Maybe the concept of confidence is flawed

[CnqrFear]

Hey guys I'm 28 years old, I've been reading dating and PUA advice since I was 18. I've matured to the point that I can see the value in Anti-Dumps machine and no longer have the drive to have sex with random women but more in finding a woman that suits me and one where I suit her. Anyway that's me.

I think the thing that stood out the most to me over these years was what is now a throw away phrase "Be Confident"

Almost every single piece of advice recommends a man should be confident.

Great so the first lesson for me was "I need some confidence so I can get the ladies"

Then I pondered okay "how do I get this confidence?" and my first response to myself was confidence is built through success in different areas:
-Sleeping with as many HB10s = confidence boost
-Making lots of money and being successful in my career = confidence boost
-Working out and getting really fit/hot = confidence boost

But I ran into a problem with the sleeping with as many HBs as possible. See I already needed to have the confident mindset before I even experienced my first success. So trying to use success to build confidence wasn't going to work for an AFC starting at zero. Everybody recommends more confidence for success, but if success builds your confidence you first need that success but women only come with confidence you already need to have.

So I was stuck, I couldn't use success to build my confidence to the levels I needed. I would go out and feel unconfident but approach anyway because the outcome mattered I was really nervous and anxious. A positive outcome meant I could add some points to my confidence file and feel better. A rejection meant I would feel bad and lose points gained already.

I just kept spinning in circles, a girl would date me I would feel great, then a week later she would stop texting and my approach at the bar failed, I would feel like crap and lose my confidence.

Like that my confidence over the years would oscillate with success and failure.

But I could never make my successes consistent enough day after day to build any real level of positive confidence. I was looking to build a win streak of 20 HBs and then I could finally say "okay I'm good with women" but that win streak never came. Just successes and failures sprinkled together never getting my confidence level to anywhere near where the articles and PUA advice said I needed to have.

So I decided the next approach was to just try to fake it till I make it, to keep assuming that I was very good with women even if there wasn't any solid evidence that this assumption was true. "I'm the man" repeated to myself over and over even in the light of defeat. "Women all want me" repeated over and over when the evidence suggests something different.

I tried to practice cognitive dissonance, basically trying to believe something that couldn't be proven true.

For awhile it worked well, I was getting more success and the fake confidence started to build into real confidence.

But after a while I found it very emotionally exhausting to keep telling myself things I didn't fully believe, and if I suffered a rejection then the real confidence I had built would come crashing down again and make believing the exaggerated lines "women love me", "I'm so sexy" harder to believe.

I started to grow tired from the emotional rollercoaster of self esteem and confidence that I was riding on feeling great after she gave me a number and feeling like crap after she said no I'm sorry.

I asked myself why do I even need the concept of confidence, instead what if I used a simple philosophy that I wasn't going to allow a success to raise my "confidence" but not allow a failure to bring my "confidence" down either

Put simply I told myself "No up, no down"

In a way it frees you from worrying about outcome.
I think it's called outcome independence on these forums

Back then outcome independence was another technique I thought I could use to get myself more HBs

But now I'm tired of riding the emotional roller coaster with every success and failure

Now I see the value of outcome independence for your own emotional health not just as a technique

So I realize I don't really need to feel like I'm the man or feel like I'm the best and I'm awesome, and I don't need to feel like I'm a loser or worthless or terrible with women either

I can just be, and success or failure I can have some emotional peace and stability.

 

[DaddyLongShanks]

If you where friends with a bunch of attractive slvts or h0es you could've amassed such a win streak, but it wouldn't be thru pickup, tricks or gimmicks.

There are groups of females that you can plow nearly everyone in the group.

 

[bigneil]

First, nobody sleeps with lots of HB10's. Just implying that shows immense naivety. IMO there are no 10's, but you'll get 1 tops.

Confidence is an emergent property of other successes.

It generally means you've been there before and you got what you wanted.

You can't start with confidence, nor can you start out at your career being rich (in most cases). You have to start with experience and gain skills first, and then you will have confidence in that particular area.

 

[PeasantPlayer]

First, nobody sleeps with lots of HB10's. Just implying that shows immense naivety. IMO there are no 10's, but you'll get 1 tops.

Confidence is an emergent property of other successes.

It generally means you've been there before and you got what you wanted.

You can't start with confidence, nor can you start out at your career being rich (in most cases). You have to start with experience and gain skills first, and then you will have confidence in that particular area.

