Life is too short: role of marriage, sex, cheating, etc...

[Egoist]

Its kinda crazy, but my mom (who has been happily married to my dad for 30+ years) has basically told me that you should follow passion in your love life, and that its ok to be selfish and to have affairs and all that.. LOL And its ok to get divorced and remarried if you are unhappy and so on. I mean I already felt this way just kinda weird to hear it from my mom of all people..

Kinda an interesting way to look at it. But basically I understand. It's almost like there is a difference between a family life and love life. Sorta like in France or Italy its impossible to find a man who has not cheated on his wife - because a wife and family is for one thing, and a mistress you have crazy passionate sex with is another. And its pretty accepted in those cultures.

What do you guys think? The roles of selfishness, family, marriage, passion, sex, etc. Do you honestly believe its possible to be crazy and passionate about a person you've been with for lets say 20 years? Should you not even expect that - but have a different kind of love and respect for each other? And bang secretaries on the side but keep it to sex only?


Fvck, I am so jaded.

Wide open for discussion.

 

[WestCoaster]

Your mom is wrong and has bought into the commercialized American "live for myself" society.

What she should've told you -- and what women do NOT want to hear -- is this: From ages 20-30 you should date as many women as possible, not get into LTR's, travel the world, sleep with quite a few women (protect thyself, invest in condoms), and develop yourself personally while also sowing those wild oats.

By the time you hit 30, after years and years of dating, you've come up with a solid outline of what you want in a woman and it's not a replica of your mom. It's your own woman. You've found this out because you've dated many and had hardships as well as good times. You know the difference between sh-t and shinola.

Then you meet a great woman at 30 or so, get married and hopefully have an enriching life together.

Honestly, I think there's nothing more pathetic than 40, 50, and 60-year old "players" who sleep around and have affairs. They're not only selfish, they're laughed at by society and end up dying losers, with alienated family members, friends, and a tombstone that says, "I was a f-cking selfish loser."

Sorry, your mom is wrong, way wrong ... glad she's not my mom.

 

[ElChoclo]

Partially agree with WestCoaster, but have to disagree with his comments re 40, 50 and 60 year old "players". Is Bill Clinton going to have "I was a fecking stupid loser" on his tombstone. Maybe, if it gets designed by a Republican. But I doubt it somehow.

 

[Friendly Otter]

WestCoaster, you are right, though I don't think this springs from any "commercialization." What is commercialization anyway? That we have enough wealth to buy things, and enough technology and science to make things much cheaper than they used to be - doesn't that just provide us with the means to follow our will, whatever it may be? The Feel-Good replacing Duty, a major shift in our philosophies, has occurred both to the left and right of the political spectrum, and that's where you should look, though I submit that it happened first on the left side.

ElChoclo, William Clinton has little to do with this particular subject. You are speaking of other accomplishments that may affect how he is remembered; WestCoaster is speaking only of the player side of people's lives.

 

[marge s.]

@ Egoist,

I'm Italian and you can trust me there... family is sacred! A cheating husband (or even worse... a cheating wife) is nothing more than a piece of s***. Not only for the cheated on partners, but also for their families, colleagues, friends... Italian divorce rates are among the highest in Europe. Do you think this is a result of general acceptance of promiscuity?? Social pressure is still very existent. Don't buy this weird Hollywood ideas about life in Europe.

 

[KarmaSutra]

I take an Existential position when it comes to my life. If something isn't working I change it until it's right to me. I don't believe it's selfish to leave a miserable job, a miserable marriage, a miserable existence.

Guys who truly live do so by the boundaries they push through and destroy. I'm not a bastard because I don't accept a dullness or mired life. Fvck that.

If you hurt those close to you in the process that is unacceptable and not what I advise.

Sit on the fence and you'll watch the world turn around you.

 

[WestCoaster]

Using Bill Clinton or any president as an example is insane. That's like saying all basketball players should be as good as Michael Jordan. Let's get some reality here.

 

[Egoist]

@ Egoist,

I'm Italian and you can trust me there... family is sacred! A cheating husband (or even worse... a cheating wife) is nothing more than a piece of s***. Not only for the cheated on partners, but also for their families, colleagues, friends... Italian divorce rates are among the highest in Europe. Do you think this is a result of general acceptance of promiscuity?? Social pressure is still very existent. Don't buy this weird Hollywood ideas about life in Europe.

I actually lived in Europe for a while. Don't tell me this ****. Majority of men in countries like France and Italy cheat. Yes, family is sacred, thats why they are discrete and keep it on the DL. They would never do anything to compromise the family, but the harmless little affairs are the norm there.

Women don't usually know, and you just confirm it.

 

[Egoist]

Your mom actually used the term affair?

LOL, does your dad know about this?

Really, I want to know, teach us how to get around monogamy.

Well, as crazy as it sounds, my mom is actually all about morals and family and supposedly never cheated on my dad or my dad on her. They just have one of those relationships. But if my mom wasn't happy, she'd move on. And after living for as long as she has and seeing people and relationships around her, she just believes that you shouldn't waste time or not enjoy life. Doesn't mean you should be wreckless or stupid, but shouldn't do something that makes you miserable either.

