Does your career define you?

[Slickster]

Hello, mods feel free to move this if you must. I'm posting here in hopes of getting some mature responses from those with some wisdom.


A guy I work with (my boss) has recently lost his job. The organization we work for has decided to go in a new direction and my boss butted heads with too many people over the changes that are coming. The powers that be have seen to it that he is gone.

It's been a pretty sad couple of months since we found out he is leaving. He is a very popular guy who has done a lot of great things for us. He is extremely intelligent and a total workaholic.

I had a pretty good conversation with him the day before he left and he said some things to me that have left me thinking. One thing he told me was that he has never been without a job since he was 14 years old. He has never once just had a couple of weeks or months to just "be". I find this astonishing.

The one statement he made that really has me thinking is "My career has always defined my life."

Now I respect his dedication to his work and that he pours his entire life into it but I can't help feeling pretty sad for this guy. He has been working SO hard for the past 40+ years that I have to wonder if he even really "knows" himself. This guy lives, breathes, and sh!ts his job. There is nothing else for him. There isn't enough time for there to be anything else. If there was he'd simply work some more. I told him that he should take a couple months off and travel. I told him that maybe he would learn something about himself. He told me that if he did that he would die!

So this has got me thinking about all the people I know who have similar views and of course myself, and what "defines" my life. It's an interesting topic and I thought I would throw it out there to hear some other viewpoints. We hear topics about men becoming a complete "package" and that eventually leads to success with women etc. I think a lot about the definition of success and how much that has changed for me over the years.

I see a lot of friends so caught up in their careers that I wonder if they will end up with huge regrets in the future. I heard a great quote recently. Something along the lines of:

"When you are lying on your deathbed nobody wishes they had more money, or worked harder."

I have another friend who recently found out he has terminal cancer. Watching how his life has changed since he found out is truly an eye opener. He too was a career guy and all the things that he focused his life on are now meaningless.

Trying to find a meaning or a purpose in life seems like a pretty deep topic but somehow I can't help feeling that the answer is a simple one and it is staring all of us right in the face.

 

[Boilermaker]

Does your career define you ?

Yes, what you do in life, ultimately defines you.

You may not call that your career, but other people will find out what you do, and they will define you accordingly.

Short answer.

Edit : What people say in their deathbeds isn't their most coherent thought anyway. People do and say all kinds of shíts in their deathbeds. Why is that the most important or accurate description of their long life story anyway? People live like they will never die, and suddenly become Buddhas, when they learn they will die? .. and we have to take that distorted bull-crap as their ultimate wisdom?

Edit 2: Besides, I don't understand what defines a man other than what he does in life. We don't hunt, we don't struggle to survive, we only PRODUCE. What do
you produce? If you take out what a man does in his life, you are pretty much left with coffee house conversations and liquid stuff like SoSuave posts.


I am astonished that you are astonished with your boss' simple sentiment, it's obvious that what he did should be a very large part of who he is/he was. Otherwise, he's an animal who eats, sleeps, consumes and dies, like about anything else that lives on the planet.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Slickster,
"Does your career define you"...well yeah but no more than you define your career...
Theres a time for all things Slickster,and you do need money,but it is a means to an end rather than the end itself...
You mention many new insights into life,yes what you describe is a rite of Passage most of us go through...Believe me without contradiction the things I value most...Health,Family,being loved by and Fvucking numerous Women,my Dog and my thirst for life!

 

[user43770]

We all have different values; some people couldn't give a sh1t about family and friends. If your job is what brings you the most happiness, I don't see why you would regret having spent your life doing it. Except for the grass is always greener scenario, which probably plays out quite often.

The only reason to truly regret how you've lived your life is if you spent it doing something you didn't enjoy. In a world where most people buy things they don't need, go into large amounts of debt and then spend the rest of their lives trying to pay for them, this is a regular occurrence.

 

[switch]

i only work bcuz the money is good and i spend a lot.

