Need advice ASAP - HB8 has an ex that's returning for more!

[Fantastic Mr. Fox]

I'd like to start by saying I'm a reformed AFC - I still have a lot of work to do, and this is a perfect opportunity to learn more and increase my skills. Thing is, I'm in a rut, and unsure on how to proceed, so here we go:

I've been flirting with this totally gorgeous girl, we have heaps in common, and there's potential for anywhere between a casual relationship to something more long-term. She invited me over to her place during our school holidays (we both go to the same art school), and I was supposed to go there yesterday.

But here's what happened.

She postponed after a pretty hectic weekend, and now I'm going to her place tomorrow (hence the ASAP!). I just found out though, that her ex boyfriend of 2 years relationship has been begging for her to let him back into her life. Whereas before I was invited over for the night, tomorrow will be an afternoon thing, so I have to make my move quickly and decisively.

My AFC mentality is tending me towards being friendly, discussing things openly, but then I read one of today's articles and realized that sh*t, that's just what any other one of her female friends can do for her. She'll get exactly what she wants - two guys chasing her, unconditional love from a confused little boy who will always understand and be her emotional tampon, and regular sex from someone who's familiar, yet an ex for a reason.

My inclination now then, is to keep hitting on her. Keep flirting. Keep the iron hot. Confuse her even more by approaching her as a lover, not just a friend. And if she pushes that away and goes for the ex, express profound disappointment that she could've missed a great opportunity. After all, I must keep believing in myself, "I am the Great Catch."

I am still afraid though, that she'll push that away out of her "confusion" and being "torn," and I won't know how to respond to that.

Now I put the situation in your hands, SoSuave! Please advise me on this.

With thanks,
Mr. Fox.

 

[Papo 12]

I can relate to this situation very well.

From my personal experience, if a girl you're seeing has an ex that keeps trying and trying to pry back into her life, you're likely going to eventually have some sort of problem. It will become frustrating, and sometimes even if you try to hold back your emotions you will wonder things in your mind and it may lead to changes in your behavior towards her without you even realizing.

I'd keep her at arms length to be honest, I mean she may be interested in you but you need to pay attention to her actions and not what she says.

Be vigilant. And use self control and your instincts.

These types of situations sometimes require you stepping away for a bit. Let her demonstrate her value to you.

 

[Iceberg]

My AFC mentality is tending me towards being friendly, discussing things openly, but then I read one of today's articles and realized that sh*t, that's just what any other one of her female friends can do for her. She'll get exactly what she wants - two guys chasing her, unconditional love from a confused little boy who will always understand and be her emotional tampon, and regular sex from someone who's familiar, yet an ex for a reason.

I'm glad you understand how AFC that is. Because there's no way in hell discussing things openly leads to anything romantic happening.

Picture the scene in your head:
You: So, (Female), I'd like to take this time to announce my attraction to you.
Girl: Excellent. I agree with your assessment.
You: Well, sounds like we have a deal. Mutual attraction.
Girl: Shall we schedule a makeout session for tomorrow? 7-ish?

That's basically what a discussion of attraction is. Except it rarely works out with the girl digging you. You can't talk your way through attraction. It must be expressed. You can discuss pay raises at work, and used car deals. You can't discuss emotion.

I am still afraid though, that she'll push that away out of her "confusion" and being "torn," and I won't know how to respond to that.

If you're the man she wants, then confusion won't enter the equation. A girl would have no problem dropping an ex for a cool new man to enter her life. There's nothing confusing about it. If (and this is a BIG 'if') you are the man she lusts for, then the ex becomes a boring, predictable part of her past, and you represent an exciting, unknown future.

Girls might be "too confused" to enter a relationship with some AFC orbiter with an ex still in the picture. But they'll never be too confused to get swept off their feet by some amazing new prospect.

 

[Fantastic Mr. Fox]

Thanks very much for the rapid response. Special thanks to Iceberg for his insight.

So I think I'll go ahead and go to her place tomorrow and keep her at "arms length" whilst flirting her pants off, then leave her to make up her mind. The way I understand it, I need to constantly put my best foot forward as a sexual, attractive and very potential new lover - someone new and exciting, then leave her at a distance to demonstrate her value to me.

All the while still spinning other plates, yes?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this appears to be the best course of action.

