Looking for perspective on fallout from a bad joke

[Atom Smasher]

I'm smack-dab in the middle of a situation, and therefore lack perspective. Perhaps you gents can give me some advice.

I've been gaming a girl from an office that I work part-time at for the past couple months, just for the practice. In other words, from my perspective there was always very little chance that a long-term relationship would develop... I simply have been practicing my skills with her.

She has responded pretty well to the stuff I've been throwing at her. She's very compliant (For example, I required a certain nail polish for a hike we took together, and she wore it. That's just one example of many). She always gives me her hand when I tell her to. She likes to be led, for sure. She responds well to flirting and innuendo, and eats it up.

We haven't kissed, as this has been strictly lab work for me and I've not wanted to escalate quickly.

She has met my sister and bro in law, and they told me she was welcome to come to their house on Christmas. I invited her, thinking she would never come as she has 2 daughters and a lot is going on in her life right now. She actually accepted, much to my surprise.

She pulled up to the house, I went out to get her as she wasn't sure which house. We hugged, with her giving me a slight, tentative peck on the cheek (the kind that usually accompanies a hug).

We went inside, and the night was rather boring. We didn't have a chance to bond, we were separated by bad seating. I played some awesome guitar, both Christmas songs and regular (Beatles songs and some instrumentals).

I noticed she didn't have that star-struck look that I'm used to from most girls, LOL, but she has always been low-key. She has heard me play many times because she's in a group guitar class that I teach once a week at the church. She always says I play great but she lacks that longing look I usually get.

Upon us leaving, she was going to follow me to close to her house as she was scared to navigate in the fog. I went outside with her, we chatted, I thought I noticed a bit of hesitation in making plans for the weekend (but I have seen this before & it was a false alarm), and I went to hug her and do the hug/kiss thing but she seemed to move her head kind of far to the side, as if to make sure I didn't go in for the full-on kiss (which I had no intention of doing). Again, she's tough read and I've seen all this before, so I didn't think all that much of it. However, I decided it would be best for me to go ghost for a while in order to gauge interest.

All was good today, with me content to stay NC, when something came to my memory that MAY have caused her slightly weird behavior.

Here's where we get to the good part, my Super-Blooper. That night, it was about 10:30 and most folks had left, and she, myself, my sister and bro in law were sitting around talking. I was bored stiff. Just as I checked my phone, a text video came in from the wife of one of my best friends. It was of Rockefeller Center... they must have gone down there last night. I remarked that the wife of one of my best friends just texted me a movie.

I said "Hey it's a movie from my friend's wife. She uhhh, we... have a thing going on... No, just kidding...

WTF??

Don't ask, I have no idea why that slipped out. Of course, we have nothing going on between us, and they are very good friends who have actually been known to joke about that. I said it in a joking way, but my God, I sure did slip up on that one. It was clearly a joke to everyone, but it was one of those lead balloon moments.

I detected a moment of silence from my family members, and noticed nothing from her. She is divorced, so she might have latched onto it. We chatted on, everything seemed normal, and we left. The rest you already know.

I'm wondering what the best way would be to handle this. She might have taken offense at my dumb joke, she might have been losing interest already (after all, I've been stringing her along without making any moves), and she might just be acting strange as always.

I was considering just staying ghost (in which case the bad joke could be festering in her mind), or perhaps sending a super-short email acknowledging that I made a bad joke last night (without mentioning the actual joke), not sure why, in order to deflect it and display that I am aware of it, and then go total ghost. This would defuse her ability to rationalize what a bad guy I am.

What do you guys think? Is it best to proactively send an acknowledgement (which would ruin my NC) or just stay ghost and let it fester in her mind (if indeed it is even festering in there?

Again, ultimately I'm kind of losing interest and really want to figure out the best move going forward from more of a learning standpoint. I do have to interact with her occasionally in the office, so I'd like to keep things as smooth as possible.

 

[_sideways_]

It was a joke right? Some people can't handle that type of humor....act as it didn't happen...they know u were joking....if anything u can blame the alcohol u had earlier, that made u stupid....if u didn't drink....fake it...or say that your friend and his wife have an inside joke about it. Like she had a dream about you....and stop worrying about it. It was a stupid joke....period.

 

[The Bat]

It was a joke. I doubt she remembers it. If she does, and she makes a big deal out of it, then that's her problem. Inside jokes aren't meant to be understood or appreciated by outsiders.

The thing about her not ogling you when guitar playing could be that since she's seen you play multiple times especially as a teacher has lost its "magic" because as a teacher, you're breaking down this art in steps and showing logic/reason behind each steps that ultimately builds this art. Women are fascinated by the final product; not the beginning or middle of it.

 

[Albatross953]

If your friend got cheated on before getting divorced that may have hit close to home.
I agree there's not much to do but carry on.

