Getting huge in prison

[Just a Shot Away]

I don't believe most these guys are getting steroids behind bars, nor do I believe they are getting protein powder. And the food that prisons serve is basically just empty calories, **** like mac and cheese with baloney and prisoners buy a ****load of junk food from the commissary. I just don't know how these guys are doing it.

Process of elimination, man! I don't buy that all those dudes that get sent to prison just happen to have great genetics. That doesn't sound at all likely. Yes, criminals probably have higher natural testosterone levels but I'd say that's about it.

These guys do two main things that I don't: sleep a LOT, and do twice a day workouts. It's gotta be one of the two, or maybe both.

 

[EFFORT]

Race is a huge factor here. The body type you described is quiet standard for Black males without much if any work.

 

[shaunuk]

Hey speakeasy, I don't agree mate. Prisons are rammed full of drugs, at least in my country... (England). You can get any drugs you want.

Prisoners can get protein powder...why not.

Like EFFORT I think race is a massive factor. I know black guys who have never touched a weight in their life, don't eat particularly well, drink booze all the time...and they're "buff" and ripped (basically have a six pack). The black guys I know who aren't big could eat a buffalo everyday and not get fat.

Also why is no one mentioning the fact that these guys could've been big WHEN they actually went to jail. Many of these guys will've been training for YEARS before they went to jail, then kept doing whatever they were doing, to a smaller extent (including possibility of steroids).

I also want to add that I have never in my life seen a muscular prisoner apart from 2 black guys I know who were already "big" (they rarely workout)

 

[Colossus]

Yes, everyone's different, but there are NO 250-lb. buff guys consuming a mere 2K calories and gaining muscle...it ain't happening ANYWHERE.

^^What he said. It's physiologically impossible. They need 2,000 cals just to maintain daily functions. Mass is built from raw materials you put in your body; it isn't just magically synthesized from thin air or "converted" from fat. Think how many calories a 250 lb man burns just doing normal activities: climbing stairs, working in the yard, chores, the gym...that's a lot of tissue to perfuse and nourish.


Like I said before, it's likely these "huge" guys in prison were pretty big when they got to prison. Also, they are probably black. And again, what is "huge", "buff", or "ripped"?

I also weigh between 225-230. I'm 6'. If I'm not consistently consuming 3,500+ calories per day, I will lose weight. Slowly, but it will go. If I wanted to GAIN weight, I would have to consume about 5,000 calories per day, which is a lot of work. Try eating 5,000 calories a day, every day, for 6 weeks. By the end of that time you'll be so sick of stuffing food in your face you'll just want to eat lettuce leaves for a week.

I consider "huge" to be a guy of average height @ a muscular 240 lbs or more with aesthetic BF levels. But it's all relative. When I was 198 lbs I thought 220 was huge. And when I'm 240 I'll probably think 265 is the new huge.

Oh yeah, because I know you're thinking it: EVEN if you threw steroids into the mix, they aren't just going to synthesize new muscle from nowhere. Those building materials HAVE to come from somewhere, even if high levels of exogenous hormones are signalling cells to retain nitrogen and glycogen and add more contractile filaments---You cant build a 3 story brick house with two pallets of bricks.

 

[The Message Boy]

Colossus says,

^What he said. It's physiologically impossible. They need 2,000 cals just to maintain daily functions. Mass is built from raw materials you put in your body.

That's your theory. I know what I saw.

Espi says,

A guy who weighs 250 lbs is NOT going to gain single pound if consumes a mere 2K a day...indeed, he'll struggle to maintain those 250 lbs.

Again, that's YOUR theory. I know what I saw lol.

EFFORT says,

Race is a huge factor here. The body type you described is quiet standard for Black males without much if any work.

What??

So which one is it guys? Is it what EFFORT said and it's based on genetics or is it what Espi said and it's based on calories consumed?

What about the elephant in the ROOM and the actual individual person's body?? Has THAT every crossed your minds lol.

That's what I've been saying since day one, MY body and YOUR body and HIS body are three different bodies. What HE can do most likely won't work for me, and what YOU do probably won't work for me, what I DO probably won't work for any of you.

For example, this right here:

Espi says,

Every day, I consume 2000 calories per day from drinking 3 doses of Cytogainer protein mix...those 3 doses alone contain 9g of creatine, 6 g of glutamine, 200 grams in protein and about 250 grams in complex carbs...

In addition, I take in 2000 hi-protein and carb calories from nutrient-rich whole foods...tuna, lean beef (93/7), eggs, whole-grain brown rice...old-fasioned oatmeal...

MY BODY cannot take all of that. Excuse my "french" but I would be shytting all night! This is what I keep telling you guys, nobody's BODY is the same. There's NO one size fits all answers, which is WHY I HATE personal trainers because they are like you guys, they prescribe one size fits all solutions to a very individual problem which should be tailored based on trial and error NOT theory.

