If you want to fight feminism, this is not the way

[Boilermaker]

So RooshV is one of the most influential "DJ"s of our times, agreed? And these days, for half of his leisurely time that is actually spent in trying to bang foreign (abroad US) women, the other half is spent for vilifying feminism and making grandiose statements about gender roles and equality. He is even spearheading a movement that seems to have its own lingo.

Unfortunately, when he formulates ideas like this:

http://www.rooshv.com/the-relationship-between-femininity-education

He not only makes a fool of himself; but also indirectly hurts the cause.

A lot of feminist (and well-educated) women picked this link up and they shred Roosh to pieces, on Reddit, their own blogs and everywhere else, while making a much bigger splash.

Whatever he has been trying to do is irreversibly damaged because you can't make idiotic excel graphs on a sunday afternoon and hope to be taken seriously.

I guess, those of you who happen to have more polarized views on the political aspects of Game will excuse us, the crowd who is basically trying to hone their skills to be able to get the women they want, for not participating in the brotherhood. I am doing PhD in EE, I play the piano, I am a ranked chess player; and honestly I have many, many other fulfilling interests than being an activist against feminism. And if the above post is what it is all about, thanks but no thanks... I just come here to read people like Zarky then.

And Roosh probably should stick to his field reports, instead of making a fool of himself.

 

[Warrior74]

http://youtu.be/j4Apdtq5Zwk

No worse than anything Roissy or anyone else has said before.

 

[Boilermaker]

Well maybe you're used to war,

but I am still trying to make sense of things.

I miss squirrels.

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?p=1850947#post1850947

 

[Jitterbug]

Whatever he has been trying to do is irreversibly damaged because you can't make idiotic excel graphs on a sunday afternoon and hope to be taken seriously.

Couldn't hurt to try.

All the feminist movers and shakers in history did the equivalent of writing idiotic essays on a weekend afternoon AND were taken seriously enough for some inexplicable reason.

How smart do you think "a woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle" sounded back then and now?

 

[Warrior74]

That woman who got outraged over his little post was ugly, she kinda proved his point. That entire thing was a great read. I don't think he made of a fool of himself at all. The chart (while being hyperbole) was amusing and the outrage was hilarious. Any woman who came to me complaining about this Roosh guy would have gotten laughed at. Especially if she fit the exact mold of what he was talking about like the chic he called ugly. Do you think that any guy who is serious about fighting feminism wants feminist to be comfortable while he fights it? LOOOOL. Are you kidding me right now? If Roosh is fighting feminism, then of course it will get ugly. How's the tired cliche go? First they ignore you, then they mock you.... I think we see what step Roosh is on. You can't fight polite battles can you?

A lot of feminist (and well-educated) women picked this link up and they shred Roosh to pieces, on Reddit, their own blogs and everywhere else, while making a much bigger splash.

This is how the word get's spread to other men. Men who never heard of Roosh and are white knighting or just curious to see what the women are upset about. Some might rail against him, look at his website, read one article or two and learn about game, the manosphere, the men's rights movement, the father's rights movement and then start to see things differently. Hell I didn't come looking for this, I came looking for father's custody rights and ended up finding all of this stuff that was sorta in the back of my mind but I had no frame of reference or voice to articulate it with. Any publicity...

* ninja edit * That being said. I personally would not have called her ugly online, because in real life I'm a polite person. I can be firm about what I believe and not insult people at the same time. And while I found his video to be amusing, it was amusing in a juvenile sort of way. It's not the road I would have taken but then being the "pickup artist guru/feminist fighter" is who Roosh is. It's not who I am. Still, I fail to see a way in which the men of the low and middle classes can fight feminism politely. It's like trying to fight for civil rights politely. Well the polite thing your enemy would like for you to do is to shut up and say nothing. You try to reason with your enemy, you try to amass an army, gain converts and force your enemy to change. Reasonable appeals to do not make anything change in this world.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Boilermaker,
Sure Roosh is becoming much more of a Rat Bag the longer he spends away from the States,and sure many of his posts are close to lunatic fringe.....However let us not throw out the Baby with the Bathwater,this guy has contributed a great deal to the ongoing fight against the FemiNazis...Say this for him,unlike so many,he is at least a genuine DJ!

 

[Burroughs]

comments from roosh youtube:

Also you could ask yourself why western men are this desperate ? because women has decided that no matter what, they will not settle for less than their dream guy..they would rather die a spinster and alone. Men are not really ready to make this sacrifice, therefore they try to make things happen..which totally inflates the ego of western women. And once it's been inflated, it can never deflate. This makes women go increasingly arrogant and vicious...many men give up and look elsewhere.

