My case: Dread and courage

[Gunny]

I discovered these forums through Rollo's excellent blog. I first thought about sending this as a PM to Rollo but as I was unable to do so I decided I'd post it here for all to see (and hopefully comment).

In short, I seek advise to a problem.

I have only recently discovered the "manosphere" but I have been "unplugged" for a while; much of what Rollo et al. have written about I have had to discover independently through some very painful personal experiences. I do, however, think that many on here, especially Rollo, have accumulated more insight than I, and at the very least you enjoy the benefit of an impartial view to my blight. So here goes.



My question is really rather simple, but let me begin with some background:

I am comfortable around women and I have had, and continue to have, several female friends (non-LJBF) in my social circles. I have no problems approaching women for non-sexual purposes (as in, when there's no intent or objective on banging her) or even chatting them up with casual sexual innuendo post-approach.

I am not afraid to talk (back) to my superiors or any other authority and I don't shy away from natural interaction with peope of "higher status" (such as celebrities). I am confident in publicly challenging an established authority (such as a professor) at the risk of personal humiliation, and I can hold public speeches and presentations with relative comfort. I have also repeatedly subjected myself to tests where there was a serious chance of humiliating and consequential failure.

All this is to say that I have the social confidence to converse with just about anyone, from Prime Ministers to pop divas, and that while I am not comfortable with public (or personal) humiliation I'm not afraid of it either. I have also voluntarily risked life and limb in war zones, jumped out of perfectly good aircraft and engaged in a number of other activities that some people would consider requiring of "courage".

Yet I am absolutely terrified when approaching a girl with sexual intentions.

Let it be clear that I am not a virgin and I have made successful, sexually oriented approaches as well as successfully initiated physical sexual contact (terrifying as it was) on a number of occasions in the past. I am also aware that I am, without the slightest boast, reasonably attractive to women. I'm 27 and quite confident with myself, my physical and intellectual abilities, and my looks.

Yet despite a proven, if limited, track record of success with women, I remain more afraid of making a sexual approach than I am of the prospect of bracing IEDs and facing bullets shot at me.

Can you explain this? Better yet, do you have advise on how to best deal with the situation? I know practice makes perfect and all that, but I'd rather not keep trying to bang my head through the wall if there's a door adjacent.

Much appreciated.

 

[\O/]

I can relate alot to what you are saying. I have the same issue at times. The reason is simply that we are too outcome dependent. When you want something from them and have an "agenda", then you have something to lose. You lack sexual confidence, which is a totally different confidence than the one needed to confront your superiors, make speeches or being indifferent towards celebrities.

When you approach women with sexual intentions, you put yourself on the line. You are putting yourself in a position where they can choose not to accept you. So to avoid this, you play it safe. It all comes down to inner confidence. You have to believe that you are the great catch, as is the popular theme around here. You have to really believe and know it.

A good way to phase in your sexual intentions, is to actually approach women without any agenda. Lose the outcome dependence. Try to just have fun and find out stuff about them. From there you can calibrate the situation and make your intentions known more clearly when she reacts positively to you in general. Don't wait too long though, because then you will end up in the dreaded friend zone. Make your intentions known, only not immediatly until you are comfortable doing that.

It basically all comes down to fear of rejection. Rejection sucks, but you can never take it personally. Easier said than done, but your skin will grow thicker after a while.

 

[TonyBaloney]

I would thoroughly agree with what "manhole" said

Reading between the lines, you are English, well educated and possibly famous yourself..... Read a few of my earliest posts and you will see that I am able to relate to the type of woman that you may be encountering; I live in salubrious South West London....you get my drift.. feel free to PM me in more detail if you wish.

But the long and short of it is yes, as manhole metions, you are anxious because of expectation/s, slight paranoia, general sub concious worry. You really will have to go in guns blazing with absolutely no expectations and a realization that all of us men, ALL of us, whoever you are, have fears, its just rationalizing them that counts.

A little secret here that will now for time immemorium be logged on the internet. I lost the love of life, and it sucked...got depressed but after a while started hitting the scene again. Next girl I was with, COMPLETE ERECTILE DYSFUNCTION.... i was completely ashamed, so much so that I was put off trying again for ages.... eventually got a viagara and things writed themselves....but I always had a slight worry that it might happen again, and in the preceding 5 year LTR, it did, a few times.... but i had the wrong mindset... sounds cliched, but you literally have not got to care what happens....... only then do you feel free to enjoy the outcome whichever way it goes..... Hope this helps buddy

 

[FairShake]

Your qualification was much longer than your actual question.

