Infinite Improvement [Journal]

[yuppaz]

Okay, I see what you mean by offensive jokes. I'm notorious on those. I say things like that just kidding, but sometimes joking around about something means that you were actually thinking it in your mind. But, I wasn't trying to be a douche or nothing. :l I actually made an approach recently and I pretty much down-talked her style of clothing and she got pretty upset with me. She didn't openly express her anger, but her voice got very stern. I backed off when I realized that. :woo:

The girl that was into me, I am not exactly into her... She's cool, but she is super girly-girl (this does NOT mean feminine) and she would probably piss me off, time provided. I probably led her on and she will hate me when she realizes that I actually don't want anything serious.

But onto my latest approach
So I was walking back to the apartment and I decided to walk through the centre, saw this girl sitting in the chair, just chillin', looking bored. I sat across from her and acted like I was going through my phone. I looked up and asked her:

FBN: Hey, can I ask you a question? Do you think it is okay to wear your halloween costume the weekend AFTER halloween?
girl: Yeah, I am going to
FBN: Really? What were you?
girl: *I don't remember*
FBN: Cool, where did you go to?
girl: [Insert club name]
FBN: Nice, do you go out a lot?
girl: Well kind of, not really. There was a time I went out 4 weeks in a row and there's been times where I was a homebody.
FBN: Hah, same here, but it's been kind of dry for me lately. You're cool, what's your name?
girl: *Let's just call her "DY"*

(We continue to talk about classes, strict parents, this and that, then she brought up dancing)

FBN: You don't know how to dance!? Here stand up.
DY: Okay

(So in the middle of the centre, I take both of her hands and guide her steps for about 30 secs to a minute. I then ended it with a spin)

FBN: And it's that simple!
DY: That's awesome! haha
FBN: I'd hate to keep you from class, but it would be great to talk to you again some time. Lemme get your number.
DY: Okay, sure xxxxxxxxx
FBN: Cool, I'll shoot you a text so you'll have my number too.
DY: Okay, I am probably going out this weekend, I could invite you.
FBN: That's what's up, I'll see you later then. *I go in for the hug, but she GOES FOR THE UNDERHOOK*

(I stop her mid-hug and she was like "haha, awkward!" and I was like "no no, I made a vow to always go underhook!" So we hugged and I positioned my arm in the small of her back and held her close for a good extra second)

~~~

It looks like she was giving me short answers by reading the text alone, but she was locking eyes with me and giving me her full attention which is always a sign of interest/respect.
She seemed very interested in me, I feel pretty confident that this will turn into something concrete. I used to feel pressured into getting a girl's number, but what's the point if she is just going to flake or not reply? To anyone reading, I don't ever number close unless I know she is feeling me. No point in getting risky numbers. I'm not going to text her until friday, I don't want to annoy the hell out of her by trying to "increase" her IL by constantly texting her.

Lessons Learned

• Show your interest the moment you meet her, not through texts.
• Seriously, show your interest the moment you meet her. It's sad when I see guys ask a girl for her number when they said less than 5 words to her before that. You really think women are THAT easy? Refer to this analogy:
  
  
• Use the kino! When she got up to dance with me, she shown no sign of hesitation. A great way to filter out the interested from the non.

"Hi, you're cute. Why don't you give me your number?"
Come on, show more personality than that.

Your Gettin it! Keep going!

 

[macallik]

2nded. Good approach broski

 

[Fly By Night]

Well doing a couple cold approaches and I'm still getting eventual shutdowns:

One:
I went up behind a girl (probably not a good thing...) and said "Hey there!" She looked at me, a little hesitant and said hey back. I said "So, just curious... who's the lucky guy?" She laughed, but it was a very nervous laugh and asked, "What do you mean lucky guy?" and gave me a weirded out look. I said "Shall I put it in plain English for you?" She then said "uhhh no". So I just said "Okay, nevermind then." then turned around and walked away. Apparently her friend was behind her because she laughed with her and starting talking and bs. Not afraid of rejection, but the spread of bad word about me. :l

Two:
Literally 30 seconds after the last approach, I went up behind her (again...) and said
FBN: "Hey what's up? My name's Fly By Night, what's yours?"
RG: (blah blah blah) *She looked a little interested*
FBN: "Gonna sound awkward, but I thought you were cute and wanted to say hey to you"
RG: "Aw thank you"
FBN: "So what year are you...blah blah blah [insert about 2 minutes of small talk, I grabbed her # during it]"
...
FBN: "Do you work out? You seem in shape" *I hold out my hand to go for a spin and she rejects it*
RG: "Sorry no... just no" *She starts walking away*

Got the number, but didn't get kino. Not going to contact her... Even in the cafe she pretended to not know me. At least I don't have to put up with her.

Three:
Sorry, eye contact just does not happen often enough to get practice in. The next approach starts by coming up behind her again. I said she had a cool backpack and we end up making small talk for about 7ish minutes. She ends up asking for my number. There was no kino... but, she said that we could chill sometime. We texted over a span of 2 hours and then I ended it. She went back home over the weekend but texted her about 2 hours ago and I still have no reply so... flake? Sigh, but I guess I shouldn't be expecting much without getting an initial IOI?