Also... if I do go to her house and she expects me to talk about her ex and all her problems, how do I avoid being checkmated into a position of a helpful friend that gives advice about her boy problems? I'm thinking it would probably be a better idea just to send her a txt to postpone until she wants to see me to see me, not to talk about her ex. Or maybe if I do go and the topic comes up, I can say something along the lines of "let's just pretend he's not an issue, and just enjoy ourselves."

Any ideas?

Thanks again,
Mr. Fox.

 

[Papo 12]

Thanks very much for the rapid response. Special thanks to Iceberg for his insight.

So I think I'll go ahead and go to her place tomorrow and keep her at "arms length" whilst flirting her pants off, then leave her to make up her mind. The way I understand it, I need to constantly put my best foot forward as a sexual, attractive and very potential new lover - someone new and exciting, then leave her at a distance to demonstrate her value to me.

All the while still spinning other plates, yes?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this appears to be the best course of action.

Also... if I do go to her house and she expects me to talk about her ex and all her problems, how do I avoid being checkmated into a position of a helpful friend that gives advice about her boy problems?

Thanks again,
Mr. Fox.

That's where you get creative and gotta start thinking on the spot with witty and smart responses.

Think of it this way, how would James Bond respond? Ever see Casino Royale? See how he responds to women? Confident, bold, quick. Witty.

And at the same time imply many sexual innuendos. But don't come on too strong, make sure you're being indirect and smirking.

BUT... from my experience, if you're seeing a girl and all she does is talk about her ex boyfriend this and ex boyfriend that, you may have to start looking at other women and realize she is probably still hung up on the guy regardless why and how they ended the relationship.

 

[vatoloco]

She invited me over to her place during our school holidays (we both go to the same art school), and I was supposed to go there yesterday.

But here's what happened.

She postponed after a pretty hectic weekend, and now I'm going to her place tomorrow (hence the ASAP!).

You've gotten solid advice but I do have a question about the bold part. What were the circumstances for the postponement? Who initiated it?

 

[Pimp-sicle]

Definitely agree with the advice you've gotten so far and glad your trying to better yourself, everyone has to start somewhere.

Alright first things first!

1) STOP comparing yourself to the ex! Somewhere in your AFC roots you see this as a competition with the ex and feel like you must be better than him otherwise you lose.

Here's the real deal, obviously this girl has some interest in you if she's inviting you over. Now without knowing exactly where she stands with her ex its tough to say how she feels about him, but MY POINT is a true DJ, doesn't think about the ex. All he thinks about is how he KNOWS he can make this girl feel great and create a strong attraction with her; THAT should be your focus.

2) If this girl is interested in you sexually she WILL NOT talk your ear off about her ex. She will maybe throw in his name casually to make you jealous, but there's a big difference between being an emotional tampon and being a potential lover.

Answer these questions if you are unsure of where you stand:

1) Does she touch you?
2) Does she laugh at your jokes, funny or lame?
3) Does she lock eye contact with you?
4) Is she flirty with you?

Its pretty hard not to tell the difference between a girl treating you as a friend or a lover. The one exception is when you have known a girl for a while, by then there is a certain level of comfort built and things like hugs, playful slaps might be more from comfort than attraction. But obviously you haven't known her that long so this isn't the case in your situation.

3) Focus on 3 steps to get women attracted to you: building comfort, creating attraction and AMPLIFYING THE F OUTTA BOTH! This is a slippery slope for most guys. Most AFC's build far too much comfort without any attraction. Then they feel like they most "confess" their feelings to the girl, who friend zones them. Then you get the hard-core pick up artist dude who is a straight up d-ick to most chicks because he thinks that's the way to get laid and he is all about building attraction, BUT forget to build any comfort. A girl will not fuvk a guy she's not comfortable with....

The best way to do this is a nice mix of both.....sprinkle in some flirting as you are getting to know her better.

Lastly, do not ask her anything about her ex
Don't bore her with any lame conversation topics aside from the general fluff talk when you just meet up.


Do feel confident that you are the f-in man and you can get this girl......outcome always follows your mind.






PIMP

 

[Pimp-sicle]

New Mac computer, my bad!




PIMP

 

[Pimp-sicle]

Fuvk my bad on the triple post! LOL





PIMP

 

[Fantastic Mr. Fox]

DAYUM! Awesome feedback there Pimpsicle! This gives me a whole new attitude and I'm super confident about meeting her now!

