Is there anyway to correct this situation or should I just simply exit?

[bat soup]

very astute observation! She is 36 so yes I fully agree that it is odd that she is still single at this life stage. Instead of micro-obsessing (which you are correct that I'm doing), what next steps would you suggest that I pursue? Her friends are not smearing me as her friends don't know me and live in another state, she is not seeing any other guys, and I have no clue on hormones lol.

Bottom line, do you think I should simply exit? Or what steps can I take to get this going in the right direction?

This girl doesn't want any type of physical contact with you, but she's happy to lap up your attention and waste your time. Why would you want to deal with her?

 

[Kotaix]

Your mistake was to ask if you could kiss her. You should just kiss her. If she doesn't like it then walk away.

Do not give low interest women the time of day.

 

[zinc4]

ok so lets say its the end of the 2nd date, we just had dinner and now its at the end of the date and I am dropping her at her apartment. She doesn't invite me upstairs and there are no clear signals she wants to kiss but also no clear signals she doesn't. How would you proceed in this situation? Maybe walk her to the door of her apartment? and then? I feel like it would be difficult to just lean in and go for it when there are no signals?

To be honest i never pick up girls or drive to meet them. I always use uber because i like to have 2 to 3 drinks on a date. I never drink and drive ever anymore.

So my strategy is centered around setting the stage early at dinner or drinks whatever you guys are doing. I will try my hardest to kino at the place even get her kissing me. I mean if its the second date and if things are going decently this should not be an issue. I would imagine picking them up dropping them off makes it easier. What i am trying to say is the stage should be already be set by you by the middle to end of the dare to where the notion of having sex with you in her mind is on the already on the table.

Try to avoid early on dinner dates btw. Im not sure why women want or expect dinner with some new stranger they just met. Boggles my mind actually. But same rules still apply still on dinner dates as well. I generally usually only meet take out chicks who i have already banged or are dating to dinner dates.

 

[Bokanovsky]

Women who send mixed signals/refuse to send clear signals are a waste of time. If you are escalating and she just freezes and provides no response, it's definitely not normal and not a sign of you dong something wrong. This woman is either not interested or is super awkward.

 

[rjc149]

Finally, I concluded that because it was the 4th date that if I did not try to kiss her, it would go to friend zone.

now she suddenly said she enjoys spending time with me but, after more thought, she thinks its more as a friend.

You already figured this part out. The invitation to her place to be alone for drinks was your in. You missed that window, because you were too timid and unassertive. This turned her off. But I get you, sometimes it's hard to read women who give no signals. A good way to escalate, without going right for a kiss, is to take her hand while you're walking between venues. If she holds it, go for the kiss. Right there on the street.

So, long story short, do I have no choice but to exit this situation? Or is there any way to correct the wussy behavior and still get things back to dating as it was before?

Everyone already said it. Pull back, go meet other women. You can undo weak wussy behavior, to a certain extent, by becoming scarce and making her wonder about you. If she doesn't wonder about you and hit you up, then you know it's over.

I met an Indian woman from Chennai at a bar. From India, accent and everything. I got her number, and we met up for a date the following weekend. We ended up hooking up. She was a virgin, but was letting me eat her out on the first date. On the second date, she let me have anal sex with her (or rather, we tried to) to keep her virginity intact. It was literally like an anal porn movie.

She then disappeared on me. I later found out, on Facebook, that maybe a month or so later, she had gotten engaged to an Indian IT guy who proposed to her with the whole hip-gyrating Bollywood dance routine. He looked so happy and blissful as he knelt on one knee, with a sweet little love poem as the caption. He now has his conservative, wholesome virgin Indian wife.

 

[Sebastian0001]

You already figured this part out. The invitation to her place to be alone for drinks was your in. You missed that window, because you were too timid and unassertive. This turned her off. But I get you, sometimes it's hard to read women who give no signals. A good way to escalate, without going right for a kiss, is to take her hand while you're walking between venues. If she holds it, go for the kiss. Right there on the street.

But, I don't think I was timid? When alone at her place, I put my arm around her. She kind of came in and then went away. I tried to massage her neck. She said "oo that feels good" only to say "oo now it hurts, sorry i'm bony" 3 second later. Then, I put my arm on her thigh on the cough, no response - not negative, not positive, just nothing. What can you do when there is just no response? But, its probably true that it might have been too late at this point since there were 3 dates prior to this I guess. So, from that perspective, it makes sense that I was too timid but still she invited me over? I had told her I had a dream about her and it was a romantic kind of dream and I think that did turn her on a bit (this was between dates 3 and 4 via text) but I probably did not do enough in person escalation?

 

[Sebastian0001]

UPDATE - So once this girl told me the friend thing, I have completely stopped talking to her. And today on Instagram, I posted a picture of me out at a cool place, and she immediately commented with interest at where I was.

All of you who said just simply ignore here are 100% CORRECT. Now, should I even respond? Maybe respond after like 3 days or something? I think I'm just not going to respond at all? I used to respond like immediately. I need to fix this loser mentality and just ignore these women. It works like GOLD. LOL. I bet if I can just correct my stupid behavior, this girl is still in play. But its very hard because I don't want to be a player or anything. I legit want to be in a happy marriage with a wife that we love each other. So, I tend to always go back to that mentality which can cause weak behavior, clinginess, etc. Its something I need to figure out how to correct.

 

[zinc4]

UPDATE - So once this girl told me the friend thing, I have completely stopped talking to her. And today on Instagram, I posted a picture of me out at a cool place, and she immediately commented with interest at where I was.

All of you who said just simply ignore here are 100% CORRECT. Now, should I even respond? Maybe respond after like 3 days or something? I think I'm just not going to respond at all? I used to respond like immediately. I need to fix this loser mentality and just ignore these women. It works like GOLD. LOL. I bet if I can just correct my stupid behavior, this girl is still in play. But its very hard because I don't want to be a player or anything. I legit want to be in a happy marriage with a wife that we love each other. So, I tend to always go back to that mentality which can cause weak behavior, clinginess, etc. Its something I need to figure out how to correct.

Ask her to your place on a night when she doesn't need to work the next morning... tell her you will cook dinner then start escalating on her 15 to 30 mins after she gets there.

If she rejects this invitation then just forget about her. Or just block her. Not worth wasting anymore time over. Dont accept any public dates with her.

 

[rjc149]

UPDATE - So once this girl told me the friend thing, I have completely stopped talking to her. And today on Instagram, I posted a picture of me out at a cool place, and she immediately commented with interest at where I was.

All of you who said just simply ignore here are 100% CORRECT. Now, should I even respond? Maybe respond after like 3 days or something? I think I'm just not going to respond at all? I used to respond like immediately. I need to fix this loser mentality and just ignore these women. It works like GOLD. LOL. I bet if I can just correct my stupid behavior, this girl is still in play. But its very hard because I don't want to be a player or anything. I legit want to be in a happy marriage with a wife that we love each other. So, I tend to always go back to that mentality which can cause weak behavior, clinginess, etc. Its something I need to figure out how to correct.

Just answer her question. One word answer, tell her where the photos was taken. That’s it. Don’t follow up with a question or invitation. It doesn’t matter when you respond. Remember, if you’re truly detached and not butthurt, you don’t flat-out ignore a woman unless you truly want nothing to do with her. Which is not the case here.

 

[rjc149]

But, I don't think I was timid?

But, its probably true that it might have been too late at this point since there were 3 dates prior to this I guess.

Again, you’re answering your own question. Trust your own intuition on what went wrong. You don’t need the red pill echo chamber here telling you the same boilerplate “ignore block delete spin more plates” advice.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Yes this works but you still have to talk and act to escalate. Ignoring is no garantee of sex. What good is ignoring a girl if it does not drop her panties?. If the panties dont come off then its a next. Write her off at that point.

lol there is no way this girl is going to drop her panties like that. Yes, she will get turned on and all of that with the right alpha mindset I agree but she is very shy on the topic of sex to the point that I can't imagine her doing it anytime soon. I think she is probably a virgin at age 36 tbh! I think its just how she was raised. She is soo conservative on these things. One time she sent me a romantic song that she wanted me to perform for her and it had a part where the guy got naked so I totally escalated with that and I made fun of her how she was just trying to get into my pants and that the song was just an excuse so she could get her hands on me. And how I could get naked but I'd have to think about it whether I would allow any touching and that i understood she had a lot of stress at work and needed to "blow" off steam but that I don't know if I will allow it. LOLL. But, her face got super embarrassed and I could tell she was very very uncomfortable. Whereas other women I have been with would have laughed and laughed and loved every bit of that whole exchange.

See what I mean? This is the problem. And I know what ur saying, just go to the next girl if she doesn't have sex. But, what if I see this girl as a long-term potential and kind of like that she is wholesome and not like all those sluts out there who would drop their panties just like that? What if that is what I want. This is my situation and I am not sure how to proceed with her given all of this.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Ask her to your place on a night when she doesn't need to work the next morning... tell her you will cook dinner then start escalating on her 15 to 30 mins after she gets there.

If she rejects this invitation then just forget about her. Or just block her. Not worth wasting anymore time over. Dont accept any public dates with her.

lol so ur saying just run back? Doesn't that make me cheap? Shouldn't she have to work a little to get me back? I kind of want to drive her crazy by ignoring her, reply slow, show a little interest but maker her want more and then get her to the point where she just straight up asks for it. She said that friends thing just a few days ago. Now she is being ignored and seeing that I am having a great and fun life without her on Instagram.

And I do like your idea though about brining her over for dinner and then going for it again. The one slight issue (and this is an issue I would like to solve for all women going forward) is that I live in a very expensive real estate market and so my apartment building is not medium priced and thus not very impressive. The landlord doesn't maintain it well, there is chipped paint everywhere, old utilities, trash not always removed timely. So, I am kind of embarrassed by this. And she lives in a little bit cheaper area so her place is really nice and all brand new. So, what to do? I kind of feel embarrassed to bring her (and other women too) over because of this.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Just answer her question. One word answer, tell her where the photos was taken. That’s it. Don’t follow up with a question or invitation. It doesn’t matter when you respond. Remember, if you’re truly detached and not butthurt, you don’t flat-out ignore a woman unless you truly want nothing to do with her. Which is not the case here.

True true but can't I respond very very slow? Like day two days to respond instead of 2 hours? This is probably something that should be done with all women?

 

[rjc149]

But, what if I see this girl as a long-term potential and kind of like that she is wholesome and not like all those sluts out there who would drop their panties just like that?

lol there is no way this girl is going to drop her panties like that.

She will drop her panties 'like that' for the right guy. She will show up to a date with a nice guy looking for "long term potential" like yourself, and excuse herself to the bathroom to wipe off that dude's *** dripping down her thigh. Believe it.

This is your problem, right here. You are pedestalizing her, and imbuing her with more value than she should really have. There are no such things as unicorns. Every girl falls along a spectrum of highly slutty to not very slutty. But they all have their moments. I'm certain you would absolutely shocked at what some "wholesome conservative" girls are hiding in their closets. Don't sh!t yourself.

If you continue pedestalizing women and valuing them more than they've earned, you will continue running into these issues.

No woman should be special to you until she's proven that she's special to you. No woman should be viewed as long-term potential until she's proven that she's long-term potential. No woman is able to prove either, until you've been in a relationship with her. You haven't. You've been on 4 dates with her, and failed to escalate them out of of the friend zone. You know absolutely NOTHING about her or who she is as a dating partner.

True true but can't I respond very very slow? Like day two days to respond instead of 2 hours? This is probably something that should be done with all women?

Why, to play some dumb mind game with her? Just respond with a one-word answer, maybe with an exclamation point to communicate that it's friendly and not butthurt.

Her: where did you take this pic?
You: Central Park!

That's it. And if a woman texts you asking a question, and you want anything to do with her, never take more than a day to respond. 3-4 hours tops. Taking your time doesn't mean being rude. No one is ever too busy to take 5 seconds and answer a text.

 

[Sebastian0001]

She will drop her panties 'like that' for the right guy. She will show up to a date with a nice guy looking for "long term potential" like yourself, and excuse herself to the bathroom to wipe off that dude's *** dripping down her thigh. Believe it.

This is your problem, right here. You are pedestalizing her, and imbuing her with more value than she should really have. There are no such things as unicorns. Every girl falls along a spectrum of highly slutty to not very slutty. But they all have their moments. I'm certain you would absolutely shocked at what some "wholesome conservative" girls are hiding in their closets. Don't sh!t yourself.

If you continue pedestalizing women and valuing them more than they've earned, you will continue running into these issues.

No woman should be special to you until she's proven that she's special to you. No woman should be viewed as long-term potential until she's proven that she's long-term potential. No woman is able to prove either, until you've been in a relationship with her. You haven't. You've been on 4 dates with her, and failed to escalate them out of of the friend zone. You know absolutely NOTHING about her or who she is as a dating partner.


Why, to play some dumb mind game with her? Just respond with a one-word answer, maybe with an exclamation point to communicate that it's friendly and not butthurt.

Her: where did you take this pic?
You: Central Park!

That's it. And if a woman texts you asking a question, and you want anything to do with her, never take more than a day to respond. 3-4 hours tops. Taking your time doesn't mean being rude. No one is ever too busy to take 5 seconds and answer a text.

ok ur def. right on the 2nd one so i followed ur advice. The first one i don't know man. Then why are there so many women who are virgins until marriage? Or ones who are really truly in love with their bf but ask to wait for sex until marriage? I think women have a little bit more control on abstaining from sex than men do. I am sure they want it as much as men, especially when the right guy is with her, but they don't always just go for it like that. This girl I am talking to is a virgin so that whole drop panties and wipe off *** has not happened for the first 36 years of her life so why is going to happen now?

 

[derby1]

Shouldn't she have to work a little to get me back

My man, you need to get a grip here, allow me to explain.

When a woman flirts with a man, it kind of makes us feel good, we go full on Beta and we start viewing her as a retirement package. This is because the dating scene isnt rigged in our favour,

A mediocre 3 with poor behaviour has more date offers in a day, than you would experience in a lifetime for being an accomplished 7.

This woman does not give a solitary f*ck about you, 99% of men are totally invisible to women. the only time you become visible, is after laying down some serious D. she will want to usually exchange sex for commitment.

you cannot pull macho man respect tactics on women you havent laid down the D

 

[Sebastian0001]

My man, you need to get a grip here, allow me to explain.

When a woman flirts with a man, it kind of makes us feel good, we go full on Beta and we start viewing her as a retirement package. This is because the dating scene isnt rigged in our favour,

A mediocre 3 with poor behaviour has more date offers in a day, than you would experience in a lifetime for being an accomplished 7.

This woman does not give a solitary f*ck about you, 99% of men are totally invisible to women. the only time you become visible, is after laying down some serious D. she will want to usually exchange sex for commitment.

you cannot pull macho man respect tactics on women you havent laid down the D

lol, seriously D as in sex? or just general intimacy? Not sure what u mean by that exactly? And remember i screwed up in the first few dates and didn't escalate which means it will be harder for me this time around to turn it around since there could still be elements of friend in her head. So i have to be extra attentive on my escalation game this time around.

so, u think i should just invite her over for dinner and work it? Do u think my apartment issue is a problem?

 

[rjc149]

ok ur def. right on the 2nd one so i followed ur advice. The first one i don't know man. Then why are there so many women who are virgins until marriage? Or ones who are really truly in love with their bf but ask to wait for sex until marriage? I think women have a little bit more control on abstaining from sex than men do. I am sure they want it as much as men, especially when the right guy is with her, but they don't always just go for it like that. This girl I am talking to is a virgin so that whole drop panties and wipe off *** has not happened for the first 36 years of her life so why is going to happen now?

You’re right, a 36 year old virgin is likely not going to suddenly start being promiscuous. In fact she’s probably so hung up about sex that she’s going to make you endlessly wait, and endlessly prove yourself to her, that you’re the perfect guy and it’s the perfect moment.

So you should probably have some other irons in the fire.

 

[zinc4]

lol so ur saying just run back? Doesn't that make me cheap? Shouldn't she have to work a little to get me back? I kind of want to drive her crazy by ignoring her, reply slow, show a little interest but maker her want more and then get her to the point where she just straight up asks for it. She said that friends thing just a few days ago. Now she is being ignored and seeing that I am having a great and fun life without her on Instagram.

And I do like your idea though about brining her over for dinner and then going for it again. The one slight issue (and this is an issue I would like to solve for all women going forward) is that I live in a very expensive real estate market and so my apartment building is not medium priced and thus not very impressive. The landlord doesn't maintain it well, there is chipped paint everywhere, old utilities, trash not always removed timely. So, I am kind of embarrassed by this. And she lives in a little bit cheaper area so her place is really nice and all brand new. So, what to do? I kind of feel embarrassed to bring her (and other women too) over because of this.

Run back?

No not at all. It's like deer hunting. She walked back into your scope just barely enough to go for 1 more ****.

Stop putting so much thought and effort into her. Try to get her to your place if she declines next her. Just go for the lay.

If she wants a public date though just dont even reply.

Ideally you should have multiple options lined up each week/weekend so if one or 2 fail then it is not a big deal.

Start looking at it from a more detached numbers perspective. And don't let your ego or fear of failure get in your way.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Run back?

No not at all. It's like deer hunting. She walked back into your scope just barely enough to go for 1 more ****.

Stop putting so much thought and effort into her. Try to get her to your place if she declines next her. Just go for the lay.

If she wants a public date though just dont even reply.

Ideally you should have multiple options lined up each week/weekend so if one or 2 fail then it is not a big deal.

Start looking at it from a more detached numbers perspective. And don't let your ego or fear of failure get in your way.

well all she did was put a comment on my instagram post asking where i was? I'm not even sure that is yet walking back into my scope? And how in the world can anyone get one or 2 dates every weekend, especially right now with the pandemic? From where exactly do you expect me to get these dates? Online dating? There are not a lot of events going on right with lots of ppl and everyone is wearing masks too on top of that. So, I would LOVE to hear from what source you are getting 2 dates per weekend?