How "game" screwed me up (FR)

BPH

Master Don Juan
Joined
Nov 8, 2010
Messages
2,772
Reaction score
1,397
Location
Wilmington, DE
Now are you really implying that if the girl had found him physically attractive and liked his energy/vibe she would've still sent that LJBF message? Just because the date was at 3PM, he didn't touch her and they were both sober? :rolleyes:
This defies both logic and advice from OG dating gurus such as Doc Love. She wouldn't think he's gay but see him as a challenge and that would make her want to pursue him even more.
A challenge is a guy who's aloof and not outcome dependent.

That is VERY different from a guy without the confidence to escalate.
 

pipeman84

Master Don Juan
Joined
Aug 21, 2022
Messages
1,510
Reaction score
1,969
Age
40
Location
Europe
A challenge is a guy who's aloof and not outcome dependent.

That is VERY different from a guy without the confidence to escalate.
Agree. Judging from OP, he didn't lack the confidence to escalate, on the contrary, he did escalate without 'reading the room'.
 

Clockwerk50

Master Don Juan
Joined
Aug 5, 2023
Messages
1,102
Reaction score
823
Age
40
As you mentioned, none of us were there to assess the dynamic and energy between both of you, nor can we analyze every detail of what was said to make a better assessment. Nonetheless, I’m throwing this out there, and hopefully, some of it resonates with you:

1. People are really stubborn, and throughout all of our lives we become self-absorbed with our own tastes, opinions, and experiences, forming a shell to prevent any foreign influences from obstructing our ideas. In order to break down their walls and draw them out, you must conform, adapt, and validate people’s moods, beliefs, and tastes. This way, they won’t feel threatened by someone else’s strangeness or different habits, and people naturally love seeing their ideas reflected in others. Once they are open to you, you will be able to infect them with your mood and heat as you desire.

Unfortunately, from what I gathered, you did most of the talking and qualifying, which is why the 70/30 rule is often suggested for first meet-ups. If a woman is truly attracted to you, she will do most of the talking, and this dynamic will naturally fall into place. If she had truly opened up to you, she wouldn’t have hesitated with the forearm touch, resisted sitting next to you during wine, or felt uncomfortable discussing going to your place. Even though your invitation may not have been malicious, she may have perceived you as untrustworthy or disingenuous.

2. You had a concrete location, time, and activity for the initial meet-up, but beyond that, you had no clear plan. You didn’t have a time limit, a plan for what to do next, or a way to smoothly isolate her. After the bar, you became indecisive, wanting sex, then not, then considering an LTR, then worrying about damaging her green flags today. This inconsistency likely made you come across as uncertain and lacking direction.

Your mistake here was improvising everything after the initial meeting, to the point where you had to buy spaghetti and sauce last minute because you hadn’t prepared in advance. This not only signaled laziness but also made it seem like you were only thinking about yourself. What usually makes people feel valued is seeing the effort someone has put in for them, and that effort is often rewarded with their willingness to invest in return.

3. Because of the lack of emotional buildup and proper logistics, she rejected your offer. When she expressed discomfort, you insisted again, which likely triggered her defenses. The repeated attempts to pull her in for a kiss with hugs, despite her turning her head, reinforced the idea that you were focused on your own desires rather than hers. This comes off not just as impatient but as a lack of self-control. The issue here isn’t necessarily the invitation itself but how it reflected your internal state, you essentially showed her that you were so interested in her that you had no reason to wait. This is not only egotistical but also suggests a potential inferiority complex.
 

Sega Genesis

Don Juan
Joined
Sep 9, 2024
Messages
185
Reaction score
138
He didn't escalate...at all...this read like a romance novel in OP's head, then he threw a Hail Mary when he couldn't even get a first down.
I don't want to start a war but OP stated she told him she wasn't ready to kiss just yet it was too soon she didn't feel comfortable or something like that.

He respected her boundaries and chose to not escalate at that time.

Another poster I think it was NJ said she was "shyt testing" him.

A word to the wise, when a girl says NO whether you think it's a shyt test or not, pay attention and stop whatever you're doing and do NOT escalate further.

Number one it's disrespectful (which you guys discuss here as it pertains to YOU being disrespected). In truth disrespect goes both ways.

Number two and perhaps more importantly you risk a sexual assault charge.
 

BPH

Master Don Juan
Joined
Nov 8, 2010
Messages
2,772
Reaction score
1,397
Location
Wilmington, DE
I don't want to start a war but OP stated she told him she wasn't ready to kiss just yet it was too soon she didn't feel comfortable or something like that.

He respected her boundaries and chose to not escalate at that time.

Another poster I think it was NJ said she was "shyt testing" him.

A word to the wise, when a girl says NO whether you think it's a shyt test or not, pay attention and stop whatever you're doing and do NOT escalate further.

Number one it's disrespectful (which you guys discuss here as it pertains to YOU being disrespected). In truth disrespect goes both ways.

Number two and perhaps more importantly you risk a sexual assault charge.
You're missing the point.

It took him several months to set up this date and several hours to muster the courage to go for the kiss. She may have been receptive to it if he had some balls and went for it rather than go for the "consolation prize" since she wasn't receptive to going inside his place. She may not have been - but he could've saved himself a lot of time by going for it earlier.

Or, you know, not pursuing somebody who wasn't that interested for several months across several apps.
 

jhonny9546

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jan 17, 2024
Messages
1,323
Reaction score
210
Location
Italy
Our foreheads touch, as we glance into each other's eyes. She tells me in an innocent way: "I don't kiss on the first date. who does that?". I tell her: "everyone, lol". The vibe is rather good, we smile, feel good (or so I assume, now looking back at it).
I would have kissed her, even as a joke. A quick kiss, and then look into her eyes again. Another quick kiss. Then many more kisses.

This is what you would have done in a natural state, if you had not had "the game" in mind, or "watch her reactions" etc.. Simply, when you feel it, do it.
If she is interested in you, she will be impressed or a little surprised, but she certainly will not reject you.

That's why rather than reading or getting too deep into tactics, when I don't know what to do, I become a little more childish or playful, but I ACT.

Then, after I ACT, I consider the mistake. But if I do it during what's happening, I could miss everything
 

New_Journey

Master Don Juan
Joined
Oct 7, 2024
Messages
525
Reaction score
386
Age
35
To add @New_Journey I refer you to your own post yesterday (or the day prior) where you posted you failed to escalate and you got harshly criticized for it.

You responded (paraphrasing) "Patience. A true DJ is patient."

Imo you did the right thing in that situation.

You felt the situation out and determined it wasn't the right time.

This situation is a bit different but essentially the same premise.
Its different baby. Let me explain.

In my case, she was a plate who I dropped, I never cared what happened, I didn't escalate on purpose.

In his situation all the right signals were there, he didn't do anything for fear of rejection. You need patience until the right signals are there, if you don't do anything is called fear.

Actually yes I have. It was what that particular situation called for at the time.
And you are not with him for a reason.

If he did lose her, it's because he was clumsy (that home cooked spaghetti thing) and tried to escalate too soon, not because he wasn't pushy enough.
Haha are you a troll bro? I can't believe men are this clueless. Quote the part that he did any escalation whatsoever.

fake boobs.
Have you ever being with this type of girl? I can tell you, it literally makes you breathless, you should try it sometimes.

Next time I saw him I asked him how it went and he told me it went really well, but that she messaged him some time later that she thinks they should just be friends. So I asked him if he ever had sex with her. Nope. I asked him if he ever kissed her. Nope. Then I told him obviously she just wants to be friends - you took her out for a sober date during the daytime and didn't even kiss her - she might even think you're gay.
Exactly, he didn't set the frame since the beginning to be a romantic date, it was a friends date.

She wouldn't think he's gay but see him as a challenge and that would make her want to pursue him even more.
The idea of a challenge is if the girl is into you and you play hard to get for fun. A guy inviting a girl for a date is him not being a challenge, he spends money on the date to be a challenge? This is idiotic.
 

New_Journey

Master Don Juan
Joined
Oct 7, 2024
Messages
525
Reaction score
386
Age
35
I don't want to start a war
LOL yes you do, stop lying, woman.

A word to the wise, when a girl says NO whether you think it's a shyt test or not, pay attention and stop whatever you're doing and do NOT escalate further.
This is generally a good idea, but I can tell you stories of those same girls who said no, 10 mins later had my c0ck in their mouth.
 

BillyPilgrim

Master Don Juan
Joined
Apr 9, 2021
Messages
5,035
Reaction score
3,879
Wy are you communicating with a chick throught all those apps? IMO it makes you needy and wanting to get her attention so bad.


Why did you take her to fvcking boring date man? Take girls to do action dates, something fun, sitting in a couch is boring as fvck, men with no game that's what they do, just talking like an interview, boring $hit.


Men with confidence go for what they want wiouth fear, you still a boi afraid of rejection.


This was expected. You've been with this girl for a couple of hours, and now you want her to be at your place. Are fvcking serious dude? What rapport have you build with this chick? You haven't even kissed her yet cause you have no balls and all the sudden you wanna her to be in your house for a " home cooked meal". That's what creepy stalkers do.


You are, you wanna mask sex with " home-cooked spaghetti" Not good


You needed to have all the ingredients in your house already, that's a big failure on your part, not good logistics.


I can see a big thirsty and desperation sign written all over your forehead, its game over at this point. You are desperate for sex.



You did good here, at this point you stopped giving a $hit about her and then this happened:


This is a $hit test, she didn't have the need to tell you that. She wanted to fvck, but you didn't even kiss her, you were scared. Learn female sub communication.

You failed the $hit test. She basically told you:

"I wanna fvck you but you haven't even kiss me yet, you have no confidence, therefore let me tell you this $hit and see if you man up and do something about it"

You should've have gone for the kiss to shut her up when she was giving you all that " feel good explanation" You failed the $hit test.


OMFG Kiss the fvcking girl already. Do you want a fvcking big sign from her telling you. " Listen, I'm wet, are you gonna kiss me, carry me to your bed and fvck me or what?"


LOL no confidence in making a move.


Translation, I'm dying for you to kiss me.


She put you in the puzzy category, learn from this.


What game tactics? You have no fcking game, zero, zip, nada, she was in a silver platter for you and you took a big $hit on it.


Copium to the maximum.


Next time, be more bold.
Need Moar Quotes! :p Anything under 20 is a rookie number.
 

BillyPilgrim

Master Don Juan
Joined
Apr 9, 2021
Messages
5,035
Reaction score
3,879
Watch OP invent Stolen Car Game...
 

crowolf

Don Juan
Joined
Feb 21, 2019
Messages
135
Reaction score
105
Ok, so a quick update on this: I decided to send her a snapchat the next day. Got nothing to lose, really. She replied in 10-15 min. And then disappeared for 5-6 hours.

The next day - same sh1t. First reply is fast, second one is soo slow. Maybe she is playing games. But her replies and timing gave me low interest vibes, so at one point I said to myself “screw that, I let you go”.

And interestingly enough, yesterday night she sent me a video “selfie” of her, in a bar, blowing me a kiss or something. I replied this morning with the “delicious” emoji.

I honestly don’t care if this will unfold, because it caused me way too much suffering for the past 2 days. But I guess she had liked something about me. Or only tries to use me for validation. Let’s see.
 

BillyPilgrim

Master Don Juan
Joined
Apr 9, 2021
Messages
5,035
Reaction score
3,879
Ok, so a quick update on this: I decided to send her a snapchat the next day. Got nothing to lose, really. She replied in 10-15 min. And then disappeared for 5-6 hours.

The next day - same sh1t. First reply is fast, second one is soo slow. Maybe she is playing games. But her replies and timing gave me low interest vibes, so at one point I said to myself “screw that, I let you go”.

And interestingly enough, yesterday night she sent me a video “selfie” of her, in a bar, blowing me a kiss or something. I replied this morning with the “delicious” emoji.

I honestly don’t care if this will unfold, because it caused me way too much suffering for the past 2 days. But I guess she had liked something about me. Or only tries to use me for validation. Let’s see.
here is where the tasteful c0ck shot comes in.
 

Hal9000

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jun 2, 2019
Messages
773
Reaction score
1,137
Seems like this was doomed from the start for a first date. You set it up so you had to keep her interested for way too long and then you were gonna drag her back to your place where you cook a meal from scratch? That's like fifth date, not first date, stuff. First dates should be quick in and out where you gauge interest and then have the option to lengthen if it's going well, or you can abort if it isn't. First dates should never take hours and involve anything other than determining whether there's next date potential. It sounds like you were trying to layer multiple date experiences on top of each other which is a lot of pressure for everyone, especially if there isn't immediate chemistry.
 

zekko

Master Don Juan
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
16,198
Reaction score
9,066
As we were passing through the supermarket next to my place to buy the spaghetti, she was chatting with her friends on the phone. And before I buy the ingredients, she says something like “I’m good, no need to count me in for the spaghetti”. I say ok. Not a big deal again. But I felt a bit uncomfortable because it was like I was luring her in with shady tactics. Which wasn’t really the case, as I mentioned we are going for “home-cooked spaghetti”. Isn’t it obvious?
For some reason the main thing I'm wondering here is did you go ahead and buy the stuff to make spaghetti anyway, even if she didn't want any?

It's mostly just curiosity, but I guess it also relates to the concept that you do what you want to do, and invite her along to do what you are doing anyway.
 

crowolf

Don Juan
Joined
Feb 21, 2019
Messages
135
Reaction score
105
Yea, zekko, that was my plan. I had it my head even before we went on the date. And the spaghetti part - I bought them for myself, at least. It was right before the check-out when she said that she is good. And you can’t expect me to just abandon them if she doesn’t wanna join? That would be so silly.

At the end it was like she didn’t want to leave yet. But I was hungry, so I had to come home and do my thing. And leave her go her own way. I probably could have bounced her somewhere so we can go for a dinner outside. But I can’t afford that. And it’s too much providership. I paid the coffee part already.

Hal, you are right. The thing is - I managed to pull this “pull” on a “1st date” twice. And this messed me up to think it can always be that easy. Although I have another 1 failed attempt before this one. Also posted a thread about it.

- - -

Another update: We’ve been snapchatting random stuff. It’s stupid and pointless but my plan is to maybe offer her to go out soon. Today I sent her a preselection photo from a cool event that I attended, and this quickly piqued her interest, for sure. Let’s see if we will meet soon.
 
Last edited:

New_Journey

Master Don Juan
Joined
Oct 7, 2024
Messages
525
Reaction score
386
Age
35
Another update: We’ve been snapchatting random stuff. It’s stupid and pointless but my plan is to maybe offer her to go out soon. Today I sent her a preselection photo from a cool event that I attended, and this quickly piqued her interest, for sure. Let’s see if we will meet soon.
Why are you so invested with this woman who is only using you as a source of entertainment and free validation? Men like you are the ones who finish last because they don't have an ounce of respect for themselves. Go approach & date other women, there are plenty fish in the sea and better.
 
Last edited:

crowolf

Don Juan
Joined
Feb 21, 2019
Messages
135
Reaction score
105
Why are you so invested with this woman who is only using you as a source of entertainment and free validation? Men like you are the ones who finish last because they don't have an ounce of respect for themselves. Go approach date other women, there are plenty fish in the sea and better.
I will try to tag your name on her butt cheek.
 

BPH

Master Don Juan
Joined
Nov 8, 2010
Messages
2,772
Reaction score
1,397
Location
Wilmington, DE
Seems like this was doomed from the start for a first date. You set it up so you had to keep her interested for way too long and then you were gonna drag her back to your place where you cook a meal from scratch? That's like fifth date, not first date, stuff. First dates should be quick in and out where you gauge interest and then have the option to lengthen if it's going well, or you can abort if it isn't. First dates should never take hours and involve anything other than determining whether there's next date potential. It sounds like you were trying to layer multiple date experiences on top of each other which is a lot of pressure for everyone, especially if there isn't immediate chemistry.
He absolutely could've invited her over to his place on the first date - if she were interested enough.

Which she isn't, as evidenced by how long it took to meet up with her in the first place and how many different communication channels OP had to hit to get a positive response.
 
Top