Need some help with phone conversations

[cowboysfan09]

Ok, so I am new to this forum, but have been reading it for a few weeks. I decided to post here after I noticed a recent trend with my phone conversations. Lately, I've been getting better at getting a girl's number (and I am just basing this on the fact that I have been getting more, whether I am doing it the right way or not according to this site). But, when I make the phone call, this is where things start to go downhill.

I usually debate with myself whether I should try to have a conversation on the phone before asking for a date or getting straight to asking for the date. I usually end up just straight asking. Well, the last few times after I asked, I'll get some type of excuse (which some of them have sounded pretty legit). Now, I think this is where I mess up. I will ask what there schedule is like the rest of the week. I'll get something like "I'm busy tomorrow, but Thursday and Friday I have nothing to do." So then I say something like "Ok then, I'll give you a call on Wednesday or Thursday and we go out to a bar or something." And she will be like that sounds good. But everytime I call the second time, she doesn't answer (this has happened twice, very similar stories). I'll call a third time, leave a message with my plans, and just delete the number and let her make the next move, which she doesn't make.

So, where exactly am I going wrong? Is not a good idea to persist after getting an excuse for the first date? Should I try to talk more instead of going straight for the plans? Or, am I doing ok and its just the girls weren't looking for something like that? I am open to criticism and would like some good advice. As a side note, I have social anxiety disorder and getting to the point of getting numbers has been hard, put now that I am at this point, I would like to go beyond it. So, any type of criticism is welcome. Thanks in advance.

 

[Igetit!]

Ok, so I am new to this forum, but have been reading it for a few weeks. I decided to post here after I noticed a recent trend with my phone conversations. Lately, I've been getting better at getting a girl's number (and I am just basing this on the fact that I have been getting more, whether I am doing it the right way or not according to this site). But, when I make the phone call, this is where things start to go downhill.

I usually debate with myself whether I should try to have a conversation on the phone before asking for a date or getting straight to asking for the date. I usually end up just straight asking. Well, the last few times after I asked, I'll get some type of excuse (which some of them have sounded pretty legit). Now, I think this is where I mess up. I will ask what there schedule is like the rest of the week. I'll get something like "I'm busy tomorrow, but Thursday and Friday I have nothing to do." So then I say something like "Ok then, I'll give you a call on Wednesday or Thursday and we go out to a bar or something." And she will be like that sounds good. But everytime I call the second time, she doesn't answer (this has happened twice, very similar stories). I'll call a third time, leave a message with my plans, and just delete the number and let her make the next move, which she doesn't make.

So, where exactly am I going wrong? Is not a good idea to persist after getting an excuse for the first date? Should I try to talk more instead of going straight for the plans? Or, am I doing ok and its just the girls weren't looking for something like that? I am open to criticism and would like some good advice. As a side note, I have social anxiety disorder and getting to the point of getting numbers has been hard, put now that I am at this point, I would like to go beyond it. So, any type of criticism is welcome. Thanks in advance.

Although a few possibilities come to mind as to what the problems might be,I don't want to guess. So a little more info might be helpful in finding the answer. I'd like to do a comparasion between your conversation with a girl when you get her number versus the convos you have when you're on the phone where the girls seem to lose interest.

Give an example of each. Clear,detailed examples.

I want to see what the difference is between when you get the number,where the girl obviously has interest (unless she gave you her number just to make you go away,but let's assume not),and when you're in a phone conversation,where that interest seeme to have waned.

Answer this...

What do you talk about on the phone with her? (be as ACCURATE as you can on this one).

How much time do you normally let pass between you getting her number and giving her a call?

Also,how do you sound when you're on the phone? Do you have any emotion or feeling going on while you're talking to her?

Answer these question the best you can.

 

[cowboysfan09]

Although a few possibilities come to mind as to what the problems might be,I don't want to guess. So a little more info might be helpful in finding the answer. I'd like to do a comparasion between your conversation with a girl when you get her number versus the convos you have when you're on the phone where the girls seem to lose interest.

Give an example of each. Clear,detailed examples.

I want to see what the difference is between when you get the number,where the girl obviously has interest (unless she gave you her number just to make you go away,but let's assume not),and when you're in a phone conversation,where that interest seeme to have waned.

Answer this...

What do you talk about on the phone with her? (be as ACCURATE as you can on this one).

How much time do you normally let pass between you getting her number and giving her a call?

Also,how do you sound when you're on the phone? Do you have any emotion or feeling going on while you're talking to her?

Answer these question the best you can.

