I keep having the same problem over and over again with women.

[Canadian Catnip]

Ok, lots of the guys that hang out here don't have a lot of experience with women. I'll admit I'm one of them. In the past I have given advice when I should have kept my mouth shut. I'm learning now to listen and read instead of giving out advice that is probably not very good for others.

Other than what I have read in DJ books and watched on some DVD's I don't have a lot of real world experience.

I have to ask you guys here for some help because I keep getting the same thing happening over and over again with women and it is starting to drive me crazy and I really want to change myself .

It usually plays out like this. I meet a women through social contacts or other interactions. They seem friendly, I play it cool and use all my DJ skills to show value and build attraction. The girl seems interested. They start smiling at me and making a lot of eye contact. I reciprocate the smiling and eye contact and they really seem to warm up to me.

Then I make the same mistake over and over again. I just keep giving them eye contact and smiling whenever we chat. Eventually the women seems to get angry at me. They start acting all b!tchy and upset as if I had insulted them.

Two cases in point. In my apartment there is a women I sometime see when I am parking my car or traveling in the elevator. At first she was nice, eye contact and smiling, I smiled back and made small talk with her for a few weeks, suddenly one day I saw her and said hi but she was really cold to me. Second story, Women at coffee shop I go to. Went in and got a coffee and sat at a table, noticed the women working there was looking over and checking me out ever few minutes. Next time I went in there she was smiling at me and I smiled back and made good eye contact. Long story short, I've been going in there for a month or two and saying hi and giving her a big smile whenever she works there. Well today I went in there and suddenly she is all cold to me like I have insulted her.

I think I'm intelligent enough to know that I have done something wrong in the whole attraction process. As I said earlier, I am inexperienced with women. It's painful to admit it to you guys and I am honestly asking for help.

I believe I am sparking some attraction in these women and coming across as a cool guy but for some reason the women realize that I am not going to go any farther with them other than smile at them or chat a bit. I think they get upset because I don't escalate or do any kind of number close with them. Thats my theory on why they eventually get upset and their mood suddenly does a 180.

Can anyone help me here. I don't escalate because I am afraid to. I keep it easy and simple and safe in the fluff zone. I'm terrified of being rejected even thought part of me knows these women are really giving me a lot of signs. I think thats what pisses them off the most, they are practically screaming "I like you" with there body language and I don't follow through. I guess it could be insulting to them.

I know what I am doing wrong and I can't seem to get over my fear and take it further with them. I really want to.

Has anyone ever gotten the same thing from women and how did you resolve it for yourself?

 

[LovelyLady]

I believe I am sparking some attraction in these women and coming across as a cool guy but for some reason the women realize that I am not going to go any farther with them other than smile at them or chat a bit. I think they get upset because I don't escalate or do any kind of number close with them.

From what you have said, they most likely think you are a male "attention w****" (as they say here on SS.) You like to get attention from them, but you exhibit no genuine interest in them - or you would have asked for the # They don't feel they "owe" you their attention - any more than a man "owes" a female "attention w****" his attention.

Not saying you ARE an AW, just that it sounds like that could be how they are experiencing you, kay?


or... they put you in the "just another guy who doesn't have the courage to ask them out... yawn." It just gets annoying to have initial interest in a guy and realize he will never have the courage to ask you out. That lack of courage (as we as women experience it) is a turn-off.

 

[synergy1]

I agree with lovelylady to a degree.

Without going too much into my background, one of my earlier faults during the learning process was lack of moving forward with attraction. I would start a conversation, spark that interest and than it would fleet. The key I found was to escalate, change it up and move forward. get her engaged into the conversation; this conversation is clearly not one between simple friends or peers. This is where experience kicks in, and its something you'll naturally develop for yourself. You just know where to take the conversation, than you start seeing her invade your private space and vice versa.

The key here is to escalate; demonstrate your interest without words. What works for me is sometimes teasing, sometimes asking the right questions, sometimes outright leaving the conversation and coming back...whatever you feel like. Tailor your game to work for you!

 

[swifTy]

do you like any of them dude?

if the answer is a yes, and a resounding yes at that, im sure you would have done something. asked for her number. something past just a hi and a smile. if not, you lack awareness and are a freakin idiot.

most likely your just seeing/weighing up their interest in you. your not gonna go for them, and when they figure that, it does pis$ them off, they feel dissapointed, its like a rejection of sorts.

find a girl you like. you won't waste a second of ur time im tellin you. you'll have her name and number so dam fast youll surprise yourself that you didn't even plan it or anything.