Other than that i hate this job.its boring and pathetic.im surrounded by people who think they sh!t golden poop.
suck,faggotry and lots of estrogen filled pvssies roam my profession.
I cant even talk about "hunting" since people immediately call me a "butcher".

Im saving so i can buy a small hangar and turn it into a workshop,for wood,tanning and metallugry...i wanna build my own canoe,maybe a piano even ...

So no,my job does not define me,its just a source of money so i can do d stuff that i want.
I will retire by 40 and go out to live in siberian woods since mankind is turning into a bleeding estrogen smelling vag!na and i want to stay away from its stinking corpse as much as possible.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Switch,
Liked your post,but have you considered that accumulating Mazooma till fourty might change you?...maybe going to live in the Taiga with the Bears and Mosquitoes wont appeal then,you change,Promise!

 

[Bible_Belt]

Does your career define you?

I don't have one. And I don't feel undefined.

The only people who understand why I'd rather grow tomatoes than practice law tend to be the career types who are burnt out on having spent so much of their life in a career that they don't enjoy.

 

[Alvafe]

I say what define you is what you like to do the most, I know some guy he pretty much works on his own company, plays MMOs, and have a family, but what really define him if you want to label him for one thing is his dirty bike racing, every single weekend there he is in some off road place running getting dirty or working on his bike.

I know others he is more know as being with his family then his work and of course some who spend so much time working he don't ahve time for his family.

your prioritys will define what you are, also take note you shouldn't let other people label on you define who you are, you should do what you want not something to make otehr people confortable about they lifes

@boilerMaker
about we don't struggle to survive, I say every day we wake up and go out of your bed is your fight for survival, remember one day you can not go back to your home, everyday is a fight easy or hard one will depend, but its always a fight for survival

 

[Die Hard]

Slick, from what you wrote it seems that you're thinking about this subject in terms of either-or. As if there is only one thing that defines a man, as if there is only one thing that gives his life true purpose, be it his job, his family, his dating life or whatever.
Ideally, a man should strive to excel in all the different areas of life.

A successful career generally means earning good money and money can lead to great material wealth, more succes with women, better chances at sustaining a family etc.

At the same time, a great career can be about something else than money. For example, becoming an important political figure and using that position to positively influence other people's lifes (think Gandhi).
Hell, you could dedicate your life to become the best dancer in the world and may not earn sh!t from it, but if dancing is your big passion in life, being the no.1 in the world will mean so much more to you than money and you will probably look back at your life with much satisfaction from your deathbed. Even if you never had money, or girls...or other stuff.

You can be defined by one thing in life or by many things in life, this differs from person to person. Excelling at one area of life might compensate for what you lack in another area of life.

Ultimately, I think a man and his life are defined by how true he stayed to himself. You yourself decide what's important in life. One man might pursue a great career because his parents raised him that way and he's really doing it for their approval. I don't think that man is being true to himself and I don't think he will look back at his career with much satisafction from his deathbed. Another man might do it because he wants money to feed his wife and children children children and offer them a good life. I think that man is a lot more true to himself and will look back on his career with much more satisfaction from his deathbed. They guys may have had the exact same career, but the difference is that one stayed a lot more true to himself than the other.

All roads lead to Rome... Whatever road you are on, you must stay true to yourself. Otherwise, change roads.

 

[Colossus]

This is a good topic and I think it's something all men face sooner or later.

My father is the Fire Chief in a very prominent ski town here in Colorado. He is essentially at the top of his profession--makes very good money, gets tons of perks, and has a lot of social cred just because of the high-profile nature of the town. Anyways, he is nearing retirement in the next 5 or so years, and he is having a lot of existential thoughts about his life and what he will "be" once he retires. He has always been Chief, but once he is done, he'll just be another 65 year old man, as he puts it.

He has been a functional workaholic most of his life, in that he has been a good father, son, and husband, but he does not know how to handle himself without work. Even in his free time, he cant sit still or watch a whole movie without getting up and fixing something or doing chores.

