Need advice, I'm not making significant gains with chin-ups / pull-ups

[mellow_yellow]

I weigh 190 lb right now. Since April, I've been following a modified version of StrongLifts 5x5 with added back exercise (lat pull down, chin-up, or pull-up) that EyeBRollin prescribed to me.

For the added back exercise, I started off a 25 lb lat pulldown and worked my way up to 150 lbs by June. I then switched to pull-ups and struggled to get 3 sets of 5 reps. I would get stuck at 4 / 3 / 3 reps. I wasn't making progress so switched again to chin-ups since they're a bit easier. I struggled to get all 3x5 sets for a bunch of workouts. Once I eventually got all 3 sets, I would add +5 lb via dip belt for the next workout. Today, I'm at body weight + 20 lb and got 5 / 4 / 3 reps.

Any exercise or technique I can use to improve my chin-ups? When should I switch back to pull-ups? Appreciate your guys' feedback.

 

[IKO69]

Strengthen all the muscles that facilitate doing a chin up. That's the key bro

 

[mellow_yellow]

That's fairly obvious.

I'm wondering if anyone followed a specific routine that helped nail down pull-ups. I'm considering going back to lat pull-downs and getting the pulls to my current BW.

 

[Soflobro#3]

Just do one or two pull ups at a time after your regular set. You have to just do as many as you can total.

 

[mellow_yellow]

@EyeBRollin do you have a recommendation? Not sure if I should try to push harder on the chin-ups before switching to pull-ups or if I should try another exercise.

 

[mellow_yellow]

I switched over to regular pull-ups at the gym today. I aimed for 3 x 10 and got 8 / 6 / 4 reps. Much better than in the past where I could only do 3 pull-ups per set.

After doing them, I did some thinking and figured that my chin-ups weren't getting stronger because I'm still too heavy at my current weight 188 lb. I need to lose more body fat so it's easier for my back to pull my own weight. I probably couldn't add more than 20 lb. to my dip belt for chin-ups because my back is nearly maxed out on its beginner gains.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Try throwing a rope dog toy with knots on the ends over the bar, and then doing your pull ups on the rope. Your max will go down because it is harder. I did that because it is a lot less stress on the elbows. I have read that it is supposed to isolate the muscles better; I'm no expert, so I don;t know for sure if that is true, but it was nice to not have elbow pain.

 

[IKO69]

That's fairly obvious.

I'm wondering if anyone followed a specific routine that helped nail down pull-ups. I'm considering going back to lat pull-downs and getting the pulls to my current BW.

I mean it looks like you have it figured out. Reduce the weight and it should get easier. Lat pull downs are a great substitute until you can comfortably do pullups.

 

[Qwazi]

Thanx, now I will have a great body

 

[KingofPuss]

Lose more weight. And just keep doing them. Throw them in the beginning of your workout to warm up, and do assisted at the end of your workout when super fatigued. That'll do

 

[MrJack]

That's fairly obvious.

I'm wondering if anyone followed a specific routine that helped nail down pull-ups. I'm considering going back to lat pull-downs and getting the pulls to my current BW.

Try to incorporate some negatives. Don’t do them every workout but once a week do only negatives for pull-ups/chin-ups and it should help you bust through the plateau.

You probs know what I’m talking about but idk how extensive your training knowledge is so I’ll explain:

Negatives are the eccentric portion of the movement (opposite of contracting your muscles, or concentric).

Just jump up to get yourself already at the top portion of the pull-up and slowly lower yourself down over the course of 6-8 seconds and repeat for as many reps as you can do at that 6-8 second timeframe.

Should shock your muscles a bit and stimulate them to grow and get stronger with the movement.

 

[MrJack]

Even better in my opinion: Just do pullups.

@mellow_yellow

Do pull-ups first thing when you get to the gym each time to gauge progress.

If you do them first one week then the next workout do rows first and then the pull-ups, you can’t accurately gauge how your pull-up progress is coming along because you tired your back and bis out a bit with the rows.

 

[MrJack]

For me doing pullups at the END of a sweat-induced workout tells me how strong I really am. How well do I perform when I'm tired and ready to quit? If I can get 5 reps when I'm exhausted and sore...

A 135-lb. 20 rep squat done at the END of a grueling leg workout gives me more confidence than a 315-lb. 5 rep squat at the beginning. It might take me 30 seconds between reps but THAT is when my strength develops--when I'm tired and tested and at my weakest.

I can see your point but all I’m saying is if you are trying to work at getting stronger and better at a specific lift or movement, it’s best to do that lift first when you get to the gym while your muscles are fresh and ready to go.

That’s why on chest day most people do bench press first and accessory shyt after, legs they do squat first and accessories after, shoulders they do overhead press first and accessory shyt after.

That’s not set in stone and depends on your goals but MOST people do it that way.