Four:
I came up to a girl (from the side) and asked if she just hopped out the pool. (She had wet hair) She laughed and said she just took a shower. I joked about how it would be weird to swim in this cold weather, and asked for the name. I shook her hand after the handshake, but held onto her hand and she laughed almost LIKE SHE KNEW ABOUT PUAS. She called me cute and asked if this is HOW I PICK UP WOMEN. I then said, "How are you supposed to do it then?" She then said "You're okay, you're good." and laughed. At the door to class I told her to wait a minute, but she did not stop and said "It was nice to meet you." and walked off.

I know I told her to wait with a loud enough voice so that wasn't the problem. Just another uninterested chick.

Five:
The girl who said she gave me a "fake" number (Let's call her KR, since she will probably pop up again in this journal) saw me in public then came up and started talking to me. She said we was free this week, but then I text her afterwards asking if she is free today or tomorrow and all of a sudden MY FRIEND I HAVEN'T SEEN IN FOREVER and I MIGHT BE GOING HOME TOMORROW and the other usual bs I hear. I was getting kino off her around the waist and pulling her into me and she let me do it. I'm confused.

I'm half wanting to text her and say "If we're never going to hang out, just say so." Now this wouldn't be the first time I showed her blatant negative signs. I'll put up the full text history later because I have to go to a study group now.

DJ's have lives too, we don't just hit on girls day-in, day-out.

 

[Fly By Night]

So I erased the history of the initial texting between me and her and I went NC because I didn't like her behavior after sending me apologetic texts. But she saw me at the library then started texting me.

Sorry, it's kind of long but the text convo between me and KR went like this:

KR: "U at the library?"
FBN: "Maybe"
KR: "U on the 5th floor?"
FBN: "Maybe..."
KR: "U a couple tables away from me?"
FBN: "There's too many people in the library to tell"
KR: "are you wearing [describes my outfit]"
FBN: "Ur obviously stalking me."
KR: "Come join us" *her and her friend at their table*

*Normally to any woman I would oblige and come join her, but this chick was rude to me in person and I wanted to see her actually chase*

FBN: "I like my spot, you join me"
KR: "but I like our spot better!"

*I didn't respond to this because I knew it would be a back and forth thing, so I just continued studying*

She ends up walking to my table and we talk about bland things and she says stuff about me having imaginary friends after she finds out that I'm an IT major and she never sees me with people. She probably perceives me as a loser, but whatever. I said she should study with me, but she said her friend was not going to move. I told her "Well you certainly have a dilemma on your hands now, don't you?" She ends up going back to her friend, figures.

I left without saying bye to her. And some time later:

KR: "Way to not say bye"
FBN: "Way to call my friends imaginary and not study with me"
KR: "U denied our invitation!"
FBN: "I would like to see some compliance frm u for once"
KR: "I dont like the sound of that"
FBN: "I dont like the sound of THAT. You seem to always want your way"
KR: "It sounds controlling"
FBN: "U think I like to be controlled? And you didn't read the last 2 words"
KR: "For once?"
FBN: "Exactly, how is it control if you never really done anything for me once?"
KR: "When have I not been compliant?"

*I then went into detail about every small time she refused to do-LOL JK JK*

FBN: "Tell me when you have."
KR: "There was never a time that i had to"
FBN: "I can... the fact that you cant is kind of scary lol"
KR: "Okay sorry about that one time I said no to the handshake but what else?"
FBN: "IDK KR, im not a psychologist. I dont sit around and examine people's behavior"
KR: "Well damn... its like that?"

*Didn't want there to be some hard feelings so I tried to ease the situation up*

FBN: "Hey now... I can tell theres a lot of miscommunication b/w us especially because we mostly talk thru texts..."
KR: "Yeah, I'm a sarcastic person, and I usually joke around about things. but im going to bed, night"

Sooo yeah. That's what happened. :l

Self-Analysis
I was kind of upset with her because of her initial attitude towards me. The handshake thing happened when we were walking to the gym and I asked for her hand and she just said no. I asked why and she just kept saying no, so I pretty much went iron-wall NC: Stopped making EC, didn't wait for her to get out the locker room, worked out in another part of the gym. But, keep in mind I didn't overreact, I saw her out of the corner of my eye behind me, I walked slower so she could catch up and SHE TRIED TO STAY BEHIND ME. (as if hoping I don't turn around to see her) So when she said no to that, I pretty much did not want to keep trying. It was after that incident that she started apologizing to me by text.

It's a weird situation. Part of me just wants to finally go all out NC to filter her out as uninterested, BUT THE THING IS, when I'm with her, she talks to me and lets me put my arm around her. (but didn't escalate) It makes me think whether I should persist or just stop it here. Honestly, my gut is telling me that I should give it one more pull, but all the flaky signs are telling me otherwise. My ego is strong enough, I can handle getting rejected, but I don't know if I can handle giving up a shot just because it seemed improbable...

OR MAYBE SHE IS JUST STRINGING ME ALONG FOR HER ATTENTION FIX?

I should probably next this b!tch

 

[Aristippus]

"OR MAYBE SHE IS JUST STRINGING ME ALONG FOR HER ATTENTION FIX?

I should probably next this b!tch"

Yes. She is stringing you along just for the attention. She's stringing you along at your expense and only when it is convenient for her. Look at it like this. She saw you in the library and simply texted you because it was convenient FOR HER.

Women that want you will bend over backwards to spend time with you. Realize that everything doesn't have to be an issue. If you choose not to go out of your way to spend time with her, then just simply don't spend time with her. If you wanted to handle the situation gracefully, you could have simply gone over to say hello and chat for a few minutes and then return to your table and continue studying.