...or is it Western Girls that has so high standards that it's mind boggling? Even the ugly western women think they are hot and want a slim, sporty, wealthy Hugh Grant type. And they get it..because of the many desperate men who has zero pride in themselves.

Dating down has become a way of life for western men. But do you really think that this condition is healthy for either part ?
There should be a balance imo, and everybody would be happier.

 

[Boilermaker]

Dear Boilermaker,
Sure Roosh is becoming much more of a Rat Bag the longer he spends away from the States,and sure many of his posts are close to lunatic fringe.....However let us not throw out the Baby with the Bathwater,this guy has contributed a great deal to the ongoing fight against the FemiNazis...Say this for him,unlike so many,he is at least a genuine DJ!

Dear Scara,

Indeed he is. You are right that we can't write him off like that. Maybe it's because I can't see he's writing this tongue-in-cheek. He seems pretty serious about his claims. Why not stick to being a DJ, Roosh was another Mystery.. What happened to him?

That woman who got outraged over his little post was ugly, she kinda proved his point. That entire thing was a great read. I don't think he made of a fool of himself at all. The chart (while being hyperbole) was amusing and the outrage was hilarious. Any woman who came to me complaining about this Roosh guy would have gotten laughed at. Especially if she fit the exact mold of what he was talking about like the chic he called ugly. Do you think that any guy who is serious about fighting feminism wants feminist to be comfortable while he fights it? LOOOOL. Are you kidding me right now? If Roosh is fighting feminism, then of course it will get ugly. How's the tired cliche go? First they ignore you, then they mock you.... I think we see what step Roosh is on. You can't fight polite battles can you?

First they ignore you, then they mock you, wow, touché... I am floored, how did that line go?

I am not talking about polite, I am talking about plain stupid. You can't fight stupid wars either, now, can you? Roosh is the guy who's doing the mocking here, if you think about it. Being outright sexist; and hiding behind humor doesn't go far in anyone's mind. Doesn't look like he's joking at all. The genius looks like he's actually believing in what he's writing! I hope you are not taking this so seriously either. And all those half-beta;half-AFC recovering men who read the story in Reddit probably tilted over the other side as Roosh himself admitted later on. How do you so surely know how people react to it? Did you actually read what happened over Reddit or are you theorizing? You are just one guy who ended up over this side, who's counting the growing number of AFCs and White Knights on the other side? The guys who actually laughed at it were a bunch of roosh followers, while they were trampled by masses of feminists and white knights over at Reddit.

The original argument is very shallow and dangerously sexist. I don't laugh at it. I am not sexist (which is a subset of racism by the way) ,yet, I am not a beta, or a white knight either. Claiming proper gender roles and trying to get back at women through high-school humor are two gravely different things. It fuels the streo-type that is associated with our community: Macho-sexist bastards who are intimidated by educated women. Well done.

 

[evan12]

let admit , his diagram is realistic , the much woman engage in workforce the much she lose her femininity , for sure there is exception but in general this is the trend .
any one worked between lawyers , manager , sub-managers ( usually females whose opened their legs to managers ) know this fact

I used to not admit by these fact , but I think it is time for men to admit that women losing their femininity with feminism

 

[Boilermaker]

^
No the diagram isn't realistic. Again, I am yelling at you: How do you know the trend? , I hear this every day from a guy who has done real-life research for 30+ years at work who says this to my 20-something hour of concentrated work on a specific topic. When I see you guys talk about trends and stuff that you actually don't have an inkling of, I want to shout at the top of my lungs: HOW DO YOU KNOW?

Roosh writes himself:

Within any topic a person’s level of expertise will likely fall within three categories:

1. Expert Status
2. Familiarity
3. Unqualified

If I were to pick the topics that I’m an “expert” on, it would be game, American dating culture, and South American travel and dating culture. A conversation in any of those topics may have me teaching my audience some things since few others possess deeper experiences that match mine.

I’m familiar in a handful of other topics, but with those it’s not uncommon for someone to know substantially more than me. I would gladly defer to another man’s more superior grasp of the subject matter by expressing humility and an open mind.

I’m wholly unqualified to discuss things like monogamous relationships, maintaining a marriage, or sports. If those topics come up I completely shut my mouth and nod my head.

