I was physically persistent with her.... Now she thinks I'm a SEXUAL PREDATOR.... wtf

[SMS 48]

OK, I'm going to be blunt right now and say I don't know what's going on anymore, and I need someone to tell me I'm not crazy here. But if she's right, tell me she's right. I need to know the truth...

Me and this girl have been flirting for a few weeks, and she never friendzoned me. In fact, she said she wants to meet up with me but she needs to "take a break from guys for a month" cause some dude hurt her or whatever so she can't meet up with me. So I was like OK....The next day she texts me at 9pm and asked if I'm home. I said yes, why? She said "wanted to stop by for a few minutes" I was like ok nice...

So she's over, we hang out, bullshyt, joke around, etc...

She takes my hand for me to lead her toward the door (there was mess on the floor and she had to step over it), then I go from that to pulling her hand/body close to me and kissed her.

She kissed back. I went in for another kiss, and she pulled back and she was like "I gotta go...." but she wasn't moving. So I figured she was playing hard to get, so I said OK kiss on the cheek, and kissed her on one cheek, then the other, then I went for the lips and she moved back again and kinda smiled, I think, or it at least appeared to be chill about it... She still wasn't moving away.

She still wasn't moving away from me. So I kissed her neck... and she just stood there and let me suck on her neck for a few seconds, which indicates she enjoyed it. Then she kinda moved back after a few seconds of me sucking on her neck, and said "I gotta go"... again. So I laughed, slapped her ass and said "get outta here." She started walking out and just looked back and in a joking manner said "you're crazy" before she walked out.

Today she texted me and said "I forgive you."

Me: Lol what? For what?

Her: For that attack

Me: You're messing with me right?

Her: Umm it wasn't very polite of you

I basically at this point told her how ridiculous it is to call that an attack. (Keep in mind I'm extremely disturbed/humiliated/angry at this point)

Her: I just didn't like how you kept holding onto me when I said no

Me: You said "I gotta go" not "no" and your arms were kinda around me too so I didn't know you were like "omg I'm being raped" in your head. This is beyond strange.

Her: And on top of that you grabbed my butt

At this point in a nutshell I told her listen, it was nice knowing you, but I don't see a reason why I should feel like I'm a sexual predator or something.... So take care.


My mind is full of fukk right now and I'm starting to doubt myself. I mean I know from experience that women are often resistant, and the man persists, and that's how it works, and its no big deal. Please tell me what you think. I'm very interesting in hearing an outside perspective of this.

Thanks in advance.

 

[LostAndConfused]

Duuuude

Stop playing into her frame. I pull alot of those same moves when girls show resistance, and they usually work. It seems like they worked for you too,

"You're crazy" ==> "You excite me." GOOD :thumbsup:

You possibly screwed up the second you played into her frame saying "You're messing with me right?" I think calling your moves an "attack" is a test. You got her riled up and she wants to see if you can stay congruent afterwards.

Although nice recovery at the end. You pulled a nice next move, and there's a chance she hits you up in the future.

 

[Scars]

shes got another man, probably the guy who hurt her is talking to her again. she was sucking validation from you and when you finally made a move you seemed like a creep. just ignore her. a real creep would stalk her. just ignore her, and if anyone gives you **** just tell them you had the balls to make a move and got shut down. anyone who hits on a girl she isnt interested in is deemed a "creep". girls know this. your rep isnt tainted, trust me. just relax and forget about it.

 

[Iceberg]

Hahahaaaaa

Why did you take it down the serious path? Oh my god. Why?

Today she texted me and said "I forgive you."

Me: Lol what? For what?

Her: For that attack

Me: You're messing with me right?

Her: Umm it wasn't very polite of you

All you had to say was, "You attacked me. I was trying to fight you off the whole time."

Then everyone has a laugh, and you plan the next meeting.

She made a comment (probably sarcastically) and you got defensive and killed the moment. Jesus, buddy. She was just f**king with you.

 

[SMS 48]

Hahahaaaaa

Why did you take it down the serious path? Oh my god. Why?



All you had to say was, "You attacked me. I was trying to fight you off the whole time."

Then everyone has a laugh, and you plan the next meeting.

She made a comment (probably sarcastically) and you got defensive and killed the moment. Jesus, buddy. She was just f**king with you.

No, she wasn't kidding. She texted me every morning with a "good morning" besides this morning (a day after the event).

I probably should have mentioned she's an Indian American (not Native American) and is very sheltered, culturally.

Maybe you're right, and I fukked up by letting her "control the frame" as the other guy put it, but I do believe she was 100% serious....

 

[SMS 48]

shes got another man, probably the guy who hurt her is talking to her again. she was sucking validation from you and when you finally made a move you seemed like a creep.

Sadly, this seems to be the case. I may have been just another source of validation and she wasn't interested. Does this mean my game sucks?

just ignore her. a real creep would stalk her. just ignore her, and if anyone gives you **** just tell them you had the balls to make a move and got shut down. anyone who hits on a girl she isnt interested in is deemed a "creep". girls know this. your rep isnt tainted, trust me. just relax and forget about it.