There was no need to whine about lack of compliance or the fact that she wants things her way. Simply do things your way. Let your actions say that you're doing things your way and she can either follow or she can do her own thing. There was no need to whine or complain about her not shaking your hand back when you first met. Everything doesn't have to be you trying to prove a point. You don't have to make things like this an issue. You simply fade away and gradually disappear by simply either keeping your conversations brief or by ignoring her text messages or phone calls.

NEVER put too much importance or value on a woman's affections. Do not devalue yourself by complaining if a woman chooses to withhold her friendship or affections. It simply means she has low interest and isn't worth your time. You simply walk away. If she tries to call you or text you, simply ignore it. Don't argue. Ignore.

Have you ever had a woman that wasn't interested simply ignore your calls or messages? You can do the same thing to women who are a waste of your time. Let me tell you a little story about a "failure" from my past. Although I don't see it as a failure. I was working with this girl. She was very friendly with me at work. And with everyone. So anyway, although I avoided dating women I work with, I wanted to befriend her.

Did part of me secretly think it might be nice if something happened? Yes. But also, the part of me that is stronger said you don't date co-workers. Anyway, I had her phone number. I figured if nothing else just being friends with an attractive girl that i worked with would be good enough. I called her one time. No response. I called a second time maybe a week later. No response. After that I decided not to call her any more. But I just acted normal at work and never mentioned that I called her. I treated her the same as always. The same way I treated all my co-workers. Friendly, sometimes joking and having fun.

About a month later she calls me. But the reason she called was because she wanted something. She wanted a favor. My response?
She said "Hi. It's _____. How are you? blah blah. Could you do X for me?"

Me: "No. Sorry, I can't. Good luck though. Bye."

I think she wanted me to either fill in for her at work or do some silly favor for her. I can't remember exactly what it was. I was simply friendly and then calmly said "No." when she asked me to do a favor. But the only time she called me was when she wanted something and I don't play that game. If you don't want to spend time with me as a friend, don't think you can just call me up when you need something and I'll jump.

She never called me again. You know why? Because the only interest she had in calling me was to get something FROM me. When I wouldn't be her little man-b!tch like other guys, she didn't bother calling me again. She had NO INTEREST in me as a friend. Her only interest was in what I could DO for her. I called this a "failure" simply because most men here equate a success story with getting a woman to go crazy over you. But in my mind, this was a HUGE SUCCESS because I didn't waste my time and energy on someone who simply didn't care about me.

Like I said, I was always friendly and handled everything calmly. Never mentioned anything after the fact or complained. I simply didn't beg for attention or allow myself to be used. I didn't HAVE to ask for compliance. I simply chose not to deal with women, no, not just women, but PEOPLE with low interest. This goes way beyond just women. I realized that this applied to male friends. I also realized recently that this applies also to the job market and to business.

I would say 90% + of the time, whenever I was on a job search and got hired, the employer immediately showed signs of high interest in hiring me. I applied. Then called. They called back promptly, and we scheduled an interview quickly, and I was hired. It's always easier to find people who already want what you have or appreciate what you bring to the table than to try to convince someone that doesn't appreciate what you bring to the table.

It's about 100 times easier. I think your problems could be avoided altogether if you do a few things.

1) WEED OUT THE WOMEN WITH LOW INTEREST QUICKLY.

2) MOVE FORWARD SMOOTHLY WITH WOMEN WHO HAVE HIGH INTEREST.

3) FOCUS MORE ON THOROUGHNESS THAN SPEED. SPEED WILL COME WITH SKILL, BUT SKILL COMES FROM BEING THOROUGH AND NOT RUSHING.

4) LEARN AND MASTER THE EASY STUFF FIRST.


Learn how to meet women where it's easier to meet them. Think parties and social gatherings. Think night clubs or groups where people share a common interest < a philosophy group or a dance class or something where people are expected to be social >. There's no urgent need to learn how to pick up random women walking by on the street. You could go your entire life not walking up to random women on the street and have as much sex as you'd ever want. Once you've succeeded in the easier venues, if you desire to later, you could learn to do this. It's what I would consider a totally unnecessary, but advanced skill.

Get back to basics. Read and re-read the things that have opened your eyes and that really help you get the right mindset. MASTER THE BASICS. And above all, don't waste your time with uninterested women.

p.s. I hear people on here say "spin plates". They're talking about having many women. I say do something better than juggling women. Be passionate about life. Enjoy the simple pleasures. Enjoy your friends. Enjoy your interests. Enjoy goofing off. Enjoy pursuing your professional goals. Enjoy your family. Enjoy physical activity. Enjoy reading. Enjoy being with people. Enjoy your alone time. Enjoy new experiences. Enjoy old experiences. Enjoy the peace of mind of not dealing with drama.

Enjoy being friends with women. Enjoy kissing women. Enjoy going home with them. Or enjoy when you weed one out who isn't worth your time. If you only get a hug, enjoy it. If you get a kiss, enjoy it. Make your standards for behavior for yourself and for others high. Worship these standards as if they were living gods. Be a man of your word. Be a good man and expect nothing less than a good woman (or women). Let THESE things be your so-called "plates". Then women will have very little power over you. You already have dozens of things that you enjoy. And dozens that are important to you. THESE are the real "plates".