 

[Atom Smasher]

That, plus my family glancing at me, is what made me remember it and wonder if it was a blunder on my part. I was just wondering weather to just let it ride or proactively acknowledge it.

You know how it is... when you're smack-dab in the middle of it you don't have perspective, not even enough to evaluate if there is even a problem at all.

 

[switch]

i make comments like that all the time, i even go beyond the line.i dont see how that is a big deal.

 

[Zunder]

My answer, which is the answer you would give me should the situation be reversed: Who gives a shyt what some milf thinks of your joke?.......... unless you do care what she thinks of your joke that (possibly) went wrong?

I got to say, the whole set up you described all sounded a little weird.

From my experience of my own fvcked up mistakes - as soon as I start worrying about how some chick may be thinking about something I said, it means I'm into her.

Your sure you not into her, even though you claim you are only "pratcising"?

 

[abe0]

I say ignore the incident. If she ever asks about it I probably say that you have a thing going on about sending each other movies or some crap like that. We all have done stupid things. Do not over analyze this crap.....or you will go crazy. You never know what those little brains are thinking at that time and what might be funny to one is offensive to another. Abe

 

[Warrior74]

So many red flags.

On you. Chick from work. Flag.
Haven't kissed yet. Flag.
Met my family. Freaking flag.
Hung out during Christmas. Beta flag.
Bored. If your bored than your boring flag.
Lack of creating interest and longing looks. Flag.
Top it off with a bad joke. Flag
Oh nevermind, none of this really matters cause I'm just practicing, expect if it works then I'm not. Flag.
Two kids. Flag
Two kids and haven't kissed? Flag.

Seems to me the joke was the last nail in the coffin. By the time you got to the joke you hand long since removed all mystery, danger and doubt. Inviting a girl over for a famy holiday? That kinda a big deal with a chick you haven't kissed.

Are you trying to signal that you are a provider type? Because that's what you signaled here. What else is there fror her imagination to work with? She knows it all, even down to how boring you can be. I think the joke could have been forgiven if your frame and game where tighter. But if your game was tighter she wouldn't have been at a family function anyway.

What should you do now? Bring the movies game. Engage, make an offer. If she accepts cool. If not **** it. Practice on someone else. If you can't do that you aren't practicing, your invested and should admit it to yourself. Personally I think you are invested a wee bit. But your sending the wrong signal in my opinion.

 

[Atom Smasher]

My answer, which is the answer you would give me should the situation be reversed: Who gives a shyt what some milf thinks of your joke?.......... unless you do care what she thinks of your joke that (possibly) went wrong?

I got to say, the whole set up you described all sounded a little weird.

From my experience of my own fvcked up mistakes - as soon as I start worrying about how some chick may be thinking about something I said, it means I'm into her.

Your sure you not into her, even though you claim you are only "pratcising"?

Yup, I'm sure it's only lab work. I normally escalate much more quickly, as I have a keen awareness of the importance of momentum. Obviously I've been coasting through, trying this and that. Right from the start she has seemed kind of boring to me, and that fact made me approach it from an experimental viewpoint.

Most of you guys here are concentrating on quick lays, but I've been through that a bazillion times and at age 56 I'm looking to hone my skills on the relationship side. I've got the seduction thing figured out; it's simply not an issue anymore, but I thought I'd try a slow run-through this time.

At this point I'm aware that the thing that made me concerned that I uttered a big blunder was because my other family members kind of did a double-take, which I'm certain they wouldn't have even done had this woman not been there.

So upon honest reflection, nope, no major feelings for her, although I only deal with people I like. As I type this, I'm recognizing my ego is involved because it's been a long, long time since a chick has been anything but eager to lick my tonsils. The after-Christmas hug struck me as a little strange and out of the ordinary.

She actually emailed me this morning... "Atom, I had a nice time at [my sister's} house. I liked your sweater. OK, off to graduation... ttyl". Her daughter is graduating from something today.

LOL, exciting stuff, eh? It shows that she's not offended by my naughty utterance. Again, it must have been my family's reaction that made me wonder, because I've said the most shocking things to her over the past few months, all of which she's eaten up gladly, I mean really crazy stuff. I've been amazingly bold verbally, more outrageous than I've ever been with any woman, but very slow physically, because I'm not all that desirous of escalating.

Thanks for the perspective, men. I'll stay ghost for a while as I think I've been too available in the past 2 weeks. This has been a great opportunity to hone the craft, and when a more serious prospect comes along my blade's going to be a lot sharper.

 

[Atom Smasher]

To warrior, I'm pretty sure my only investment is my ego with the wishy-washy goodbye scenario. Other than that, she doesn't excite me, which I why I turned this one over to experimentation. No loss if and when I finally go over the top with her. As I've mentioned previously, at my stage of life I'm not looking for quick lays (which are easily gotten at this point) but for a more stable relationship. This one was never a serious prospect for that as she's too boring. I would say there's definitely some ego there, but very little emotional investment in her.