Short and to the point and well said. And I agree there is no such thing as a HB10. Hell even a 9 is super rare in face I don't think I ever seen a 9 either. I would say tops I seen was 8-8.5 the highest

 

[bigneil]

Are beautiful women on the decline?

Have all these Likes on FB made them overconfident so they all put 10lb on?

I can hardly even find a hot girl at a strip club these days, and they are all half my age so they gain 1 point there alone. I'd say only 1 in 10 are hot, and 9/10 of the hot ones have tattoos, so only 1 in 100 is hot and tattoo-free (and the one I found here is 31). In other settings, I continuously see hordes of women and not one hottie.

Did you see Women's World Cup? What a bunch of dogs! I've seen prettier girls on women's basketball teams for crying out loud. Shouldn't young, healthy, champion women be attractive?

Is it the GMO food? God help us.

 

[CnqrFear]

First, nobody sleeps with lots of HB10's. Just implying that shows immense naivety. IMO there are no 10's, but you'll get 1 tops.

Confidence is an emergent property of other successes.

It generally means you've been there before and you got what you wanted.

You can't start with confidence, nor can you start out at your career being rich (in most cases). You have to start with experience and gain skills first, and then you will have confidence in that particular area.

But how does an insecure AFC gain the confidence he needs if he can't get the success because he doesn't have the confidence in the first place

 

[DaddyLongShanks]

But how does an insecure AFC gain the confidence he needs if he can't get the success because he doesn't have the confidence in the first place

Start off low and work your way up. Sex is very powerful, so you have to be having sex with someone and lots of it. Initially their "looks" might not be the top of the line, but your c0ck should be wet and often and at will. This base confidence will allow you to grow.

 

[bigneil]

But how does an insecure AFC gain the confidence he needs if he can't get the success because he doesn't have the confidence in the first place

Confidence is not the end game. Success is. You don't need confidence to achieve success. You need hard work and perseverance. You need to fail a few times until you find a way to win.

A batter becomes confident after he hits a few home runs.

You're asking "How do I hit a home run if I don't have the confidence?"

You go the to batting cages. You practice. You strike out a few times. You get booed a few times. You keep trying until the bat hits the ball. That's how.

 

[om1xr]

Confidence is something that people have a hard time to explain because words normally can't describe feelings or mindsets.
So what I realized is this; at least from my own experience:

• Loving yourself and being able to express yourself freely without being concerned of what others think of you and being detached to results because it is what it is and we can't control a lot of things so what's the point of all those anxieties and being attached to every negative thought that cross your mind.

• What's success: it differ from one person to another and if you think that success is what's defined by others and society like being rich, dating beautiful women or any other definition then you are just a slave of imitation.

I liked a quote from a book called Manuscript found in Accra:
"
What's success?
It is being able to go to bed each night with your soul at peace."

 

[zekko]

You're asking "How do I hit a home run if I don't have the confidence?"

You go the to batting cages. You practice. You strike out a few times. You get booed a few times. You keep trying until the bat hits the ball. That's how.

Agreed. If you don't have confidence from prior successes, you can get it from preparation. If you know you have practiced and prepared to do a particular activity, you will be more confident at it. That can be difficult when dealing with women, though, since there are so many factors at play that you can't control.

When I used to be in plate spinning plates, I was never really confident. But everyone always said you have to be confident, so I knew enough to fake it. As far as I know, the girls couldn't tell the difference. I didn't try to be ****y, funny, arrogant, I just tried to be laid back and cool.

They tell you not to let the rejections bother you, but with me they always did.

 

[RangerMIke]

I really don't think you build confidence by being with women, what you get is experience.

Confidence is built when you successfully complete something that is difficult for you to achieve. The best way to build confidence is to find something that you currently can not do, then practice at it until you are good at it. It doesn't have to be with women, it can be ANYTHING.

Confidence is nothing more than self-assurance.

 

[Mike32ct]

Neil, Zekko, and Ranger nailed it.

Aim for COMPETENCE, not confidence. Practice like a mofo and keep fine tuning things until you can do something well consistently (and still keep at it).

Zekko's caveat is very true though. With women, there are lots of factors beyond your control, so it's not QUITE the same as learning a "skill." But there are still areas where a guy can improve.

 

[3agle 3yes]

Confidence is an inside thing, you cannot have it without.

This may be hard for some people to believe but how you feel about yourself isn't due to your results, your results are due to how you feel about yourself.