 

[Egoist]

I'm at a time in life where I want to avoid all misery, but I am surrounded by stories of people who have it bad...

For some odd reason, I actually WANT to get caught up in the problems. I stop caring if I am going to be a problem in their lives, and I start asking questions, I confront people for them. I put words in their mouths. I know there is more I could do to bother people, I could really make some people angry at me, it's so tempting.

I know *******s and b!tches who do this kind of stuff on purpose. I know people who will cheat on their boyfriend for months, than when they are caught, complain about how their whole plan is now ruined. I've been on cab rides where a girl is crying about her boyfriend being an *******, I have the urge to ask her where she lives to go say hi to the guy...

There are women out there who thing this way ALL the time, they get joy from other people's misery. They put themselves through misery, because they love the feeling of what it is like to get finally be rid of it.

Wreckless stupidity, that is a good way to put it.

If I was with woman I loved for 20 years, and out of now where she drops a big bomb on my head about something she's been hiding from me. I'd think I'd go off the wall, I'd leave her and become a 60 year old player like Westcoaster said. If I was with a woman and somebody said something insulting, I wouldn't back down, I'd put them in a corner and have them say it again to me. The reason I would stay faithful to my woman is because of all the feelings I am allowed to have because of her.

I do believe every man should have a mistress, and I feel the need to give equal rights to women... she should have a poolboy.

i just believe that love and passion is important.. I think i'd really rather have 10 passionate 1/2-year relationships in "honeymoon stage" rather than 20 years with one person..

But.. of course we are still young and stupid and you never know... But I can see how in some situations its better to have a wife and family for one thing, and a mistress on the side.. as long as its not excessive.

Lets face it, very few men who have the means to get any woman they want stay in a lifelong relationships, at least not without multiple affairs. Mostly you see the "multiple wife" pattern... Or one wife and affairs.

I mean look at the hottest, most in love couples. They fizzle out in a couple years. Its crazy! Hot actors resorting to prostitutes and clubgirls.

Hell, i am 100% sure even Dr. Phil screws his interns. Anybody who is as righteous as he is is bound to have a really dark side (see Rush L. for an example)

 

[WestCoaster]

Egoist, you were raised wrong and by a strange mom, and your values are skewered. Let's put it this way: older single women aren't that hot either and if your mom went back out on the market, I doubt her phone would be ringing off the hook.

Meet some 50, 60, 70 year old multiple divorcees and see how happy they are. I've met them, not a happy dude in the bunch. Not that all long-term marriages are blissful, but 60-year old players with multiple divorces are pathetic. People laugh at them, not with them.

Sorry, but you're working on the wrong things ... your mom and much of this site strays from reality much of the time.

 

[Colossus]

Egoist:

Yes, you are jaded. That attitude is why the divorce rate is ridiculous in this country. "If you're not happy, divorce." "If you're not satisfied sexually, cheat. It's ok, everybody in those other countries do it. It's all about me me me me me ME!!!"

What a bunch of cop-out excuses for not facing hard problems in life. When you are young and UNmarried--yes--you should be self-concerned, in a non-hedonistic sort of way. But if you maintain the pursuit of only your pleasure throughout life, you will end up being one of those 50-something multiple divorcees Westcoaster was talking about.

The MM forum seems to be drifting south like the main forum did. I cant believe some of these threads. What a waste.

 

[Egoist]

Egoist, you were raised wrong and by a strange mom, and your values are skewered. Let's put it this way: older single women aren't that hot either and if your mom went back out on the market, I doubt her phone would be ringing off the hook.

Meet some 50, 60, 70 year old multiple divorcees and see how happy they are. I've met them, not a happy dude in the bunch. Not that all long-term marriages are blissful, but 60-year old players with multiple divorces are pathetic. People laugh at them, not with them.

Sorry, but you're working on the wrong things ... your mom and much of this site strays from reality much of the time.

do me a favor and refrain from judging me or my parents based on a few comments SPECIFICALLY MADE TO PROVOKE DISCUSSION.

 

[Egoist]

Egoist:

Yes, you are jaded. That attitude is why the divorce rate is ridiculous in this country. "If you're not happy, divorce." "If you're not satisfied sexually, cheat. It's ok, everybody in those other countries do it. It's all about me me me me me ME!!!"

What a bunch of cop-out excuses for not facing hard problems in life. When you are young and UNmarried--yes--you should be self-concerned, in a non-hedonistic sort of way. But if you maintain the pursuit of only your pleasure throughout life, you will end up being one of those 50-something multiple divorcees Westcoaster was talking about.

The MM forum seems to be drifting south like the main forum did. I cant believe some of these threads. What a waste.

Funny enough I am actually a pretty good guy, but yes I am jaded. You are also jumping into extremes here, which is never good. The reality of life is.. you never know.

P.S. you guys are taking this sh!t way too seriously. I guess its wrong to even talk about stuff others might consider thought-provoking.

