Have I been seduced? Solve this riddle!

[George Gordon]

Hey guys. I want to tell you my story. And I want everyone to give me their perspective and feedback on my situation.

Don’t hold any punches... and I’m sure there will be a few.

I just got back from going out with my ex-girlfriend from over a year ago.

And I’m confused.

I thought I had a good grasp of women... and suddenly, I feel like a complete AFC, like I’m at block one. I’ve been through these boards years ago. And yet I feel clueless like I’ve gone full circle on this one.

Here’s the story...

When I first started seeing my ex, we went out for 2 months before going steady. We didn’t sleep together in that time. We fooled around a lot, and I could tell she was turned on every time, but she refused to sleep with me.

I applied all the common principles found here.

One night she came over and told me she slept with another guy she was seeing. She went to grad with him, and told me she felt obligated because of that.

I ‘let’s be friend’s her’ right then and there.

The next evening she calls me. We screw and then start going steady.

Eventually, I move back to my hometown from the city. She follows me. We plan to move across the country, and do.

Things didn’t go well for me personally, and I moved back home.

She followed a few weeks later.

We continue going out, and she lives with a friend of mine and his girlfriend.

A month later, I breakup with her.

The reason I brokeup with her was because I didn’t fully trust her. First of all, from the incident before we went steady. Second, my gut told me she was cheating on me... but there was never any real evidence and she’s never admitted it—just a hunch.

We bump into each other through mutual friends on and off throughout the coming year. And she’s constantly trying to get my attention... and throws sobbing fits around me.

I ignore her for the most part. But we do get together, lay on my bed and watch a movie one night. But she’s unreponsive to all my advances.

Now here’s the story she told me today...

After I brokeup with her, she had a threesome with my friend and his girlfriend. Then she cheated on her with my friend. She said it was because of our breakup. Bullsh!t detector.

The thing is this guy seems like the ultimate Nice Guy. That’s what confuses me. He’s a real ass underneath, but he’s really ‘nice’.

Then she slept with a guy she used to work for when we were going out. And fooled around with his friend too.

Now she’s seeing another guy. She’s screwing him, but she’s not going steady. I met him at a party. Yet another seemingly Nice Guy.

Now, I’m confused. So I ask her why she refused to sleep with me when we first started dating. I know a woman would never answer this truthfully. And she said she didn’t know.

She continues to tell me that she loves me, but implies that she doesn't want to sleep with me. I ask her about the others guys. "It was just sex." -- What does that mean?

I walk away like I should have done when I first 'let's be friend's her'.

I feel like I’ve been played. Like I’ve been completely seduced into believing this chick was someone she was not... like she formed to my idea of a woman. During our conversation, when I started suspecting it, I started testing her... and she flinched on few.

What I don’t get is that I’m not a Nice Guy. In fact, I’m a jerk. I always get into confrontations with bouncers. I’m aggressive, and sometimes I’m reckless and place myself in dangerous, life-threatening situations for the thrill of it.

But I’ve always been a one-woman type of man.

When we started going out, she said she wanted to marry me. I laughed it off thinking she was naïve. But I’m beginning to wonder if I was the naïve one... while everything she did was a test to figure out what kind of woman I want.

That’s the brunt of it. If anyone wants more details, ask me to clarify them.

Other than that, let me have it between the eyes...

(Note: I'm not interested in newbies belting out "AFC!" That's not helpful. I want constructive feedback ONLY.)

 

[Nighthawk]

Maybe the 'nice guys' are better in bed than you?

 

[George Gordon]

Maybe the 'nice guys' are better in bed than you?

Not sure on that one. I never ask. But she told me once that I gave her 4 orgasms in one session.

The sex was abundant throughout (+7x per week)... except when seperated by distances. The whole time we were going out, she made an excuse to not have sex maybe twice (right after she went on the shot).

Also, women have always commented on what a sexy or sensual dancer I am. If there's any legitimacy between good dancing and good fvcking, I doubt that could have been a reason.

But based on that info, do you think it's still a possibility? Or what else could it have been?

 

[Tomatoes]

What do you want from her?

Sex? Relationship? Both?

How do you feel about her?

 

[mountain]

my friend, i think we are attracted to the same girls... irratic, super sexual, and altogether flakey. There is something exciting about a girl like this, and for the same reason girls can't stop dating jerks, we can't stop seeing these girls. the problem with this situation is that since the girls' actions make no logical sense, you try make sense out of it... and the tendency is to blame yourself for the problem. what if i did this differently? but you have to understand that no matter how well you play it, these girls will flake because they enjoy the drama it creates. they enjoy the desperation.
i'm a one-woman kind of guy, and i've fallen for wild women like this, so i understand your confusion. she is designed to make you doubt yourself and thereby surrender to her femininity. resist it.

 

[George Gordon]

Tomatoes

I want to understand this. What's the answer to the riddle? Is there even an answer? This girl's down a 180 on my perceptions of women... and it defies much of what is taught here.