I am pretty much the opposite; I work hard when I need to but I'm more of a "work to live" kinda guy. I live for my free time and my other pursuits. I do have pride in my profession and I busted my nuts to get here, but essentially my job facilitates the rest of my life.

I have zero qualms with this kind of life, and to be honest I doubt I ever will. Work does define men in a social sense, and women especially place a lot of value on our careers and resources. But at the end of the day, you get the most meaning out of these things:

Helping others (be it knowledge, skills, labor, or time)
Cultivating and maintaining personal relationships (family, woman, friends, children)
Consistently pursuing novel challenges (new hobbies or personal goals)
Making an honest living


Work is an essential part of life. And I dont mean just in a monetary sense to put food on your table, but to have purpose. A man without any work is a man without purpose. And work is not always synonymous with a JOB, work is essentially any labor that you do which produces a harvest.

Work will mean different things to different people, but we were MADE to work, in different capacities. I've always said if I inherited a fortune or won the lottery, I would still work. I would still have a job (at least part time), where I punched in and punched out and used my skills for some kind of good.

Everyone always says "oh if I won the lottery I would never work another day in my life". Well then you would also be the most unfulfilled person in the world. All your play and hobbies would have no meaning. After awhile, even cool stuff like fly fishing and backpacking and cars and travel would get old, because you would have no heterogeneity in your life. Those things would lose their luster, and you would be unbalanced.

I cant say whether or not I enjoy life more than guys who live to work, but I suspect that I do. I may not be as rich as they are, but I do have balance, which in my estimation is the recipe for general human happiness.

 

[Rubirosa]

I hope my rambling here makes some sense.....
Humans have 3 basic instincts in this order...
1) Survival
2) Sex
3) Everything else

A career falls into the first category more or less, but can be applied to category 2 ( a chick needs to feel comfortable to be horny, and a nice home will make her feel more comfortable as opposed a guesthouse with 50 other guys in the next room ).

The ego is sometimes tied into what one does for a living, and society expects that a man should achieve some monetary advancement over the decades of one's life. Therefore, there exists a fear that one will be judged too much on their career depending on their age....

If there's a kid who is working a minimum wage job while attending college, then that's ok because he's just "starting out", but if a much older guy is doing the same job, then people will assume that something "went wrong", and this can lead to unhappiness for that older person if their personality is not strong enough to stand up to the ridicule.

We as men think that work is work, and that anyone working should get respect regardless of the salary. I agree, but the 21st century World is ruthless, and this judgemental enviornment creates havoc on a man's sense of self worth. So then it becomes a struggle---"Money, or do what I REALLY want to do ?". Comfort vs. Happiness ? Are they the same or not ? This question becomes more stressful as one ages because as you get older, the concept of comfort and security becomes more important (especially if you have kids)

 

[Rubirosa]

i only work bcuz the money is good and i spend a lot.

Other than that i hate this job.its boring and pathetic.im surrounded by people who think they sh!t golden poop.
suck,faggotry and lots of estrogen filled pvssies roam my profession.
I cant even talk about "hunting" since people immediately call me a "butcher".

Im saving so i can buy a small hangar and turn it into a workshop,for wood,tanning and metallugry...i wanna build my own canoe,maybe a piano even ...

So no,my job does not define me,its just a source of money so i can do d stuff that i want.
I will retire by 40 and go out to live in siberian woods since mankind is turning into a bleeding estrogen smelling vag!na and i want to stay away from its stinking corpse as much as possible.

You have have a great attitude and I envy you for being so successful at a young age, but there's a contradiction in your post ; "I spend a lot" coupled with "I'm saving"
Which one is more truthful ?

 

[glass half full]

Does your career define you? I guess it depends on who you ask. Which then becomes "do you really care what They think?"

Your life is your own. Of course some income will be necessary. Do you want the kind of woman who will consider it a "do or die" thing to make the most money possible, so her appetite for acceptance and approval will be comfortable (pride)?

