Now that I've got the number...

[krd]

Okay, so I finally got a girls phone number after about a year of not doing it. I was so excited when it happened, but I soon went right back to being stressed out. Now I actually have to call her on the phone and try and make some plans, but I don’t know how I’m going to pull it off. In the past, every time I’ve gotten a girls phone number, it has never led to an actual date. Plans fell through, or I gave up too easily or whatever.

I want to try and call her tomorrow, since there is an event I’ll be going to. I met her and her friend at a concert on campus in which I was a guest performer. As her friend wandered away for a little while, we got a chance to talk and she explained that she happened to step out of the room during my performance, so she never got to see me. This time, it’ll be a similar event in which I am also invited to perform. It wouldn’t be a date, but maybe it could be a chance to get to know her a little better and for her to see me perform. If she happens to show up on her own, or her friend wanders a way for a few moments, hopefully we can get a chance to talk afterward and make further plans. (I’m not quite sure what to do if I am unable to get her alone, though.)

I keep going over the rules in my mind and praying that I know what to do. From what I understand, I must wait 3-5 days from when we met to call her. Tomorrow it will have been three days. Also, I’ve heard that if nobody answers, and a machine picks up, I should not leave a message. This is a tough one to follow, because what do I do then? If I keep calling her and nobody answers, won’t she figure out it’s me and get annoyed? And if I do leave a message, what do I say? Do I ask her to call me back? Doing this would allow the ball in her court, and I’ve heard that I should always maintain control. But that leads me back to the problem I just mentioned.

I hate calling people on the phone. Sometimes I can actually feel my heart pound whenever I have to do this, so I really hope I’ll be able to hide the nervousness in my voice and not stumble over words or anything. And not give up at the first sign of things not going as smoothly as I’d hoped, but at the same time, not coming off as too pushy or desperate. I’m actually considering printing out Pimpology’s post on the subject and keeping it by the phone with me.
http://www.sosuave.com/ubb/Forum6/HTML/000685.html

I know I sound like I’ve got a major case of one-itis, but it’s really not about the girl. I just want to break out of this lifelong slump I’ve been in. These situations don’t happen to me often enough for me to just wait for the next time. If an opportunity finally comes along, and I don’t handle it the right way, then it’ll be the same story for the next opportunity, and the one after that, and the one after that, etc. My main goal (as far as my social life is concerned) has been the same for six years—to get a date. If it’s so nerve racking for me getting to stage one—the approach, and stage two—getting the number, how can I possibly get enough practice with stage three—getting the date? So I have to take advantage of the opportunity while I still have it.

In a way, it’s hard to justify why I am posting this, because to me, it’s such a long shot that I’ll be able to pull this off, anyway. My friend has been unavailable these past few days (the one time I could really use his advice) so I guess I’m looking for some feedback.

 

[am4591]

Yeah, I hate talking on the phone too. Just chat for a few minutes, though, then set up the date. Then get off the phone, save the conversation for when you see her.

Invite her to your place for dinner before this event--that is, if it's at night--then take her to your show. Of course, if you're performing the whole time, you won't get to talk to her much, so you can make up for it afterward. Good luck.

 

[krd]

Originally posted by am4591
Invite her to your place for dinner before this event--that is, if it's at night--then take her to your show. Of course, if you're performing the whole time, you won't get to talk to her much, so you can make up for it afterward. Good luck.

That's a good suggestion; unfortunately, I still live with my mom, so inviting her to my place isn't really an option. I'll most likely only be performing one song, so I may very well have other opportunities to talk to her.

I've got all sorts of scenarios in my mind, such as what would happen if she did answer the phone, but couldn't make it. Would I then suggest we make plans to get together some other time? Keep in mind, with my lack of transportation and inexperience (and uncomfortableness) with driving, I really have little idea at this point how I am going to pull off the task of taking her out. I'm thinking of just holding off on it for now, perhaps seeking advice from my friend first and then calling her back when I have a better idea of what to do. Of course, if she says she can't make it, perhaps it's a sign that she isn't interested. In which case, if I call her a second time to try make plans, I may come across as pushy and unable to take a hint.

There are all kinds of factors to consider when trying to make something like this happen. Just my luck, I may be faced with a scenario that I simply wan't expecting and will have no idea of what to do next. Being able to pursue this in the right way without coming out looking or feeling like a fool is a tough hill to climb. I know it's not the right attitude to have, but sometimes I really feel like the odds are against me. Looking over my past experiences and still feeling like I haven't improved or learned anything reinforces this belief. If this weren't the case, there would be no need for me to make posts such as this one.

