attracted to a girl, and I mean for years, but one day for whatever reason I look at her in a different perspective and think "Wow, she's pretty hot". It's an interesting phenomenon, and can happen both ways.

Better than having a purpose, is being successful at your purpose. That is even more likely to attract.

I also agree the game can be pretty tiring. It's boring and asinine. It can be fun if you're in the mood, but I find genuine connections to be much more interesting.

Yep, the thing is that genuine desire is being a rare thing to find.

With all this social media stuff... It seems people value more material things than inner values. And I can notice clearly how game changed with that.

In some 5 or 6 years ago, it was very different than nowadays.

 

[BeExcellent]

That's a totally passive strategy, but it will work for a woman.

If a man does that he'll attract nothing, or maybe the occasional gay man.

Right. That’s the point. Women (particularly the good ones) are passive (but receptive) with men who approach them who they have interest in. This is why it is incumbent on men to approach.

This is also why I DO NOT chase men. Ever.

If a man stops choosing me for whatever reason then I let him go. Even in a LTR. Why would I go running after some man if he has chosen to do something (or someone, Ha!) else? I put a tremendous amount of care and concern into my interactions once an interaction gets established. I’m not running after someone & beat him over the head with how great I am or how much I care for him or love him. That’s insecure, desperate & low self esteem.

Rather I just let go. There are others who want an opportunity to get to know me.

Next...

 

[bat soup]

Right. That’s the point. Women (particularly the good ones) are passive (but receptive) with men who approach them who they have interest in. This is why it is incumbent on men to approach.

It´s interesting to hear a woman say it directly.

I think a lot of the problems that men have is because they´re too passive and they expect women to make the first move.

 

[Guy69JackBlue]

It´s interesting to hear a woman say it directly.

I think a lot of the problems that men have is because they´re too passive and they expect women to make the first move.

Females could never succeed if they were males. Despite what they think of the so-called "abundance" they have just because they're female. It's amazing how unaware they are that everything is on "easy mode" for them.

Now "mind reading" is something that's expected of us lol. When there's literally no way of knowing if something would be welcomed or considered harassment (taken from her own words). It's not worth the investment of energy when there are easier ways to get it.

 

[Vantagepoint34]

Females could never succeed if they were males. Despite what they think of the so-called "abundance" they have just because they're female. It's amazing how unaware they are that everything is on "easy mode" for them.

Now "mind reading" is something that's expected of us lol. When there's literally no way of knowing if something would be welcomed or considered harassment (taken from her own words). It's not worth the investment of energy when there are easier ways to get it.

You can clearly see that parallel example in the movie Year one with jack black. Where both men and women are just trying to make the only meal of the day in beginning of flick. On harassment it's hard to see through the lines. Like you want to keep an air of mystery. In some cases if you're not upfront and stay in that mystery mode. Like a tall dark handsome or italian stallion. You want to be a mystery. Mystery can also be mistaken as eccentric which is not good. If a girl is young enough 18-22 they can also dismiss you as just weird. So women can be considered mature in some aspects 5 years ago. Present day it is more equalled(year one) I'll tell you something because science says otherwise. Development of the brain is completed by 28 so either man or womans car insurance goes down once brain is fully developed. Like Ben Franklin would say better to invest gold coins toward your mind. In this case the leveled playing field makes the love game more playable to Afc's or future ex-husbands. Divorce rate is still over %70 so you can't argue with something that is sure Like game in europe or Russia. Women from arab or saudi countries are also extremely attractive...

 

[bat soup]

Females could never succeed if they were males. Despite what they think of the so-called "abundance" they have just because they're female. It's amazing how unaware they are that everything is on "easy mode" for them.

Now "mind reading" is something that's expected of us lol. When there's literally no way of knowing if something would be welcomed or considered harassment (taken from her own words). It's not worth the investment of energy when there are easier ways to get it.

I think to be considered harassment you'd have to keep insisting after you'd already been told no. Or grab a girl Trump-style outside the HR department.

