Do women actually like good men or are my observations legitimate?

[LiveYourDream]

And I won't bend over backwards for woman.. But I do consider myself a good guy.. I don't feel the need to treat woman like shyte.

However I really don't think this approach has served me well.

Maybe its just the type of woman we have had dealings with so far.

@soulforge you have grown a tremendous amount on here in the last several years. Who you are and what you will tolerate or not, in your interactions today is not who and how you were a few years back. You have grown massively. How YOU respond to a woman is far more masculine now.

Who you are today is not the man you were in all of your old relationships!!! The latest updated version of you walked away from your most recent LTR, FAR DIFFERENTLY than the previous! Super differently!!! If you don’t think so...go read your old posts. Not judging just pointing it out. Men come here to improve and you are doing that! When you look back at your old relationships see who you truly were then. See how far you have come since then...in your own growth. You are much more of MAN now than you were then. Remember that and consider that too, when you look back at your old relationships. I am not justifying any woman’s behavior toward you. I am just reminding you to consider your part in those interactions/relationships accurately and as who you were then.

You have lots to be proud of. Keep improving. Keep focusing and moving forward.

 

[Mike32ct]

I don’t deny the bad boy thing and women’s interest in bad boys. It’s definitely very real.

But I don’t dwell on it. I’m not a bad boy. I have no desire to be a bad boy. When I see a chick with a bad boy or find out her ex was a bad boy, I just chuckle and move on.

A good guy/nice guy/decent guy shouldn’t waste brain cells worrying about this.

The next woman that tells me I need to “be more rough around the edges” I will tell to shove it (in the nicest nice guy way possible lol).

 

[RangerMIke]

Younger women get spooked off by nice guy behavior because this is a trait many men have that indicate they will become needy and clingy stalker types. Chicks hate this sh!t more than anything else. There is nothing wrong with being a pleasant person, but if the chick pulls back you just let her go... if she likes you regardless of your behavior she'll come around as long as she thinks you will let her go without complaint when your ride is over. So called 'jerks' get lots of women in their 20s because the chick knows when she's done playing with him... he'll just move onto the next girl and forget about her... which is what she wants when she is younger and spreading her wings.

It's the same reason we all react negatively to high pressure salesmen... the harder the sell, the more we doubt the product.

 

[Sunnypoo]

There is a big difference between being a nice guy and being a genuinely good guy. Often times "nice" guys aren't really all that nice. They tend to engage in negative behaviors such as manipulation, passive aggressiveness, and neediness. They operate under the guise of being nice, whereas a genuinely good guy is good but not a push over. Women want a masculine and confident man but they also want a man who is kind and compassionate, solid and not a push over. When it comes to doing things for a woman it is right to expect the same in return as it creates equilibrium.

I think when guys keep running into the same types of women that call their ex's names or diagnosed them with being a narcissist or they were an *******, etc., then these guys are PICKING THE WRONG WOMEN. Work on your picker and try to find a way to meet a better woman. These women are attracted to that type of guy in very much the same way a beta guy is attracted to the wrong woman. Also, equilibrium is great, it creates the perfect balance of power but you must start out that way. A good woman will develop a profound respect for a man that lives by such a principle.

 

[LiveYourDream]

Many such women would rather try, try again with these guys than to do the same with the “good guy”... that is, waiting for him to grow a backbone in order to balance things out.

Women want and desire a man, with a backbone.

No backbone equals not attractive to a woman.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Everything you said is true but it also proves how much women don’t understand men whatsoever, even though they have these so called “screening processes”. They might think they’re picking the higher value guy but what they’re realky picking is the lower value guy that has less to offer in the long run. That’s why when they hit that wall hard they start seeking out that nicer guy who turned out to be pretty alpha because he has choices now and he’s not choosing her. It’s like a cycle.

That "lower value" guy might get her engine running and her juices flowing. Sometimes the female that caught your eye vibrates at a much lower wavelength than you and the grimey guy makes her feel more. Its not for us to worry about. Spend time on ladies who are giving their body to you.

 

[LiveYourDream]

The men on SS (and in life) that are consistently successful with women CLEARLY and unapologetically convey to others that they have a backbone. Those men convey it consistently, as well.