Spin them over and over until you get dizzy. And keep spinning them. Then when a woman says "I can't hang out tonight." You can honestly say "That's fine. We'll do it another time.". But maybe on the inside of your head you're saying "COOL! Now I can go watch that movie I've been wanting to see!" or "Great! Now I can go visit my friend and we can go out and have a few drinks!" Or "Great! Now I can hang out here and read or meditate.". Now you're in a place where every possible outcome leads to success because the definition of success has changed completely, according to YOUR wishes.

 

[Fly By Night]

Well I am back home for Thanksgiving break, so I won't be having too much female encounters for a while. So while I'm here I might as well do another:

Observation

1. Initial eye contact - Seems to be a biggie for me. This is probably a reflection on my inner confidence and how relaxed I am with people on a deeper level than conversation. This goes beyond game because I am able to speak to virtually anyone, but apparently it agitates my nerves to make nothing but eye contact with them. I suppose nothing but exposure therapy will be the fix to this. I will make a mini boot camp this break to make eye contact with people (both genders).

2. Weeding out uninterested women - The last encounter I had seemed to show that I failed to weed out an uninterested chick. I guess my eagerness to have some success affected my process of elimination. This goes back to the first item where women would give me eye contact meant they WANTED me to approach them. At the time I didn't because I was focused on getting better with EC, but who knows how easy they will let it be if I did... I've been raised with a "nothing good comes easy" mentality, so I feel like if a woman makes it too easy for me, she's no good or easy to all guys. It's probably a different ball game in this case and I should take the opportunity as it arises from now on.

3. My appearance - I read up on GLL's site, and it says that Looks, Style, and Social Freedom is what makes you attractive to women. I've been working on social freedom for a while and I've been keeping myself above par on looks. Only thing left is style, which I must admit I've been neglecting. I also thought about it from another perspective: Wouldn't I find a woman dressed up well more attractive than that same woman in sweatpants and a hoodie? I remember some guy (who is also black at my school) who wears really upscale stuff. I'm talking designer looking jacket, dress shirts, khakis, and dress shoes EVERY DAY. Then I notice he's at a table with all white chicks, all giving him attention and sneaking him some light kino. I think the stuff he wears is what homosexuals might wear... It just doesn't look... Masculine. It seems to be getting him some attention either way. I'm going to hit up some stores while I'm back home.

 

[Fly By Night]

Kinda messed this one up, but it's all good.

I went to an administrative technology meeting and I was just chillin' with some guys there listening to a speech and there was a cute photographer standing in the front. I thought, "Meh, let's practice some eye contact." So I was pretty much subtly sneaking in EC at her with a smirk on my face. It was weird because she would make direct EC with me for about 1 second then look away. Then she would continue to avoid my eyes and I would look away to break the tension, but I would eventually look back to lock eyes with her for another 1-2 seconds.

After the speech, we were outside and I was talking to her. There was a raffle and she said that I might win, I told her that she should just give me the shirt now, she then told me the winner was not even going to be chosen that day, I told her to send me it, she said she'll drop it off at my place or just end up wearing it herself, I said she is going to have to come to my place and take the shirt off... and do my laundry.

Then I went into the basement because some guys wanted me to help clean up. I come back and she is talking to this other guy and he would not leave. Then my friends wanted to leave so I left with them.

Observation
I like my friends, I really do. But sometimes I just want to tell them just go ahead while I hit on this chick. But being afcs themselves, they would not understand or be as encouraging for me to go for it. One day one of them said "Dude, you should call that girl a s1ut. Who cares? It's not like you had a chance with her." That's NOT the kind of energy I want to be surrounded by.

Lessons Learned

• Focus - I need to engage a girl as much as I can. I think Arist said it before that I should get as far as possible with a girl as I can. It feels like when I learn a new thing to remember, I forget something before it. Focus also means that if I want to hit on a girl, I can't let my friends be an excuse for me to pu**y out.
• Increase Confidence - I think another big reason why I didn't continue talking to her way because we were in a room full of people giving me attention. At the time, I was half talking to her and half talking to people around us. I don't know why I felt uneasy flirting in public, but I should start getting over that.

 

[Aristippus]

Fly,

Yeah. Go as far as comfortably possible with that particular girl at that particular moment. As far as is comfortably possible at that moment could be simply getting or giving your number, it could simply be friendly conversational touch and then an invitation to get together some time.

I have to clarify something. You always give a woman room to pursue you while at the same time encouraging her. How would you do this? I'll give you an example from my past. At one point I was considering getting together with a girl I worked with. I changed my mind later because she had a boyfriend. But anyway, at the time I didn't know. So I thought, well, I can offer my number and if she's interested she'll either call me or she'll offer her number right away.

So we were having fun conversation and talking about places we enjoy going and then I said "We'll have to get together some time. Let me give you my number.". Then I simply gave her my number without asking for hers. She gave me hers without me asking after she put mine in her phone. You can create opportunities for a woman to pursue you if she's interested. One way is by offering your number and then if she's interested, she'll call or offer hers.

You can do this with touch as well. You can be minimal with touch during conversation and then wait for her to come to you and initiate conversational touch. Then you can do the same. A little bit of touch to reciprocate. At some point you can gradually move a few inches closer and then just stay put and see if she does. You want to inch forward and then slowly wait and observe if she reacts favorably and begins initiating. Always leave room for her to close the gap. That way she can pursue you.

