I have compltely utterly failed

[Maxtro]

Almost 5am and I still can't fall asleep.

I just now realized that I was cheating, as in not playing by the rules of relationships. Instead of actually making my intentions fully known I was secretive for fear of rejection. If I wasn't hiding odds are we would have only gone on one or two dates. But because I went the friends route we ended up having like 12 of them. So now I'm wondering what is the difference between friends hanging out and people on a date? Did the fact I didn't try to kiss her make it not a date? Or was it also because none of us really knew the others intentions?

Because we never did anything physical I knew that we weren't dating but a part of me actually believed we were. My mind and my heart were actually saying two different things.

HeMan,

The thought of hooking up with her didn't feel wrong to me, but it did to her. I honestly can't imagine how having sex can make a friendship go bad. If anything it should make the friendship stronger since that's the closest you can actually get to somebody. Of course she didn't see it that way at all. Hell I wouldn't even want to be just friends with girls. What's the point if you aren't having sex?

Are people in relationships actually not friends with each other?

edit: LOL stupid 10 post rule. I rarely have more then 10 posts in a day and my 5 year average is actually 1 post per day. Way to go forum :kick:

 

[nightcrawler]

maxtro the reason you want to have a friend that's a girl is because not only will you get the benefits of hanging out with her girl friends, but you will also learn about the female psychology.

sex doesn't ruin a relationship? I've tried being friends with girls I was being sexual with at the time and sexuality just made it impossible

 

[The Logical Player]

Problem:

you Maxtro, are exactly the reason why I warn girls that I am with to NOT be just friends with guys, because guys like you (and there are MANY out there) don't want their friendship, they want their pvssy. Some guys are faster to get it, some never do. And currently, you are at AFC Orbiter Chump status.

Solution:

you Maxtro, need to get OPTIONS, really quickly, meaning, AS FAST AS POSSIBLE. I don't care if they are 8's, 6's, or 3's, but you need to get 10 phone numbers, and go hook up with 5 of those new chicks......and after you are done with them, go get 10 more numbers, hook up with 5 more.......then do it again, and again, and again.......and after a while, you will condition yourself to NEVER EVER EVER be as big of a chump as you are being with this "friend" of yours

 

[Maxtro]

Yeah I feel like giving her that warning too. She should have known that something was up when a boy was spending so much time and her. And yet she was clueless. Heh I'd think I'm more like the AFC Orbiter Champ. I wanted her pussy and her friendship. I actually have very few friends right now. She was the only person I actually hung out with outside of school/work. I know that is asking for trouble. In my perfect world/fantasy I have a lot of lady friends that I can have sex with whenever I want. I want somebody to fuck and be able talk to.

BTW telling me to go hook up with a girl, let alone 5 is like telling a house cat to beat up a bear, it's just not going to happen. I haven't kissed a girl in 5 years. I can try lowering my standards though she was actually about a 6. Getting back on point, I just can't hook up with a girl when I want. If I could, I would have not even gotten into this mess.

I can take what I learned and never make the same mistakes again.

 

[CaptainJ]

The lesson you can learn from this, is that being a girl's friend does not get you into her pants.

 

[HeMan]

maxtro

the fact that u have strong feelings for her and she does not have for u will make it akward if u guys have sex, especially if she is drunk.. gurantee she will cut out of her life...

one good friend who i slept with bc i was stoned and i thought why not, i cringed everytime i saw her after i slept with her.. she just started to annoy me for some reason.. she was still the same person

time to move on for now dude...

as everyone says here, improve yourself and more than likely she will take notice eventually if u remain friends...

there is no need to get upset over this... she is just a girl... enjoy her friendship and your life.. good friends are amazing to have! improve yrself over time and just have fun... gurantee if u continue to have fun with this girl and u dont show unfatuated love towards her u guys will eventually hook up

 

[Luke Skywalker]

there is no need to get upset over this... she is just a girl... enjoy her friendship and your life.. good friends are amazing to have! improve yrself over time and just have fun... gurantee if u continue to have fun with this girl and u dont show unfatuated love towards her u guys will eventually hook up

I don't think Maxtro is going to see this girl in the same light anymore, especially if she just LJBFed him and lost her virginity with another guy. That's sending a very strong message that undermines one's masculinity. It's like saying the other guy is able to turn this girl on, but what does that say about Maxtro? She sees him like a brother or sexless friend -- and you want to maintain a friendship? Let me tell you what you can do with that word "eventually".