This isn't about being a creep... I mean this chick really thinks I made an "attack" on her. WTF if she tells people and word spreads? The way she worded it scared the crap out of me too "you kept holding onto me even though I said no." "and then you grabbed my buttt"

I didn't grab it in a horny way, I slapped it for a split second playfully.

I'm in utter disbelief over here. Reading online material for years has always stated to be persistent, but not a rapist. Well yeah, that's what I did.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Curry fever! They look nice, but the ones I find are always too hairy

Yes, she is a little backward and sheltered in her culture. The male/female dynamic is similar to Asians. They still hold on to a lot of idealistic preconceptions about relationships, ideas that we would associate with 1950's America. You can't change any of that, but the right way to regard her is still the same, just laugh it off and tell her she liked it. You did what you are supposed to do as a guy, which is make the ho say no, which by the way, she never actually did.

 

[Jariel]

The part where she says she didn't like you holding onto her is very blunt and tells you all you need to know. Saying you attacked her or trying to portray you as a lech is totally outrageous from what I can see and she's being a drama queen, but even if she didn't feel threatened, she probably felt you came on too strong and acted clingy.

This is a big problem for a lot of former nice guys and AFCs. We start following seduction "gurus" and PUA advice that tells us we need to be more sexually aggressive, make bold moves and they instill this fear into us that if we're not getting sexual within a certain time frame we're going to end up in the friendzone. I've seen some "gurus" even preach that we should not take no for an answer when a woman is pushing us back, telling us that it's just her playing games with us etc. This is very dangerous territory.

No matter what you read in textbooks or hear other guys tell you, you should ALWAYS pay attention to her actions. The process of seduction is a two-way dance. You make your moves, she responds, then you continue escalating. If she backs off or doesn't respond to your advances, then you need to take a step back.

When she said "I gotta go", that's your cue to take a step back and let her make the next move...or just part ways leaving her wanting more.

 

[SMS 48]

The part where she says she didn't like you holding onto her is very blunt and tells you all you need to know. Saying you attacked her or trying to portray you as a lech is totally outrageous from what I can see and she's being a drama queen, but even if she didn't feel threatened, she probably felt you came on too strong and acted clingy.

This is a big problem for a lot of former nice guys and AFCs. We start following seduction "gurus" and PUA advice that tells us we need to be more sexually aggressive, make bold moves and they instill this fear into us that if we're not getting sexual within a certain time frame we're going to end up in the friendzone. I've seen some "gurus" even preach that we should not take no for an answer when a woman is pushing us back, telling us that it's just her playing games with us etc. This is very dangerous territory.

No matter what you read in textbooks or hear other guys tell you, you should ALWAYS pay attention to her actions. The process of seduction is a two-way dance. You make your moves, she responds, then you continue escalating. If she backs off or doesn't respond to your advances, then you need to take a step back.

When she said "I gotta go", that's your cue to take a step back and let her make the next move...or just part ways leaving her wanting more.

Do you think I should have apologized?

 

[Iceberg]

Do you think I should have apologized?

No. No no no.

If she didn't want to be there, she wouldn't have been there.

If you locked your door and started tearing her clothes off, then yeah that's a little aggressive. It's not aggressive to make out with a girl who texts you at 9pm, stops by your house, and guides you by the hand into your own bedroom.

Pause and Rewind.

What was she expecting in that moment? Good conversation and ice cream?

You can't apologize for acting sexually when she, herself, guided things down that direction.

Were you aggressive? I don't know. I've had girls make out with me, then pull the, "I gotta go" thing. And then, they don't go. They linger around for a few minutes because they want you to kiss them again. I've been in that exact spot. And if you were dealing with a NORMAL girl, it would be no big deal. But you got one of those weird, Virgin-y chicks. So she's laying the guilt trip on herself.

Either way. F**k apologies. You did nothing that any red-blooded man would do when a girl comes by at night and brings you into a bedroom. What other way could you have played it?

 

[Leopold]

Aren't you guys always telling simply to ... walk away?

Why pull off with that shlt?!? If you aint gonna give it to me I think I'll stop wasting my time and find it somewhere else.

Tell her... you are too serious/not fun/ boring/ non-sexual/ or something similar and see if she proves herself to you by qualifying.

 

[SMS 48]

Aren't you guys always telling simply to ... walk away?

I'm not included in "those guys" because I have no idea WTF I know or don't know anymore. I've had a bad streak of rejection lately.

Why pull off with that shlt?!? If you aint gonna give it to me I think I'll stop wasting my time and find it somewhere else.

Tell her... you are too serious/not fun/ boring/ non-sexual/ or something similar and see if she proves herself to you by qualifying.

A little too late for that.

 

[SMS 48]

No. No no no.

If she didn't want to be there, she wouldn't have been there.

If you locked your door and started tearing her clothes off, then yeah that's a little aggressive. It's not aggressive to make out with a girl who texts you at 9pm, stops by your house, and guides you by the hand into your own bedroom.