 

[Fly By Night]

Yeah, I should give them the chance to reciprocate. When I went to dance class, I ended up dancing with this girl for 3 songs straight, then she pretty much asked to stop dancing then pursued other guys. I pretty much ignored her since because I'm sure she's put me in the creepy guy category, or something similar.

For a while now, I've been cutting down on the woman approach thing and focused on improving myself. Got nicer looking clothes and spending more time in the library, I actually found some surprising things. One day in the library, I was wearing a blue polo, khakis, and converse-looking nikes, and I was just minding my own business and this girl walked up to me and asked if I was using a chair that was at my table. I told her no and she took it and walked away. Now, there were other chairs available that no one was using... She was opening me? lol Too bad, she was kind of cute, but I was sort of coming down from my approach mode.

Another time in the cafe, I was just walking around wearing a fitted hoodie and jeans (btw, I wear this hoodie a lot) and this girl stopped me to ask where I got my hoodie from. I joked around about how it is more expensive than it should be and then that was it. If she was opening me or not, she sort of let the conversation drop so I didn't continue it. I guess the way you present yourself really makes a difference.

Observation
So a friend, LP, and I went to study earlier today and we were going to meet another one of my friends. It was pretty interesting when we arrived because the guy we went to meet up with (let's call him broseph, lol) came in and introduced himself to LP in a classy manner, then did not pay her any extra attention from there on. He then continued to joke around and be a funny, cool guy (as he normally is) with his roommates.
So I'm just there observing and I notice how LP was giving him subtle attention. Normally LP would be giving me most of her attention, but it was all gone during this time. Broseph was just being a lively guy and every time he started to speak, LP would look up and pay him attention. We were not even in a group talking, I'm saying like he would be in the kitchen when we were in the living room and she would look over her shoulder at him, almost hoping that he was talking to her. I then remembered someone say that "A woman decides if she wants to eff you within the first 3 seconds of meeting you" I guess broseph made a very good first impression and was just portraying himself in the best light. Then he finally got around to ask her about her major and such, and LP was trying so hard to keep the convo going... it was surprising to say the least. But she eventually lost interest because he mentioned his gf and he wasn't escalating with her, LP then continued to throw kino in my direction.

Ridiculous. I'm not mad that she's giving other guys attention, but at how fast she switched to and fro. Just ridiculous.

EDIT: So she texted me the next day asking a question about class and she ends up to be in the library with my friend and now they are inviting me AFTER they already met up. We normally all agree to meet at the same time when I call them up, now they just decided to forget about me until they need help with a problem.

It's kind of shady.

 

[Fly By Night]

Wow, I haven't updated this thing in a while. Makes sense since I've been on break. I haven't been working out as much since I am away from my school's gym and I feel like it's taking a toll on my confidence, I haven't been making eye contact as easily as when I was at school. Probably just a mental block. As of currently, I am reading the SS Hall of Fame to read up on some fundamentals and seeing if I am approaching things the wrong way.

Before I left to come back home, 3 events took place. I "made love" to my plate who shall now be known as T*, went on a "date" with LP and her friend, and went to a party (with T* there).

I'm not going to explain the first one because I would practically be writing an erotica novel on here.

The second one, I was not going to explain, but I just want to point out that some guys will scowl their faces at the thought of going on a date with a girl and her friend. I thought that wanting a date completely alone with her would seem needy (she invited me out so I couldn't just kick her friend out of the picture). Apparently, her friend was "critiquing" me and sizing me up to see if I was a good catch. I do not feel threatened by the thought of some chick wanting to size me up for her friend. Or was that because I don't exactly have high IL for her? When I told them I hated disney movies, she was all like "Awww, you were doing great until you said that." But, I stayed by my word and didn't change how I felt about them. I think it worked out for me since I wasn't debasing myself to appeal to them. LP still contacts me up to today, so no she did not lose interest because I didn't do the alpha thing and blow off her until I get alone time with her.

But this update was mainly posted for the party
So this new chick I was talking to, lets call her LE, seems interested in me. She has went out of her way to walk an extra couple blocks to my apartment even if she had to walk an extra distance to get to her place. We met when I happened to be walking right next to her on the street and another girl I knew, knew her then said hi to both of us and asked if we both knew each other. She walked off, then I just used that as an opener LOL! (THE ADVANTAGE OF HAVING FEMALE FRIENDS?) She was very receptive, and very sexy. (cute face, fat a**, fat tits, generous curves) Now the thing was that, I did not actively seek her out, but I was just showing her good signs of IOI's like eye contact and physical closeness and she seemed to like it. This happened on and off for about 3 weeks wherever we ran into each other.

Fast forward to the party at the end of those 3 weeks
At the party, I was with T*, but she was whisked away by random guys for dances. This made me a little jealous on the inside, I'm not going to lie, but I reminded myself that we are not in a relationship so I have no right to be jealous. I then found LE there and there was some guy pretty much following her around like a little lapdog. I went up to her and gave her a big hug and joked around with her. I kept it moving so to not end up appearing like her lapdog. Later that night, the DJ played that mega-popular korean dance song. I happened to run into her when this song started, so we started doing it side by side having a great time. That guy was STILL following her not making any moves lmao! :crackup: But I felt kind of bad for him. When the song changed to a pop song, I danced up behind her and she started grinding back into me. I kept it controlled for the most part, all I ended up doing to her was guiding her hips, massaging her thighs, and putting my head near her's. We went for 2 songs, then I kept it moving.