 

[Igetit!]

I don't think Maxtro is going to see this girl in the same light anymore, especially if she just LJBFed him and lost her virginity with another guy. That's sending a very strong message that undermines one's masculinity.

This is false. This girl DID NOT undermine Maxtro's masculinity. He did it himself. I don't mean to be tough on the guy,but I'd rather tell him the truth and let him be a little upset now,than to have him relive this thing over and over again with girl after girl. He shot himself in the foot. He said it himself. This is his second thread about the same girl. The first one was called,"Should I end my friendship with this girl?". You see that? He asked should he end his "friendship" with her. When he met this girl,instead of just revealing his interest to her,he hid it behind friendship. That's what he did. He presented himself as a friend to her instead of a potential romantic interest. And all she did was respond in like manner. She didn't do anything wrong. He put out friendship to her,and she recipricated with the same. He got what he sent out. If he had revealed his true feelings to her from the beginning,she would have responded in like manner,or she would have rejected him. This isn't that hard to figure out. If you want friendship,you put out friendship. If you want romantic interest,you put out romantic interest. He screwed up by trying to play it safe.

It's like saying the other guy is able to turn this girl on, but what does that say about Maxtro? She sees him like a brother or sexless friend

This is because the other guy did turn her on,which is obviuos because she lost her virginity to him. And as for what it says about Maxtro...it says that he approached her wrong. Maxtro is every bit as capable of generating attraction in women as that guy did with this girl. It easily could have been Maxtro to whom this girl lost her virginity to. You say she sees him as a brother or a sexless friend. Well of course that's how she sees him,that what her presented to her. The other guy presented himself to her in a sexual way,hence,she had sex with him.

First impressions are lasting. You can't try to pull a switcheroo on people and have them be ok with it. You can't pretend to be a girl's friend for a while,then later on try to pull out your sexual side to her and expect her just to go along with it. She's known you one way for the entire time you two have known each other,then all of the sudden,out of the blue,you want to have sex with her? Doesn't work that way. Maxtro says that he completely and utterly failed. That may be true with this girl,but the failure occured looong before she had sex with this other guy.

You were scared to just come out and ask her for a date for fear of being rejected. Oh well. I'm sorry,but like I said before,what was she supposed to do? Sit around celibate and dateless until you found the courage to ask her out? If you see a girl you like,you need to make your interest known as soon as possible. Otherwise,it's a one-way ticket to the friendzone.

 

[Maxtro]

maxtro

the fact that u have strong feelings for her and she does not have for u will make it akward if u guys have sex, especially if she is drunk.. gurantee she will cut out of her life...

one good friend who i slept with bc i was stoned and i thought why not, i cringed everytime i saw her after i slept with her.. she just started to annoy me for some reason.. she was still the same person

time to move on for now dude...

as everyone says here, improve yourself and more than likely she will take notice eventually if u remain friends...

there is no need to get upset over this... she is just a girl... enjoy her friendship and your life.. good friends are amazing to have! improve yrself over time and just have fun... gurantee if u continue to have fun with this girl and u dont show unfatuated love towards her u guys will eventually hook up

Honestly I wouldn't want to have sex with her because we were high or drunk. I wanted to because I really liked her. What makes things the hardest is that she was my best friend.

I really want to move on and start improving myself. Right now I can't stop crying. There is no way I can even be around her till I regain control of my emotions. I really need to become a better man.