Women desire men like that.

 

[LiveYourDream]

Men here need to be better at identifying HOW women value men.

We may think it makes sense to value based on being a "good guy". But to them it is senseless.

Women want "good guys". They don't want just any good guy. Women want "good guys" that consistently demonstrate a solid backbone.

When women don't find a good guy that consistently demonstrates a solid backbone, their first internal default is to other men that do, unfortunately that leaves the azzholes.

 

[LiveYourDream]

I think men can mistakenly think women are turned on by or attracted to men doing sh!tty things. It's a man's consistent demonstration of having a backbone that attracts her and then keeps her around. She tolerates an azzhole's sh!tty behavior. She doesn't admire it. It's his backbone (first) that keeps her around.

 

[Robert28]

Good men have a backbone, but the thing is when you’ve made them show it your ass is done. They don’t play the bull**** games of showing backbone but keep on dating her. Fvck that. When I’ve had enough I’ve had enough. You won’t catch me in those years long relationships full of fights and bs and calling the cops and making a scene in front of the neighbors. The so called “bad guys” love drama, I hate it and I run from it. If a woman uses me then that’s on her but she won’t use me forever and eventually she will be in a ****ty place and wish I was around (this is why women come back to me a lot) but I’m long gone. Just because other women can’t see I habe other women waiting in the wings doesn’t mean I don’t. It’s why they’re so shocked when they’re replaced so easily by me and upgraded substantially. My “bad boy” comes out in the end, not the beginning. It’s my final “fvck you” to them.

 

[Robert28]

There are no doubt women who will pull this $hit even if you are the dominant guy in the beginning. And these women should be dropped at the first infraction.

But perhaps you should consider changing your approach so that they FEAR the consequences of their acting up before they do.

Nah I don’t want anyone being in fear around me. They should be who they are, I’ll figure out the real them soon enough. If they want to act up that’s fine, but they’ll only do it once and I’m gone. No argument, no discussion, nothing.

I’ve had so many girls admit to me “I didn’t realize what I had and how much I’d miss you until later down the road”. I know other guys out there I’m competing with are screwups and make me look like a genius in the end. That’s the secret, know guys she’s gonna date after you are gonna fvck up way worse than you ever did. Then they start to miss you........lol

 

[LiveYourDream]

There is a primal aspect to this, for women, that men may forget or not be aware of.

When a man has a backbone and is not afraid of showing it, it attracts and keeps a woman's interest because, deep inside her, she will feel more safe, by being with him.

If something were to happen that made her feel unsafe ( primal = a tiger tries to eat her for dinner), he is a man that has demonstrated he handles things. On a deep primal level, she feels safer with such a man, versus a man who has demonstrated that he hesitates or refrains from stepping up when confrontation occurs.

A tiger tries to eat her for dinner... Who is going to actually handle it? Who is going to make sure she is safe, aka: "save her"? "Nice" guy? Azzhole? Truth is a man with a backbone who doesn't hesitate! That is why men who ONLY demonstrate "nice" and show no backbone repel women. Again...I am speaking of a primal drive for safety, in women, that is below their conscious awareness.

 

[Robert28]

There is a primal aspect to this, for women, that men may forget or not be aware of.

When a man has a backbone and is not afraid of showing it, it attracts and keeps a woman's interest because, deep inside her, she will feel more safe, by being with him.

If something were to happen that made her feel unsafe ( primal = a tiger tries to eat her for dinner), he is a man that has demonstrated he handles things. On a deep primal level, she feels safer with such a man, versus a man who has demonstrated that he hesitates or refrains from stepping up when confrontation occurs.

A tiger tries to eat her for dinner... Who is going to actually handle it? Who is going to make sure she is safe, aka: "save her"? "Nice" guy? Azzhole? Truth is a man with a backbone who doesn't hesitate! That is why men who ONLY demonstrate "nice" and show no backbone repel women. Again...I am speaking of a primal drive for safety, in women, that is below their conscious awareness.

