Interesting article -whats wrong with American society raising boys

[mateo_g]

Barbarians and Wimps

I'm sure this will spark some debate, which is good, but the writer makes some very strong points as to the decline of proper methods to help boys become men and not total wimps or jerks.

 

[elvis aint dead yet]

While I agree with some things said in that article, the main point is, why should men treat women any differently?

Women want equal rights and have fought for it. So they now are out in the "real" world fighting with other men for jobs, homes, careers, school, and so on. Why should a man let his guard down when a women will stab him in the back for the same position.


We can't be like our fathers, grandfathers or great grandfathers. IT's a different time.

On another note, I was raise by a strong father. He was a military father and if i did something wrong, all my mother had to say to me and my brother was "i'm telling your father." And let me tell you, me and my brother would disappear for days if we could.

What I see today, men and women, is that they are raised by parents who want to be more best friends then parents.

I dated a younger women who had a younger brother. I could not believe the things he said to his parents. He'd curse at them, he'd tell them to F off and basically, he'd get away with it.

And the sad fact is, I see this everyday in stores, malls, and grocery stores. Kids are controlling their parents, not the other way around.

So either there are going to be many barbaric men and women or many wimps who live at home when they are 30 or 40.

How do you change this? who knows, maybe parents should start being parents again. Maybe some people should just not have kids at all. Sad to say, but when MISSY has 2 kids already and can't afford to pay for their food, why is she pregnant again? That is just plain stupid. Maybe mean, but some people shouldn't have kids.

Neglegent mothers need to be punished and deadbeat fathers need to be punished.

Kids need to be punished.

it's called responsibility. If nobody accepts it, then how can we change?

 

[squirrels]

This article owns.

It seems to encapsulate many of the popular ideas on this site. (I was reminded of Pook's article talking about having too much vs not enough testosterone, and of the movie Fight Club)

Elvis, I agree, people don't take responsibility in this day and age. Everyone wants to blame someone else (or everyone else--AKA "society") for everything that's wrong in their lives. The women becoming less feminine, that's happening too. But that's the other side of the "imbalance." Seems like we're all becoming either barbaric or androgynous.

The world would be a better place if more people stopped trying to control everyone else and just grabbed hold of their OWN lives. Took responsibility for themselves. There are too few examples of that now, and the media doesn't report on THEM, because they have no "shock value."

 

[THA REALNESS]

The reason wimps become wimps is because men are taught to be "men"and do what they have to do..(hmmm i wonder who came up with that)


Instead of doing what feels right to them."Boys will be Boys" turned into " I think little Billy needs Anger Managment" .

Energetic boys where sent to little league now... they're sent to the psychiartrist.

Boys kissing girls " bird and bees" and not it's restraining orders and sexual harrasment .

Kids used to stand up to Bullys ,nowadays they wait till they graduate college ,get a job,marry a model "and show them"(lol)

A thug meant criminal ,now it means "real man" and so and so on..

Even in ****ing GUY TV and Movies are super- femenized acting like a regurlar joe is wrong look at " American PIE" they acted like Stiffler was from another Planet or some sh1t .

Fathers and men in general are to blame ,however. We should know better .We need to lead by example ,and we need to teach our young ones how to be boys again how to trust their instincts and make their own decisions.

We need to stop falling victims to what women and the media want us to be and then maybe our kids can be proud of being men once again cuz right now it's passe to even have a penis.

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

Mateo, elvis, squirrels, and tha realness -- all great posts you each brought up many valid points and how true they are!!!

The children are messed up because the parents that have them are messed uo in the head - and mentally void, and spiritually dead! The men have become women and the women have become men - and such become their children. Whatever values that dominate society today come from the parents - meaning no or very little values, because the parents don't have the time or the inclination to raise their own seed. They just want to make money and have sex and be entertained 24/7 - fulfilling their physical desires but totally neglect the spiritual element in their lives.

Parents are delinquent in their duties because the so-called family structure is not valued and respected as it should and must be. Sad to say many of the topics discussed here contribute and reinforce this negative trend. Sex outside of marriage contributing to out of wedlock births, teenage pregnancy, no father in the household, parents hating each other – they just wanted to have sex and not have a child.

The dramatic rise in sex outside of marriage since the late 60’s during the so-called sexual revolution, and the women’s liberation movement has been the number one culprit of the destruction of the family. Fifty years ago wh@res didn’t have babies and the average woman had shame, or there was so few that society could absorbed them; however today, The average woman is a wh@re and these wh@res are having babies in vast numbers and have no shame in doing so, and actually their parents throw celebrations and give congratulations to them..

And when you ask who is the father, they start stammering because they don’t even know!!!! Or they say he is an ass-hole, no good bum, an abuser, or I don’t need him nor does my baby, but I’m sure in hell am going after his money! So you ask her, if he is all those horrible things that you claim, then why did you take your panties off and let him ravage you? Instead of saying I am a slut and a wh@re and I just wanted to feel “IT”, she says, ”he was nice the first week I met him, and then he changed.”

After no more than 6 months from the date the baby is born (they have to lose that weight first) they are out at the bars and clubs looking for sex with multiple partners, and lo and behold another wh@re baby. The Ho’s mother ends up raising the child in her absence, and the baby calls her grandma, ma! Father is not around partly because he is irresponsible but mainly it is because he doesn’t want to associate with the Ho that was just suppose to be a ‘fuvk buddy’ or sex girlfriend, and she has now turned out to be the mother of his child. The children are the ones that suffer, are they are left alone crying in t he wilderness. Don Juans, just remember, there are dire unintended consequences beside diseases, that are of the direct result of satisfying your sexual lusts.

 

[MetalFortress]

And for all DJs with young sons, it is your obligation to raise your son to be a MAN!

 

[Zircon]

Ok.

I sure agree with a lot that is said about men being wimps. The one thing that I associated with (unfortunately) was one of "needing" a girlfriend to affirm my importance as a person in this world. However, this is somewhat more complicated for me (as I suspect it may be for other people on this board) in that I had certain problems with my parents, which carried through to school etc. Coupled with social/media pressure ("I need a man who reaaaaally cares for me") it is easy to fall into this trap. You can say what you like, it doesn't matter who you are, to some extent you WILL be influenced by these factors. If you are not you are simply closed off to the world and living in your own fairytale which you created by being so goddamn stubborn.

What I don't like, is the fact that the author of this article uses women to be a base reference for men.

"For more than a decade I have been in a position to see young men in the making. As a Marine, college professor, and now principal of a K-12 charter school, I have deliberately tried to figure out whether the nation through its most important institutions of moral instruction—its families and schools—is turning boys into responsible young men. Young women, always the natural judges of the male character, say emphatically "No." In my experience, many young women are upset, but not about an elusive Prince Charming or even the shortage of "cute guys" around. Rather, they have very specific complaints against how they have been treated in shopping malls or on college campuses by immature and uncouth males, and even more pointed complaints against their boyfriends or other male acquaintances who fail to protect them."

Now this quote PISSES me off. I do not believe that only men are solely responsible for what has happened. I'm sure as hell that it is a fact that women have been liberated to such an extent that they now have an innate need to test and use their powers (any powers for that matter) just because this is their nature. Several women have recently tried power play with me, which I have summarily cut off. You can call this testing. Whatever. I call it being a b1tch. Different word, same meaning.

If you guys are stupid enough to let someone use a woman as a test for your manliness , go right ahead. You are doing exactly what she wants you to do, you dumbass gimps. They are doing EXACTLY what they have been doing in the past ("I need a man who reaaaaaaally cares for me"), and you end up supplicating on a different level.

Whichever way you look at it, you supplicated. You let a woman's needs/wants dictate what you are (supposedly a man), and you put your needs and wants aside to get lucky.

catch a wake up

 

[squirrels]

Let's not get too carried away trying to shift the blame off to women. Women's lib has had a profound effect on the male demographic, yes, but let's not forget that it was NEVER the woman's responsibility to make sure that a boy grows up learning how to be a MAN.

That is the FATHER'S role. The father doesn't even PLAY that much of a role in the family in traditional society...he's off making the money or fighting a war while the woman holds down the home front. But the MAN'S responsibility is to make sure the boy becomes a man. (playing catch, fixing/building stuff, manly outings, maybe teaching him to fight, stick up for himself, respect his elders, etc)

Families without fathers have contributed to the decline of that (as PRL said, the woman gets pregnant and then ditches the father except for his money, writing him off as a shmuck, so the kid learns that the man in his life is a shmuck and ends up growing up a little POS)

Sure, women are becoming less effeminate and more troubled as well. But that's not our responsibility or concern as men.

 

[Cage&Aquarium]

Originally posted by mateo_g
Barbarians and Wimps

Take that feminism!

But, seriously, though it made alot of good points, to go back to the way we once were we would have to strip women of their rights once again. So, we are really screwed no matter what we do, eh?

Well, at least I got the being a gentleman thing down.

 

[princelydeeds]

Originally posted by squirrels
Let's not get too carried away trying to shift the blame off to women. Women's lib has had a profound effect on the male demographic, yes, but let's not forget that it was NEVER the woman's responsibility to make sure that a boy grows up learning how to be a MAN.

That is the FATHER'S role. The father doesn't even PLAY that much of a role in the family in traditional society...he's off making the money or fighting a war while the woman holds down the home front. But the MAN'S responsibility is to make sure the boy becomes a man. (playing catch, fixing/building stuff, manly outings, maybe teaching him to fight, stick up for himself, respect his elders, etc)

Squirrels thats not entirely correct. I cannot think of a society in which all the men were always off at war. Only in the last 100-200 years did this off at work thing really take affect. TRaditionally men were there all the time, just as women were. When boys were old enough, they were side by side with their fathers at work.

Today, when a chick becomes a single mother society transforms her into some kind of victim. When in actuality she is solely responsible for choosing who knocked her up. Women (in modern society) choose men not the other way around. This board would not exist were this not a fact. Women need to be alot more responsible when they choose to have children. Women in todays society choose the worst possible mate then wonder why he is absent from their lives. I place the blame on women for making such poor choices.

If I loan someone my car and they wreck my car, the law and the insurance companies hold me accountable. With women, the man who caught a nut in the back seat of the car is the one who is held accountable when all he did was hold her body for a few moments. I'm not saying he should walk away without responsibilty, but I am saying women should not get pregnant from guys that aren't committed to them for the long haul.

Society has made it in a womans best interest to have as many children from as many people as possible. Just having 3 kids can bring a woman $1500+ tax free per month. That estimate is on the low end, I know plenty of guys who pay well over $600 per month for one child. Women make more money from child support than they ever did from welfare. The new welfare in this country is child support. When Clinton passed the welfare reform act of 96 out of wedlock birthrates sky rocketed in 97. In 97-98 out wedlock birthrates almost double in both the black and white american communities.

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

Squirrels correctamundo, if i had a son it is my responsibility to properly raise him and teach him as a father, however, with the father out of the household and the mother with the child who has a new man/pimp in the household every other month, this makes the task of rearing a child difficult, if not impossible for the father.

Let alone the child is constantly being reminded on a daily basis of how his father is no good and irresponsible, She is upset and has become bitter since the man bailed out of the so-called relationship. Because the ho knows that the man wasn’t interested in her because of her feminine characteristics and her worthiness, because she doesn’t possess such qualities, rather he treated her like the wh@re that she is and was just with her for sex. And hos want to be sexed –so he performed his duties!

She should be angry with herself for opening her tw@t to her pimps without any commitment or qualification. She knows guys are not going to stay with her long because why buy the cow when you could get the milk for free! Men's natural propensity is to pursue his prey and it is up his prey to make the decision of whether he is worthy of such attention - so the ultimate responsibility and blame for bringing forth rotten fruit is with the womb that houses the seed and bears its' fruit, since she is its'keeper!

Wh@res like sex but don’t like the responsibility that comes from it and now they are bitter because their ho lifestyle has been cramped and now must marry a decent ‘guy’ before she gets old – 27 years old about – and her beauty fades and can no longer entice pimps as well as her younger competition. So her life is in turmoil and she must exact revenge on the guy whose sperm put her in this condition, so she makes life as difficult as possible for the father- emotionally, mentally, and financially speaking.

I shudder sometimes, just thinking about such a thing, and how I could have been living this nightmare for the last 20 years – arguing on a weekly basis with my baby’s mama and giving her 25% of my hard earned money. This is just one reason I say no to hos! I’ve been luckier than most of the dudes I know!.

Sorry, I kinda went off-track there. I said all that to say this – the negativity the child hears everyday from his mother concerning his father, makes it an uphill battle winning over the love and respect of his child because the mother ho has intentionally put thoughts in the child’s head to purposely strain the relationship between the two. Wh@res are very selfish individuals, and they put their own happiness and well-being over their child’s!!

You have to understand how these devious wh@res think - she puts her own sadistic and selfish concerns and personal desires as having a higher priority than the personal development and welfare of her child'. That is why she has sex with dudes every week while her children are in the other room by themselves watching TV, and why she is at the bars and clubs finding her next pimp to sex her and leaves her child with another 12 y/o child to baby-sit., and why most of the money from child support is spent on her personal entertainment and necessities and not on the child’s welfare – she takes glee in the fact that she squanders the money and lives partially on the baby’s daddy dole, and then mocks him for doing so! Say no to hos!!!!

 

[squirrels]

I'm still of the mind that birth control should be government-regulated and you should need a license to bring a child into the world. Would solve a lot of problems.

I mean, to adopt a kid you have to go through an extensive screening process with social workers to insure that you're "worthy." Why should natural-born kids get screwed over with whatever they end up with? If you have to qualify as a good parent to adopt, why not to conceive?

 

[elvis aint dead yet]

While I agree with what PRL has said, there just are too many people in this world, MALE and FEMALE, who plain and simple, should not be having babies.

While in most cases the mother will get custody of the kid while the man pays child support, there just are too many instances where both the Mother and Father abandon the kid.

Too many deadbeat fathers in the world.

Too many Mothers, as PRL said, who go out and find another man every week.

While the kid grows up thinking his mother is a "*****" and his daddy is a deadbeat Stranger.

It's become to easy for people to just get up, go, and move on while the kids suffer.

 

[Jin]

ok... instead of focusing on the problem gentlmen.. let us work together toward a solution...

a start is choosing a person of quality. We all know how hard it is to find a woman of quality these days... all the more important now because of their rarity.

And we must accept responsibilty for our actions... one of the hallmarks of a man. If you take the risk of not wearing a condom... guess what... you'd better be prepared to support and raise that kid as a father and as a man. Own up to your actions and take responsibility...

another is to watch how we behave toward women and to other people in general. I see a large trend now to claim to be a "thug" and act overly macho... this,
in my opinion, is utterly stupid and ridiculous... a thug is a violent criminal with no thought for other people... who the f*ck wants to be like that!? Learn how to talk in a coherent manner and stop claiming to be the "baddest mofo" on the planet. Let your actions and results of your work speak for themselves. A man is only valued by society when he producing or providing something useful.

Don't "holler" at women... grab your balls, be a man, and walk straight up to her and introduce yourself.... "hollering" at a girl just means you lack the cajones to actually talk fact to face with her and with respect.

please feel free to add to the list of solutions for the positive advancement of men today.

Best,

Jin

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

Squirrels - this is what the nazis wanted to do - I don't have to have devils and wicked people dictating to me of what my divine responsibility is...God already told me what to do! I'll be damned if I follow a man's law to procreation over God's commandment - be fruitful and multiply!!!

Jin - I've been on this site for two months and I have been giving DJ's the solution but they don't want solutions, they want pvssy, and most of these cats get burned or disrespected in the process. My above post gave the only infallible solution.

 

[ShortTimer]

Originally posted by elvis aint dead yet
While I agree with some things said in that article, the main point is, why should men treat women any differently?

Women want equal rights and have fought for it. So they now are out in the "real" world fighting with other men for jobs, homes, careers, school, and so on. Why should a man let his guard down when a women will stab him in the back for the same position.

We can't be like our fathers, grandfathers or great grandfathers. IT's a different time.

Exactly!

The 60's happened, they are equal now, women need to suck it up and take it like a man.