There is a test you can take, most therapists can help with this. It will tell you what your ideal jobs may be. The important thing is your happiness. After my time not working following my stroke, I've had the opportunity to look through my past check stubs, important papers, etc. Not because I wanted to, but I needed to find certain documents. And I realized that trading hours for dollars doing what you don't like, and not having what you would like to show for it, and doing it to please a woman who cannot be pleased no matter what, was a waste of a lot of hard work, time and my own pride. So do what you want to do with your life, it's more important than many people will talk about. Find a woman who cares about the things you do, or who accepts yours as you accept hers. This is such an important thing, yet not many folks talk about this. It really is all our actions that define us, not just our job. Some folks would disagree (my wife for instance), she is married to her job. This is the difference in people I mentioned, it's very important. Good Luck...

 

[zekko]

I work hard when I need to but I'm more of a "work to live" kinda guy. I live for my free time and my other pursuits. I do have pride in my profession and I busted my nuts to get here, but essentially my job facilitates the rest of my life.

This describes me as well. I'm not the kind of fellow who has been fortunate enough to "do what he loves" my whole life as far as work goes. I have enjoyed my career, don't get me wrong, but I'm at the point where I'm getting tired of it. Doesn't matter, I'm going to retire in a few years anyway.

I do think that a career defines a man to a large extent, for me at least. Not so much what I do, but the fact that I am successful. I remember my confidence suffered back when I was broke. Before I found my direction, at one point it seemed like everybody made more money than I did. That has since reversed.

In my generation, we were raised to believe that a man should be able to stand on his own two feet. If you can't do that, it IS a problem, IMO.

 

[romangod]

Short answer.

Edit : What people say in their deathbeds isn't their most coherent thought anyway. People do and say all kinds of shíts in their deathbeds. Why is that the most important or accurate description of their long life story anyway? People live like they will never die, and suddenly become Buddhas, when they learn they will die? .. and we have to take that distorted bull-crap as their ultimate wisdom?

Edit 2: Besides, I don't understand what defines a man other than what he does in life. We don't hunt, we don't struggle to survive, we only PRODUCE. What do
you produce? If you take out what a man does in his life, you are pretty much left with coffee house conversations and liquid stuff like SoSuave posts.


I am astonished that you are astonished with your boss' simple sentiment, it's obvious that what he did should be a very large part of who he is/he was. Otherwise, he's an animal who eats, sleeps, consumes and dies, like about anything else that lives on the planet.

And we're suppose to take this naive bull-crap as your ultimate wisdom? If so, humanity is on a downward spiral worse than I've imagined. More than likely you've never been on your deathbed or been with someone who has. If so, I would assume you'd glean some wisdom or at least question whether life is more than just what you "produce" or how other people define you.

We only produce? Trust me, when my parents were dying they were not questioning whether they produced enough. Maybe their wisdom wasn't as coherent as yours but I appreciated their "I love you" and "You've been a good son" more than anything a pee brain like you could offer.


Now, I'll tell you what defines a man. It is his character regardless of what the fvck he produces or does for a living.


Cheers!

 

[zekko]

Spinning plates is not an option, in fact there is basically no room for women and working out at the same time.

This forum pretty much unanimously pushes the "Hit the gym" mantra, and you can't count me in on that. It takes a lot of hard work and self discipline to keep up a good workout routine.

Having said that, you raise a good point. I'm not sure people get the idea across that if you are going to be working out solidly, chances are you're going to have to give something else up. For those who work long hours, and/or live busy lives, that is. This probably isn't a problem for the young, unemployed guys on the forum, but it may be some others.

 

[origin138]

This is a really good question, and I think the answer lies within which purview you deem most important.

I deem my purview most important, because I have to live with myself, and if there is a God, answer for myself.

I have a value system that I live by, and when my life starts sucking, it's because I'm usually not living in line with some, or all of my value system.

On this list are about 30 bullet points (values) written down in an if-then format. i.e. If I value self-respect, then I will......, If I value masculinity, then I will..., you get the point

2 values on this list are career-related, the rest are more about the quality of man I want to be (be masculine, be a role model, have self-respect, be a leader, be self-actualized, be healthy, be loyal, be accountable, be financially independent, etc).

So, long story short, it defines me to a small (albeit very important) degree, and any woman (or man) that thinks it should define me entirely can suck me sideways.

 

[switch]

You have have a great attitude and I envy you for being so successful at a young age, but there's a contradiction in your post ; "I spend a lot" coupled with "I'm saving"
Which one is more truthful ?

lmao thats one of my big problems man, im trying to save money but at the end of the month most of it is *poof* gone. i have this tendency to spend most of my money and i dont even realize it lol. its very difficult to save,but im trying

Dear Switch,
Liked your post,but have you considered that accumulating Mazooma till fourty might change you?...maybe going to live in the Taiga with the Bears and Mosquitoes wont appeal then,you change,Promise!

true, ive changed a lot since 2 years ago.actually im everything that the old switch didnt like.
carpentry and having my own small tannery were always a drem for me. i usually kill small critters and roast them on campfire.
but what if i had the opportunity to kill a moose, then skin it and process the skin in my own tannery? awesome.

my uncle had a cabin in the tundra, im really considering to buy that.
while i agree that a lot will change in me by 40, a few things wont change

1.love for hunting
2.MILF
3.my hatered of children and animals.

This forum pretty much unanimously pushes the "Hit the gym" mantra, and you can't count me in on that. It takes a lot of hard work and self discipline to keep up a good workout routine.

Having said that, you raise a good point. I'm not sure people get the idea across that if you are going to be working out solidly, chances are you're going to have to give something else up. For those who work long hours, and/or live busy lives, that is. This probably isn't a problem for the young, unemployed guys on the forum, but it may be some others.

its true.i only have time for work and the gym.no time for girls. but im just hitting 25 and well i couldnt give dipsh!t to girls anyway.
recently a girl wanted to commit to me but i couldnt simply because i dont have the time or energy.

 

[Boilermaker]

The way this question is asked is actually trying to soften the grim reality of the truth behind it.

You are what you do.

What does "career" really mean? For a college professor to get promoted to be a distinguished professor may not be the defining element in his life,

but what IS a man if you don't define by him by what he does, at the end of the day?

What defines Richard Dawkins? Why would you be interested in the details of the life story of the late Mandela?

What do you first think when you hear the names Kasparov, Feynman, Lincoln?

Our petty and modern lives may seem to have diluted the true meaning of a man's life, but make no mistake, you are still defined by what you do in life, as a man.

When I think of anyone I respect, it is always a combination of envy and obsession or curiosity about what they do. I can't understand any other definition of a man, really, if there has to be one.

This is of course apart from our common denominators, that we all poop, eat, sleep, breathe and die. Yeah, that's common to all.

 

[origin138]

In light of Mandela's death, I think its important that all men take an honest look at not only their careers or life paths, but what kind of legacy they'll leave behind if they were to die today. Mandela, Lincoln, Ghandi all had careers, but their legacies speak more about them as men, and define them much better as men.

It's the quality of a man that defines him, not his career, although many of the ways his qualities develop are through his career. Many things tie into the quality of a man...his values, strength of character, loyalty to his friends and family. Career is only one aspect. We all know Lincoln was a president, but his legacy exposes much more than that.

I want my legacy to be something like "Origin was highly respected. He walked through life with his head up and led by example. He was a man of action, not a man of complaint. He made a difference just by entering or exiting the room. He was great with women and a leader of men, and didn't compromise his values even in the face of adversity. He lived life on his own terms and not at the expense of those around him. He made a difference and he is respected even in death."

Sounds better than "Origin the small business owner who nobody knew because he worked all the time and never really made any kind of impact on the world."