All this is true BUT you won’t convince me a woman can read a man well enough to see how he will react when the **** hits the fan. You can be the most alpha guy with a 12” penis and piss yourself in front of your girl when someone sticks a gun in your face while y’all are walking down the street. The same guy she wasn’t really attracted to because she thought he was “too good” might react in a way and beat the hell out of the guy with the gun. No one knows how they will react in a situation like that so I know there’s no way in hell some random woman can see that trait in a guy cause she went on a few dates with him.

 

[LiveYourDream]

All this is true BUT you won’t convince me a woman can read a man well enough to see how he will react when the **** hits the fan. You can be the most alpha guy with a 12” penis and piss yourself in front of your girl when someone sticks a gun in your face while y’all are walking down the street. The same guy she wasn’t really attracted to because she thought he was “too good” might react in a way and beat the hell out of the guy with the gun. No one knows how they will react in a situation like that so I know there’s no way in hell some random woman can see that trait in a guy cause she went on a few dates with him.

I agree with you! And...remember it is a deep primal drive, below a woman's conscious thought process.

 

[Robert28]

@Robert28

This is what $hit tests are for. So that she can determine what you will do based on her best ability to suss it out of you.

This is why they will still forever $hit test you, although at varying degrees and times depending on how well you pass them.

Rollo calls it Women's existential fear. https://therationalmale.com/2019/03/11/womens-existential-fear/. Is it really the best she can do? Is he still fit to protect her?

According to some of the original game theorists, even handing you her purse to hold is a $hit test of sorts. Her telling you that she will "cut you off" is another $hit test. She is testing you often and you are not even aware it was a test. Hell SHE isn't even aware she is testing you.

And we wonder why mental health is so bad in this country. No wonder so many women have depression issue. I should have dropped out of business school and become Frasier Crane.lol

 

[Trump]

The excuses guys come up with are because its easier to make these excuses than to work on yourself and these attributes.

And for the guys who claim "I am all these things but it still isn't working", its not YOUR opinion of whether you have these attributes that matter its the woman's opinion.

So if it’s the woman’s opinion, then why work on the attributes? Why would a man work so hard when the outcome is based on luck?

The man can either;

a) work his butt off, work out, make money, be strong, dress well, be ambitious, and the woman can still tell him to go to hell.
b) relax, take it easy, dress normal, have a normal 9-5 job, meet a woman on the train, crack a few jokes, have her fall in love and marry him.

I’ll take the path of least resistance, option b.

 

[LiveYourDream]

If you want to dive deeper...a woman feeling safe is what allows also her the 'freedom' and capacity, 'to let go' (feels safe enough) to express more of her intrinsic femininity. The safer she feels the greater her feminine nature will be outwardly demonstrated/shared/lived.

 

[LiveYourDream]

Design and live the life that brings YOU happiness, with or without a woman.

 

[PeasantPlayer]

@Robert28

This is what $hit tests are for. So that she can determine what you will do based on her best ability to suss it out of you.

This is why they will still forever $hit test you, although at varying degrees and times depending on how well you pass them.

Rollo calls it Women's existential fear. https://therationalmale.com/2019/03/11/womens-existential-fear/. Is it really the best she can do? Is he still fit to protect her?

According to some of the original game theorists, even handing you her purse to hold is a $hit test of sorts. Her telling you that she will "cut you off" is another $hit test. She is testing you often and you are not even aware it was a test. Hell SHE isn't even aware she is testing you.

That brought up cringe memories as me holding a chicks purse in front of multiple cute women at a clothing store when I was a 18 year old beta

 

[guru1000]

Here's the thing about some "good" men: They are generally not good. "Good" most often comes out of necessity. Why be "good" when you can just be who you are and get the results you want? So being "good" for some (keyword qualifier here) is simply being obsequious with the ulterior motive to get something in return. You see, being "good" for those individuals is simply a scheme to get what they want because just being themselves has not worked and they needed to develop methods, or shall we say machinations, to attain.

Whereas the "bad" guy can simply BE who is he without care as to what you or she thinks and still get exactly what he wants. He doesn't need to feed machinations or feed contrivances to be someone he is not, and thus is more genuine than the good guy.

So now the "good" guy has become bad. And the "bad" guy has become good.

Wrap your head around that.