That's because most people think they feel good because they're successful, when the truth is, they were successful because they felt good.

Whatever happens outside happens inside first.

Most people want to be lead and they look for direction outside of themselves, unlike in the past when it was clear who was high status and who was not people are unsure because there are influxes of people (especially in major cities) and most people don't know each other.

In every grouping people look around to see who is in charge, and this usually goes to the person who is most assured of themselves.

I will also add, we must put ourselves in the position as the selector, not the women, regardless of whether they're "10s".

They key difference between a selector and one who isn't, is the selector has the ability to reject.

Stop trying to appeal to someone else's standards, and start seeing if they appeal to your own.

 

[skinnyguy]

Learning game will lead you to having contrarian viewpoints. Who would have thought that telling a girl she looks fat will increase her attraction to you. But hey it's pretty much true - girls these days are so indifferent to beta chumps that if you act in the opposite way their pvssy will get wet.

I'm starting to feel that really, being yourself is the way to go. I tried acting like Tyler Durden in my approaches and it didn't work. He has a certain style, but I have to develop my own style.

I have pulled when I was feeling good about myself, and when I had good people around me. What works for me is social circle game. Whenever I've gone out to clubs alone, even if I dressed well and approached women confidently, I didn't get anything. But the times when I was socially integrated, was having tons of tun, and didn't give a fvck about what happened is when I had the most success.

You're putting too much pressure on yourself. If you think about puss all the time you won't get any. Try to have different interests, like art, traveling, music, wine, lifting, etc and the puss will eventually fall in your lap.

 

[JohnyTheArrow]

Very good post.

It shows what I already know.There is no such thing like alpha male in the way most men imagine.There will be always women who will reject you no matter what, look, rock stars,millioners,actors also do get dumped.

The famous RooshV is not getting laid as 'alpha male' and he is tall,looks very good and devotes all his time to getting laid.

http://aaronsleazy.blogspot.com/2012/09/roosh-v-sucks-with-women-and-doesnt.html

It's like with gold rush, someone digs gold and million others follow to catch the dream.But most of the time it is just a dream.
If there is gold rush sell shovels.

What is best about game ? Not game at all. It's all about YOU.You become stronger and better.It gives you power and power brings *****.

 

[mangotot]

That's because most people think they feel good because they're successful, when the truth is, they were successful because they felt good.

I heard there are people who are unhappy and depressed on the inside are success say money wise. I don't know how that works based on this post.

 

[mangotot]

The famous RooshV is not getting laid as 'alpha male' and he is tall,looks very good and devotes all his time to getting laid.

http://aaronsleazy.blogspot.com/2012/09/roosh-v-sucks-with-women-and-doesnt.html

It's like with gold rush, someone digs gold and million others follow to catch the dream.But most of the time it is just a dream.
If there is gold rush sell shovels.

Rooshv was on some controversial $hit stirring TV program recently and he looked real good. There is no reason why he should not be getting laid. He is a shovel seller as well.

 

[JohnyTheArrow]

Rooshv was on some controversial $hit stirring TV program recently and he looked real good. There is no reason why he should not be getting laid. He is a shovel seller as well.

Yes,he is getting laid like every other dude, just not in numbers people imagine he should which undermines his 'skills' and mythical game knowledge.

 

[OlympicTim]

Confidence is a state of mind it isn't about success or failure.

I played goalie in hockey growing up and again the main theme is having confidence. However even the most confident goaltender can still let in bad goals have bad games and overall just fall to **** luck and bounces. Does it mean he is a bad goaltender? Nope. It means he has room for improvement and needs to keep working at it.

You can apply the same to women. When you approach she could be in a bad mood, have a boyfriend, fighting with her friends etc etc. Their are so many factors you can't control when approaching women. A failure doesn't mean you are bad with women. All it means is that you have room to improve.

 

[TheMonkeyKing]

The concept of confidence is misunderstood.

It seems some people interpret it as a display to other people.

CONFIDENCE, definition:

full trust; belief in the powers, trustworthiness, or reliability of a person or thing: "We have every confidence in their ability to succeed". belief in oneself and one's powers or abilities; self-confidence; self-reliance; assurance.

This says nothing about displays nor interpretations of others. Good social skills are a result of confidence, not proof of it. Some of the least confident people I have ever met have very good public relations, but get them alone, take their audience away and they become jellyfish: fun to look at, but essentially empty and potentially very dangerous.

There is a huge difference.