 

[LovelyLady]

I don't escalate because I am afraid to. I keep it easy and simple and safe in the fluff zone. I'm terrified of being rejected

I know what I am doing wrong and I can't seem to get over my fear and take it further with them. I really want to.

We women can sense your fear. I can tell within the first three sentances a man speaks if he is the kind of man who is able to ask a woman for her number.

See, we are used to most guys being afraid and nervous when they approach us. They can get awefully tonguetied

It isn't your fear in and of itself that causes us to shutdown with you.

It is your inability to act even while you afraid/nervous that is the concern.

It is attractive to experience a man taking action against a fear he has - especially if it is relation to you, as a woman. That tells us subconsciously you will be brave on our behalf if we need you to champion for us - and for our relationship, if it is needed later. And of course that you are brave in going after other things in your life that you clearly want.

This is all "primal" sub-conscious communicating going on that we intuitively pickup on when we interact with you. If we like you, we will send you signals (as you have described receiving from these women) but ultimately - we need to feel your backbone in the most basic of ways - Can you act on your desire for us or can't you?

 

[Fleshy99]

You need the get past the idea that these women are on your "look-out" list. Simple get in your mind as if these women didn't check you out but they just looked around the room like anyone else. Smile back and be polite, but after about the second exchange of smiling you really need to start up some small talk with ALL of them. Don't force it but when you are in a good mood and you find a small thing to start talking about just go for it.

You need to start up that small talk and show that you have a pulse more so then the ability to smile. And dont focus on just one of them, but casual and talk with all of them. If this talking stage is something you can't seem to get past you have deeply rooted problems that you need to resolve on your own.
These deeply rooted problems are nothing you should be worried about or afraid of, but they are your problems and you deal with them on a daily basis. If I was in your position I would do things that help you build confidence through things like - working out, yoga, tai chi, any activities that give you that extra edge. You need to make you own value mean much more than it already does in your own mind in order to understand that rejection is just them missing out on a great person.
I had the same deal with rejection forever and the way I got over it was that I work really hard in many ways and maintain my worth and it took me 3 years to build up to that point. Basically I did thinking on top of things that just built my confidence. This concept doesnt just apply to women, it also applies to business deals and getting that new job you want, as well as getting people to go out of their way for you because they respect you instantly even if they dont know you because you radiate respect for yourself.
Again this is a long process, but it will take time so hang in there. SS may not be able to help you with you "inner distractions" so you may have to look for outside sources to accomplish what you need to do. The resources are right in front of you, everywhere you look.
hope this helps.
Fleshy

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

...
I know what I am doing wrong and I can't seem to get over my fear and take it further with them. I really want to....

Name three things envolving other people that you can do confidently to completion.

 

[Canadian Catnip]

Name three things envolving other people that you can do confidently to completion.

Can you explain what you want here? Do you want three things like... I'm good at Rock, Paper, Scissors. Or something like... I'm mechanically inclined, even when I'm standing up. Ha, I'm funny too.

Seriously though, can you extrapolate a little on what you just asked.

 

[Canadian Catnip]

We women can sense your fear. I can tell within the first three sentances a man speaks if he is the kind of man who is able to ask a woman for her number.

See, we are used to most guys being afraid and nervous when they approach us. They can get awefully tonguetied

It isn't your fear in and of itself that causes us to shutdown with you.

It is your inability to act even while you afraid/nervous that is the concern.

It is attractive to experience a man taking action against a fear he has - especially if it is relation to you, as a woman. That tells us subconsciously you will be brave on our behalf if we need you to champion for us - and for our relationship, if it is needed later. And of course that you are brave in going after other things in your life that you clearly want.

This is all "primal" sub-conscious communicating going on that we intuitively pickup on when we interact with you. If we like you, we will send you signals (as you have described receiving from these women) but ultimately - we need to feel your backbone in the most basic of ways - Can you act on your desire for us or can't you?

I was writing a response to your post earlier today when I had an epiphany.

I suddenly realized that I always thought of myself as an average guy. Average to me meant that I was not good enough to match any of the other men out there. My thoughts around women always went something like this. "Well I'm just an average guy, she could do better than me"

Then I got to thinking that Average also meant I was better than 50% of the men I see. Wow what a change in my thinking. Today I was thinking "50% of the men I meet today I am better than."

