LJBF'd? Are You Really In The Friend Zone? The Different Types of LJBF Zones.

[Alanswer]

There is only one Friend Zone BUT there are several LJBF Zones... But everyone mixes them up.

The problem resides in the fact that you may very well have been LJBF'd BUT NOT be in the Friend Zone.

How can we be LJBF'd without being send to the FZ?
Because there are several Friend Zones or more accurately LJBF Zones.

There are several Friend Zones because people (and PUA alike) misidentify rejection (LJBF/no-sex zone) with the true Friend Zone.
Girls don’t help since they often use « Let’s Just Be Friends » as generic rejection line.

What I mean is, and contrary to what every PUA think or advertise because it’s simpler to give one unique and solve-it-all PUA routine, technique than to try to analyze the true complexity and variety underneath these two concepts (LJBF and Friend Zone), LJBF doesn't equal Friend Zone.


Because to be in the Friend Zone, you'd need to be FRIENDS!

Unfortunately, the concepts of Friend Zone and LJBF are used un-differentially. But the true FZ can only exist if there is a friendship (logical, no?).
If not, you may have been LJBF'd but you're NOT in the FZ, you're in the LJBF (or NO-SEX/rejection) zone.

If, after being rejected, you accept (*****!) to and trully BECOME friends, then you'll be in the FZ, but not in the period in-between the rejection/LJBF and (real) friendship.

So, a girl can have many reasons to LJBF you… And It’s not always to put you in the Friend Zone nor because she‘s not attracted to you.

That's why I see confusion and doubt (there's a thread right now called "Is the FZ bull?") about FZ, LJBF, rejection... And how to deal with it (them).

Here are 10 examples of different situations:


1- LJBF is some kind of (sh1t-)test. To see how you’ll react.

This occurs generally the first you meet a girl and try to hit on her.

This is NOT FZ.

2- She LJBF you because you’re (and also her emotional response, she may feel like she shouldn‘t be falling for you so fast -- e.g. some minutes ---) putting too much (emotional) pressure, too quick on her. So, she’s trying to slow you (as well as herself) down.
Thus, she’s attracted but she would like to take her time.

This is NOT FZ.

3- She feels like you’re a player and tries to see if you’re really interested in HER, her personality, not only her appearance. And for that she’d like you to know her and her to know you better before to make out or have sex.
[Side note: For a majority of girls, a solid relationship must start by a friendship. You learn to know each other over time and if you still like one another after some days, weeks or months, then your relationship has more chance to be a long and enjoyable ride. That’s also why sometimes it doesn’t take much to get out of the Friend Zone.]

A good way to know if you’re in this situation is if she asks you the : « Why me? » question. She may be attracted but she needs to feel she has some value in your eyes, that you respect her (she’s not just another ***** or piece of meat here only to satisfy your desires) to accept having a (sexual) relationship with you.

That’s the ‘Mirror Effect’ (we can also find that ’effect’ in LTRs - Last Minute Resistance- and ***** shields -when a girl don’t wanna go too far by fear that society, her friends, you or even herself will think she’s a *****/slut because she had sex with you too quickly-.)

Her value is determined by the value YOU give her. So, if there is a too significant discrepancy between the way she sees herself and the way she thinks you see her, she won’t go for it.

This is NOT FZ... But could lead to it.

4- She may not be that much into you (anymore) because you said or did something that turned her off BUT you still have your chances IF you know how to play it by doing some damage control.

This is NOT FZ. This is clearly the no-sex zone

5- Because YOU are the one acting like a friend without realizing it, and it would only take for you to make your intentions verbally, but more importantly, non- verbally clear to get the girl you want…

This is FZ if you were friends before to get LJBF'd.

6- She’s not (enough) attracted to you… (YET!) That’s, of course, the most common one. And you’ll get out of the Friend Zone if you can first understand the reason why you’re in there and modify your behavior accordingly (if you can and/or want).

Here 2 sub-situations:

a) You just met the girl. (NOT FZ)

b) You’ve been friends for quite some time now. (The true FZ)

7- She really values your friendship (that’s not some kind of BS she says to be polite while rejecting you) and is afraid of destroying it if you have sex and/or if it isn’t that great (you realize you‘re not sexually compatible or it would be too awkward).

This is still FZ. But an easy one to get out of.