 

[Guy69JackBlue]

I think to be considered harassment you'd have to keep insisting after you'd already been told no. Or grab a girl Trump-style outside the HR department.

Ok... Then rephrase to "annoying."

Now keep in mind they have the option of saying and doing nothing and still being "in the game." It requires no effort from them at all.

 

[bat soup]

Ok... Then rephrase to "annoying."

Now keep in mind they have the option of saying and doing nothing and still being "in the game." It requires no effort from them at all.

Frankly, who cares if they find it annoying?

 

[Guy69JackBlue]

Frankly, who cares if they find it annoying?

1. It wastes your time
2. It lowers your social reputation in any circles this girl may be in.
3. It drains your energy.

 

[BeExcellent]

It´s interesting to hear a woman say it directly.

I think a lot of the problems that men have is because they´re too passive and they expect women to make the first move.

I agree wholeheartedly. I have stated around here countless times that the best women operate this way. The best you’ll do perhaps is you’ll get swiped on by a woman on OLD. That by itself is the indicator of interest. From there, be a man & initiate. Otherwise the chick will select from those men who are acting like a man and initiating...all you are in an online dating profile is a paragraph & a few photos. Pretty low investment. Understand that, cast a wide net, and contact women. You’ll do fine.

I don’t do OLD, and the couple of times I’ve tried I’ve lasted a week and that’s it. Too much of a time sink. I meet men going about my life rather than online...and I find I meet the kind of men I’d like to meet by going places I like to go.

As to other posters crying about “well you couldn’t survive if you were men....?” How childish. If females were males we’d be male, right, so just like men. But we are women. Men desire the company of women. That’s not news. Women have strengths on different things than men, which again should be understood. Men and women are built to complement one another. And how healthy women approach the mating realm is different than how men approach it.

I know men who expect to be chased after. Without exception the women willing to chase are less attractive, less desirable, less of a package than a woman who requires effort from a man. These women are also insecure and needy/clingy, which gets old fast. In other words expecting women to chase is selecting for a sub optimal slice of the market. Sure you can get laid doing that if you as a guy has game. But you will end up with the crazies and psychos who are insecure and too unstable to develop a quality interaction with a quality man.

And then you’ll wonder why you don’t have a quality relationship at some point. You take on the female/feminine role when you expect the woman to chase. That puts the woman in the masculine role of the hunter. Healthy women don’t do that. They are feminine and demure & wait for a man to approach them. That is the natural order of things.

Expecting women to chase sets you up to have relationships with domineering women...also not natural. But passive men typically end up with??? Domineering women. Don’t set it up that way.

Men approach/initiate, women respond. That is optimal. Even today in 2021.

 

[Guy69JackBlue]

I agree wholeheartedly. I have stated around here countless times that the best women operate this way. The best you’ll do perhaps is you’ll get swiped on by a woman on OLD. That by itself is the indicator of interest. From there, be a man & initiate. Otherwise the chick will select from those men who are acting like a man and initiating...all you are in an online dating profile is a paragraph & a few photos. Pretty low investment. Understand that, cast a wide net, and contact women. You’ll do fine.

I don’t do OLD, and the couple of times I’ve tried I’ve lasted a week and that’s it. Too much of a time sink. I meet men going about my life rather than online...and I find I meet the kind of men I’d like to meet by going places I like to go.

As to other posters crying about “well you couldn’t survive if you were men....?” How childish. If females were males we’d be male, right, so just like men. But we are women. Men desire the company of women. That’s not news. Women have strengths on different things than men, which again should be understood. Men and women are built to complement one another. And how healthy women approach the mating realm is different than how men approach it.

I know men who expect to be chased after. Without exception the women willing to chase are less attractive, less desirable, less of a package than a woman who requires effort from a man. These women are also insecure and needy/clingy, which gets old fast. In other words expecting women to chase is selecting for a sub optimal slice of the market. Sure you can get laid doing that if you as a guy has game. But you will end up with the crazies and psychos who are insecure and too unstable to develop a quality interaction with a quality man.