I think I got full of myself by trying too hard to show scarcity. Because I danced with T* and she started making out with me. It lasted about 5 minutes so LE could have seen me with her. I looked for LE after that, but she was nowhere to be found. :l

Could that guy have finally made a move on her? I doubt it, he looked super nervous and only danced when I started dancing with her. I used to hate it when guys call themselves Mr. Steal-your-girl, now it looks like I became that guy that night.

Afterthought
LE definitely has high interest in me, but after that night she might think I'm taken or lost interest because I shown more to another girl. I haven't seen her around because I was busy and could not go to the meetings that she shows up to. I feel like a douche typing this but she is hotter than my current plate in every aspect EXCEPT PERSONALITY (I don't know her well enough to say I like her personality). I think T* has the LTR mentality that I look for.

Just wanted to post that overdue field report.

 

[Fly By Night]

First week of school over, so I went out as a refresher. I went to a party and drank a little and danced. It was a freakin' sausage fest in there, so I just chatted some girls up. I got 2 dances, and each one was not even that great. They both halfheartedly danced then just walk away after a minute or so. I then slow up to talk to one chick and we end up talking for about 10 minutes. The quick summary: She gave me BS reasons to not dance, when she does, it was another half-assed attempt, dances with another guy, then insults me at the end of the night.

During the talk, she said she was reserved from guys because of bad relationships. I think I should start taking this one as a red flag because every girl who's ever said that to me never ends up in my favor. I start saying that not every guy is the same.

She's trying to be all friendly and when I make a move, she starts to put her hands up as if she's getting ready to shove me off her. Never a good sign

I ease up off her in order to let her come back to me, but she didn't really reopen me, she just stayed next to me. I leave somewhere else and come back. She's dancing with some other guy... [sarcasm] cool [/sarcasm]

At this point, I was kind of pissed at her and said to her after her dance, "I bet you're having fun now." and she just laughed and then danced with me. Then the party started to end and she was like "You're really sensitive". She said it in a real b!tchy tone too. I pulled her in closer and said, "oh so you want me to be more other other guys?" "Uh, no, you're too sensitive to be like them." After she said that, I was pretty much done with her, but that word kept spinning in my head when I got back home. These past few months I thought I had the most insensitive attitude towards women, I guess I still don't truly have it yet. But, forget it. I kind of failed hard when I didn't screen her out early, though.

She seemed cool when I was talking to her, but at the last minute, when the party was about to end, she 180's and becomes a straight up b!tch.

 

[Fly By Night]

So the other day, LP invited me to lunch. We ate and she talked about 90% of the time and I was just inputting my responses here are there. She then goes around and says that she has never seen my apartment before. (I knew where this was going) I don't think I like her like a plate, but she is obviously interested in me.

FBN: "I never had a reason to, haha".
LP: "You've seen my room before, that's no fair, I wanna see it!"
FBN: "You sure? I mean don't you have class?"
LP: "In two hours, I'll have time"
FBN: "Okie dokie"

So we get to my place and she says she actually has to do some homework. So I just get on the xbox while she worked. I was kind of confused to why she came to my place then not do anything, but she finished up in about 30 minutes. I offered her a tour around and we end up in my room. I had no idea what to do from there to escalate, partly because she seems to be setting me up to be a bf before effing, so I just showed her random stuff like putting some of my hats on her, etc. She then laid down on my bed so I sit on her lap and talk about what I do for fun. She then started trying to tickle me and then we go into an all out tickle fight. The time in between, I'm picking her up while grabbing her ass, my face is in her boobs, but I'm playing it off like I was doing it by accident. She was putting her face in mine as if to make out, but I didn't let that happen. I would imagine a lot of "what are we?" questions to follow suit. We then stopped and she went to class.

She was shouting and laughing during the whole time, so when we were done, my roommate was like "dude... do you have another hook up?" I just laughed. :crackup:


First Number of the Semester
This approach was really direct for my own taste, but sometimes you just got to be honest with what you want.

Saw this chick walking and she had a nice set of legs, but I couldn't see anything else because of her coat. I caught up to her as she walked through the door into a building.

FBN: "hey!"
*She sort of glances back and turns back around, I think she thought that I said hey to someone else*
FBN: "Hey, I was trying to stop you."
Her: "Oh hey, sorry about that."
*I didn't have anything slick to say, so compliment opener incoming*
FBN: "I just wanted to say... You look great in that outfit."
Her: "Oh, thank you."
FBN: "Where you heading off to?"
Her: "Personality"
FBN: "What?"
Her: *She said something that I still did not hear, personality class??*
FBN: "Oh, okay cool. Are you late or something?"
Her: "Yeah class is about to start like... right now"
*Time constraint, no time to "game", might as well go for the close already*
*I stopped her and said...*
FBN: "Okay I didn't want you to be late for class so real quick, what's your name?" *extending hand out*
Her: "Ann" *smiling and shaking my hand*
FBN: "Hey Ann, I'm Fly By Night, if you're not too busy, we could go out for dinner sometime" *displaying my nicest smile*
Ann: "Maybe." *displaying her own nice smile*
FBN: "Great, why don't you gimme your number. We'll talk first. I have to get to know you before I can go out with you... make sure you're not crazy, haha"
Ann: "Haha, that's a smart idea. My number is ---"
FBN: "Cool, I'll let you get to class now, cya!"