Ok, he admits that he isn't an expert in political science, anthropology, biology , genetics or any other field that he needs to have a working knowledge of, to make bombastic claims like those in his diagram.

So he must shut it up and become a traveller. We all enjoy him.

 

[Warrior74]

Dear Scara,

Indeed he is. You are right that we can't write him off like that. Maybe it's because I can't see he's writing this tongue-in-cheek. He seems pretty serious about his claims. Why not stick to being a DJ, Roosh was another Mystery.. What happened to him?



First they ignore you, then they mock you, wow, touché... I am floored, how did that line go?

I am not talking about polite, I am talking about plain stupid. You can't fight stupid wars either, now, can you? Roosh is the guy who's doing the mocking here, if you think about it. Being outright sexist; and hiding behind humor doesn't go far in anyone's mind. Doesn't look like he's joking at all. The genius looks like he's actually believing in what he's writing! I hope you are not taking this so seriously either. And all those half-beta;half-AFC recovering men who read the story in Reddit probably tilted over the other side as Roosh himself admitted later on. How do you so surely know how people react to it? Did you actually read what happened over Reddit or are you theorizing? You are just one guy who ended up over this side, who's counting the growing number of AFCs and White Knights on the other side? The guys who actually laughed at it were a bunch of roosh followers, while they were trampled by masses of feminists and white knights over at Reddit.

The original argument is very shallow and dangerously sexist. I don't laugh at it. I am not sexist (which is a subset of racism by the way) ,yet, I am not a beta, or a white knight either. Claiming proper gender roles and trying to get back at women through high-school humor are two gravely different things. It fuels the streo-type that is associated with our community: Macho-sexist bastards who are intimidated by educated women. Well done.

I'm a redditor,and yah I read the thread. But I also know reddit is full of virgin neckbeards that makes the main SS discussion forum look like Hugh Hefners diaries.

So to you, how many people respond in outrage counts huh? To the guerilla fighter and the underdog, it's how many people even notice that counts. I agree its shallow. It's Roosh. When has he ever been anything but shallow? His readership knows that. I would place no weight in anything roosh says other than about actual game. It's like when Roissy starts talking Human Bio Diversity and Politics or Race. I tune that shyt out.

Most guys, until they go through something drastic are gonna stay white knights and enablers. And most men who have woken up really don't give a crap what stereotype you think we fill, because we've gone out and we see what works. Why do you care what they think? That's my question to you. If you agree, agree. If not, don't. But to worry about how many people "trampled him" and "oh my what will they think of us" is lame.

So, what would you have him do? You've explained how it was stupid, now explain how to do it better. How would you "fight feminism", if you were Roosh?

 

[Boilermaker]

I'm a redditor,and yah I read the thread. But I also know reddit is full of virgin neckbeards that makes the main SS discussion forum look like Hugh Hefners diaries.

So to you, how many people respond in outrage counts huh? To the guerilla fighter and the underdog, it's how many people even notice that counts. I agree its shallow. It's Roosh. When has he ever been anything but shallow? His readership knows that. I would place no weight in anything roosh says other than about actual game. It's like when Roissy starts talking Human Bio Diversity and Politics or Race. I tune that shyt out.

OK - points taken, I am getting convinced by this.

So, what would you have him do? You've explained how it was stupid, now explain how to do it better. How would you "fight feminism", if you were Roosh?

I'm not sure. I wouldn't fight it probably. I wouldn't acknowledge it, and I'd occasionally joke along the lines of 'all those feminist chicks are ugly BTW'..
When he gears up and starts to talk like a professional; that's when it bothers me, and I tune out.

 

[Serg897]

Agree with the OP. Its an idiotic graph with zero basis in reality. Women can choose to be educated and still retain their femininity.

 

[Burroughs]

I'm not sure. I wouldn't fight it probably.

serious question...if you 'wouldn't fight it probably' why level criticism against Roosh? His graph pissed you off....why would it...assuming you're not a feminist she-beast with a PHD lol...Let Roosh do Roosh and you do you.

If you don't want to fight...then being critical is a less than a useless exercise. Why bother?

 

[Boilermaker]

His graph pissed me off simply because it is idiotic and undermining *MY* cause; by infuriating the "neutral" grounds as well.

I live on planet earth and I have to interact with women regularly. I may not be an activist myself because 1) I don't think the war should be fought like this and 2) It is easier for me to discard women who have more aggressive views than to correct them.

What did an old legend on this site used to say? Never try to fix a broken b!tch.