 

[switch7]

I weigh 190 lb right now. Since April, I've been following a modified version of StrongLifts 5x5 with added back exercise (lat pull down, chin-up, or pull-up) that EyeBRollin prescribed to me.

For the added back exercise, I started off a 25 lb lat pulldown and worked my way up to 150 lbs by June. I then switched to pull-ups and struggled to get 3 sets of 5 reps. I would get stuck at 4 / 3 / 3 reps. I wasn't making progress so switched again to chin-ups since they're a bit easier. I struggled to get all 3x5 sets for a bunch of workouts. Once I eventually got all 3 sets, I would add +5 lb via dip belt for the next workout. Today, I'm at body weight + 20 lb and got 5 / 4 / 3 reps.

Any exercise or technique I can use to improve my chin-ups? When should I switch back to pull-ups? Appreciate your guys' feedback.

what's your squat and deadlift like?

 

[M Musashi]

Here's a method of increasing rep count (it's primarily an endurance method but worked well with pullups for me at lower reps). This is a method from Lyle Mcdonald.

I recomend you focus on bodyweight pullups until you're around 3x15 reps at bodyweight. My weighted pullups didn't budge until I got decent numbers with bodyweight. Before starting this I recommend test your max pullups, unweighted 1 set and then stop pullups for 1 week. After 1 week off pullups:

1. Take your max rep count
2. Take 60% of that
3. Perform sets of that many reps
4. Rest 1-2 minutes, perform next set
5. When you start to grind, stop, avoid failure
6. Perform this 2x/week
7. Retest for max after approx 6 sessions

Fleshed out:

Let's say I can perform 13 pullups max. 13 x 0.6 = 7.8 (8). I warm up and then perform sets of 8 reps resting for 1-2min in between. When I start to grind, no more pullups.

It sounds unnecessarily complex but really the concept is very simple: Get more volume by avoiding excessive exertion. You'll be surprised, first workout you may get 3-4 sets of your 60%, by your 6th session you'll be around 8 sets.

So weighted vs. BW

1. 3 sets of 4 (12 total reps)
2. Average 6 sets of 6 (36 total reps)

Also remember that pullups are subject to fluctuating BW. A difference of 5lb give or take due to BW will make a huge difference if you don't have a solid base to work from. I prefer neutral grip or ring pullups.

 

[M Musashi]

I'm convinced that very few people on this planet will EVER be able to do 15 pullups in a set. Even fewer people can do 15 reps x 3.

FYI a perfect score for Marine Corps basic training is 20 dead-hang pullup reps.

I've rarely seen anybody in my years of training exceed 10 quality-form pullups in a single set.

Perhaps it's the bias of my gym (many athletes) which skews my expectations but I really I don't believe 1x15 pullups is unattainable for most. Most of the guys I train with can hit 10 quality reps with weight.

In any case, I think volume should take initial precedence when training low-risk (ie. no 20 rep deadlifts) exercises which move your body through space.

 

[speed dawg]

I always would just do negatives after I gave out, until I got to my desired rep number, as slow as humanly possible. Usually helped me progress. Chin-ups and pull-ups always came pretty naturally to me.

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

I weigh 190 lb right now. Since April, I've been following a modified version of StrongLifts 5x5 with added back exercise (lat pull down, chin-up, or pull-up) that EyeBRollin prescribed to me.

For the added back exercise, I started off a 25 lb lat pulldown and worked my way up to 150 lbs by June. I then switched to pull-ups and struggled to get 3 sets of 5 reps. I would get stuck at 4 / 3 / 3 reps. I wasn't making progress so switched again to chin-ups since they're a bit easier. I struggled to get all 3x5 sets for a bunch of workouts. Once I eventually got all 3 sets, I would add +5 lb via dip belt for the next workout. Today, I'm at body weight + 20 lb and got 5 / 4 / 3 reps.

Any exercise or technique I can use to improve my chin-ups? When should I switch back to pull-ups? Appreciate your guys' feedback.

Do hangs. Work ROM (range of motion). Do band work. Warm up. Dynamic stretch. If I were say doing 5*5 workout, I would need a chain and belt for weight.

What is your goal? What exercise do you start with. Ideally, switch it up. Shock your body. Also, don't start off with chin ups or wide grip or close grip pull ups. Do lat pull down but light weight to warm up.

I was once doing 10*10 and struggling as a young chap. With time, I was doing reps of 15-20 for sets. Its like many things. It takes time. Ever consider German volume training?

Lastly, how is your diet?

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

Perhaps it's the bias of my gym (many athletes) which skews my expectations but I really I don't believe 1x15 pullups is unattainable for most. Most of the guys I train with can hit 10 quality reps with weight.

In any case, I think volume should take initial precedence when training low-risk (ie. no 20 rep deadlifts) exercises which move your body through space.

Most big gyms have guys and girls on gear. I never compare myself to anybody but who I was the day before.

Agreed. Deadlift is a complex exercise as is squats. High risk for injury.

 

[switch7]