Pause and Rewind.

What was she expecting in that moment? Good conversation and ice cream?

You can't apologize for acting sexually when she, herself, guided things down that direction.

Were you aggressive? I don't know. I've had girls make out with me, then pull the, "I gotta go" thing. And then, they don't go. They linger around for a few minutes because they want you to kiss them again. I've been in that exact spot. And if you were dealing with a NORMAL girl, it would be no big deal. But you got one of those weird, Virgin-y chicks. So she's laying the guilt trip on herself.

Either way. F**k apologies. You did nothing that any red-blooded man would do when a girl comes by at night and brings you into a bedroom. What other way could you have played it?

No no.

I offered my hand and she grabbed it so I can lead her toward the door.... As in the entrance/exit to my house.

Not the bedroom.

I asked him in particular because he seemed to think I shouldn't have went for a 2nd or third kiss after she said "I gotta go."

 

[SMS 48]

This is part of why I'm so confused.

Story with a different girl (who was a virgin)

- I showed her the bedroom and threw her on the bed (she protested but made out with me).

- I felt her up, blah blah, my hand was making away toward her boobs, she smacks it away

- Keep making out with her, wait a minute go toward the boobs again, she smacks it away

- Pin her hands up high, stick my hand under her shirt

- She says "SMS no I'm serious"

- I reply "yes, I'm serious too!" and keep rubbing

- She says "but... SMS"

- I say "my hand is already there its too late" and keep rubbing her tits and making out with her

- I go to suck on her tits, she pushes my head away and says no.

- When she least expects it, I start sucking her tits, and then pause and say "would you like me to stop?" She just smiles and doesn't answer.

If anything THAT was a sexual assault. Then what does she do? Later she confesses I loved how you didn't take no for an answer it totally made me feel comfortable and let me come out of my shell

Fukk you women, for being so god damn confusing.

/endrant

 

[MM92]

She seems a right wrong un. Stay well away!

 

[MM92]

SMS that last one was totally rapey

 

[SMS 48]

SMS that last one was totally rapey

I agree, and she loved it... And it led to us eventually having sex.

Anyway

UPDATE: The girl called just now, I did not answer.

 

[f283000]

UPDATE: The girl called just now, I did not answer.

Now I know it was a sh|t test that you FAILED MISERABLY (read iceberg's post which I thought was great). She wouldn't be calling you if she felt that she was attacked/raped by you.

HOWEVER, it doesn't matter what her reasons are whether it be a sh|t test or not. You shouldn't talk to her ever again.

Any girl that somehow even insinuated i attacked her in any way when that wasn't the case I would erase from my life IMMEDIATELY.

erase her cell/facebook/email. Delete her from your life ASAP in fact change your # if you can. Accusing someone of sexual assault is a serious thing and that's not the type of woman you want to have any dealings with. You never know what kind of thing she could pull in the future. She is trouble.

Her: Umm it wasn't very polite of you

Your mistake was to have kept the conversation going at that point. That's the point you should have ignored her for the rest of her life. You don't just keep talking to a woman that accused you of sexual assault. She could turn that in as evidence to the cops.

You made a big mistake there but don't make any more. Delete her from your life, ignore her, never talk to her again and if she keeps calling you think about changing your #

 

[SMS 48]

^^ You can add the following post to your list of mistakes.

She texted me, and I answered:

Her: I was just kidding

Me: No you weren't.

Her: Yes I was!

Me: (Explaining how I know she wasn't)

Her: Lol fine, maybe for a second I thought there was truth to it. I was being stupid, you're going to stop talking to me because I had a moment of stupidity?

(Didn't answer that text)

Her: I still want to hang out with you

Me: I don't think that's going to work out. I'm not the monk that you expect me to be.

Her: Then what?

Me: Then contact me when you're ready to move on and not stuck on that guy anymore.

Her: What if I'm not stuck on anyone? What if I just can't hook up with you?

Me: I don't know what you mean by that.

Her: What if I'm just not attracted to you?

Me: Then there's no point in hanging out.

Her: Glad you're honest.

(Did not answer to this)

Her: I'm sorry, I was just trying to socialize. I didn't think you expected more than that.

Me: Nothing to apolgize for.

/end


I must say, I've never felt uglier in my life. Feels pretty ****ty when a woman (who is average looking, by the way) not only won't hook up with you when the opportunity presents itself, not only state that she does not find you attractive, but actually feels the need to apologize to you about it.

Whatever, life goes on. I'm on a bad streak though.

Thanks for the replies though. I welcome all input.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Actions not words, my friend, actions not words. She could have also told you that you were god's gift to women - they're just words; they don't mean anything whether they are good or bad. In judging her actions, she was at least a little attracted to you. She would not have let you kiss her if it were otherwise. That assessment is based upon an action, not some words, therefore it means something.

Take some pride in having the courage to tell a woman to fvck off if she is not interested in you physically. That is a big step that most men never have the guts to make.