8- She doesn’t want a romantic BF-GF relationship with you but wouldn’t mind having some good time on the side (I.e. being **** buddies, sexual ‘relationship‘)… BUT she’s afraid or unable of expressing it.

FZ or not? Good question. Let's say FZ de facto but not potentially. We could consider it's not FZ since she wants more. LJBF for sure.

9- She is an ex-hook up or girlfriend.
It depends if you became actual friends. But even so, it cannot be FZ since you DID HAVE SEX with HER. Sex is incompatible with friendship, therefore with FZ.


10- YOU put her in the Friend Zone but now would like more.

This was NOT FZ since you chose it. But it could be now because she could not be attracted to you anymore.

…

You see there can be a lot of reasons why a girl LBF you… And there are more…
So, there are different methods, solutions to apply to each LJBF situations. You need to understand that BEFORE to try to know how to get out the Friend Zone. Because your Friend Zone is not the same than someone else's. Or LJBF with one girl/situation has not the same signification with another.

 

[MurdocIsGod]

Friendzone checklist. She thinks you're either:

a) fat/ugly
b) below her (ties in with beta and pathetic etc)
c) dull

or rarely

d) a brother

You can actually hang out with a girl for a long time without becoming like a brother to her. I think that only happens when you're basically best friends. A girl who you simply hang out with in a group but barely speak to one on one? Could that be true friendzone? Doubt it... That's probably fat&uglyzone or guysshehasnorespectforzone.

 

[Igetit!]

Friendzone checklist. She thinks you're either:

a) fat/ugly
b) below her (ties in with beta and pathetic etc)
c) dull

or rarely

d) a brother

I agree with what Alanswer (the OP) said about women using the LJBF thing for many different situations. Just because a girl says "LJBF",it doesn't automatically mean you're in the real,true,genuine friendzone.


It's kind of like when a girl says no,but she really means yes,and there are times when she says no,and she really means no.


You just need enough wisdom and experience to be able to tell the difference.


There's a lot of good info in this thread. The only thing I disagree with the OP on is getting out of the friendzone,and the friendzone I MEAN is when you've laughed,talked,joked and played around with,been her shoulder to cry on,been her councellor,her "girlfriend",have never said or done anything sexual towards her,have discussed and advised her on her relationships with other guys and listened to her gripes and complaints about them,and this all has been going on for months and months and months....even years in some cases,


Then after doing all that,you finally ask her out,and she gives you the LJBF speech. In that scenario,you TRUELY ARE in the friendzone,and you CAN'T get out.

You can actually hang out with a girl for a long time without becoming like a brother to her.

I suppose you can,but I honestly don't see how. If it's one on one,and you don't flirt or tease the girl,if you're repeatedly in her presense WITHOUT showing any type of interest in her,HER EMOTIONS will friendzone you by default.


That's the thing....the friendzone (the real one) is the result of a neglect.

It doesn't happen because of something YOU DO,it happens because of something you DIDN'T DO,something you FAILED to do.


Women are EMOTIONAL. If you failed to flirt,tease,or show any type of sexual interest in a girl,the LACK OF SEXUAL FEELINGS OR EMOTIONS will be filled in by affection or aquaintenance. If you're going to be around a girl over and over again,SHE WILL FEEL SOMETHING......period.


I mean basically,there's only two options:sexual or not. NOT CHOOSING is NOT an option. So if you don't purposely make a decision,HER FEELINGS will do it for you.

I think that only happens when you're basically best friends.

True,but this should never be.

A girl who you simply hang out with in a group but barely speak to one on one? Could that be true friendzone?

It could be.

It doesn't matter if you speak to her one on one,if you speak PERIOD,she'll start to get a sense of who you are and what kind of person you are,and that'll let her know if you're the "type" of guy she's normally drawn to.


If you are,then yeah,I suppose you could hang out with her in a group without falling into the friendzone. She'd probably be giving you IOIs whenever you're around,but if you don't eventually pickup on them and reciprocate,again,it's friendzone by default.

 

[Alanswer]

Then after doing all that,you finally ask her out,and she gives you the LJBF speech. In that scenario,you TRUELY ARE in the friendzone,and you CAN'T get out.

My motto is: You should ALWAYS be able to get the girl... If you play it smoothly...

