I'm not a loser, but I might as well be one...

[Nobeard]

I have a lot going for myself. I genuinely like who I am, I feel like I can tell a good joke, hold decent conversation, am in good shape. Yet I seem to fail with women, and although I like my life and am very optimistic. I feel that having a mate or at least the options of mates is very important to being emotionally balanced and to avoid depression.

So my problem is something I don't even understand. It's as if I can't make an action with women. Or I don't know how to talk to them into leading into sexual attraction...

It doesn't mean that I don't have girls who like me or find me attractive. For instance, there's this girl in one of my college classes. I find her attractive and would like to get to know her.

I think she feels the same way. I actually know she does, almost like a fact. Yet I can't formulate the right way to make a move on her. Even if it seems simple, I just can't seem to do it. I know its not that I am incapable, I just don't have that skill naturally.

I know she likes me... it seems so easy. For instance, its a relaxation course on relieving stress. She got to touch my arms at one point to give me a massage and she turned bright red (I do karate and have pretty firm arms). She also has flirted with me very verbally saying that my massage on her was great and she also needlessly touches me when we are picking up our papers. Ha its a funny class we also got to rub ourselves on each other back to back which I noticed she enjoyed. (I did too, her ass felt like a ripe peach)

To make things even more interesting I noticed that this other guy was hitting on her that she really didn't react much to. She is friendly with him but she is not nearly as physical with him as she is with me... The reason I bring this up because for some reason this seems like a complication to me. It's like its in my nature to not want to start a conflict, which doesn't seem very masculine or dominant.

But its not fear of being weak or being unable to defend myself if a conflict did happen with this guy. Its more of a social fear. I often think how different my life or this situation could have been 1000 years ago. In a time when I man could just smash on any other man without getting arrested, I would have no qualms of just beating the **** out of any suitor or man that got in my way. Not that I am overly aggressive or want to bring unneeded violence into this world, that's not my point.

I just find it ridiculous that I am not afraid of pain, fighting, or most of life. Yet social situations involving a girl make me want to just ignore them or it makes me unable to make a move. I just kind of stay vanilla and never push the envelope. I don't freeze up like a deer, I just do nothing to make progress in getting to know the girl in front of me.

I mean it goes to show that even if you feel or look like a tiger, if you don't use your claws or teeth, you might as well have just born a ***** cat on some level lol.

So why the problem? Whats keeping me back. I haven't been here in a long while so I am mostly just rambling and needed a place to do it, but I would like any comments.

I would also like to end this on a positive note because I am only 21 and will never stop bettering myself. I am going to nip this in the butt one day, and hey I have that class with her tonight, so I'm going for making that day today!

 

[st_99]

most likely you are putting females on a big pedestal. you look at them
like they are goddess. you need to stop that sh*t. it takes time.

 

[Nobeard]

Yeah maybe, I don't feel like I worship them though. Even if I did, I think I would probably get more results treating them like goddesses rather than just ignoring them like I do. I think I am just afraid of being socially open with women in a open setting. It's more of a what others around me might think type of thing and when I have randomly got with girls the few times in my life, I have always kept their interest...

You got me thinking... I guess I have always felt this way since elementary school and its never really went away. Its like back then in elementary school relationships were taboo or as young kids they are perceived that way. I think I have been dodging this for so long that I still feel like what I am doing is taboo. Probably why having another dude in the equation even up's the stakes for me because I feel a sense of peer pressure that has nothing to do with the girl. Well, the girl makes me anxious too but only because getting close to her would be soooo obvious to everyone else in the room and that bothers me for some reason.

 

[st_99]

Yeah maybe, I don't feel like I worship them though. Even if I did, I think I would probably get more results treating them like goddesses rather than just ignoring them like I do. .

IMO you are ignoring them because you you have fear. So why do you have fear? I mean, you want to bang them so what is holding you back from pursuing?

Well, you are scared because you DO put them on a pedestal. You fear rejection because you think you are beneath a pretty girl. That is the essense of pedestalization.

If your friend told you to go up to some fat chick and try to get her number as a joke you probably wouldn't feel all that scared about it and if she shot you down you'd probably laugh and say to yourself "this blimp can't be serious, lol" it does not appear you have this mindset with the pretty ones but you ought to.