Ann: "Cya!"

After writing that down and reading it in text it sounds like she might not be that excited about me, but she seemed to be attracted to me in person. When she said "maybe" it was more of a shy maybe, like she didn't want to just say yeah. I ran out of things to say when I decided to go direct, so I just brought up dinner even though I don't really want a dinner date. But it's whatever.

I had about 5 approaches before this, but I never closed them because I sensed low interest. Another approach I just chickened out of like a little b!tch, I asked her for the time and she told me it and even stood there for an extra second after I said thanks, as if she was waiting for me to continue talking to her. :l

 

[ARrocket]

Nice approach man, very well done. She gave the number up pretty easily so she at least found you attractive. Just don't take too long to hit her up!

 

[Fly By Night]

Texted her this evening, this is what happened:

FBN:Whats up Ann? Its FBN
Ann:Hey!
FBN:mb if I made you late to class, what you up to?
Ann:lol its fine, im getting rdy to hang with some friends
FBN:staying in or girls night out?
Ann:were not sure, probably staying in
FBN:Cool, if you did go out, you couldve seduced me with another one of ur outfits lol. do you go out a lot?
*^my lame attempt at a sexual innuendo*
Ann:Kind of, do you?
FBN:Here and there. are you what people call a "partier"? not that it matters to me, just curious
Ann:in some aspects. i just turned 21 not too long ago, and i kind of slowed it down
FBN:Slowing down after 21? thats cool, u hanging with ur friends for the whole weekend?
Annrobably, what are you up to?
FBN:Nothin really, hw and anything else that comes up. If you were free, we coulda hung out.
Ann:so what's your story anyway? do you normally pick up girls on campus on their way to class?
*Woah! Fastball! :nervous: *
FBN:Only when they look like you lol, whats YOUR story?
Ann:I just had some chips... thats pretty exciting.
FBN: Nice

*Then I just stopped texting because it was getting late*

Good? Bad? I don't really know, she did not answer my hang out proposal, but then again I didn't really ask straight forward. She instead starts accusing me of being a PUA, just shows that this generation of men are expected to be ashamed of their sexuality.

I think I might wait until the weekend's over and ask her out for something during the week. I can't remember the last time I got past this phase of meeting a girl... I can get numbers, but I just can't get past the phone games...

Reflection
If I'm not mistaken, women who are interested in you would want to flirt back to you over the phone, right? How come every time I text girls, it's like they always try to reject me. Are women even attracted to guys anymore?

 

[saturnalia]

can`t you live your life without posting everything here?

who are you, that people should be curious about your daily issues

we all got them, all the 7 billion people out there got them, why can`t you live your life without the compulsion of fervouros posting?

 

[AAAgent]

Saturn,

That's your narrow minded way of thinking. Most people post here to log their history of attempts and learn from their own mistakes. Logging their posts in a public journal also allows other forum members to provide criticism and advice to improve. It's a bit different then leaving all your memories in your head and hoping that you can regurgitate them all repeatedly for constructive learning when you'll probably forget the majority of the tidbits.

Many times, people have faults that they don't realize or don't understand how to fix (social awkwardness). Having an unbiased opinion who can pinpoint that and perhaps provide a solution is a whole lot better than ramming at a wall with a failed routine.

@FBN

The conversation seemed too forced on your part. Seems like you were attempting to draw her interest by being funny and sexual but IMO i don't think it worked too much. I'm horrible with text game as well haha and i know it. I just went on a blind date with a girl who told me i'm a cold tester and she didn't know if i was interested (i'm extremely flirty and talkative in person at times).

I realized everytime a girl throws out a questions that has the potential to make me look like a player, *******, etc. I diffuse it with a serious statement, then follow it up with a laugh (not a joke). They usually don't ask it again as the serious statement kind of throws it off.

I would stop trying to build attraction/forcing it through text. Just talk to them casually and slowly get to know them and let them know it, throw in a few jokes, setup a date. Keep enough info about yourself hidden so you can actually talk about that stuff during the date.

 

[ARrocket]

I agree with AAAgent. It sounds forced, like you're trying too hard.

I'd give it a D+ as far as text game goes

Next time, don't ask her all these questions; 'are you a partier', 'do you go out a lot,' etc. Too much. Just tell her you're going to be at [insert bar here] tonight and she should come out.

saturnalia GTFO!

 

[Fly By Night]

@saturnalia
I was thinking I should put EVERYTHING in this journal, but I realized that it would be pretty pointless since most of your guys would not care/know how to help. If you noticed, I've only been posting about women here, but I've been doing other things like hitting the gym, schoolwork, and web design. If I took your advice from the start, I probably would not have had the experiences I had in this journal, I would still be telling myself there's still one "special" girl out there for me who'll run into my arms one day.

@AAAgent
Yeah, after re-reading my texts I was asking too many questions. I was trying to keep the convo going just long enough so she doesn't think I was being a player and rushing her to meet up... but that didn't work lmao! I thought it would have been appropriate since we only talked in person for like 1 minute.

@ARocket
Lol, my text game was that bad? I mean I could've been super direct, but I even told her in person that I would get to know her first before going out. Wouldn't it be really incongruent if I did the opposite of that?