This is false. This girl DID NOT undermine Maxtro's masculinity. He did it himself. I don't mean to be tough on the guy,but I'd rather tell him the truth and let him be a little upset now,than to have him relive this thing over and over again with girl after girl. He shot himself in the foot. He said it himself. This is his second thread about the same girl. The first one was called,"Should I end my friendship with this girl?". You see that? He asked should he end his "friendship" with her. When he met this girl,instead of just revealing his interest to her,he hid it behind friendship. That's what he did. He presented himself as a friend to her instead of a potential romantic interest. And all she did was respond in like manner. She didn't do anything wrong. He put out friendship to her,and she recipricated with the same. He got what he sent out. If he had revealed his true feelings to her from the beginning,she would have responded in like manner,or she would have rejected him. This isn't that hard to figure out. If you want friendship,you put out friendship. If you want romantic interest,you put out romantic interest. He screwed up by trying to play it safe.

I agree that this is completely my fault. Either I didn't act because I was scared to or that I simply didn't know how. One thing that I didn't mention is that when I first met her, we were coworkers and she was in a relationship. I was waiting for it to end then I would hook up with her on the rebound. I never figured out the timing of when to actually make a move and we started down the friend path. Check out this thread that goes over the first time we actually hung out.

I think I almost got laid, want to make sure that happens with her

Sadly I only got one response which was some encouragement from Luke. If I had gotten some actual advice the fallowing months of my life from then to today would have been very different. In essence this site failed me when I could have really used help. After reading that post I'm very upset that the last line came true.

This is because the other guy did turn her on,which is obviuos because she lost her virginity to him. And as for what it says about Maxtro...it says that he approached her wrong. Maxtro is every bit as capable of generating attraction in women as that guy did with this girl. It easily could have been Maxtro to whom this girl lost her virginity to. You say she sees him as a brother or a sexless friend. Well of course that's how she sees him,that what her presented to her. The other guy presented himself to her in a sexual way,hence,she had sex with him.

I do agree that I could have had sex with her if I played my cards right. The only thing I was missing was the attraction, heck I'm pretty sure I did have her attracted to me in the beginning but I didn't escalate out of fear. Hell I probably could have fucked her Saturday night if I actually made a move. She was responding very well to my touches. But the past is the past and worrying about it will only lead to insanity.

First impressions are lasting. You can't try to pull a switcheroo on people and have them be ok with it. You can't pretend to be a girl's friend for a while,then later on try to pull out your sexual side to her and expect her just to go along with it. She's known you one way for the entire time you two have known each other,then all of the sudden,out of the blue,you want to have sex with her? Doesn't work that way. Maxtro says that he completely and utterly failed. That may be true with this girl,but the failure occured looong before she had sex with this other guy.

You were scared to just come out and ask her for a date for fear of being rejected. Oh well. I'm sorry,but like I said before,what was she supposed to do? Sit around celibate and dateless until you found the courage to ask her out? If you see a girl you like,you need to make your interest known as soon as possible. Otherwise,it's a one-way ticket to the friendzone.

Since we were coworkers and she was in a relationship at the time. It didn't feel right to let my intentions be known to her right away. But I know I did wait too long. Obviously I'm still trying to figure this stuff out. If I had actually tried to have sex with her back in November I could have avoided this whole mess.

 

[HeMan]

geez dude

you have taken this way to personally...

u sound very very depressed over this...

u must have deeper issues than this girl..

when my last girlfriend ended it with me, who happened to be the love of life, i actually was fine about it to my surprise... i realised its not her that was making me happy...

there is more to life! get over it dude...

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Honestly I wouldn't want to have sex with her because we were high or drunk. I wanted to because I really liked her. What makes things the hardest is that she was my best friend.

Now you like her after the fact. However, on earlier threads you said you really just liked her as a friend, or didn't want to get into an LTR with her. Maybe just have a little fun at best, but nothing serious.

I really want to move on and start improving myself. Right now I can't stop crying. There is no way I can even be around her till I regain control of my emotions. I really need to become a better man.

You feel devastated that this happened to you. This happened to me a few years ago so I know this stuff. It got me so angry that I put up a profile on AFF and lavalife to find a random hook-up before the end of the month to lose my virginity if it meant getting even in some way with her. (I aborted at the last minute). I've never been that motivated before to seek a hook-up then when I got shell-shocked by that lady by what I read. Similar to the shell-shock you are experiencing here, but multiplied by 100 since I had no intimate experience with any woman before and that just stung.