Hey, thanks for the quick reply. I'm not sure the best the way to answer all of these questions, so I'll just tell you the whole story and see if it helps. But, let me preface this by saying, I don't think I use all of the tricks on this site. I don't try the C&F or make fun of them and stuff like that. If the conversation gives me an oppurtunity to go for one of those, then I will, but generally, I don't like make fun of people. I find that I can talk most easily by just being myself and saying what I would normally say in any conversation. Ok, now the story (LONG)...

So I met this girl at a wedding a few weeks back. She was a bridesmaid and I was a groomsman and we had to walk together. So this was a perfect chance for me to talk to her. I was just kind of joking with her as we were walking but this wasn't really much of a chance to talk. She wasn't laughing too much but I didn't let that stop me from being myself. As we were walking up to area of the reception, she comes and grabs my arm and says "I better walk with my groomsman" even though none of the other ones were doing this. I knew at this point she was into me and it honestly screwed with my head. Having social anxiety, it takes awhile for me to warm up to people. I didn't really know what the next best move was so I didn't really say much of anything while we were walking together at this point. It was like, ok I blew this, whatever. Later, all the bridesmaids and groomsmen had to dance together and she seemed really excited to dance, so I thought I still have a chance. She asked if I was having fun and I said yea and said "and the bachelor party was pretty fun too," just to keep the talking going. She asked me about the bachelor party and I think it made me seem like a pretty social person so I was happy with that. From that point on, every time there was a slow dance song, she would grab me to come dance.
While dancing, we talked about the music that was being played. I'd like to tell you exactly what was said, but I really can't remember every sentence. I wasn't too flirty, just talking and getting to know more about each other's taste in music. Finally on the last dance, I went and asked her to dance before she could ask me. Again, can't remember the exact words but just talking, nothing flirty. And a lot of the time she's rubbing my back, so I know she's into it. Anyway, before I leave and go and say bye. I say "you seem like a fun person and I think we could have fun together, can I get your number so we can hang out some time." and I get the number. I also find out that the bride of the wedding has put in a good word for me and thats probably why I was getting so many chances.

I call her not the next day but the day after that, around midnight. As I said, I went straight for asking if she wanted to go see one of my friends perform in a band that weekend. She said she had plans with family and I asked if she what the rest of the week was like. She said the Thursday and Friday are free (as I mentioned in the original post). I then asked her if she did anything after the wedding, she said she went out with friends to a bar. I guess I could have talked more about this but I told her what I did and that I did it all in my tux. She found this pretty funny. I ended it there and just said that I'd call that Wed or Thurs and it all lasted about four minutes. My emotions: I didn't want to sound dull or over excited, I just talked normally and tried to be friendly, I was laughing and smiling. What I find wierd is that if she gave me the number to get rid of me, then why did she answer when I called?

Thanks for reading, and I hope this helps. Let me know if you need more.

 

[Gangster Of Love]

Igetit! gets it!!!

If it is someone you often see, then keep talking and building rapport and increasing her interest in you, then you invite her to get together with you, before you even ask for the number. The number is just a formality at that point. You call her and it is already common knowledge why you're calling, no need to chit chat or get into long convos, where it can only go downhill.

When talking, don't take too long on the phone. By the time you call her, her interest in you needs to already be high, where you are just calling to make plans. Be very decisive. Anytime she can't do it on a specific day, but has a counter offer, it is a very good sign. At that point, if she tells you a couple of days where SHE CAN, then be specific and pick a day. No vagueness.

 

[FirefighterMD]

Igetit! gets it!!!

If it is someone you often see, then keep talking and building rapport and increasing her interest in you, then you invite her to get together with you, before you even ask for the number. The number is just a formality at that point. You call her and it is already common knowledge why you're calling, no need to chit chat or get into long convos, where it can only go downhill.

When talking, don't take too long on the phone. By the time you call her, her interest in you needs to already be high, where you are just calling to make plans. Be very decisive. Anytime she can't do it on a specific day, but has a counter offer, it is a very good sign. At that point, if she tells you a couple of days where SHE CAN, then be specific and pick a day. No vagueness.

This. Work on being more specific with your plans. Get rid of "Let's go out sometime" or "I'll call you then/later" from your vocabulary. If she can't make your first proposed time, ask her when she is available. If she continues being vague like "I'm not sure what I'm doing the rest of the week yet", she probably isn't interested. If she gives you a specific or relative time (ie: "We can go tomorrow instead." "I'm free Friday") it means she probably has some interest. But you need to be precise again. If she is still "busy", I'd probably back off, even if the reasons are legit, she probably doesn't manage time well, or is super busy to the point going any further would just have more problems anyway. Depending on the girl, I might wait a week or two and give it one more try. But don't dwell on it. Go meet other girls in the meantime.

 

[cowboysfan09]

Anytime she can't do it on a specific day, but has a counter offer, it is a very good sign.

Thanks for the reply. What if she doesn't counter? Should I counter with something else like how I asked "when are you free," or should I just let it go?

 

[FirefighterMD]

Thanks for the reply. What if she doesn't counter? Should I counter with something else like how I asked "when are you free," or should I just let it go?

It's perfectly fine to ask her if she is free later in the week if she turns down your first proposal. Like I said, if she continues being vague, it's a bad sign. If her first excuse was legitimate, she'll at least give you a ball-park to work with.

 

[Gangster Of Love]

Try what I do sometimes, a little edgy if you're not used to it, but it will work a good half of the time, specially if there is some interest, tell her, "Ok, when are you taking me out then?", that should be the ONLY question you ask a broad on the phone early on. that should sweep the carpet from under her feet too. She should respond in one of two ways,
"When am I taking you out??? When are YOU taking me out?", or "Whe are you available", both win-win situations. Her communication at this point is all non-verbal, if she just can't stop being vague or non-commital, she is not interested enough. You can just say, "Ok, well, call me in two weeks or so"; that's your way of you checking out, and do it without expecting anything. Move on.

Every invitation needs to be a suggestion, in statement form, as in "Let's go to...." "We need to get together this week..", etc.

 

[Igetit!]

Well,I agree with what Gangster of Love said for you to do.


As for the interaction you gave a description of,to me,it appears that there was simply no chemistry there. No fire,no passion,no electricity,no drive,no...no nothing. It was just the standard cookie cutter,"Would you like to get together sometime?" comment. This'll be the billionth time I've said this,but here goes...

Women are EMOTIONAL. They want to "FEEL". You have to generate some type of feeling in her,anything. In fact,a guy who would approach her and make her angry would have had a better chance with her than someone with the approach you did.

After all,what is anger anyway? It's just passion in a different form.

Simply put,I think this girl was bored with you. In the beginning,she was open to seeing what you were all about based on the good word the bride of the wedding put in for you. But when it was just the two of you,alone,one on one,I don't think she "felt" anything.

Did you generate any emotion in her? And I mean "ANYTHING"?

Women choose chemistry and passion over character and intergrity.
So it doesn't matter if you were "nice",respectable,or a "good" person,if she doesn't "FEEL" anything,she'll lose interest.

That's what I was looking for in your reply,and I didn't see it.

I saw what seemed to be you being upfront and showing respectibility to her,but no "energy" if you will.

Anyway,that's what I took away from the situation.

 

[cowboysfan09]

Well,I agree with what Gangster of Love said for you to do.


As for the interaction you gave a description of,to me,it appears that there was simply no chemistry there. No fire,no passion,no electricity,no drive,no...no nothing. It was just the standard cookie cutter,"Would you like to get together sometime?" comment. This'll be the billionth time I've said this,but here goes...

Women are EMOTIONAL. They want to "FEEL". You have to generate some type of feeling in her,anything. In fact,a guy who would approach her and make her angry would have had a better chance with her than someone with the approach you did.

After all,what is anger anyway? It's just passion in a different form.

Simply put,I think this girl was bored with you. In the beginning,she was open to seeing what you were all about based on the good word the bride of the wedding put in for you. But when it was just the two of you,alone,one on one,I don't think she "felt" anything.

Did you generate any emotion in her? And I mean "ANYTHING"?

Women choose chemistry and passion over character and intergrity.
So it doesn't matter if you were "nice",respectable,or a "good" person,if she doesn't "FEEL" anything,she'll lose interest.

That's what I was looking for in your reply,and I didn't see it.

I saw what seemed to be you being upfront and showing respectibility to her,but no "energy" if you will.

Anyway,that's what I took away from the situation.

This is very interesting, I guess I never thought of it that way. When I look back on, I don't think I created any emotion. I guess I was doomed even after I got the number. I was making her laugh while we were dancing, does that count? How exactly do you make someone emotional? Do you have a link to another post about this?

 

[Gangster Of Love]

This is very interesting, I guess I never thought of it that way. When I look back on, I don't think I created any emotion. I guess I was doomed even after I got the number. I was making her laugh while we were dancing, does that count? How exactly do you make someone emotional? Do you have a link to another post about this?

By making a connection. Tap into her values. Get her to reveal what she values in her different parts of her life, associate those positive feelings with your company, and create strong attractions.

There is no short cut to what you are asking for. You need to embark on the path. In the meantime, you can experiment with stuff like striking while on a hight note; for example, you could kiss her or make physical contact while she is laughing (sign she's enjoying your company).

To get pretty descent with girls shouldn't take you too long. To get very good at making an emotional connection, it is a longer, ongoing journey.