I guess I went from thinking that I was at the bottom of the barrel to now thinking I am somewhere in the middle. It's a hugh leap in MY thinking.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Can you explain what you want here? Do you want three things like... I'm good at Rock, Paper, Scissors. Or something like... I'm mechanically inclined, even when I'm standing up. Ha, I'm funny too.

Seriously though, can you extrapolate a little on what you just asked.

Just list three types of interactions which you have with other people where you feel confident.

 

[slaog]

Are you sure you didn't freak them out by smiling too much?? If You over think things you'll start acting what they'll see as being "weird". If you smile too much you could come across as being like that.

It's like you're trying to be too nice to them but afraid to say anything which makes it worse. I bet they know you're afraid to talk to them!

I was writing a response to your post earlier today when I had an epiphany.

I suddenly realized that I always thought of myself as an average guy. Average to me meant that I was not good enough to match any of the other men out there. My thoughts around women always went something like this. "Well I'm just an average guy, she could do better than me"

Then I got to thinking that Average also meant I was better than 50% of the men I see. Wow what a change in my thinking. Today I was thinking "50% of the men I meet today I am better than."

I guess I went from thinking that I was at the bottom of the barrel to now thinking I am somewhere in the middle. It's a hugh leap in MY thinking.

Interesting way of looking at thing!

 

[Canadian Catnip]

Just list three types of interactions which you have with other people where you feel confident.

Well first of all I deal with customers on the I.T. hardware side of things. I'm pretty confident and relaxed when a customer is relying on me to help them fix a piece of hardware they have. (Like I said, I'm mechanically inclined)

I have to go into new situations and meet new customers and build rapport very quickly. I feel confident I can put people at ease quickly.

I feel confident when I am with my friends or family members, hanging out or meeting for a meal.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Well first of all I deal with customers on the I.T. hardware side of things. I'm pretty confident and relaxed when a customer is relying on me to help them fix a piece of hardware they have. (Like I said, I'm mechanically inclined)

I have to go into new situations and meet new customers and build rapport very quickly. I feel confident I can put people at ease quickly.

I feel confident when I am with my friends or family members, hanging out or meeting for a meal.

Come on that's two (your customers and family), I need another one.

 

[Canadian Catnip]

Come on that's two (your customers and family), I need another one.

Actually I believe I mentioned Friends, Family and Customers but thats OK. The third one is...

I am Confident in talking in front of my co-workers in meetings at work.

Sorry I haven't gotten back to you sooner on this.

So what is this supposed to prove anyway?

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Actually I believe I mentioned Friends, Family and Customers but thats OK. The third one is...

I am Confident in talking in front of my co-workers in meetings at work.

Sorry I haven't gotten back to you sooner on this.

So what is this supposed to prove anyway?

I'm trying to find a common thread with when you are confident, not with who. You do want to become confident in situations other than instances for work, friends and family right?

So you still have only two different situations when you're confident. When you are at work and when you're hanging out with friends and family. You've only really described in detail what you do at work. Other than "hanging out" with friends or a meal (which takes no effort what so ever) you haven't really said much about what you are doing when you're confident interacting with other people.

 

[Wodan]

This is ridiculous you said you wait weeks? months? before escalating from fluff talk! you wait till your disqualified. Just find out the situation its more prosperous. You either then get the girl or not, instead of defenately not.

 

[Canadian Catnip]

This is ridiculous you said you wait weeks? months? before escalating from fluff talk! you wait till your disqualified.

Yes it is ridiculous isn't it. Thats why I am posting this here. Everyone is different in life. Some people are completely screwed up on some things.

I doubt myself in front of women all the time. I just can't find the confidence to go farther.

 

[Canadian Catnip]

I'm trying to find a common thread with when you are confident, not with who. You do want to become confident in situations other than instances for work, friends and family right?

OK I think I get it now. Let me think about it a bit and figure out some better answers for you.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

OK I think I get it now. Let me think about it a bit and figure out some better answers for you.

Just to make things even more confusing, isn't it interesting that you need to figure it out. I'm not trying to point a finger because I'll bet that there may be a few other people reading the thread asking themselves the same question. It's not something people normally think about but understanding it at this level not only answers a lot of personal questions but also opens up possible opportunities.