 

[BGMan]

What I do is simply ask her to meet with me at a coffee shop for a half-hour chat. Taking her out to dinner is something that I would save for a later date (say, third date).

Krd, you're coming along nicely. I was in your situation a couple of years ago, and trust me, while it may seem the most frightening thing to do at first, after a while it won't be so bad. This isn't to say I don't get nervous still, but the nervousness is low enough I don't let it get in my way.

What you should do is just do it, and if you stumble, don't sweat it; just keep on doing it and getting other girls' numbers. Some girls, incidentally, will think you're very brave for asking them out because most guys are too chicken (a major complaint women have about men these days), so if you stumble, don't assume the girl thinks you're a wuss.

BGMan

 

[krd]

Well, I did it. I called her up to invite her to my performance. I actually called and there was no answer, not even a machine. After about six rings I gave up and figured I'd never hear from her again. But a few minutes later, a remarkable thing happened. She called me back. Caller ID can be a good thing sometimes! Anyway, she told me she couldn't make it--she already had plans for mothers day. We had a little bit of light conversation about what we were doing for mothers day. She seemed in a really good mood. She wished me luck at my performance and said she had to go. I realize we probably talked a little too much and I should have ended the phonecall before she got a chance, but all in all, I was just happy she called back.

About an hour after I came back from the performance, I got another phonecall. Again, it was her. I was so surprised! The girl actually called me on her own! She asked me how I did with my performance and we had some more light conversation. I know that I am supposed to keep the conversations brief, but I never pictured the scenario where she is the one calling me. If someone calls you--usually, it means they want to talk. Still, I believe I let the conversation run on to long, as she was the one who eventually ended the phonecall this time as well.

Now at first, I was really excited and happy, but anyone who knows me well, knows I don't stay that way for long. A few things got me confused. For one thing, I threw out the idea of us doing something together later on in the week. She said she liked art, so I suggested a couple of art galleries I knew of in the area. I even asked which days she would be free and she said she didn't know. But somehow the conversation got steered in another direction. I don't quite remember how it happened, but I'm concerned that she may have done that intentionally, because she doesn't want to go out with me. But why would she call me in the first place? Was she testing me to see if she really liked me and I failed the test? Also, I heard other people talking in the background and she was talking to one of her friends a few times during the conversation. There were definitely other people in the room. Maybe they were saying things about me, who knows? Maybe they actually had her call me so that they could say things about me behind my back. She also seems a bit giggly, maybe even a little flaky--it's really hard to tell if she really likes me or if she's just playing little games with me for her own amusement.

So at first I took the phonecall as a really good sign, but now I'm skeptical. Of course I'm making all kinds of assumptions about this girl I hardly even know. But does anybody think my assumptions are justified? Or am I being overly pessimistic? I know I'll eventualy find out for myself, but I guess it helps me a little bit for the time being to hear other peoples opinions.

 

[crowes22]

krd, RELAX man, and quit thinking so damn much.

You want to ask her out, then do it, no more fvcking 'what if's', alright?

You are being your own enemy here man, I'm serious.

You are doing fine, apart from second guessing every damn scenario you 'think' may be going on.

You are looking for every reason you'll fail, or that she doesn't like you. Stop man, I can't tell you how important that is!

Relax and realize you are already chatting w/ her. Quit being so fvcking negative about your past w/ chicks, wtf can you do about it? Not shyt. Except learn.

RELAX!!!! Don't be afraid to crash-n-burn man. If you are, you will NEVER even take off! Remember that. Even when you are feeling all nervous, those nerves can be a brick wall, or they can be a boost of adrenaline.

Know what I think is cool about it? It's up to YOU to decide which they'll be, will they hinder you, or help you?

If you can learn to make them help (only by facing them), you'll see that they can be an ally, not a foe.

You want her? Go for it, best of luck.

 

[finn_dogg]

Hey, you are overthinking everything right now. Looking too far into things, I've got the same problem.

She called you back right...so there has to be some interest level. You are looking too deep I think. You were happy she called...but then you started to look at all of the negative things that could be the reason why she called. Don't do this because it will kill you, trust me. It is an AFC thing to do and only makes you more nervous in the end because you aren't as confident.

One thing you should realize is that she is probably nervous too. This is when you gotta be a man and be cool. If a weird situation comes up like a pause in the converstion, it will only be weird if you make it seem weird. You gotta act like and man more and not look at the negatives.