But, frustration like this can really propell you into action, as it did for me back then, because, if you can handle this, you can take on the world. You should use the negative energy from this and convert this into momentum and go out there and cold approach like crazy using SHOCK AND AWE openers, or ask random girls out there on the internet or offline if they want to do you. By now you should be so frustrated that you'll proposition girls and just not care how they react.

Check out the SHOCK AND AWE openers. You've got to work that nerve to ask people to have sex with you --- you know why -- you just save your time if nothing else, that way, if they don't want you that way, you just mvove on.

I do agree that I could have had sex with her if I played my cards right. But the past is the past and worrying about it will only lead to insanity.

Kudos to you. That is the right attitude to have.

If I had actually tried to have sex with her back in November I could have avoided this whole mess.

Maxtro I hate to say this. But I think you should investigate the sign of the month of November because I think you just got stung.

Should read the scorpion and the frog story. Women are like scorpions -- if you can't handle them, then you could get stung.

 

[The Logical Player]

did you miss your diagnosis? why dont you take the advice and USE IT little man


Problem:

you Maxtro, are exactly the reason why I warn girls that I am with to NOT be just friends with guys, because guys like you (and there are MANY out there) don't want their friendship, they want their pvssy. Some guys are faster to get it, some never do. And currently, you are at AFC Orbiter Chump status.

Solution:

you Maxtro, need to get OPTIONS, NO EXCUSES NOT TO, really quickly, meaning, AS FAST AS POSSIBLE. I don't care if they are 8's, 6's, or 3's, but you need to get 10 phone numbers, and go hook up with 5 of those new chicks......and after you are done with them, go get 10 more numbers, hook up with 5 more.......then do it again, and again, and again.......and after a while, you will condition yourself to NEVER EVER EVER be as big of a chump as you are being with this "friend" of yours

 

[Maxtro]

geez dude

you have taken this way to personally...

u sound very very depressed over this...

u must have deeper issues than this girl..

when my last girlfriend ended it with me, who happened to be the love of life, i actually was fine about it to my surprise... i realised its not her that was making me happy...

there is more to life! get over it dude...

It is definitely deeper then just the girl. Consider the fact that I'm 27 and I've never had a girlfriend. I've only been in one relationship, with a fat girl, and that lasted only two weeks. She was the only girl I've ever kissed and that was 5 years ago. The only thing I've had between then and now were "friendships" with girls who weren't interested in me. I was hurt when I realized that each girl didn't like me that way. None of those friendships lasted as long or were as close as the one I had with this girl. Right now I feel that God himself hates me and will not let me be happy. In my own sad pathetic way I'm trying to enjoy my life. The worst part is that I have no pleasant memories to look back on since I never got what I really wanted.

Now you like her after the fact. However, on earlier threads you said you really just liked her as a friend, or didn't want to get into an LTR with her. Maybe just have a little fun at best, but nothing serious.

I think I was trying to convince myself that I didn't have oneitis for her. I kept trying to tell myself that I only wanted her for sex. But I was only lying to myself. The fact that I spent so much time with her actually made it worse.

You feel devastated that this happened to you. This happened to me a few years ago so I know this stuff. It got me so angry that I put up a profile on AFF and lavalife to find a random hook-up before the end of the month to lose my virginity if it meant getting even in some way with her. (I aborted at the last minute). I've never been that motivated before to seek a hook-up then when I got shell-shocked by that lady by what I read. Similar to the shell-shock you are experiencing here, but multiplied by 100 since I had no intimate experience with any woman before and that just stung.

I actually did something like that 5 years ago. When the girl I was dating dumped me, I messaged the woman who I had sex with before that I met on AFF and told her I wanted to see her. Our encounter wasn't nearly as good as the first one because my heart just wasn't in it. I don't want to do something like that again.

But, frustration like this can really propell you into action, as it did for me back then, because, if you can handle this, you can take on the world. You should use the negative energy from this and convert this into momentum and go out there and cold approach like crazy using SHOCK AND AWE openers, or ask random girls out there on the internet or offline if they want to do you. By now you should be so frustrated that you'll proposition girls and just not care how they react.