 

[iwanttofight]

I know what you mean exactly. Survival of the Fittest. Im actually a pro mma fighter and lived and trained with some of the best fighters on this planet. Ive trained two to three times a day for the past 10 years to become a human weapon. I used to think on the same lines as you, i would say things to myself like "screw that guy, i would kick his azz". This attitude gets you know where in life. I have the complete different approach to life now. I talk with everybody, and try to get to know them, and maybe become friends with them. But people know deap down I would fukkk them up, probably because I have cauliflower ears and some visible scars from previous stiches. Just relax and respect women bro and they will respect you. Don't put them on a pedestool. Remember women want your approval, do you think they take 2 hrs to do their hair and makeup, get dressed up, to go to some lame azz bar for the hell of it, hell nooooooooo there trying to look good to pick up dudes. That's my mentality and im sticking to it

 

[Nicholas]

Hi bud. I find myself in very, very similar situation. Even that thing with that girl you have, not so long ago I was in exactly same situation... believe it or not.

I can't formulate the right way to make a move on her.

This. THIS! I'm looking at this now, and it seems to me that I've been searching for this 'formula' for eternity. There are a lot of right ways, but it seems that I've been trying to find a way that ensures me 100%, that there's no chance to fail. FEAR! You can deny it but in a lot of different, indirect ways it can mess up your logical thinking and acting. There's no perfect approach, perfect sentence to say...or if there is one, no way guy can presume all the factors, consider the situation and think of a PERFECT line in right time that can make chick jump on your huge penis and fvck you right there on the floor. We just have to give it a shot. You can think about it all day'n'night, analyse and calculate, all you gonna get is wasted effort and time. Putting pressure upon yourself and stressing about that stuff, no. Don't let it put you down.
Try to pass that mental barrier, and your mind might open up.

You can't become uber seductive without experience.
You can't convert passivity into activity without experience.
Experience is irreplaceble. You can't learn it. But you can get it AND it actually costs NOTHING.

 

[yuppaz]

From the outside, it looks like you are doing a couple things:

1. Putting WAY too much pressure on yourself to be perfect and not having any kind of rejection tarnish your image of yourself.

2. Not understanding the way that women work / think very well & how the dating world really is, because you simply haven't experienced it in the real world.

#1 - is a personal favorite of mine, because I am still working through this issue, although I am farther along in fixing it then you probably are. You think highly of yourself (which is GOOD), but on some level know that people's perceptions of you are wrong. You don't want to go and try something that fails, because THEN that possibility of the chink in your armor will become very real. At that point, you may try and look the fool, get rejected, be ACTUALLY tested for your value as a man and think you have come up short. Which would be DEVISTATING, LIFE ALTERING, A CLUSTER-F*CK of EPIC proportions!!!!!! AAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH. You may be a HUMAN instead of Mr. Wonderfull and you might even have FLAWS!!!!! OHHH M GGGGG

That is where you are wrong.

Your scared to go and lose because you have a strong, but possibly false image of who you THINK you are supposed to be in your eyes, in your peers eyes, in your families eyes. So you play it safe, maintain that image, and don't try to build the relationship / be tested because of a fear of losing that image of yourself.

But what you need to ask is "What is maintaining that (possibly false) image really worth"?

I would venture to guess that at the end of the day it hurts you more to try to keep it, then it does to actually put it to the test.... put yourself on the line and see what happens.
You may look like a total tool because you don't know what to do, but so f*cking WHAT? You take a hit to your ego, it get's knocked off it's peg and you actually find that there are things you need to actually work on in those interactions with women. You may fail 50 times and have some chick you flirt with stare at your c@ck and point and laugh histerically...but SO WHAT? At least you learn something about interacting with women as a man to a woman, vs. in some strange semi flirtatious platonic way. You need to stop letting the fear of losing the image of yourself get in the way of actually doing what you want to do (aka in this case start hitting on girls). Be ok with the fact that you know you are just learning and will make lots of mistakes along the way. If you are REALLY worried about it, meet women you don't see with your friends (if your worried about social issues later, which can be valid when you are this new to interacting with women).

Don't lose yourself in learning a bunch of pickup sh*t though, just get comfortable interacting man to woman, touching and lead things forward with the girl. Losing who you are when learing this stuff makes it cost a whole lot more emotionally then just being you and trying.

#2 - women want mens attention, they often date (A LOT FOR COLLEGE GIRLS) and they at that time F*CK A LOT OF GUYS). While your off worrying about whether or not she will hold your hand when you two first meet up, she is getting railed by 2 guys in the back of a van. They aren't little princesses bro, you need to start opening your eyes to that fact alone right now so you see that the silly things you worry about now (she touches me more then him etc. etc.) mean f*ck all. Move things forward with the girl and realize that she likely has or does ride a lot of c@ck (but she'll never admit to that openly...ever. Don't let that bother you too much though just enjoy it for what it is.