Nice guys ARE jerks.

[coldcoal]

Yes, I know. It's a topic that just won't die. It is an aleness with hundreds of home remedies, and despite all there is to read, the question never dies: What is wrong with me? What am I doing wrong? Why doesn't she like me?

My kind friend, the answer is in your questions.
You, Mr. Nice Guy, are a self-centered bafoon.
You are the jerk.

You see, "jerks" are not really jerks. A jerk is rational enough to realize that there are simply hundreds of reasons, reasons that have nothing to do with him, as to why women can and inevitably will reject him from time to time.
A jerk knows there is little he can do to decypher and salvage these mystery reasons. He is a realist. He chalks it up to experience and moves on to greener pastures without haste;
He tries to learn more about...THEM.

A nice guy, on the other hand, always puts himself at the center of everyone else's universe. You believe a woman does not like you because of something about YOU. Something YOU did. Something YOU said. The way YOU look. It's always me, me, me with you damn nice people. You are perfecionists. You believe you fail because of YOUR imperfections.

You, Mr. Nice fellow, are SO self-centered that you actually believed at some point that you knew what women wanted. So much, in fact, that you would TELL women themselves about how great you are, about how you will romance them, about how you listen well. Me, me, me. Look at me. I'm a great guy. You will love me becuase I am what women say they want.

HA! What an EGO!

"Jerks" don't make all of these fanatical promises to perfect strangers. They are realistic enough to know the depths and effort required to be truly "the one". They know it is unique. And for this reason, they are more conservative with thier gifts and promises and showering affection.

To be continued....

 

[Gangster Of Love]

Absolutely right on target. The "Nice Guy" is tryin' too hard and uses his fake niceness to manipulate people, women in particular, into liking him. The jerk has an attitude of "What you see is what you get", whereas the nice guy is a wolf in sheep's clothing, harder to detect, yet deep inside he is most likely as bad and manipulative as the jerk, if not more.

 

[MackJr]

I think that's harsh. Nice guys really are nice, they're just making the mistake that women want to be treated the same way they want to be treated.

When you start learning this stuff, the initial temptation is to be a jerk. You can be nice, but do so in masculine, almost macho way. Macho is bull**** but if you think about it, those women who act like children are putting on an act too. For some reasons these displays are associated with sexuality.

A woman I was with had had psycho boyfriends before. She was ultura feminine and so made the mistake of associating uncontrolled aggression with mature manliness. I turned her on without hitting her or doing crazy stuff that her jerk boyfriends did that I won't mention online.

Masculine, not crazy.

 

[coldcoal]

Men are called jerks quite often for less than serious reasons. In many cases being a 'typical man' is as good of a reason as any other for a woman to qualify you as a jerk. Sometimes you just have to be right about something. "Crazy" and "abusive" are not standard or required prerequisites, and I think no person here seriously believes an alcoholic, woman-beating scumbag is something to spotlight as admirable in any way.

What is important here is the irony of the nice guy mentality when compared to general jerk-like characturistics.

Jerks are often considered ignorant of a woman's feelings or needs, most especially by hard core 'nice guys', yet it is most frequently the nice guy who is tossed way side by women and struggles most frequently with this type of failure.

No one calls him a hypocrite.


Nice guys suffer with this failure for 5 years, 10 years or a lifetime because no one will call him stubborn and ignorant.


He doesn't know because no one will tell him.

The goal is not to become a jerk at all. It is to realize that, in thier own way, they have been one all along.

 

[coldcoal]

The Bottom Line

It is what the nice guy fails to do that makes him 'the jerk'.

Women are simply people and people enjoy privacy as much as company, predictability as much as spontinuity and so on. To largely deprive a person of reasonable balances between these things, one way or another, is testing a person's tolerance.

Jerks are too much of one thing, nice guys are too much of another. Neither is better than the other, because they violate the same principle of balance. They are the same. Nice guys ARE jerks.

Women may appear to say they want one while they go for the other, but the truth is they seek a self-defined mixture of BOTH. They want the balance that suits thier own personality, as a person in whole.

It is for this reason a "DJ" can break "DJ rules" partially and sometimes; why "AFC" tactics can be effectively seductive and why some "DJ" tactics might from time to time fail. And all vice versa.

For the nice guy to be afraid of being a jerk is no different than a jerk being afraid to be a nice guy.

Each deprive, together they thrive.

 

[DJ_Dork]

Think you got it partially wrong - jerks are pretty much self centered like nice guys are. Nice guys believe that "being nice" makes up for their "lackies" which girls see as "loser"

 

[coldcoal]

Originally posted by DJ_Dork
Think you got it partially wrong - jerks are pretty much self centered like nice guys are. Nice guys believe that "being nice" makes up for their "lackies" which girls see as "loser"

This would be another way to look at it, but it still boils down to the same idea. If jerks are self-centered like nice guys, then nice guys must be self centered like jerks.

If nice guys believe being nice makes up for 'lackies', then it is a form of ignorance because this is rarely the actual outcome.

At any rate, the 'nice guy is jerk' post is more about hitting the right variety of basic emotional needs a human being, more than it is about nice guys and jerks.

Space to Intimacy
Laughter to Compassion
Intellectual Stimulation to Fun
Challenge to Dependability
Predictability to Spontanuity
Romance to Drama and so on

The full spectrum is at the whim of a resourceful DJ.

Starting to build this spectrum is what we all learn here. We start small in a way by giving the woman a phone call (attention) after waiting an X number of days (no attention). What should be realized is that as the stages move on, there is still the same basic pattern of attention vs. no attention that can essentially be followed. The adjustment is not the give and take of attention, the adjustment is WHAT to give and take in the form of attention. This is where balance comes into play.

A suave Don would know that a form of space (being scarce, busy, occupied) would be best followed immediately by something more intimate, such as scented candles and a massage. The candles/massage is powerful in it's own right, but with the right timing it can be explosive.....especially when mixed and matched with other balances.

For example, in the quip above, we have the balance of space and intimacy. But we can add spontinuity to make it more powerful by injecting the intimacy into the time slot of an essentially boring daily routine (predictability).

What is most important here is that the theory applies to both monogomous LTRs and gigilo-type seductions. Both men need the power in balance to accentuate each effort against another.

We can compare efforts to colors; like painting a white line on a black canvas. It is accentual by it's own contrast; requires little effort to notice. But when one effort is a slight shade darker than the next then the next and the next, it becomes tedious to draw attention to the changes. It will all seem monotone in short time.
A resourceful DJ's job is easier when balance and contrast is well understood and applied.

This is what nice guys, jerks and even some Dons lack.