You have poor self-esteem about your problem is my guess. You are used to being the man and in this part of life you aren't the man and you are having trouble dealing with that.

How do I get over a natural tendency for crippling self-esteem issues? I realize that in certain (actually many) areas of life I am not the man and don't have to pretend to be. I get over my ego. It's not easy, many men have failed mightily before they do this but it is absolutely essential towards success.

 

[drak_ool]

Yet despite a proven, if limited, track record of success with women, I remain more afraid of making a sexual approach than I am of the prospect of bracing IEDs and facing bullets shot at me.

...

I know practice makes perfect and all that

You've answered your own question: you haven't had as much experience approaching women as you've had doing other "dangerous" (in your view) activities, so you are still troubled by it. Practice is the only way to go about it, no secret trick here, as with most facets of Game. You can do a quick search around the forum for "Approach Anxiety" (AA) and you will find many suggestions on how to overcome it. If you have really bad AA, the most common approach is to try a number of approaches (say 100) where you set yourself up for failure (such as by wearing a ridiculous costume or saying something silly/inappropriate). After being turned down too many times to even count, you will be much less sensitive to rejection.

 

[Scaramouche]

Hi Gunny,
Welcome on board Old Mate....You are among friends...Look it is all a matter of familiarity,and fear of rejection...Why not try going places where you may interact with them...just a few....Dancing Classes,Yoga,cooking classes,friendship Adventure groups,Oh and did I mention Dancing?....You go or have not long finished University,good,every Uni has a friendship group for young Overseas Students...They are easy meat...Learn something about the Culture and Countries of Target groups and you are in...Your Danger is not never meeting Women,that's as easy as rolling off a log....No your problem is falling for the first one you meet!

 

[BMX]

Practice, practice, practice with approaches day and night. The more daytime approaches you manage to get in, the better off you will be with ridding this approach anxiety as you will be facing your fear head on and hopefully without any impairing substances in you. Keep plowing. A lot of great advise has already been dispensed above.

Judging by your screen name, you would be someone from my brother branch. In a few months I will be forced to go "no contact" on SS due to training demands of active life. Until then feel free to PM me. I know what it's like clearing buildings day and night, shooting under stress, explosions, jumping from 13,000 feet, etc. The pain from any rejections I get now hurt 99% less than getting punched in my face.

 

[Gunny]

Thanks for the advice, all of you.

While I realize practice is of course necessary, let me clarify a little. I have no problem finding women, hanging out with them or even chatting them up sexually. University has been great for that, indeed.

My problem is quite specific in that I find it difficult to make that first approach comfortably without a non-sexual pretext. If I have any excuse, however transparent, to make the first approach I have little issues with taking it from there.

The problem is when I don't have any sort of pretext other than wanting to talk to her because she's attractive and can't make up one. I'm quite serious when I say that I'm less afraid of being physically shot at than being "shot down" in an approach.

I appreciate the tips. I do need to force more practice on myself with some Spartan discipline. It's silly really how much terror something as mundane and harmless as that can induce.

 

[betheman]

You are really overthinking this and terrorising yourself at the same time, what is it you are scared of? my estimation is your ego, rejection ...can it cope with it?
really it doesnt matter, you will get shot down at some point. so what! noone ever died from being rejected, I do hate the term rejected and prefer to use 'missed shot' because that is really what it is. you are taking a shot, you as Gunny, are not being rejected, she knows nothing about you, nothing about your personality, character, background values etc etc.
she may not think you are attactive, the next girl might but you will not be attractive to everyone, even afte opening up with a woman, you might discover you arent really attracted to her!
stop focussing on the outcome for a short while and just talk to these women. I cant believe you cant make some sh!t up about any woman, its easy, you can even develop you own portfolio for when you get brain freeze.
make a complete wild guess about her career/job, you fly a lot yeah? "hey your an air hostess arent you? Im sure I saw you on xyz flight" and just take it from there, her immediate response will usually give you a clue if its worth pursuing.
leave the ego at the door