 

[zekko]

We didn't have a chance to bond, we were separated by bad seating.

This is the part that jumped out at me. If she came there as your "date", or even anything remotely resembling your date, you should have made sure she was seated next to you. If I were her, that would have put me off right there. Way more than the joke.

And if she wasn't there as your date, I don't know why you would expect her to show interest.

As for the guitar bit, it's a little like a magic trick. The more she sees the trick (or sees you play), the less amazing it is. You say she's never really been impressed though. Maybe she had a former boyfriend who played or something.

 

[Atom Smasher]

Seating was really strange this year. My sister has only one couch, which was full, and the rest of the chairs are separated. I was actually calculating the possibilities like a chess game, but I was check mated.

She was there as my date.

What intrigues me is that she verbally says I'm an amazing guitarist using those exact words, always asks "How do you do that (like one would actually say after a magic trick). So she is impressed, for sure. I'm intrigued buy the fact that she doesn't visibly go into a trance state like almost all women, but I think she hides these things. When I play, it's amazing how virtually all women I play for sink into a deep trance that is very visible.

I'm a good friend of Phil Keaggy, and he was telling me one day how he would show his wife a new song that would eventually become a huge hit, and she would say, "That's nice, hon, but you said you'd take out the trash".

This whole thing has been a heck of a lot of fun as I've been pushing the limits beyond anything I've done before. I've been saying and doing the most outrageous things, things that I would never have dreamed of doing even a few short years ago.

The bottom line is that I find this whole thing very interesting indeed, especially because it has enabled me to reach an entirely new level of boldness and detachment. Although my OP may sound like there is some attachment there, such is not the case, except to re-state that I only hang out with people I genuinely like. I don't game brats, slvts, drama queens, and "entitled" women. I lost perspective over whether my comment was completely over-the-top bad, because there was a definite surprised look on a couple of family faces. Regardless, it was an unskilled move on my part, not congruent with my personality. Perhaps that incongruence made me wonder also.

Another thing that makes this girl somewhat intriguing is that she is very even-tempered. No matter what I can't seem to get any negative drama out of her. Yet she doesn't fall into the completely boring category because she loves toys, is very playful, and enjoys my over-the-top teasing. That even-temperedness is quite refreshing, but it will probably translate into boredom eventually. Like I said in my OP, I'm starting to lose interest.

I know this place is frequented mostly by guys who are looking for quick seduction and scoring (not you, Zekko), so I get it that most are interpreting my comments from that framework, which is not my framework. You and I have talked here about the patience of the mature man, which can be used to devastating effect when used with intent. I'm just greatly enjoying this experiment, taking my time and seeing how much I can sharpen my axe for when I really want to go in for the kill with other prey that is worthy of my attention.

 

[cordoncordon]

Atom I don't think your comment was that out of line. But it is all about settings.....if you were just with her at a bar or nightclub having a few drinks? The comment was nothing to worry about. But since you were with her in front of your family, with her meeting them for the first time, during Christmas? Then yeah, it was probably out of line. I know if I had a new girl meeting all of my family during Christmas and I made a comment like that, I would get the exact same silence and looks from my family that you received. That uncomfortable 'what the fawk did I just say' feeling would come over me. And I would feel the same as you afterwards. But if I said it with just her at the bar? I would laugh at it and never think twice about it.

I think you should email her and tell her exactly what I just wrote. Something like "hey I was thinking that the comment I made about the guys wife the other day was probably kind of inappropriate considering the setting in front of my family and it being Christmas and all. I want to apologize for that." And leave it at that. I think she would consider it a pretty suave and mature move on your part if you did. And you aren't really apologizing for what you said (which you shouldn't), just for the time and place you said it.

Good luck.

 

[Albatross953]

I like what cordon suggested, but I'm the guy who broke a plate a couple of weeks ago by being too honest...so grain of salt.

 

[Warrior74]

To warrior, I'm pretty sure my only investment is my ego with the wishy-washy goodbye scenario. Other than that, she doesn't excite me, which I why I turned this one over to experimentation. No loss if and when I finally go over the top with her. As I've mentioned previously, at my stage of life I'm not looking for quick lays (which are easily gotten at this point) but for a more stable relationship. This one was never a serious prospect for that as she's too boring. I would say there's definitely some ego there, but very little emotional investment in her.

Right. I assumed as much considering your age. But I was a little drunk and still felt like it needed to be said. If nothing else, I posted for younger guys here who are not looking to settle down and might get the wrong impression that this is somehow good game for being a DJ. For being a provider, yah it's classic beta game. And dating older women, I suppose that is the signal you want to flash. But maybe, just maybe the same rules still apply if you are looking for something stable or quick. Good game is still good game.