That's what I want.

Getting back with her now that she screwed my friend, and caused a **** storm in his relationship, would be weird. Not logically interested. But that's logic.

my friend, i think we are attracted to the same girls... irratic, super sexual, and altogether flakey. There is something exciting about a girl like this, and for the same reason girls can't stop dating jerks, we can't stop seeing these girls. the problem with this situation is that since the girls' actions make no logical sense, you try make sense out of it... and the tendency is to blame yourself for the problem. what if i did this differently? but you have to understand that no matter how well you play it, these girls will flake because they enjoy the drama it creates. they enjoy the desperation.
i'm a one-woman kind of guy, and i've fallen for wild women like this, so i understand your confusion. she is designed to make you doubt yourself and thereby surrender to her femininity. resist it.

Thanks mountain. That's makes sense in an illogical kind of way.

But what did you mean by, "they enjoy the desperation"?

Did you mean they enjoy being desperate?

Or did you mean they enjoy creating desperation in men?

She reminds me a little of the character from Fight Club. What does Tyler Durden say about her again? "Be careful with that one. She's a predator posing as a housewife."

So what's your take? Do they do this on purpose, or is this just 'who they are'?

Yesterday she said she wanted to have my kids and be my wife. Where does this sh!t come from? I mean, how many people are inside that head, anyway?

Could you share your story with me? I appreciate that.

 

[mountain]

confusing

Hey George,
First of all, how does this girl defy what is taught here? Seems to me like she is a textbook example.
By "they enjoy the desperation" i meant they enjoy the dramatic feelings created by wrecking sh!t on purpose. It's not guy logical, don't think on it
It sounds like the girl now uses you for emotional support. Read this post that I just put up and see if it sound familiar at all. did you let her take ownership of you?
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=99215

Dealing with women is like any other game. You play by the rules, however illogical, or suffer the consequences.

 

[makinwOmensmOuthdrOp]

This girl is a emotional f' up. There are alot of factors to consider.
It could have been tons of things.
1.Childhood misfortune
2.You
3.She could have learned something that suggested she sleep with other guys to get closer to you. (Jealousy).
4.She fell into depression and is trying to get her emotions stired by creating all this drama.

Basically what everybody else said. IMO she's not worth the hassle(nobody is).

 

[Friendly Otter]

George, that she moves across the country with you, and then follows you back, that means a great deal. It means she is having very serious thoughts about you.

That she has sex after you two had broken up, well, having sex when you're single is normal. You say you broke up with her because you felt you couldn't trust her; what to think of that is impossible to say when all we know about the case is written on a message board. So you just have to decide if you can trust her or not on your own.

She does seem a bit flaky, though, what with the crying and all. You'll just have to decide how flaky and what to think of that on your own too.

 

[Thomas94305]

She withheld sex at first = she wanted you to be her boyfriend, and she didn't want to be seen as a slvt.. If you were not bf material, sounds like she'd slept with you very quickly.

She has a 3some with your friend and his gf..then cheats with your friend = she has a problem respecting relationships. Your suspicion of her cheating is founded, although not proven.

Don't take responsibility for her behavior. If she cheats, she will have bad relationships. You do not owe her anything right now. And, if you want to be caring, or a friend, or whatever, it's not caring at all to "enable" bad behavior. We don't know for sure that she cheated on you. But, she's certainly not building security in her relationships, and is looking for sexual adventure, at the expense of her relationships. Given that's what she wants, she should get that..all of it; meaning boyfriends that leave her is part of what she's asking for.

She doesn't want to choose between good relationships and sex with several guys. She wants both. It's not kind of you to help her do this. I'd set some limits with her, and head for good relationships. If you're suspicious, and have reason to be, then why get too close?

 

[PRMoon]

The only thing to be understood is that people (women) will do erratic irrational things during the course of their life. Switching directions and interest and morals several times a year, a month, a week, a day all of that can be expected from anyone because we are irratioanl and defiant beings. Our social interaction is multi-teired and very complex and the more digging you do, the only thing you really acheive is to find yourself in a deeper and deeper hole.

Having coughed up that philisophical jargon for your reading amusment, I would chalk this one up as life lessoned learned. Did she play you? Doubtful, few people would go through even half the stuff you listed there if there weren't some feelings. Is she promiscuous now because of your breaking up with her? F*ck no! At worst you brought out a part of her that was always there or helped her formulate a new social status for herself concerning men. Both of which are decisions she arrived at on her own and she should own up to because she's an adult. Would the whole thing of been easier if you LJBFed her at the get go? That part is debatable because though you may have lost contact with her, there is always the what if factor. What if you met a girl who put you through an even more baffeling experience? What if things were only slightly different during the experience potentially changing the whole outcome? There's an endless assortment of things that might have come to pass but didn't.

I recommend filing this case closed in your mind. Keep in MINOR contact with the girl just to referance the whole thing, but spend your time wisely and keep your eyes open for other "one woman man" opportunities in the world.

 

[Snoodle]

OMFG

Sad, Very sad. Listen, it would be in your best interests to cut all contact with this broad immediately. Whether you realize it or not, you've got her way up on the pedestal. She fvcking knows it too, you're screwed.

You fvcked up at the get go when she admitted to having sex with another guy when you were supposed to be "going steady." You gave her another chance - immediately! (The next night, for christ's sake). At least you got to tap it - but as for "going steady" again, WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY??????

I sure hope to hell you're not ever thinking about marrying this immature slvt... She's a cheater! What would ever make you think that she wouldn't do it again?

I'm telling you, when you move on and find some other chick, she's going to be ten times better. Trust me. You'll wonder why in the hell you wasted all that time on this first broad... You're self esteem will be higher, she'll actually like you instead of cheat on you. God dammit, you're letting yourself remain trapped in her fvcking woven spider web by giving her the fvcking attention after she displays a sobbing fit. Don't do that. That's her way of controlling you.

Wake up and smell the fvcking coffee. Find another chick. You will.

 

[Marlimus]

this girl is a worthless slvt.

 

[I-am-someone]

I actually agree...
She admitted to cheating on you. If a woman cheats once with me, her soul has become rotten to me and she should be thrown into the garbage bin.
The fact that she could lie about it so coldly just tells you that there is no fvcking way in hell you can ever trust her about ANYTHING ever again.

 

[George Gordon]

Thanks for the feedback guys.

But, no. She never admitted to cheating on me. I suspected it. But there was no real evidence. It was just a gut feeling.

Some of you may have misread the information...

When we were seeing each other, she slept with another guy. There was no commitment yet. I was seeing other women then too. And then after I brokeup with her, she slept with my friend and other guys.

As far as I'm concerned, she's free to do that without an commitment to me.

The thing is we are very similar and compatible. And we had a good relationship... besides the fact that we both had our own issues. But isn't that life -- communicating through both parties issues?

She says she still loves me, and I believe it. My friends have told me that too, ever since we brokeup.

Is this relationship salvagable? is my question.

 

[I-am-someone]

We cannot answer your question, George.
It's kind of like asking to predict the future.

My personal preference would be to move on.
People tend to live in patterns. If you don't trust her, that will come back in the future. You can break patterns, but it tends to be very difficult.
You know all the facts, and only you can predict this, but I've got a hunch that salvaging this relationship will cost you a lot of energy and leave you with nothing to show for it.

 

[MindOverMatter]

When we were seeing each other, she slept with another guy. There was no commitment yet. I was seeing other women then too. And then after I brokeup with her, she slept with my friend and other guys.

As far as I'm concerned, she's free to do that without an commitment to me.

And that's your problem. You should give a f*ck what a girl does right after a breakup. A girl that really loved you would have probably been emotionally messed up and kept away from dating for a while, whereas this sl*t you picked up simply saw it as an oppurtunity to get more d!ck. The fact you know all this sh!t about her character and are wondering whether or not she cheated on you again is a bit sad. No sh!t she cheated on you. She did once before, you let her off the hook, and then she prolly did it again knowing she could get away with it. I have no doubt that she f*cked those people while she was with you too and excused it as being "just sex".

Do yourself a favor and stop trying to figure out this sl*t, don't LJBF her, just cut off contact and move on with your life. Stop being a sucker, be single if you have to until you find a decent girl, but most of all don't keep talking to this b!tch. She doesn't love you, she never did, you (like most guys), spent too much time listening to the sh!T that was coming out of her mouth instead of judging her by her actions.

And don't buy into the myth that if you fix this problem, it will make the two of you a stronger couple in the future. This kind of sh!t just gets worse and worse the longer you stay in it, that's why I'm saying get out of it now and never speak to her again.

 

[KingBeef]

Your ex is a *****!!!! :trouble: :trouble: gET rid of her!!!

 

[three12]

George Gordon,

I am not reading any replies. So I may have missed alot of what was said.

It seems clear that you have misinterperted alot of things. You are not a jerk. Getting into trouble with a bouncer does not make you a jerk. It makes you an ass.

Secondly, you need not be a jerk to get girls to sleep with you.

Thirdly, she screwed a guy at 'grad' I'm taking that to mean she was 17 or 18. Then you went out with her. She'd probably had little sex before that. And shes comfortable enough now to sl*t around. Before then she was probably inexperienced as she hadn't had much sex.

You are not a DJ. You are an AFC. You have a tonne to learn.

You've got plenty of time to learn it.

Forget this girl.

Don't analyse anything.

Don't worry about whether or not you were 'seduced'.

Get back on the horse. Start again.

Scrap EVERYTHING you think you know about girls.

three12.

 

[mrRuckus]

If there's any legitimacy between good dancing and good fvcking, I doubt that could have been a reason.

Women love my sex and i can't dance for sh1t. Luckily they have sex with me before they ever see me dance

Invalid!!!