 

[TheTrader]

Meet some 50, 60, 70 year old multiple divorcees and see how happy they are. I've met them, not a happy dude in the bunch. Not that all long-term marriages are blissful, but 60-year old players with multiple divorces are pathetic. People laugh at them, not with them.
.

oh holy **** people will laugh at him?? HOW TERRIBLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! besides that why do you think are those dudes unhappy - is it
a)because they are self centered
or b)because they lost all their money in their multiple divorcees`.



leave that feminine **** like fearing that people laugh at you in the discussion forum

 

[xmlenigma]

Bottomline is no one can tell u whats right. You have to find your purpose in life.

There are people whose love life changes to family life and their purpose becomes nothing more than seeing their children happy. PERIOD.

Thats their choice. What would I want.. maybe more than that.

In this world we want nothing more than that someone connect with us deeply. If you cant find that you will never be happy.

It is also very difficult for most people to recognize what they have and value it. Imagine being a 30+ guy and falling into some kind of chronic disease. Who is going to care for you? Not your friends. Your FAMILY.

Would you rather DIE in such a scenario or see your kids grow up even if you are on a wheelchair?

LIFE is much deeper than the things you guys talk about so far.

More than anything.. Find your purpose in life.. Simple.

PS: Im single but have spent a lot of time with little kids (la familia) and will tell u that ..ive not enjoyed anything more than to be in the moment with them. They DRAW you into a world......and take ur pains and pressures away...

 

[WestCoaster]

Excellent post xmlen. It is possible to have kids and a career and hobbies. I do think some of this board does not mirror real life. Do people really want to be "players" and "sarging" at 60? It's freaking nuts.

I understand the rules here, the DJ Bible and so forth, but if some of the opinions on this board were spoken in public, they'd lock people up in the looney bin.

It's natural to want to get married and have a family ... and mothers telling their songs that cheating is where it's at? She should be in the looney bin. People seeking passion/starry eyed feeling for 10 years and then changing partners? That starry eyed feeling doesn't last 10 years.

Guys here have read too much of this site and believe it, including your's truly.

Why anyone's goal would be to be single and a pathetic player at 60 is beyond me.

* Yeah, saying 60 year old players are pathetic is feminine ... yeah, right. Go meet these guys ... if that's who you want to emulate, have fun bucko.

 

[DJDamage]

Why anyone's goal would be to be single and a pathetic player at 60 is beyond me.

I don't think anyone wants to end up being 60 and still playing the field. But what happens if you don't meet someone that suits you?! should you settle for less just for the sake of marriage? What happens if you are divorced or your wife dies in that age?! should you just say fvck it and forget you still have a d1ck (with the help of viagra) Would that make you a loser to be 60 year old sarging?! no. Who are we to judge that man?!

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=80737&highlight=divorce

A married man with family has extreme stress from his wife and kids so his belly grows and hair falls out. But he has status; he is a 'success' by society's standards because he is married and has kids. Take that status away, which divorce does, he has nothing to hang his identity on except to be a serf to the state and to the ex-wife who demands all these 'payments'.
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Divorced men are often given the status of criminals. They are struggling to survive, given a financial sentence that exceeds most jail sentences.
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The plan for attack is simple. Instead of putting time and effort to love women, love life instead. Then bring women into your life. If she doesn't like your life, kick her out and go get another. You'll find the One when she loves your life.

I am sure by the time a man turns 60 and he is still single, looking for a woman to fvck will not really be a problem nor a priority. If he can still fvck he would find some old divorce/widower and fvck her. Just because people get old doesn't mean they should stop hooking around.

The goal here is not to be single happy or married happy but to be happy with yourself and your life.

DJD

 

[WestCoaster]

Good post DJ Damage and I agree with you. My point is the constant posts here disparaging marriage, advocating cheating, and guys setting themselves up to be a loser. When that's questioned, someone is called feminine. Yeah, right.

And yes, I know married guys can be losers, too. But aspiring to change wives every 10 years, having affairs, and being a lounge lizard later in life aren't very good goals, IMO.

I'm not married and don't consider myself odd ... but I don't consider the institution of marriage odd either.

I think people are taking this site to extremes. About 80 percent of the attitudes on the board are so way off Allen Thompson's initial theories, it's not even funny. One time Allen posted a thing up there about persistence and Allen was questioned. Uh, it's HIS site, not the posters here.

Also in Allen's theories are that there are enough tools here that can help one find the right woman, or at least the right things to look for in a woman so one doesn't have to be a lounge lizard later in life. That's also dismissed.

Some guys here -- me included -- need a big break from this board. Walk down the street and say, "I used to be an AFC man, but now I've got my neg-hits down, I'm DJing, and I'm gonna sarge tonight."

Someone will think you'll need electro-shock therapy.

This board needs a reality check.

 

[KarmaSutra]

i just believe that love and passion is important.. I think i'd really rather have 10 passionate 1/2-year relationships in "honeymoon stage" rather than 20 years with one person..

Fvcken' A right