Don't know, just my take on what worked for me. I'm no bodybuilder competition looking guy but when I take my shirt off girls like what they see and that's all it's about

 

[Kerpal]

lol @ black guys having super genetics or whatever. Most black guys I see are fatter/more out of shape than most white guys I see. Big and muscular with a 6 pack is certainly not "standard" for people of ANY race. The fact is most inmates, and most people in general, are not in very good shape at all and it has more to do with their diets and levels of activity than their genetics.

You can't pick out a tiny percentage of any group and claim that all members of that group are that way. People see a couple of prisoners with good genetics that they focus the camera on on Lockup MSNBC and suddenly decide that all prisoners are juggernauts, while ignoring the dozens of skinnyfat inmates in the background.

 

[EFFORT]

So which one is it guys? Is it what EFFORT said and it's based on genetics or is it what Espi said and it's based on calories consumed?


Espi is saying something that isn't up for debate, high calories+progressive overload

I'm saying the majority of the guys that you consider huge/ripped (175-200lbs range 10-15%) are that way from there genetics. This doesn't discount what espi says, if these guys were to increase calories and do a weight lifting program with progressive overload on Deads/Squats/Bench/Rows/Military Presses they would become A LOT bigger

What about the elephant in the ROOM and the actual individual person's body?? Has THAT every crossed your minds lol.

This is what I've been saying, Genetics....unless you have a different definition.

That's what I've been saying since day one, MY body and YOUR body and HIS body are three different bodies. What HE can do most likely won't work for me, and what YOU do probably won't work for me, what I DO probably won't work for any of you.

The concept of progressively getting stronger on Deads/Squats/Bench/Rows/MP with a surplus of calories isn't up for debate. (Sure you can use some unconventional form of training Sandbags, BW exercises and see results, but that same person would achieve better results via the big lifts) The practice will look different in terms of what routine/cal totals/cardio scheme works best for the given person.



MY BODY cannot take all of that. Excuse my "french" but I would be shytting all night! This is what I keep telling you guys, nobody's BODY is the same.

Exactly and no one is saying this. He's not saying you should eat 5k cals. But you will need to eat more cals and get progressively stronger to grow, the personal application of the variables (routine/diet/frequency/cardio/supplements) is what customizes it to your body. I really don't think anyone here believes in a one size fits all no variable adjusting training philosophy.



There's NO one size fits all answers, which is WHY I HATE personal trainers because they are like you guys, they prescribe one size fits all solutions to a very individual problem which should be tailored based on trial and error NOT theory.

Looks like your interpreting a "one concept fits all" for a "one size fits all" Like I said before the concepts are going to fit all Muscle gain = Progressive Overload, Calorie Surplus, Staying Lean/Fat Loss= Cardio+ Diet Changes..... The variables are what you customize for that persons goals/body/circumstances. In American football you have to rush/pass/kick to advance up field. Its not up for debate. Everyone knows those are the options, but you have to customize those options based on a lot of factors. Same thing here.


Don't know, just my take on what worked for me. I'm no bodybuilder competition looking guy but when I take my shirt off girls like what they see and that's all it's about

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[EFFORT]

lol @ black guys having super genetics or whatever. Most black guys I see are fatter/more out of shape than most white guys I see. Big and muscular with a 6 pack is certainly not "standard" for people of ANY race. The fact is most inmates, and most people in general, are not in very good shape at all and it has more to do with their diets and levels of activity than their genetics.

You can't pick out a tiny percentage of any group and claim that all members of that group are that way. People see a couple of prisoners with good genetics that they focus the camera on on Lockup MSNBC and suddenly decide that all prisoners are juggernauts, while ignoring the dozens of skinnyfat inmates in the background.

I thought it was common knowledge that black guys generally have better genetics for building muscle/staying lean/athletics. Respectable trainers like IA and DC who've trained countless people from different races say the same thing.

"Black people in general USUALLY have better genetics for athletics. I don't know any strength coaches that have trained a lot of people of mixed races that will not tell you that including myself.

IA"


"I have trained at least 2,000 people, probably more like 3,000 and have NEVER had a great Japanese or Chinese lifter even though I have trained a BUNCH of people from this descent. Yes, they get bigger and stronger but I haven't worked with one yet that developed into a good bodybuilder, which is something that I commonly achieve with other races. I don't particularly care if I am PC. Most black guys I work with are very easy to train, they train, eat, sleep, grow--simple. I have to use a lot of intricacies with the average white guy, even though most whites have an OK level of genetic capacity for lifting. People from Arab nations also usually suck at lifting--sorry guys, I just call them like I see them. And I am one of the most non-racist people you will ever find and believe we are ONE species--people/Homo-sapiens. But there are district differences in intrinsic abilities, and to not see and believe such is just foolish.

IA"

 

[Kerpal]

Um, are we talking bodybuilding here or actual performance? Bodybuilding is men on a stage in thongs and oil showing off their bodies for other men. It has nothing to do with being athletic, quite the opposite in fact.

Anyway, you are again using anecdotal stories and focusing on small groups of people. Statistically, blacks in the US actually have higher rates of obesity, diabetes, etc. than whites. The "standard" body type for black people, and people of all races, is more like this than this, and I believe it has more to do with their diets and activity levels than their genetics.

Now at the highest levels of athletics, certainly some races may have certain advantages over others in various sports. For example, most sprinters are black, most swimmers are white, etc. But you can't look at this extremely small group of people and make extrapolations as to entire races of people.

 

[Colossus]

That's your theory. I know what I saw.

Sorry sonny but it's not theory, these are proven, observed physiological limitations. Why is this so hard for you to understand? You CANNOT build muscle from thin air! Thinking someone could add substantial mass with a meager nutrient intake is comic-book mythology.

Further, it has been shown that blacks tend to have a higher percentage of type II (fast-twitch) muscle fibers than most whites. This partially explains their dominance in sprinting, football, and explosive athletics. This is on a per-population basis; so if you were to take a group of 100 random white men and 100 random black men you would likely find a greater natural propensity in black males for explosive athletic performance, and muscle size. Type II fibers have much more potential for hypertrophy than type I fibers. There are peer-reviewed studies backing this and any seasoned strength and conditioning coach will tell you the same. Blacks also have the highest rates of obesity, but it has also been shown that Type II fiber prevalence in the body correlates with increased risk of obesity. My opinion is that racial dietary factors are more responsible for the disparity, but that's another topic.

AND---to edify this even further, the US prison population (as of 2005) was comprised of 2,531 blacks, 957 hispanics, and 353 whites per 100,000 population. This is US Census data, not some made-up stat.

You need to refrain from spouting your mouth off on topics you know nothing about. One person's subjective observation is not statistically valid; not for arguments and much less for population-based statements.

 

[EFFORT]

Um, are we talking bodybuilding here or actual performance? Bodybuilding is men on a stage in thongs and oil showing off their bodies for other men. It has nothing to do with being athletic, quite the opposite in fact.

Talking in general, a Black guy will have a leaner more muscular body without much work, not talking about bodybuilder size....talking about the standard prison size guys that the OP is calling huge 175-200 lean

Anyway, you are again using anecdotal stories and focusing on small groups of people. Statistically, blacks in the US actually have higher rates of obesity, diabetes, etc. than whites. The "standard" body type for black people, and people of all races, is more like this than this, and I believe it has more to do with their diets and activity levels than their genetics.

Studies have been done on this, its very common knowledge, Colossus summed it up well

Now at the highest levels of athletics, certainly some races may have certain advantages over others in various sports. For example, most sprinters are black, most swimmers are white, etc. But you can't look at this extremely small group of people and make extrapolations as to entire races of people.

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[blinkwatt101]

I'd like to chime in on the whole 'black' thing as well. I don't think they are leaner per say. But the darker you are,the more lighting works in your favor to show off curves.

Why do you think white/lighter skinned people tan? Helps you to look leaner. Now go look to see what pros like Jay Cutler and them do to their skin.....it's looks groce.

(I wish the golden days of bodybuilding still existed,and they were still valued,they didn't tan to this extent and their skin still looked real)

 

[Just a Shot Away]

Why do you think white/lighter skinned people tan? Helps you to look leaner. Now go look to see what pros like Jay Cutler and them do to their skin.....it's looks groce.

Yeah, even black bodybuilders tan, though. It's true. Black guys are predisposed to being better at building muscle. But there's plenty of huge freakin' hispanic dudes in prison as well. AND white guys, so...for what it's worth, it's not only genetics.

But not all white guys look gross after tanning. I mean look at the guy on the left. He still looks good, you know?

In all seriousness though, a lot of guys probably just get a lot of food from the outside to supplement their 2k calories from prison food. Lots of tuna cans I assume, bread, tons of peanut butter, etc...

 

[Bible_Belt]

There needs to be a real study on what's going on in prison. A lot of people have asked this question and there seem to be few clear answers. I don't believe most these guys are getting steroids behind bars, nor do I believe they are getting protein powder. And the food that prisons serve is basically just empty calories, **** like mac and cheese with baloney and prisoners buy a ****load of junk food from the commissary. I just don't know how these guys are doing it.

I asked a friend of mine this question. He was locked up for a while. There were no weights or exercise equipment allowed in the jail, which was actually a tent city in the desert. The food was garbage; sometimes a meal would be bbq sauce on a piece of white bread. Protein powder or any nutritional supplement was considered contraband. You could buy extra food from the commissary, but it was all junk food, chips and candy.

He said he left prison in the best shape of his life, huge arms and chest, 30 pounds heavier than he is now. I asked him basically the question that was quoted, what do prisoners have that lets them get big?

The answer...time. Prisoners have more time on their hands than you and I can imagine. That is the part of the punitive theory behind jail - the boredom. If you do enough exercises over enough time, it does not matter what you eat. They did body weight exercises, and because they couldn't use weights they would go into the bathroom and fill up trash bags with water, and then use those like sandbags to work out. Someone had to watch for guards, because the water bag was contraband, and they would all be punished if caught.

None of this makes eating bbq sauce on white bread a good idea. Obviously, diet matters in helping you get the most from your workout. But if you are locked in a room all day with nothing better to do than workout, you can still be muscular.

 

[Drum&Bass]

He said he left prison in the best shape of his life, huge arms and chest, 30 pounds heavier than he is now. I asked him basically the question that was quoted, what do prisoners have that lets them get big?

The answer...time. Prisoners have more time on their hands than you and I can imagine. That is the part of the punitive theory behind jail - the boredom. If you do enough exercises over enough time, it does not matter what you eat. They did body weight exercises, and because they couldn't use weights they would go into the bathroom and fill up trash bags with water, and then use those like sandbags to work out. Someone had to watch for guards, because the water bag was contraband, and they would all be punished if caught.

None of this makes eating bbq sauce on white bread a good idea. Obviously, diet matters in helping you get the most from your workout. But if you are locked in a room all day with nothing better to do than workout, you can still be muscular.

I thought I already explained this on page 1 of this thread ??

Lots of guys and gals who I've met in different gyms I've trained at who only eat 2 meals a day and work hard to support their families find time to work out in a gym and are muscular as hell !!!!

I truly don't believe someone needs to consume excess calories to become big and strong. Look at the new studies conducted on protein intake !! for years everyone blindly believed that in order to become muscular one needed to overload on protein, when in reality 20 - 25 grams of protein per meal is enough for hypertrophy.

Im sure genetics has its part in having a nice physique...BUT.......if the entire world worked out FREQUENTLY, as in several times a day...and ate minimal calories which prevented them from being in a constant state of hunger, Im pretty sure the amount of healthy muscular looking physiques of the population would be impressive.

Say what you will, throw studies at me if you want...

If you want to get big and muscular focus on frequency of lifting, I wouldnt worry so much about progressive over load, just do something ALL the time and you will grow.

 

[Kerpal]

BTW, to chime in on racial dispositioning: blacks are by far the physically superior race...I'm surprised that people even debate that. One need only point to football, baseball, or basketball to prove blacks' superiority in physical/athletic prowess. They'd dominate hockey, too, if it weren't for the cultural/socioeconomic divide of that sport.

Also, most blacks are way more muscular and dense than whites...which is why very few blacks don't swim competitively...they don't have the ideal physical disposition.

Let me make an analogy:

"Whites are by far the mentally superior race. One needs only to point to new inventions, scientific discoveries, great artworks, etc. to prove whites' superiority in mental prowess. Most whites are way smarter than blacks, which is why very few blacks create new inventions, make scientific discoveries or great artworks. They don't have the ideal intelligence."

See, there are many factors at play in both situations. It has to do with a lot more than just genetics. I really don't think the whole racial supremacy thing is a road we want to go down, especially because you can make that argument cut both ways, and people's feelings will get hurt

Anyway, my argument is simply that muscular and athletic with low bodyfat is not the standard body type for any group of people. "Standard" means that it applies to most members of a group. Just go outside and look around, I certainly don't see any race/ethnicity who are mostly made up of muscular and athletic people :crackup:

 

[EFFORT]

Nothing productive is coming from this thread, should probably lock it quik.

 

[Just a Shot Away]

It's not just time. I've been the same size for two+ years now, and go to the gym regularly (with some layoffs here and there) and try to eat as much as possible.

The mystery persists.

 

[Bible_Belt]

It's not just time. I've been the same size for two+ years now, and go to the gym regularly (with some layoffs here and there) and try to eat as much as possible.

The mystery persists.

But what if they locked you inside the gym and never let you leave? That's what I mean by "time." It's the spare time involved in daily life...hours upon hours of it.

 

[SkillzthatKillz]

Espi has a very American way of thinking in terms of race and athleticism. White Europeans are dominating sports right now. Haha remember that joke in boxing “never bet on the white guy” News Flash! The heavyweight champion of the world is white! Look at the UFC or soccer. Look at strong man competitions the winners of that are all white. Wake up people there’s a lot of racism against whites (in America) in boxing and in the NFL do some research and you will see.

I think it’s wrong to say anyone race is superior in anyway to the other. I understand this is a very touchy subject so ill leave it at that.