Actually I'm not feeling motivated at all. Most likely it's because I wasn't able sleep last night so I have no energy. Hopefully I'll feel better tomorrow and be able to start chasing girls.

I really wish I could find a magic bullet or something that could just fix everything that's wrong.

The Logical Player, I addressed your post already in a previous post. But anyways I CANNOT just go out and hook up with 5 girls. It should be obvious from this thread that having sex with a girl is currently beyond me.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

It is definitely deeper then just the girl. Consider the fact that I'm 27 and I've never had a girlfriend. I've only been in one relationship, with a fat girl, and that lasted only two weeks. She was the only girl I've ever kissed and that was 5 years ago.

What exactly have you done, besides classes, to meet girls during those five years?

The only thing I've had between then and now were "friendships" with girls who weren't interested in me. I was hurt when I realized that each girl didn't like me that way. None of those friendships lasted as long or were as close as the one I had with this girl.

Did you let your intentions show early on those "friendships" that you wanted more than just "friend"? Do you see any reason that you keep getting friendzoned?

Right now I feel that God himself hates me and will not let me be happy. In my own sad pathetic way I'm trying to enjoy my life. The worst part is that I have no pleasant memories to look back on since I never got what I really wanted.

At least not with the specific women that you wanted. How many women were they? Hey, I feel the same way too sometimes, but lately, the blame has shifted to my set-up and lack of motivation on my part. I felt strongly about it that way back in 2006, but felt I got the experiences that I wanted.

I think I was trying to convince myself that I didn't have oneitis for her. I kept trying to tell myself that I only wanted her for sex. But I was only lying to myself. The fact that I spent so much time with her actually made it worse.

But this is really after the fact that she had sex with someone else. If she didn't have sex with anyone yet, or wasn't interested in having sex, then you would still be in a more calmer state of mind just wondering whether or not to continue a friendship with her since you were not getting what you want.

The fact she had sex with someone and rejected you at the same time may be creating a oneitis with you because she's not available to you and has made a choice. Since you want what you cant have, this creates a pressure towards her.

I think the poison from the sting is there and see this friendship as turning toxic over this incident. You will never be the same around her.

I actually did something like that 5 years ago. When the girl I was dating dumped me, I messaged the woman who I had sex with before that I met on AFF and told her I wanted to see her. Our encounter wasn't nearly as good as the first one because my heart just wasn't in it. I don't want to do something like that again.

The reason I went on AFF 2.5 years ago was to see if someone liked me enough to have sex with me, or if it was really that bad. There are people on this board, and elsewhere who would love to hook up with someone from an adult site for some fun - but think it doesn't work. See. Free sexual encounters if you wanted. It's not that bad. You can have a release if these normal girls don't pan out.

There are lots of black hookers around anywhere. You like black poon or something -- is it a racial fetish?

Actually I'm not feeling motivated at all. Most likely it's because I wasn't able sleep last night so I have no energy. Hopefully I'll feel better tomorrow and be able to start chasing girls.

Sure, maybe you will! Make 5 approaches tommorow.

I really wish I could find a magic bullet or something that could just fix everything that's wrong.

Try subconcious programming, or making suggestions contrary to your current engrained negative way of thinking.

 

[Maxtro]

Responses in bold

What exactly have you done, besides classes, to meet girls during those five years?

Just classes and work. I never liked the idea of chasing strangers.


Did you let your intentions show early on those "friendships" that you wanted more than just "friend"? Do you see any reason that you keep getting friendzoned?

In each case I kept my intentions to myself for as long as possible. Then when I'd tell the girl it would blow up in my face. The reason I think that I keep getting friendzoned is that I didn't do enough to attract the girl and yet I kept trying to spend time with them.


At least not with the specific women that you wanted. How many women were they? Hey, I feel the same way too sometimes, but lately, the blame has shifted to my set-up and lack of motivation on my part. I felt strongly about it that way back in 2006, but felt I got the experiences that I wanted.

I've been into girls since I was 13 I think I tried to chase about 15 girls (it might be higher) each one ended poorly. I think I actually had 2-3 girls who wanted to have sex with me but I said something stupid and blew it. They actually told me either on the phone or IM that they wanted to have sex with me.

I know the only person we can blame is ourselves. The problem can't be that every woman is wrong.

But this is really after the fact that she had sex with someone else. If she didn't have sex with anyone yet, or wasn't interested in having sex, then you would still be in a more calmer state of mind just wondering whether or not to continue a friendship with her since you were not getting what you want.

Actually on Sat night when she was in my house, I knew I wanted her. I was ready to move into a relationship. Of course it was far too late at that point.

The fact she had sex with someone and rejected you at the same time may be creating a oneitis with you because she's not available to you and has made a choice. Since you want what you cant have, this creates a pressure towards her.

The fact that she had sex with someone and rejected me during the same day was a major eye opener. I crashed really hard that night. I did make a lot of realizations

I think the poison from the sting is there and see this friendship as turning toxic over this incident. You will never be the same around her.

Maybe, maybe not. Either way I want to see where it goes as a learning experiment. Right now things between us are pretty good. But it may turn ugly in a couple of days depending on what I do.


The reason I went on AFF 2.5 years ago was to see if someone liked me enough to have sex with me, or if it was really that bad. There are people on this board, and elsewhere who would love to hook up with someone from an adult site for some fun - but think it doesn't work. See. Free sexual encounters if you wanted. It's not that bad. You can have a release if these normal girls don't pan out.

Eh, not in the mood for it. I don't even want to masturbate since I'm trying to set a personal record of how long I can go without it.

There are lots of black hookers around anywhere. You like black poon or something -- is it a racial fetish?

like all women as long as the meet my minimum qualifications. I don't care what race she is, if we click, we click.

Try subconcious programming, or making suggestions contrary to your current engrained negative way of thinking.

I'm actually reading a NLP book that a "guru" personally recommended to me. I do wonder if it help change anything.

 

[Maxtro]

Note: I don't care if I get any future replies to this thread or not. In essence this is the conclusion of this girl in my journal. Months or possibly years from now I can look back at my threads and see how everything played out.

Today, I decided to "end" the friendship. I talked with her for almost an hour going over my thoughts and feelings about her. I felt I had nothing to loose so I was able to be very open. At this point I knew that she would never have any interest in me and I also thought that she would get mad at me, thankfully she didn't.

Needless to say I was very AFC. I told her that she was my best friend and that I really liked her. I said that I really like spending time with her but it was also painful because we weren't really together. (Told u it was AFC) So I said that I can't spend any time with her till I get over her or she changes her mind. She folded her arms on the table put her head on them and looked up at me with water in her eyes. She was so sweet and understanding.

We talked about various stuff for a while and she told that me that back when we had our first "date" in November she had no interest in me and that she didn't know I liked her. We both agreed that if I made a move on her back then she would have rejected me and this whole mess wouldn't have gotten so big. I gave her a warning about single guys in the future who want to be her friend and I hope she fallows it.

She told me to call her and hang out with her when I'm over her. I told her to call me when she wants to hook up We had a nice hug and I went on my way.

So there we are, no secrets, no games, no freezouts, still on good terms but we'll probably never hang out again. I feel so free, there are no lingering thoughts about what if's. Everything is out in the open and I feel good about it. Realistically this is the best way it could have ended.

 

[ohsnap]

dude WALK AWAY FROM THIS GIRL. she is bad news, she's gonna make you feel like arse. hanging around her hoping she'll have sex with you is only going to bring you down and whether consciously or subconsciously, it will make you LESS ATTRACTIVE TO OTHER WOMEN.

WALK AWAY!!

 

[The Logical Player]

i am still wondering how MAxtro is even contemplating taking advice from a 32 year old virgin

kid, just do what i said, and you'll be off for the better

 

[Maxtro]

LOL read my last post guys. I did walk away.

Too bad I can't edit my opening post to tell people that I resolved the issue.

 

[ohsnap]

did you tell her "i don't want to be friends anymore"? don't. just start ignoring her. she sounds like a bi*ch.