Forget your past with women or striking out. Remember, you only need to find one right one...and chances are you won't find her on the first try.

 

[Rev]

Hi krd, I remember your 'no results' post (archives). I'm sure we're all glad to see you post here again. Obviously you've got a terrible confidence problem, but I think you are relatively confident in yourself as a person. You are just clueless about what you perceive to be a rigid and complicated process. Anyway, you did fine up to here:

Originally posted by krd
For one thing, I threw out the idea of us doing something together later on in the week. She said she liked art, so I suggested a couple of art galleries I knew of in the area. I even asked which days she would be free and she said she didn't know.

I must point out that setting up dates had been my biggest weakness (I go a non-traditional route), but this jumps out at me: Fundamental error. 'Suggesting the idea' is fine IMO but you are a busy man with a lot to do and you cannot arrange your schedule around her free time. Only a desperate man would be available for her at the time of her choosing. You (the man) determine the place/time/activity. You'll always get that same answer asking when she's free. If you want, give her 2 time/date choices right up front. If she happens to truely not be available, it doesn't matter, because now the ball is in her court and she can counter-offer if she's interested. Trust the other guys on this board for advice on how to make a date that sticks.

But somehow the conversation got steered in another direction. I don't quite remember how it happened, but I'm concerned that she may have done that intentionally, because she doesn't want to go out with me.

No Dude, this happens. It's called conversation. Just let the subject keep changing and changing (and don't try to bring it back). That's what a great conversation is.

But why would she call me in the first place? Was she testing me to see if she really liked me and I failed the test?

She called you because she had high IL. Maybe she was turned on by your musical talent. Congradulations! Learn from how you achieved this.

Testing? Possibly. Good Instinct to recognize this but you should have made your intentions clear - to get a date with her to find out if you want to proceed to get to know her better

Also, I heard other people talking in the background and she was talking to one of her friends a few times during the conversation. There were definitely other people in the room. Maybe they were saying things about me, who knows? Maybe they actually had her call me so that they could say things about me behind my back. She also seems a bit giggly, maybe even a little flaky--it's really hard to tell if she really likes me or if she's just playing little games with me for her own amusement.

Now your just being paranoid. Stop that. If you're really concerned, just ask.

So at first I took the phonecall as a really good sign, but now I'm skeptical. Of course I'm making all kinds of assumptions about this girl I hardly even know. But does anybody think my assumptions are justified? Or am I being overly pessimistic? I know I'll eventualy find out for myself, but I guess it helps me a little bit for the time being to hear other peoples opinions.

Hmmm. I would proceed with expectations only of gaining a learning experience. Maybe next time you ask her out, say (in a C/F tone) "This is your last chance, y' know." Then bust her balls (which you haven't mentioned doing BTW).

 

[Rev]

BTW, If you call and she's not there and you get a machine (and since chances are she's got caller id but you can't be sure) just leave a very brief message. Someone posted this:

machine: *beep*
you: "Hey, this is krd. I'm at 555-5555." (hang up)

A message this short doesn't even give you a chance to stumble and leaves minimum for her to analyze.

 

[krd]

Wow, thanks guys for the replies. It definitely makes me feel a little bit better. I wasn't able to sleep very well last night, partly because wasn't feeling too well, but also because this has been on my mind. You guys are right--I do overanalyze things, it's a major downfall of mine. I guess I figure if I think of every possible thing that can go wrong, it'll be less of a disappointment if it does happen.

And Rev, I agree that I can't let her know that I'm not busy and that I need to make it look as if I have a life. Again, that's a danger of talking on the phone too much, because it makes it look like you've got nothing better to do. She definitely has caller ID, because I never gave her my number, yet she was able to call me (although she doesn't appear to have a machine). Next time this happens, I'm considering not answering, and perhaps calling her back in a few days on my own terms, with the intention of setting up a date. I definitely don't want to become her "phone buddy" or someone she calls up all the time like one of her girlfriends. Because that's what she'll end up seeing me as. Although, in a way, I hope she does call me again, because then I'll at least know she's still a little interested.

I printed out Pimpology's post, and like I said, I'm going to keep it by me when I call her. He breaks it down pretty well. As for "busting her balls", that's a tough one. I feel that in this case, it could be dangerous to make a generalization and say that it works for all women. It all depends on the girl. For some, it doesn't bother them at all--they're used to it and they'll give it to you right back. Others may take it the wrong way. Saying something like "this is your last chance" may appear conceited to some women, whereas others would be able to see the humor. Perhaps I should get to know her a little better so that I can decide which one she is.

For instance, one time around Valentine's Day just for fun, I put my arm around a girl I knew and asked her to be my valentine. When she said "sure", I took it away and said "Just kidding". The next time I saw her, she let me know that she was offended by it and that I had developed a big ego. I told her I was only joking. There are no hard feelings and I've still talked to her since then, but it just goes to show that you never really know how a girl will react.

 

[krd]

Just a few more points on the replies. I plan on asking her Wednesday. The reason I didn’t set up any definite plans right then was because I was reluctant to attempt to make any real plans until I had a better idea of how I was going to go about things. I didn’t expect her to call me—I was most likely going wait a few days before I talked to her again. As I said, I’m a very inexperienced driver, so as far as transportation is concerned, I didn’t want to set up anything I wasn’t going to be able to handle later. Now I’m in the early stages of deciding how I’m going to go ahead with it. Hopefully I’ll know in a few days, so I can give her a set of clear options.

I want to do something that she would enjoy. She said she liked art, but didn’t appear too enthused when I mentioned the art gallery. However, I know I’m supposed to have a set of options already pre-determined, so that I remain in control of the way things are going. Asking her straight out what she wants to do, I realize, is supplicating AFC behavior. I’m not really sure how I’m going to make sure she will have fun with me and at the same time, not let her think she’s running the show. Otherwise, she’ll lose interest, and to be honest I have doubts whether she’s interested to begin with.

Which is why I wonder if I should be taking all this time to plan things out. I could easily just be wasting my time, especially if she just ends up giving me excuses as to why she can’t go. I know this sounds funny, but it kind of bothers me that I haven’t received a phone-call from her today. I wouldn’t even answer it anyway, because I’m aware that doing so would probably do more harm than good, but the fact that she hasn’t called today in comparison to yesterday, when she called me out of the blue, is to me, most likely a sign that her interest level is petering out.

So I should probably start to consider forgetting about her and moving on to meeting other girls. Problem is, the semester’s almost over, my friend that I hang out with (and helps me with my women issues) will probably be going back home, and there will be much fewer opportunities to meet women. So I kind of feel like this is my last chance for quite a while. Let’s hope things start working out soon.

 

[BGMan]

All right, KRD, let's get some things straight.

1) Girls hardly ever call guys. When they do, they're usually highly interested in you.

2) Don't think that just because she didn't call you today that her interest is petering out. See above.

In summary, just stop thinking so hard, take her to the @#$*%art gallery and have some fun! And while you're there with her, make sure to also talk about other things you both find interesting. Act as if you're enjoying yourself. These things take practice, so don't expect to DJ it totally the first time.

If she gives you excuses, then simply brush it off and look at the progress you have made thus far. You said that you haven't gotten this far with anybody before, right? Just take it easy!

Also, you may want to do something like take her out for a quick ice cream afterwards (for, say, 15 mins). Just a thought.

BGMan

 

[BGMan]

Will someone ban this MartL guy? He must REALLY be 1 year old!

BGMan

 

[krd]

I've thought about what I should do, and I think the best plan of action would be to skip the whole art gallery deal, and just take her out to eat at one of my favorite pizza places. It's not very fancy or expensive, but the food is good. The art gallery is only open at certain times--on weekends it's only 12 to 4. Definitely not an ideal time for a date. Plus I really don't know how much she likes art galleries--I mainly assumed she did, because she is studying fine arts in school. But standing around looking at paintings is not everyone's idea of a good time--however, I believe few people would turn down a night out for dinner.

The main thing I have to do is practice driving, so that I'll have it down by Friday, perhaps get more comfortable with parking. The restaurant I have in mind has a rather small parking lot up on a slope, and if it happens to be full, I may have to parallel park on the street. But if all else fails, I guess I can have my little brother drop me off--he's 17 and has his own car. I don't know--would this be an acceptable alternative? I figure it beats having my mom drive me.

Just a question though, should I call her tomorrow or on Thursday? If I call her tomorrow, she'll be less likely to make other plans if she knows about it longer in advance. However, she'll have more time to think about it and possibly change her mind. If I call her on Thursday, it will seem more spontaneous and less planned, more informal and relaxed. But again, it may end up being too short notice. What do you guys think? Also, if I ask her if she's available on the days I suggest, and she says something like "I don't know", how would I respond?

Anyway, thanks guys, for your suggestions so far. They've really given me a bit more hope that maybe it's not too impossible to pull this off. Still, I guess I'll just have to wait and see.