need advice within the next few hours!

[Tao of Steve]

i have recently made great strides. i have become far more comf with women, approaching them, chatting them etc.

i finaly made my 1st cold PU's last week - 3 in 2 days.


one was in a group of girls - all students from diff countries. i was charismatic in front of all of them, chatting them up, being the center of the group etc.

i asked the one out - the main one i was talking to (she asked me for my #). she quickly and exictedly accepts. however, she asks if its ok if her friends come (she is latin american, and the culture is a bit more traditional, she doesnt really know me etc., so i think its a safety thing).

i chuckle and say 'its ok, but it would be more fun if just u and i go. she accepts.

were going out tonight. she calls today, and asks if i can do a favor. her friend is going to be downtown near where we are (she lives near me) and doesnt want to go home alone, can i drive her?

i say she has to meet me where i am, and it has to be by 11, and since its not out of my way, i'll do it.

now i also like this girl too.

did doing this look a) afc - i am going to be viewed as useable)
b) not a big thing

or c) should i also work on this girl?
how should i view this, how should i have reacted, should i not do these types of things again.

now should i drive the one im going out with home too - she lives way on the other side. i dont want to look like a taxi - but it may look bad if i dont. what if she asks me to drive her home?

 

[Bungo Pony]

were going out tonight. she calls today, and asks if i can do a favor. her friend is going to be downtown near where we are (she lives near me) and doesnt want to go home alone, can i drive her?

You're not doing your date a favor, you're doing her friend a favor. You haven't even dated this bytch yet, and she's already using your good nature to her and her friends' advantage. When is her friend going to return the favor? Probably never.

did doing this look a) afc - i am going to be viewed as useable)
b) not a big thing

or c) should i also work on this girl?
how should i view this, how should i have reacted, should i not do these types of things again.

Here's the thing - you're worse than a taxi driver. You're driving someone for free. The best way to get out of situations like this is to ask for gas money. If her friend doesn't have any money or wants to pay it later, she can walk home. You don't even know this girl!

There are other times where you can be tricked into a situation like this. You end up driving her friend home, and she asks if she can pay later. That's when you dump the both of them off and never see them again. Let these girls earn your favors.

As for driving your date home, you're using your own gas money for your own pleasure.

 

[Tao of Steve]

i need some more opinions - im leaving in a hour and a half. i am going to call her, and say 'listen, i can't drive your friend home, but i will see u at 8'.

however, i am getting the voice mail on the cell now, and dont want to leave a message.

 

[Oxide]

i went out on a date with a girl who lived 35 mins away. so figure, drive there, drive to downtown, drive back to her house, drive home. A LOT OF MILES. new rule :if a girl is not into me or im not into her, shes not worth driving more than 20 mins for.

 

[bigforearms]

If it's not out of your way, drive the friend home. Cooperation (or feigning it) is one of the most effective compliance techniques. It will improve your image, and the likelihood that your date will say yes to later requests (think other dates, not using this for sex), if you do.

Asking for gas money is a terrible idea. If it's only 10-15 mins out of your way, you're not wasting enough gas to warrant asking for money. Asking for gas money won't make you look like a man, it'll make you look like a cheap *******.

These girls aren't trying to dupe you into being their errand boy. Remember, they're foreign. They don't have contacts, cars, or any other way of getting around in your city. Driving them home once does not make you a taxi. Just don't drive them around getting their groceries, etc.

The most important thing, though, is that you already committed to taking her home. Turning her down now will make you look indecisive AND a prick. Be a man and follow through with this commitment, which you made in good faith.

 

[Bungo Pony]

Cooperation (or feigning it) is one of the most effective compliance techniques. It will improve your image, and the likelihood that your date will say yes to later requests

It will also improve the chance of the women asking more "nice" favors of you.

Asking for gas money won't make you look like a man, it'll make you look like a cheap *******.

Asking for gas money isn't supposed to make you look like a man, it's to protect your own ass from getting taken advantage of.

These girls aren't trying to dupe you into being their errand boy

LMAO!! That's what I used to think. Then I ended up in the "friend zone".

Remember, they're foreign. They don't have contacts, cars, or any other way of getting around in your city.

...so they take advantage of the first guy that hits on them. There's a thing called "public transportation". There's a thing called "asking for directions".

The most important thing, though, is that you already committed to taking her home.

Yes, and he'll know better for next time.

 

[-HPNOTIQ-]

Bungo - I gotta agree with Bigforearms to a point. Not all women act like the Television and Cosmo Brainwashed women from the Western world. In many traditional countries, it's custom that the MAN pay, drive, and such or he can come off as very rude or cheap...but...Steve, you gotta use your gut on this one. Don't let em AFC you to buy everthing for them.

Oxide - I'm digging the rule. If the girl isn't willing to meet me half way from a 30 min. commute...NEXT

-HQ

 

[bigforearms]

Bungo Pony:
1. Yes, it will increase the chance of his being asked for favors in the future. I assume he is decisive enough to say yes or no to future favors regardless of whether he provided this one.

2. Asking for gas money when the person he's dropping off lives very near where he lives is cheap, and doesn't protect him at all. Asking for gas money only makes sense for long-distance, intercity trips.

3. You don't become an errand boy by performing one favor that doesn't take you any extra time or energy. Errand boys, and friend-zone chumps, go out of their way to perform repeated favors.

4. I don't see this as him being taken advantage of. He's going out with these girls. He gives one of them a ride home that doesn't inconvenience him, and in the process scores brownie points with the other girl.

5. I guess we both agree on this point.

Tao of Steve:

Foreign exchange girls go out in packs so that they're not taken advantage of. I've seen this a number of times at my university. If your date with the one girl goes well, DO NOT use the ride home for your date's friend as an excuse to try to pick your date's friend up. She's there to help her friend spot creeps, and I guarantee trying to use the ride home from a date with another girl to pick up her friend is going to land you in creep zone with both of them.

 

[Tao of Steve]

here's what happened

heres what happened:

i got hold of her by phone a few hours b4 i was to meet her. i was short, firm and too the point. 'listen 'mary', tell your friend i can't drive her home, but i;ll see u at 8'. she said ok right away.

just to clarify - i wasn't going out with both of them, i was going out only with 'mary', and her friend was at a concert. so i would have been driving home a girl i didn't even spend time with that night.

the date: i thought i did reasonably well, making improvments since my previous dates. my sense of presence, comfort with my surroundings, body lang, and eye contact were decent (i used to really suck at these things).

she seemed a little tired, less interested then when i met her the previous week. her body lang was s lightly closed. for eg, we sat on a love seat in a cafe, i sat near her, turned and faced her. she sat straight ahead, and even moved away slightly.

my convo was probably a little lame most of the night. mundane things i guess (asking her about her feelings on canada, the cultural differences, her family, friends etc).

i teased her about her appearing bored. she asked me a number of times what i had to do the next morn, and what time i had to get up (i told her when i accepted to drive her friend home, i had to leave by 11 as i had to get up early).

i gave her vauge answers. she also was trying to find out if i bussed or drove to the date - to which i gave her vauge answers. (it turns out by the way, her friend is engaged back home, and she was at the concert with a guy friend). she re counted a few stories of her and her friends meeting weird pushy guys (i think security is a concern of theirs), but that they trusted me.

at one point later on, the convo picked up, and she finnaly started returning some of my kino, laughing etc. we were talking about ex lovers, and how her and i met.

she stated a number of times how immpressed her, and her friends were with my forwardness, friendliness etc in meeting them. as well as how they all talked about my sense of presence, and confidence, abilty to engage them all in convo etc. and how they were bugging her to get my number.

but it seemed more like they saw it as this native born guy that was really friendly etc., rather than a romantic thing.

she stated how she wanted to introduce me to all her group, and how she liked meeting lots of people etc. she asked if i emailed her yet, and said shed email me. she was hinting at the friendship thing, and me coming in to her crowd.

at that point (when she told me she was tired and was going home) i was already ending it in my mind. she noticed that i became quiet.

i ended it unceremoniously, not saying i'll seee u soon or had a good time or anything. i gave her a quick hug, without even really looking at her (she gave me her cheek when i outstretched my arms). and walked away.

if she contacts me again. im not sure if i should say straight out 'im not intrested in a friend', or 'i was intrested in u, not your friends'. or, take advantage of a big group of girls who seem to be immpressed by me (i have big social proof with these girls) and use it to meet her friends, increase my social proof, meet other girls, have party's to go to etc.

there being foriegn girls seems to be a key element. they meet lots of people and want to have many friends. so it may be different that with native born girls, who either like u or dont.

what is the consensus: a) keep trying to raise the intrest level of 'mary b) end it, take a stand type of thing against ljbf type of thing or c) get in with her crowd and try to meet others (i can tell her that i am not intrested in her romatically, but we should b friends).

 

[Doppler4000]

Sounds like you went into this whole thing with a big chip on your shoulder. You made assumptions about why she was asking you to help the friend and held that against her. She picked up on it and her interest level dropped in a major way. It mattered that she was a foreigner, I'm sure- but I'm guessing the way you acted would have turned off even a local girl. It's possible to do a favor or be more agreeable without getting walked all over in the long run. The second or third time she's asking to give her friend a ride is when you need to take a stand. By the way, why the heck were you talking about ex's on a first date (or any date??) ??? That alone is a really bad thing.