And then you’ll wonder why you don’t have a quality relationship at some point. You take on the female/feminine role when you expect the woman to chase. That puts the woman in the masculine role of the hunter. Healthy women don’t do that. They are feminine and demure & wait for a man to approach them. That is the natural order of things.

Expecting women to chase sets you up to have relationships with domineering women...also not natural. But passive men typically end up with??? Domineering women. Don’t set it up that way.

Men approach/initiate, women respond. That is optimal. Even today in 2021.

Females don't "compliment" as much as you think. It's more of a parasitic relationship. They have a hole to offer in return. Nobody really cares what females say or think... They just tolerate them if they think it will gain them access to a hole that is necessary to satisfy a physiological need that males have.

You don't understand the basic fundamentals that underpin male and female relations.

Male/female relationships are not "mutualistic" like you are saying... It is more parasitic. And the male is willing to tolerate this because it allows him to satisfy a physiological NEED.

 

[bat soup]

I've found that terms like "chase" and "passive" are relative and framed from the male perspective on Sosuave.

True, women don't approach like men approach. They do chase. Many men can't get out of their logical minds and see the more-than-obvious initiations that women make. I would say 80% of the time, when a man thinks he's been successfully audacious with a woman, he's really just played his part without realizing her audacity - because it's subtle. At some point she gives him control - and she gives him plenty of opportunities to fukk it up.

But this is Sosuave, the terms are framed by men, which is fine - whatever helps them improve. I'm seeing a different paradigm. The whole ball field and all nine innings.

It's true that women are subtle. Incredibly subtle, unless you know what to look for. And then it's glaringly obvious.

 

[Vantagepoint34]

I agree wholeheartedly. I have stated around here countless times that the best women operate this way. The best you’ll do perhaps is you’ll get swiped on by a woman on OLD. That by itself is the indicator of interest. From there, be a man & initiate. Otherwise the chick will select from those men who are acting like a man and initiating...all you are in an online dating profile is a paragraph & a few photos. Pretty low investment. Understand that, cast a wide net, and contact women. You’ll do fine.

I don’t do OLD, and the couple of times I’ve tried I’ve lasted a week and that’s it. Too much of a time sink. I meet men going about my life rather than online...and I find I meet the kind of men I’d like to meet by going places I like to go.

As to other posters crying about “well you couldn’t survive if you were men....?” How childish. If females were males we’d be male, right, so just like men. But we are women. Men desire the company of women. That’s not news. Women have strengths on different things than men, which again should be understood. Men and women are built to complement one another. And how healthy women approach the mating realm is different than how men approach it.

I know men who expect to be chased after. Without exception the women willing to chase are less attractive, less desirable, less of a package than a woman who requires effort from a man. These women are also insecure and needy/clingy, which gets old fast. In other words expecting women to chase is selecting for a sub optimal slice of the market. Sure you can get laid doing that if you as a guy has game. But you will end up with the crazies and psychos who are insecure and too unstable to develop a quality interaction with a quality man.

And then you’ll wonder why you don’t have a quality relationship at some point. You take on the female/feminine role when you expect the woman to chase. That puts the woman in the masculine role of the hunter. Healthy women don’t do that. They are feminine and demure & wait for a man to approach them. That is the natural order of things.

Expecting women to chase sets you up to have relationships with domineering women...also not natural. But passive men typically end up with??? Domineering women. Don’t set it up that way.

Men approach/initiate, women respond. That is optimal. Even today in 2021.

No. Wait a minute...rebuttle here. You don't agree Males in the future don't get wiped out? 2021 has changed. The normal girl that lives at the gym was interrupted by gym closures. Ladies have veras Fat put on weight. It's well known women don't handle the extra weight(that's a big dynamic). Look at the science predicted only women are left. Orange tans prevail. We've met in the past for sure lol small world :crazy: