gunwitch method discussion

[J S Az]

I want to discuss the Gunwitch Method (particularly part 2), and so I'll start it off with some questions

Firstly, I wonder if the Gunwitch Method should really be listed under speed seduction in the DJ Bible? Is it really speed seduction? I mean sure, it mentions how to approach and close in a very short amount of time, but to me, the Gunwitch Method seems like the overall EVERYTHING to know as a DJ.

Secondly, I want to open a discussion about the following three things as related to making a good sun:

1) Don't masturbate so much-- rely on girls for sexual pleasure not yourself. Anyone tested this personally-- how much of an effect does it have in your experience?

2) Don't fantasize in details about things. I'd like to hear what people think about this. I definately agree, like I used to always fantasize in detail about doing certain things before I go to sleep. Now I am trying not to, but I have a hard time falling asleep. What should I do? Do people just think about their day and fall asleep? Do you count sheep? Do you just stare off into nothing?

3) Eat healthy. Cut off all whites. What would be a healthy diet then, and what are its effects?

There's a lot more I'd like to open a discussion about here, but let's start with this. Thanks.

 

[Jariel]

I've made it no secret that I'm not a fan of Gunwitch. It reeks too much of desperation and lack of dignity for my liking, and the goal of it is to get laid, and not necessarily by an attractive woman.

I can't remember his exact words, but the impression I got from something Gunwitch said is that his method is designed to get you so damn horny, you'll f*ck just about anything!

And as the phrase "make the ho say no" suggests, it really is verging on harrassment.

In my opinion, the Gunwitch method is about dropping all respect for yourself and acting on instinct, whereas the DJ style is the opposite and promotes evolving and improving as a man to the point where women are priviledged to be with you and everyone respects you.

 

[J S Az]

Originally posted by Jariel
I've made it no secret that I'm not a fan of Gunwitch. It reeks too much of desperation and lack of dignity for my liking, and the goal of it is to get laid, and not necessarily by an attractive woman.

I can't remember his exact words, but the impression I got from something Gunwitch said is that his method is designed to get you so damn horny, you'll f*ck just about anything!

And as the phrase "make the ho say no" suggests, it really is verging on harrassment.

In my opinion, the Gunwitch method is about dropping all respect for yourself and acting on instinct, whereas the DJ style is the opposite and promotes evolving and improving as a man to the point where women are priviledged to be with you and everyone respects you.

who are you a fan of?

 

[whistler]

Originally posted by J S Az
I want to discuss the Gunwitch Method (particularly part 2), and so I'll start it off with some questions

Firstly, I wonder if the Gunwitch Method should really be listed under speed seduction in the DJ Bible? Is it really speed seduction? I mean sure, it mentions how to approach and close in a very short amount of time, but to me, the Gunwitch Method seems like the overall EVERYTHING to know as a DJ.

Secondly, I want to open a discussion about the following three things as related to making a good sun:

1) Don't masturbate so much-- rely on girls for sexual pleasure not yourself. Anyone tested this personally-- how much of an effect does it have in your experience?

2) Don't fantasize in details about things. I'd like to hear what people think about this. I definately agree, like I used to always fantasize in detail about doing certain things before I go to sleep. Now I am trying not to, but I have a hard time falling asleep. What should I do? Do people just think about their day and fall asleep? Do you count sheep? Do you just stare off into nothing?

3) Eat healthy. Cut off all whites. What would be a healthy diet then, and what are its effects?

There's a lot more I'd like to open a discussion about here, but let's start with this. Thanks.

Gunwitch IS speed seduction, in the sense that its purpose is to let you get in a girls pants asap, nothing more. Most important, as Jariel said, it's not about self-improvement--it's not about becoming more attractive.

Frankly, the benfits of becoming more attractive far out-weigh having a string of ONS's.

As for # 2, fantasizing builds expectation.s Whether they're in the forefornt of your mind or not, they can ruin your game. They can steer your behavior in subtle ways that don't mesh with the reality of the situation.

 

[MindOverMatter]

Jariel brings up some good points, but I disagree about the fact that the GWM is about sleeping with anything that crosses your way. The point of the method is not to try and f*ck everything, but only women that you find attractive.

Second of all, GWM is all about timing in my opinion. If you time it right, you are guaranteed to get laid. If you do it at the wrong time, you fail.

For example, if you are in a club and you do GWM as soon as you approach, it will fail. If you talk to her a bit, dance, build some rapport and then isolate her, it has a very very high success rate, and I have field tested this. You'll be surprised how effective it is at getting a girl to leave with you.

Another example, if you are on a date and are having a drink at a martini bar or something, it's a bad time to go into sexual state. But if you establish rapport at the bar, get her comfortable, and then go for a walk in the park, and you apply GWM, it has a very high success rate (I also field tested this).

As you can see, the key is having some sort of rapport/chemistry. Eye-contact without chemistry is just staring, and it's creepy. If you don't have some kind of chemistry with the girl, or if she is not attracted to you, or your timing is wrong (i.e. you do it before she is comfortable), GWM will creep her out.

It's up to you to test it out, learn where it works, and where it fails. Like I said, you can't learn game from an article, you can only learn it through trial and error.

As for the "make the ho say no", it's it does sound creepy, but remember, the article was written for beginners. A lot of people who first start approaching tend to have very low confidence, and they will sometimes eject early during the approach. It's a defense-mechanism. Their low confidence makes them believe they will be rejected, and in order to save face, they eject. Or they get nervous, and eject, etc. GW says "make the ho say no" in order to teach the AFC some persistance, and make him learn not to give up before he's actually been rejected.

But I agree with you. There are many ways to say "no" besides saying "no i'm not interested", and the non-creepy thing would be to respect that and move on. persistance is good when she's somewhat interested in you, but if she is obviously not interested, persistance is very very bad, and it creeps her out. don't be one of those guys.

as for Jariel, I don't think he is a fan of any method. In terms of game, from what I've read by him, he operates in a similar way that I do. Basically, have a large social network (lots of male/female friends) through which you meet girls, be good looking (that includes dressing well, working out and being in amazing shape etc), and basically be the best possible man you can be.

In other words, be a prize. When the girls see you as a prize, you don't need neg-hits, C&F, GWM, etc. You can be yourself, (you can even be afc from time to time, just not too much) and still get laid and have girls be obsessed with you.

 

[Jariel]

Originally posted by J S Az
who are you a fan of, if I may ask?

I don't really look to anyone in particular as a role model, but there are some guys on this forum I have a lot of respect for and who have helped me see things clearly. I also have hell of a lot of admiration for some of the guys in the H&F forum who have dedicated themselves to working out, diet and transforming not only their appearance, but their state of mind.

It's a long route, but it really is worth it in the long run.

 

[Jariel]

Originally posted by MindOverMatter
In other words, be a prize. When the girls see you as a prize, you don't need neg-hits, C&F, GWM, etc. You can be yourself, (just not too much) and still get laid and have girls be obsessed with you.

Absolutely spot on!

 

[J S Az]

so you guys would like someone like Pook?

 

[frivolousz21]

my role model is myself

really...I am proud of who I am and who im still becoming!

 

[Visceral]

Originally posted by Jariel
In my opinion, the Gunwitch method is about dropping all respect for yourself and acting on instinct, whereas the DJ style is the opposite and promotes evolving and improving as a man to the point where women are priviledged to be with you and everyone respects you.

I just had a revelation regarding this whole self-improvement thing ... bear with me.

We all know about those hopeless AFCs giving women flowers, chocolates, bad poetry, expensive gifts, dinner and a movie, ad nauseum in order to impress the girl and qualify himself as a worthwhile man.

We're told here that this is bad. We're told that we need to bust our ass in the gym to get a ripped body. We’re told we need to bust our ass in the rat race to become rich and powerful. We’re told that we need to be stimulating, entertaining, exciting, etc. Has anyone wondered why?

I’ve realized that it’s because that’s what women want us to be! We believe that we’re doing it for ourselves, but that’s just a lie. We’re doing it because it’s what women want!

Aside from the fact that this is the message that Madison Avenue's been sending us for who knows how long ... I just realized that self-improvement is fundamentally no different; where the AFC gives the woman stuff in order to impress and qualify, the DJ turns himself into the stuff ... but he does it for exactly the same reasons, to impress and qualify.

What we're told to idolize as self-improvement - the self-interested expansion of our power that even Nietzsche would be proud of - is really nothing more than AFC "giving", just adapted for the shallow and materialistic women of the 21st Century.

IMO, what Gunwitch is trying to say is: "What the Hell are you doing? You're giving the woman everything she could ever want - a hot body, a silver tongue, and a big, throbbing bank account - just like a goddamn AFC!"

Self-improvement is nothing more than turning yourself into her trophy, into her fantasy made flesh. Just like those AFCs you all claim you're better than, it's never been about you and what you want for yourself, but always about her and what she wants from you.

"The Matrix has you" indeed ... man, I feel sick.

 

[HKgunslinger]

Gunwitch is a desperate hack. He basically rules out all "game", doesn't show how to demonstrate value, or elicit values, any of that. He just goes on the premise that all women are horny and want to get laid, so get a boner and go approach them. Bad fvcking idea.
This guy is an idiot who probably sleeps with many ugly women. And WTF is up with his stupid-a$$ "rating system" whereby you can judge what kind of women you will get based on criteria given? Talk about idiotic, self-limiting beliefs, under the guise of "scientific data".

'Slinger

 

[HKgunslinger]

Originally posted by Visceral
Self-improvement is nothing more than turning yourself into her trophy, into her fantasy made flesh. Just like those AFCs you all claim you're better than, it's never been about you and what you want for yourself, but always about her and what she wants from you.

Well God forbid we try to improve upon ourselves before we try to drag women into our lives, eh?

To be THE PRIZE, you must BE THE FVCKING PRIZE! And that means self-improvement! Women are not going to be attracted to a lazy fat-a$$ who does nothing to better himself or his situation!

Taking care of your body (exercise, lifting weights)
Being well-groomed
Learning conversation/social skills

And if YOU don't care about you enough to improve on those things, then there's no reason for any woman to give two sh!ts and a nickel about you either!

'Slinger

 

[mistyc]

Originally posted by Jariel
I've made it no secret that I'm not a fan of Gunwitch. It reeks too much of desperation and lack of dignity for my liking, and the goal of it is to get laid, and not necessarily by an attractive woman.

So you missed the part where Gunwitch talks about approaching "your 10", ie, women who turn YOU on regardless of if hollywood tells you Britney Spears is a 10 while you don't think she's hot at all..

I can't remember his exact words, but the impression I got from something Gunwitch said is that his method is designed to get you so damn horny, you'll f*ck just about anything!

That is, like you said, your impression... Find the quote, or stop lying.

And as the phrase "make the ho say no" suggests, it really is verging on harrassment.

No, it suggests not giving up till you get an actual rejection VS an imagined one (ie, "oh she didn't touch her hair so I ejected to find another woman!")

In my opinion, the Gunwitch method is about dropping all respect for yourself and acting on instinct, whereas the DJ style is the opposite and promotes evolving and improving as a man to the point where women are priviledged to be with you and everyone respects you.

GWM1 is about the steps you have to take to get laid. GWM2 is about improving yourself to be the attractive natural masculine male women want. Dropping all respect for yourself? rofl! Maybe dropping the stupid part of "pride" and "ego" that get in the way of achieving your goals...

DJ style seems to be about whining on sosuave forum rofl Thankfully not everyone does it....

oh BTW, as an old-timer here who hasn't posted in months or even a year, and who used to whine he couldn't get women.. Thanks to gunwitch's methods and his constant advice and coaching on pua chat, I have finally achieved my first lay with a FREAKING HOT GIRL who is so nice and passionate...

mistyc.

 

[ketostix]

I don't know why some people are down on the GWM. The way I see it most natural pickups follow that method to a large extent. It's really just natural game, no routines, no canned material. You approach, get rapport with fluff talk(not verbalizing anything sexual, you do that with body language, i.e. sexual state), look for her buying signs then push for isolation. Also Gunwitch states that basically each person's success with girls higher on the hotness continuum will vary. I don't think Gunwitch recommends to only target UG. Anyway it's really just a natural game method where you're congruent with your own personality and you rely on nature to take it's course really. Some people find GWM creepy. I don't know C+F, opinion openers, patterns and the like can be pretty creepy too, especially when they're not congruent with your personality.

 

[Visceral]

I agree, GWM is meant to be 100% natural game.

As for only working on ugly girls, I disagree.

If ugliness is involved, I think it's that GWM is meant to bring success to ugly guys, especially since Gunwitch makes such a big deal about all the fat, ugly, poor guys he's seen pull good women, as well as his own physical shortcomings.

IMO, GWM is meant to make it possible to get laid even if you have nothing going for you.

 

[mistyc]

GWM is the essence behind it all. The 100% logical way.

ie:

If you wanna get laid,

- make an effort
- realize looks matter but ****, make an effort anyway (to improve your looks AND to game women)
- relax about things, she won't bite your arm off if you try to **** her
- assume rapport, don't be a weirdo
- be in sexual state and approach women you desire. No desire for sex = no sex
- persist past obstacles, like "awkward" silences, "uhmm aww" when it comes to moving or isolating, etc
- etc

It's the essence behind it all.. Any successful PU has this unless the girl is doing all the driving and the guy is passive, or unless the guy is going to a hooker...

 

[whistler]

Originally posted by Visceral
I’ve realized that it’s because that’s what women want us to be! We believe that we’re doing it for ourselves, but that’s just a lie. We’re doing it because it’s what women want!

We're doing it because that's what women want and we want women.

So?

The difference between self-improvement and AFC methods is simple. Self-improvement works.

 

[whistler]

Originally posted by HKgunslinger
Gunwitch is a desperate hack. He basically rules out all "game", doesn't show how to demonstrate value, or elicit values, any of that. He just goes on the premise that all women are horny and want to get laid, so get a boner and go approach them. Bad fvcking idea.
This guy is an idiot who probably sleeps with many ugly women. And WTF is up with his stupid-a$$ "rating system" whereby you can judge what kind of women you will get based on criteria given? Talk about idiotic, self-limiting beliefs, under the guise of "scientific data".

'Slinger

Actually, it fits with science (more or less).

Here