As for the delay - she initiated, she was always saying how keen she was to have me over and how she couldn't wait. I scheduled it for Monday, which was probably too soon, and I may have lost some ground. She also had a pretty full-on weekend with parties and the like, and I bet that's when her ex stepped in when she was pretty drugged up and started being desperate with her, tugging at her heartstrings with nostalgia missiles. But hell, after that last post by Pimpsicle (which I will read as many times as he posted it) I'm very sure of myself about this next encounter.

And I answered "HELL YES" to all four of your questions. Life is good!

 

[sodbuster]

If she brings up her ex, say the same thing you say if she tells you she has a BF " I don't want to date him" BUT how much of a catch is the girl? You were talking drugged up?

 

[Fantastic Mr. Fox]

No, I wasn't talking drugged up. I've known this girl for a long while but held back when she mentioned her BF ages ago. When she became available I began flirting and making advances and she responded in kind. Her interest level seems high. I was saying she was probably pretty drugged up over the weekend, she's quite the party animal, and she seems to be a pretty good catch, so I'm willing to pursue it as far as possible.

 

[Iceberg]

No, I wasn't talking drugged up. I've known this girl for a long while but held back when she mentioned her BF ages ago. When she became available I began flirting and making advances and she responded in kind. Her interest level seems high. I was saying she was probably pretty drugged up over the weekend, she's quite the party animal, and she seems to be a pretty good catch, so I'm willing to pursue it as far as possible.

I'm no angel, nor do I expect girls to be. But I wouldn't consider a drugged up party girl to be a pretty good catch. They're fun to bang for a few weeks, but I wouldn't seriously date a girl who I saw as "quite the party animal". So considering your AFC past, and possible lack of experience, I just wonder if you're inflating her value because she's pretty and she pays attention to you. We've all been guilty of that.

The only guys who can keep those types of girls in check are the dudes with drug habits and party animal tendencies of their own.

I'm happy that you're confident in your ability to get this girl, and I don't want to ruin that. But I gotta ask...what makes you think her IL is so high?

 

[Pimp-sicle]

I'm no angel, nor do I expect girls to be. But I wouldn't consider a drugged up party girl to be a pretty good catch. They're fun to bang for a few weeks, but I wouldn't seriously date a girl who I saw as "quite the party animal". So considering your AFC past, and possible lack of experience, I just wonder if you're inflating her value because she's pretty and she pays attention to you. We've all been guilty of that.

The only guys who can keep those types of girls in check are the dudes with drug habits and party animal tendencies of their own.

I'm happy that you're confident in your ability to get this girl, and I don't want to ruin that. But I gotta ask...what makes you think her IL is so high?

Good post Iceberg and I agree with your thoughts.

Fox, party girls who are hitting it hard like this every weekend or even during the week RARELY if ever, make good long term prospects.

Still be confident and game her, but take it as a see where it goes approach rather than being dedicated to wanting her exclusively straight off the bat.

Make her PROVE that she is worthy of that consideration, s*it women are use to getting things without lifting a finger, don't give her your trust without her earning it.

And if your thinking "well I've known her for a while and see that she's trust worthy..."

Well that's a whole different can of worms since b4 you were just an friend and now your viewing her through a different lens and most likely she is too.




PIMP

 

[terran2k]

you're overlooking obvious red flags because she is hot. you're going to bury yourself in a world of hurt, lies and a bunch of other drama.

I made that mistake once or twice, never ended well for me.

 

[Fantastic Mr. Fox]

I'll keep those things in consideration. I definitely think she needs to win my trust a bit more, but I don't judge people who take drugs unless they're actually super harmful like needles etc. But I'm not here to discuss my opinion on drugs or drug abuse.

Also the substances she uses are the same as mine, and she parties more than me but has the same philosophies about life, parties, and everything else. It's common ground, despite the apparent volatility, it works. We're both artists and a lot of her art is inspired by acid, and a lot of mine is inspired by trips of my own.

It's true I may be looking at her through different lenses now that she's available and I may be fooled by her appearance. We've ended up changing plans several times now, all understandable within their context, and I'm not seeing any more red flags compared to before. Some of them have actually disappeared.

Anyways the distance has helped me gain perspective and I totally agree, she needs to prove herself. I've always maintained the attitude that just because a girl bats her eyes and wiggles her arse at me doesn't mean I'm going to fall for her.

That said, I'm keen to keep gaming, I'll let you know how things proceed

Thanks again for all the feedback, it's been really useful.

Mr Fox.