Sounds like you got your answer. You said you say bold stuff to her all the time, but apparently not to your family. Which is how most of us act, I guess that incongruency bit you. If I acted around my family the way I do everywhere else they probably wouldn't recognize me. As it stands the older I've gotten the more I've started to be congruent with my family and they do not like it. I'm a right and proper bastard and I know it.

 

[Colossus]

Oh nevermind, none of this really matters cause I'm just practicing, expect if it works then I'm not. Flag.

You know Atom, I have to agree with Warrior here.

It sounds to me like an example of the old SoSuave adage "if she really wasn't a concern to you then you wouldn't have composed a full page post about it."

I think the joke was definitely poorly placed, but the overall picture seems to be she is getting mixed signals from you. Pseudo-dates, flirting, hugs, a peck, Christmas with your family----all of this screams I-wanna-date-you, but between (possibly) the joke and your lack of making any REAL moves, she is getting wigged out and is probably withdrawing to protect herself.

This is why you just don't get involved with women at work. If it works out, it's great until it isn't, but with a false start like this, often it just gets awkward and they end up resenting you.

 

[Atom Smasher]

Thanks guys. Actually, my family is very coarse in their humor compared to me, so they normally wouldn't give it a second thought and I think that I might possibly have been wrong about their reaction. Come to think of it I had a bit of wine in m, though not drunk, and I think I might have misread the whole thing, even their reaction.

I think I amplified the whole thing in my head, although the joke certainly wasn't my best work...

Thanks for the perspectives, guys.

To Cordon, I'm thinking along those lines, possibly just referring to "a comment I made"... but keeping it clear that it's not an apology but rather an acknowledgment that I'm aware. I was going to do that right off the bat except I felt it was very important to go ghost for a few days since I had been too available for the past couple of weeks. Thanks.

To Colossus, I've been playing around with the idea of keeping her wondering because she's had a recent string of guys sniffing around her and eager to please, the usual orbiters. I figured I'd hang back and play it super-slow just to see what is to be seen. I wanted her to wonder why isn't Atom Smasher acting like all these other guys? She's actually my age (which is way above my usual dating age group of late 30s - 40s), but she's thin and hot. Most women my age are all hagged out, so those guys, as you can imagine, have been sniffing up her skirt like mad. I had to make sure to avoid being one of them.

You're probably right about her withdrawing to protect herself, but I'm not 100% sure. You're right about women at work... I only have to see her if her computer goes down, and I only do a few hours a week on-site, much of it off-hours, so I figured the risk was acceptable.

I'm pretty sure I'm being honest with myself when I say the main issue was that I wasn't sure how bad my joke actually was, and was wondering if that affected her when we departed. She definitely doesn't fit the mold of most women I see. She's a hard read, whereas I find most women to be incredibly easy reads.

That's probably the crux of the issue... I'm not used to hard reads as I haven't experienced that in years.

Thanks again, guys.

 

[trent_afc]

I'm just greatly enjoying this experiment, taking my time and seeing how much I can sharpen my axe for when I really want to go in for the kill with other prey that is worthy of my attention.

Atom, I'm starting down a similar road, but I have an internal conflict regarding gaming women I have little interest in. I definitely need to sharpen my axe as well, but playing chicks for the sake of playing just seems wrong to me. Then again, I read that they love the drama, so maybe I'm doing them a favor...

How do you rationalize the behavior to yourself? Not trying to judge you at all, just seeking some guidance for my own clarification. Thanks

btw sorry for the semi-thread-jack

 

[zekko]

I think I amplified the whole thing in my head, although the joke certainly wasn't my best work...

This is what I was thinking. At the end of the day, it was just an off the cuff remark that you made, which will be forgotten soon enough. Not that big of a deal.

If you're going to live "out of your head" at social gatherings, without thinking about and filtering everything you say in your mind before you say it, every once in a while a line is going to fall flat. Again, no big deal, and nothing to sweat about.

I still think she would be more irked at any real or perceived lack of attentiveness that you showed her (not sitting with her, performing, etc.). Maybe I misread your post, but it sounds like you barely spent time with her. Since she was at a party where she barely knew anybody, she might have felt a little abandoned.

It's also interesting that you don't merely know her from work, but also from church apparently. I wonder if this changes the dynamic at all as far as the SoSuave "iron rule" about not dating anyone from work. Also, in Smasher's defense, this is just a part time job, so I doubt that gaming a girl here is that big of a deal.

Of course, this whole thing shows the problem with "practicing". You get the girl responding, but you're not interested enough to escalate when it is called for, so you don't get a real effect. And if it does work out, you end up stuck with a girl that you're not really interested in.