 

[cowboysfan09]

By making a connection. Tap into her values. Get her to reveal what she values in her different parts of her life, associate those positive feelings with your company, and create strong attractions.

There is no short cut to what you are asking for. You need to embark on the path. In the meantime, you can experiment with stuff like striking while on a hight note; for example, you could kiss her or make physical contact while she is laughing (sign she's enjoying your company).

To get pretty descent with girls shouldn't take you too long. To get very good at making an emotional connection, it is a longer, ongoing journey.

Thanks for all the help gangster, I really appreciate. Can you be a little more specific on tap into her values, like an example that would have worked well in the situation I was in. I'm not sure I completely understand the first paragraph of your reply. I know there's no short cut, and that's why I'm here. I'm new to this game and I want to keep practicing, but not with the same methods everytime. I want to try some of the suggestions here without getting too entangled in what everybody offers to do. I do like the high note thing and will give it a try next time. The only thing I question here is that you guys are making it seem like the only way to get a successful date is to get them emotional, and I'm pretty sure I've seen ppl have success without doing this. But, you're the experts I guess, and I'll give it a try.

 

[Igetit!]

I guess I was doomed even after I got the number. I was making her laugh while we were dancing, does that count?

Does making her laugh count? Well you tell me. Look at the way things are RIGHT NOW between the two of you. Are you happy with the way they are? This is where things can get kind of tricky if you don't have dating experience and don't know what to look for.

A woman WILL SOMETIMES laugh if you generate chemistry in her,but she will also laugh simply because you said something funny.

Don't get these two confused because they're NOT THE SAME.

She can go to a comedy club and laugh all night at the guy on stage cracking jokes,but that doesn't mean she's sexually attracted to him.
She's just laughing because he told a funny joke.

Or just to put it plainly,NO,you making her laugh while you two were dancing didn't count.

How exactly do you make someone emotional? Do you have a link to another post about this?

Well,there are so many posts here on generating emotions in women,but I can't think of a particular one off hand.

However,this question of your on how to make someone emotional is EASY,EASY,EASY to answer. And it's EASY to do.

How do you make someone emotional? Simple. Whatever emotion you want a woman to feel,YOU HAVE TO EXPRESS THAT EMOTION YOURSELF...FIRST.

When you talk to a girl,BE FEELING THE EMOTION YOU WANT HER TO FEEL.

If you're happy while you're speaking to her,your happiness will come across in the way you speak,your tone of voice,your bodylanguage,your demeanor,etc.

Emotions are contagious.

When she "senses" an emotions coming off of you,it'll infect her,then she'll start to feeling that emotion,too.

It's easy to do.

The only thing I question here is you guys are making it seem like the only way to get a successful date is to get them emotional..

THATIS THE ONLY WAY. Unless you plan on going the route of prostitution where there's no emotions involved,just an exchange of money and "services".

Look...

Men are PHYSICAL.

Women are EMOTIONAL.

We men are physical. Now tell me,would you go out with a woman if you knew without a shadow of a doubt,that no matter what you do,what you say,or how long you to went out with her,that she would NEVER let you touch her? If she said,"Ok,I'll go out with you,but there will be no kissing,no hugging,no hand holding,no touching of any kind...EVER.

If you knew that there would never be any physicality of any kind...EVER with a girl,would you still date her? Considering you're a man,hence you're physical?

Of course not.

Well women are EMOTIONAL. If she doesn't "feel" anything in the first few moments with you,you think she's going to sign up for that long term?

The fact that you said that you were starting to get the impression that what I and everyone else was telling you was making you think that the only way to date successfully was to make a woman emotional is music to my ears.

You're finally starting to "get it".

Thumbs up dude.

 

[cowboysfan09]

Thanks for the help Igetit. I am new to this whole dating experience, so yea I'm not good at reading into what women are doing. I guess that just takes more practice. I did get laid recently though (it didn't involve much of a phone conversation ). I don't really remember showing much emotion during that encounter but maybe with one night stands its different. I was more flirty, which could have somehow given her some type of emotion, I don't know.

How do you make someone emotional? Simple. Whatever emotion you want a woman to feel,YOU HAVE TO EXPRESS THAT EMOTION YOURSELF...FIRST.

That does make it sound simple, but the only thing that worries me is faking the emotion. If I'm excited about something, I don't go yelling and jumping up and down. I just have a smile on my face and just seem happy to be there. I don't really know if this is enough, but I guess I can try to show more, and hopefully it won't come off as fake. I'll keep working on the emotions and see new problems I can come on here about.

 

[FairShake]

Isn't it obvious? You're probably not interesting to her.

Before you call, outline what you're going to say. For people with social anxiety disorder this is always a good bet. Even if you deviate from script, it's there.