If you don't it's because you made mistakes and/or is not good enough.
But in a real friend zone like you describe. I don't see why you couldn't. You're a man, she's a woman/girl, sexual potential is there and tension can always arise. It's up to you to increase/reveal/build it.

The question is: Why have 'you' allowed this situation to take place? Once you have the answer, you'll be able to do something about it.

 

[satelliteparties]

My motto is: You should ALWAYS be able to get the girl... If you play it smoothly...

Wrong, if a girl has no physical attraction to you/interest in you...or just has a little interest in you...it's not going to change. That's 99 percent of the problems of dating and this board in particular...chasing girls with no or low interest.

What I don't get is, why do people (girls do this too not just guys) want someone who doesn't want them or only kind of wants them? Is it the whole challenge thing?

For me, if a girl isn't interested in me, or showing mixed signals, it makes me not interested in her regardless of who she is or what she looks like.

 

[Alanswer]

Wrong, if a girl has no physical attraction to you/interest in you...or just has a little interest in you...it's not going to change.

Totally disagree. Attraction and interest are so volatile concepts and feelings that they sure can change. I think you play it too safe and easy.

When I'm here (or writing articles), I try to put myself in the shoes of guys asking or needing advice. If they want to know how to seduce a girl with SEEMINGLY low interest (at a moment m), I try to make my job to help them do just that. But I always try to make them understand that's not necessarily the best way to go, for their own good.

For me, if a girl isn't interested in me, or showing mixed signals, it makes me not interested in her regardless of who she is or what she looks like.

This I (personally) partially agree with. Attraction is complex and mixed signals can have different causes/origins.
Nevertheless I'll never pursue a girl that doesn't seem interested enough in me. I'm not a beggar and never will be.
If she cannot see what I could give her, too bad for her.

But as the majority of girls see me as a player I have to win them over by doing some actual 'work'.

 

[Packers2010]

this may be true. but i was friend this a girl for 7 years. like best friends. then one day we just started hooking up.

she did just break up with her Long term bf so it could just be that she left alone. well thats what she told me anyway.

either way. you can be in the friend zone but still get the sex. she just wont date you.

 

[Alanswer]

you can be in the friend zone but still get the sex. she just wont date you.

NO.
1. Friendship is incompatible with sex (do you fvck your guy friends? No? So, you see what I mean.)
2. Once you had sex you CAN'T be in the FZ.
3. You're not in a BF-GF (romantic) relationship but you're not in the FZ.
By the way, if SHE decides you're not good enough for her to date you, stop fvking her now. You're just her dild-o. You may be getting sex but you don't have her respect.
If that's a mutual choice, it's cool.

 

[Cherokee]

I was "friendzoned" and the next day the girl came onto me.

Never listen to what they say, only what they do.

 

[st_99]

Yeah, I agree, the LJBF thing is kind of a grey area. Sure it could mean she'll never do you in a million years OR she just isn't going to give herself away all at once. If you got some confidence then you'll never assume the former and always assume the latter. It doesn't matter what she thinks, only what you think.

 

[Alanswer]

This is very true. OP makes out that it is possible for him and other men to attract any girl, which is completely false, and since he appears to stick to this view loses any credibility. People are very complex and are attracted to different things. That does not mean that a women who isn't currently attracted to you now couldn't be in the future. It does mean that there are women out there who no matter how hard you "improve" yourself, will never be attracted to your type of personality, physical build, face, etc.

Before to try to cast some doubt on my credibility. Be careful to don’t lose yours.

Did you notice the thread you’re in, therefore the context you should consider to interpret my words, before to comment?

I’m not talking about rejection nor girls in general BUT about a woman you’re in the Friend Zone with.

In this specific situation/context, you should indeed think you are able to always get the girl. Not that you necessarily and surely WILL have her, but you’ll really commit to the attempt.

Unless you’re fat, ugly, stupid AND broke, you must consider you have your chances… Or you don’t need to bother even trying getting out of there.

Also, you don’t wanna give yourself excuses as to why you've failed before you even try something. You can’t allow your (usual) negativity to rule your mind or you’re DONE.

To conclude, I’m talking about mindsets and that’s definitely a belief/conviction you wanna have. If you don’t aim high enough, you won’t make it.

I think it should do it.
Still, you gave me an idea for a new discussion, an interesting one.

 

[Alanswer]

Look forward to seeing it.

HERE.