All the jabs, punches and acids thrown into the Feminist Cause are spreading the fire. We shall just be silent. And do our thing, being resilient.

and that's exactly what I am doing, doing my PhD silently, while I am regularly rewarding Feminine women; and ignoring un-feminine ones.

so yes, What Roosh does hurts me and my cause, because NOT engaging the beast directly is the way I choose to go about it. So I see myself entitled to criticize him; when he goes overboard with excel graphs he draws in airports.

Does it make sense?

Edit: Disgustipated, it's hurting my cause by making the notion of masculinity we defend here look shallow and ignorant. We like i) big boobs, ii) stupid women, iii) they'd better be waitresses and iv) submit to us unconditionally. Riiiight ... And what happens to the neutral side is , when they get to see Roosh, or Pick-up-Artists they develop preconceptions about this stuff. In short, it's tainting us and doing them a favor. If I was into conspiracies, I would think Roosh is doing this for a reason, but I won't go so far, this time.

Edit: Burroughs, you either didn't read me or I didn't explain it clearly. I am in this for obvious reasons as well. If all women disappeared or turned into blue sea monsters today, that would hurt me, too. Get it ? It's not like some saving the whales bullsh!t I am criticizing here. What he does by being stupid, indirectly affects my life and the future generations as well. I never said I had "no interest", I wouldn't have posted Roosh in the first place if I had no interest.

 

[disgustipated]

How is this undermining your cause if you're discarding those feminist type women? That is the only type of demo , women wise, that it offends mostly. You should be suffering zero repurcussions since you presumably screen these women out? Please elaborate if I'm mistaken.

I sorta agree in general with it. Regardless, its refreshing to see a guy stand by and defend something he says that is controversial and not back down for pc reasons. Good on him.

 

[Burroughs]

so yes, What Roosh does hurts me and my cause, because NOT engaging the beast directly is the way I choose to go about it. So I see myself entitled to criticize him; when he goes overboard with excel graphs he draws in airports.

Does it make sense?

not really....why get butthurt over a cause you have no interest in. Because it hurts you indirectly somehow because some 'feminists' talk about it on their sites....getting mad at people getting mad....thats some faggot sh!t right there.

 

[penkitten]

right now, if you are up to date on political media... there is some "feminism" that you should be aware of because it also regards you.
if certain laws are passed which take away a woman's right to birth control, then it also takes away men's rights to birth control.
many people are forgetting to step outside the box and look at the bigger picture.
sure the people putting this stuff up on the table are older married men who don't have to worry about knocking up some girl they barely know because they met her at a club somewhere. however, are they considering how it will affect their grandsons?
if women no longer were allowed to have birth control or abortions, how will that affect you personally?
i don't want to get into politics here, as it is a rule not to... and i don't want to get into it over moral thoughts either.
i just want you to be aware of what some women are fighting hardcore for right now... the ability to keep a job and insurance and have the right to use the birth control of their choice.
i ask you to remember when you choose someone to vote for, that you know how they will be using your vote. do you approve of how they will vote on this issue.

not all feminism is bad. this is one issue that no matter how you feel about any other fem' issue, you have to figure out where you stand.
the outcome affects everyone (except the old married guys putting it on the table because their wives are too old to get pregnant and they can't get their ****s up to play with anyone new)

 

[( . )( . )]

I must have missed the memo. When did we start giving a sh!t about pissing off ugly/fat femcunts?

I don't even understand OP's gripe, just read it and Roosh pretty much nailed it.

 

[Who Dares Win]

I mostly join Warrior's point of view when it comes of reading Roosh and other leaders of the manosphere however with all the honesty I have in myself I want to ask you guys:

Do you really think he is that wrong saying that the more a woman is educated and the less feminine and pleasable she is to deal with?

Let me elaborate first, Im not saying that women who wants for them something more than being a housewife are damaged good, what Im saying is that no matter her personality being in a liberal feminist environment like our universities would definitely damage any woman even worse if she study stuff like sociology,psychology or women studies which are mostly about that crap.

To that add that her ego will increase when she bvllsh1t herself into thinking that her degree makes her a catch as if she was a man and then it doesnt come too hard to realize she will have highter expectation, less acceptance of "being the woman" in a relation and the quality of her sh1t tests and games will grow esponentially from before.

That would be like denying that a man serving in the army for years would not be less pacifist than a man who does not.

What I can agree about with you is that a poor graph should not be used to describre more complicate issues since the whole info can be misunderstood or manipulated.