 

[Aristippus]

Here's a pretty basic example of how to set up a time to meet with a woman:

"Hey, how are you?" "I'm doing ok. How are you?" "I'm fine. Just figured I'd call to see how you're doing." "Do you always pick up girls walking to class?" "You looked friendly so I figured that I'd go talk to you. Anyway, I wanted to see if you'd like to get together later on this week at __________."

Nothing fancy here. Nothing witty. Just be friendly and to the point. And NO TEXTING!!!!!! You're screwing up by texting. Yes, I know, there are a few guys that will say "I meet and have sex with women all of the time through text." Yeah. I know. And occasionally you see a person with six fingers and six toes.

Text messages do not force you to learn conversation skills and to think quickly. They don't teach you to overcome call anxiety. It slows down the learning process and is a crutch. It's just another barrier that depersonalizes you. She might send messages to some of her friends, but they became her friends through in-person interactions and/or conversations. Besides, you want to be different. Or do you want to be another one of her girlfriends? And the men who text her all of the time and compliment her all of the time could fall into the category of her girlfriends. They aren't going to see any action.

Understand, I'm not contradicting my past discussions where I say you set up situations where she can pursue you. But it is more of a dance. A dance where you have to lead and then create the opening where she feels comfortable moving in on you. It is MUTUAL ATTRACTION, versus one-sided efforts on the part of the man. My personal approach is, you lead the interaction, where you will meet and when, and then you allow her to initiate some physical contact and then you simply reciprocate. Then it's back and forth. You both initiate. It might be 50/50 or 40/60..... where the lower number represents how much you reciprocate. The equal or higher number represents how much she initiates touch. I might not be describing this perfectly, but I do have a clear idea, a clear image in my head, of how the interaction will look and feel.

*** Back to my original point. You could make your plans something low-risk and low time investment. This is for YOUR sake, not hers. What if she turns out to be really boring or a dud? What if she is annoying? Meet somewhere where you can bail out on her or cut the interaction short without seeming rude if you start to realize that she has nothing going for her other than her looks or if you both just don't click when you meet.

Low-risk to me means day time. And it means something like meeting at a coffee shop (if you don't like coffee, order hot chocolate or tea) or something that is NOT dinner. Something where you can leave early or if you both really click, you can extend the time you spend together. It could be meeting at a pastry shop or for dessert somewhere. It's more casual and low pressure. It also isn't as cliche as the dinner date. The dinner date is pretty routine, and it sets up all kinds of pressures and expectations. It's also a drain on a man's wallet for a woman who hasn't even clearly displayed her interest in him.

I'd suggest to stop using the word "date" though. I don't use it and only mentioned a dinner "date" so it would pull up all of the imagery and associations that are typical for a man and woman who go out to dinner. Get the word "date" out of your vocabulary. Just meet women, enjoy spending time with them, and let them reel you in. Trust me, it's a lot more fun than "dates". After you've been with a woman long-term for a while, you can sometimes call a night out a "date" just to spice things up. Like you're re-living the time when you first met.

This is a little game you can play once in a while to keep the passion in an existing relationship. But for meeting new women, I suggest throwing that word into the garbage. You don't even know if you like these women yet, so how can you take a woman on a date who:

1) You don't know.
2) Might be annoying.
3) Even if she isn't annoying, she could have low interest and be a colossal waste of time and effort.
4) Could have weird hang-ups or issues. Meaning you might stop it before anything starts.
5) etc, etc, fill in the blank.

Finally, on compliments. Use compliments sparingly and vary them. Don't keep repeating how good she looks, especially to new women. It's a tired, old, overdone approach and you're only one of millions, no, I'd say billions, of men who use this approach. You complimented her once on her looks when you first got her number. No need to repeat a compliment on her looks on the phone.

The right compliment at the right time can make a woman feel wonderful and sexy. Overuse of compliments and compliments that aren't special and too common are either annoying or old hat. Sometimes it isn't even whether or not the compliment is about looks. It's about how you deliver the compliment. Most men do it like every other man. Wrong compliment, wrong time. But compliments aren't your main tool anyway. Alright. This has gotten a bit long. Hope this helps. Take care!

 

[Fly By Night]

Thanks for the advice. I need to stop trying to act like Mr. Smooth all the time and be more direct. I got a few things to fall through this past couple of days.

My guys threw a party and I was invited. We were having a good time and one of them asked if I wanted to invite LP. I was like "why not?" I invited her and picked her up. Long story short: We danced, started making out, party ended and we stayed there to continue making out when everyone else left/went to sleep. Of course, like I knew this was going to happen, she started asking me if I liked her more than just a friend. I told her she was cool, but I didn't think I wanted a relationship at the moment. She said she understood. When I saw her today, she actually had hickeys on her neck from that night LOL. Her parents are supposed to visit her this weekend, hopefully they clear up before then.

As for Ann, I took your advice as closely as I could Arist. It went down like this:
FBN: Hey Stranger
Ann: Whats up??
FBN: nm, finishing up my work. thought Id see how ur doing
Ann: Well thanks what are you studying
FBN: mobile apps, ive been pretty busy, but id like to see if we could meet up on thursday, something quick in the afternoon
Ann: im free after -:--
FBN: Cool, meet at --- at -:--
Ann: Sure
FBN: Cya then

So I have a date so far, hopefully she doesn't flake.

So if this week goes by as planned, I will have 3 plates :woo: :crazy: