Diversify Your Game

[MVPlaya]

Guys,

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THERE IS NO UNIVERSAL GAME
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All of us get to this site believing that somehow, if we, someway, memorize enough techniques and strategies and work on them long enough women will all fall for us. And furthermore, the ones that don't... well, they're just stupid hoes or haters and we should neXt them because they are just Attention Whoring us or they missed their french pedicure this month. However, what we need to realize is that women ARE different... despite whatever you have heard, whether it was Pook or Fingers. There are genuine differences between women that "game" cannot always overcome. Sure, those techniques you've been working have turned you into quite the ladiesman, but do you really believe that all those women you neXted just had their own issues and would have fallen head over heels for you if they would just have dropped their "b!tch shield" or "anti-slut defense"?

The fact of the matter is, the type of game that we are taught at SoSuave is geared towards a majority of women. Majority does not mean 80%, it might not even meand 60 or 50. Fact is, I don't know how many and so don't you! But what I do know is this: while we are turning some women on immensely, we are turning off other women with these same traits that we continually hear praised all over our forum. When we first learn our techniques and become happy with our kino and neg-hits we become overjoyed and think they are "the magic wand" (as Allen likes to say). But simply, this is not true... you guys have noticed how Doc Love advocates not using kino in his system, its not as if Doc is right and Allen is wrong (or vice versa), its simply that Doc Love caters to a different portion of the women population.

Now, frequently women will fall for different techniques (so no kino or lots of kino can work on the same girl). However, if women don't fall for our techniques it is not just because they were hating on us or attention wh0ring. It is because you used the wrong technique. Do you guys really believe haters cancel themselves out in the grand scheme of evolution by hating on every last guy? No! Some of the hottest and most interesting women I know can hate on a man with game simply because they see something else in the games these players play, however, they might be attracted to that "nice guy" we deplore. Okay, simply put, we get MUCH more women than those "nice guys," but the point is this, we are still missing out on some fine women. There is no one right way to playing women! I've read one post from a guy asking for a DJ quiz so that he could see what he was doing wrong!!! Do you guys REALLY believe there is one right answer for all of 'game'? Of course not! The fact is: what Doc Love told you is right for some, and what Nick/MotU/Fingers/Anti-Dump/Casanova/DeAngelo told you will be right for others. If we really want to "maximize" our game, we need to be able to play "all" styles... and, most importantly, know our audience.

In the book How To Play Women that Play Guys, there is a chapter on slightly older women who are hunting you. The advice given here is completely counterintuitive for any DJ, you must fake AFC tendencies!!! Instead of playing suave and making it seem as if her games have little effect and you're in charge, pretend to be a little nervous in her alpha-female presence, make her feel as if she's tearing that animal inside you out of your shell. Even more, in one of the chapters on Senorita Escandalosa's, or, in SoSuave talk, HB10 Attention Wh0res Playsta'z, the recommendation is actually take the LJBF route. If you become player it could turn her off, instead, be a friend and make her feel good around you but never show any signs of romantic feelings towards her. If she wants to know if you like her, switch topic, this will make her worry that her game ain't strong enough and she'll begin to wonder what's so different about you because you are not attracted to her like ALL other guys, players or AFCs, (however, if you were a player who showed little interest she would have known what was going on and NeXted you).

Repeated researches proves that people like others who are like them. Because by being like them, you are special, you are unique. In fact, research has shown, women who are quiet and reserved are more attracted to guys who are quiet and reserved while outgoing women like outgoing men. So what is the point of neg-hitting a shy girl when she's on no pedestal? Why kino an ice-queen when imitating her a little can make her break her walls much more effectively? Its true that opposites attract, but that is sometimes, similars attract almost ALWAYS. So don't think this amount of kino & that much C&F + so many neg-hits will always close the deal, these are excellent weapons and they keep you lively as well as your game smooth, but sometimes, your weapons are just not suited for the battlefield.

What we need to understand is that everything we do can be a weapon. Ever hear a chick go in this voice of total submission and helplessness and ask a poor guy to do her this "huge favor," instead of her helplessness being seen as "damn, what a weak b_tch," it turns the male on and the poor guy is suckered into doing it. A CHARACTERISTIC THAT EPITOMIZES WEAKNESS IS A WEAPON IN THEIR ARSENAL! So why should men shy away from weapons that aren't "alpha-male"? There are so many times that I have read a GREAT hint that only to see it be smacked down by some "Master Don Juan" who thought it was "AFC." Guys, instead of writing things off as AFC, we need to look at each of them as a different weapon in our arsenal for a different setting. Any CIA agent knows that when they try to trick counter-intelligence, they need to know what "audience" they are playing to. So when you go out and you are on your mission, know what your "audience" is and how you can work them. Don't just CA everyone and neXt the unresponsive ones, take a step back, observe, and decide how to play your cards. Sure, you could "reduce your rejection rate by 99%" if you see whether women want your game, but the fact is, sometimes you will run into some women that are special and don't fall for your normal game. Special does not mean they are the one or even your true love, nothing close to that, but this means that if your usual game fails on her, you are going to have to neXt through a hundred more women before you hit one of this caliber. Normally, you could just neXt her, after all, there are plenty of other girls out there, but is that really the DJ thing to do?

So guys, there is no such thing as an AFC move. AFC guys may screw up all the time, but some of their stupid moves can work miracles on some HB's out there if played just right. So remember, diversify your arsenal if you want universal game

 

[Mr. Fingers]

Interesting post.

I agree for the most part. There is no ONE approach to anything in life. As I have said before, there may be one goal, but there are many paths to reach it.

However, I am not so sure I would want to embody all of these approaches. It is simply too much work to adopt them all, and for the sake of what? Screwing more girls? I really don´t have time for this! Bills need to be paid and my dreams are not going to happen by themselves!

So I think rather than trying to become this Uber-DJ who changes his style for every woman he meets, it´s much more practical to just pick an approach that suits your personality and gets you the type of woman you are looking for. For this you must ask yourself.

1) Who am I? What is my natural state of being?

Are you introspective? Fun-loving? Profound? Adventurous? Shy? Write down a list of adjectives you would use to describe yourself when you are with your friends and not thinking about seduction. Also define yourself when you are alone. What are the things that you love doing? Where do you enjoy spending time?

2) What kind of woman do I want? What do I want from her? Where can I find this woman? What does she respond to?

If you are lookin for young, sexy women just to get your rocks off, then hit the clubs, bars, etc. and be the Alpha male with your crazy social proof, negs and whatever else you have adapted to suit your personality.

If you are looking for a hottie who can get into stimulating conversations and accompany you to yoga class, then you know exactly where to go and how to approach her. (Bookstores, yoga classes, etc)

3) How do I convey who I am and attract this woman?

- Having the confidence to approach and initiate things
- Having the detachment to let go and make her chase you
- TRIAL and ERROR! For knowing the fine line between the two
- Figuring out what you want out of life in general and the type of man you want to be. Then treating these women like they are not really high on your list of priorities.
- Watch other guys who are successful with the type of women you are after. What is it about them?

Ultimately, there are too many systems out there to learn them all.

Find your niche and follow the path with heart, because at some point you have to let go of your complex games and simply BE!

 

[Player_Supreme]

I don’t agree with everything you said. I think mr. Fingers outlined most of what I wanted to say except:


The fact of the matter is, the type of game that we are taught at SoSuave is geared towards a [B}majority of women[/B]. Majority does not mean 80%, it might not even meand 60 or 50. Fact is, I don't know how many and so don't you! But what I do know is this:

>>>>how do you know it’s not 80% if you don’t know it’s not 50???

***************


There is no one right way to playing women!

>>>>true this is why you study your prey.


Repeated researches proves that people like others who are like them.

>>>>what research??? What sources??? I’m interested in knowing this.


So why should men shy away from weapons that aren't "alpha-male"?


>>>>This is my whole problem with men trying to be alpha when it’s not in their genes. We are less than 10% of the population. The time of the alpha has passed. We are no longer needed by society. The other word for alpha is manifestors. It is the generators who rule…the sheep! Most alpha’s have no real power anymore and are basket cases. There are no more trails to blaze and wilderness to uncover. Our time has past.

>>>Generators masquerading as initiators (alpha’s or manifestors) is ludicrous…only asking for trouble, as can be seen by the main posting page on this board. I've even mistakenly posted on how to act like an alpha, but now I wish I hadn't. You can't turn a bunch of nerds into alpha males...just not in the cards. Better to be comfortable with your own genetic structure and move on from there.

>>>Because of the growth of humanity and society. Mankind needed the sheep type to carry us forward. Mankind needed these worker bee's to produce the society that we currently enjoy. If your a true alpha I feel for you. If your just learning something that should come naturally then your one of the other types and learning seduction techniques are a plus!

Don't just CA everyone and neXt the unresponsive ones, take a step back, observe, and decide how to play your cards. Sure, you could "reduce your rejection rate by 99%" if you see whether women want your game, but the fact is, sometimes you will run into some women that are special and don't fall for your normal game.

>>>>>Why would you not want to follow the steps to success. Go for those that are choosing. Why swim up stream when you can float downstream to the land of Pvssy!

 

[Deep Dish]

There is no universal game.

There is no game. By that I mean 'gaming' skills of techniques are entirely unnecessary. Guys do not 'get' women by techniques, guys delude themselves into thinking it was what they did which got the girl. There have been times I've been asked, by guys, how am I 'so cool', and how I attract so many women. I can never give them an answer, I don't do anything at all.

Just the other day I approached some hot chick without even realizing it; and while things went well, it wasn't until retrospect did I realize I approached her and that I did some 'seduction techniques'; but it wasn't because of inadvertent techniques which made things go well, it was because the girl liked me when she set her eyes on me, with any 'techniques' as icing on the cake. Women decide within seconds of how far you'll ever get with them, whether lovers or not, and it's certainly not from techniques.

However, if women don't fall for our techniques it is not just because they were hating on us or attention wh0ring. It is because you used the wrong technique.

No, it's because the women didn't like them. It can be quite a blow to a overblown male ego to know that a certain woman is simply not attracted to him, so hence many guys blame 'what they did'.

Okay, simply put, we get MUCH more women than those "nice guys," but the point is this, we are still missing out on some fine women.

There are guys who are plentiful nice, who don't 'do' techniques, who can land more women than these self-described players.

Repeated researches proves that people like others who are like them.

I believe that's called conscious similiarity, and it's true.

Its true that opposites attract, but that is sometimes, similars attract almost ALWAYS.

On the surface you will end up with people who are similiar to yourself, particularly in the looks and socio-economic departments; but deeper down with your opposite, e.g. masculinity vs. femininity, etc.

You guys have noticed how Doc Love advocates not using kino in his system, its not as if Doc is right and Allen is wrong (or vice versa), its simply that Doc Love caters to a different portion of the women population.

Doc Love caters to a different portion of the male population, guys who are looking for a good wife, not guys looking for a quick lay.

 

[Thoroughbred]

People like people that are similar to them. It is true. There has been a lot of research done on this. However, I think opposites attract more often than you think.

 

[MVPlaya]

Mr. Fingers:
- I agree that we all have stuff to do and become the Uber-DJ is too much of a time consumption. However, what I am asking for is not to learn "all game styles" but "more game styles." If we just break it down to 2 or 3 audience categories: shy/nice girls, popular girls, playsta'z we can have some much better game. Do you thing World Champion martial artists learn EVERY SINGLE kick/punch/throw/block/grapple? Of course not, they have their 2 or 3 favorite moves and master those... similarly, instead of having everything be the consensual kino/neg-hit/c&f/play-hard-to-get sosuave strategy, lets have another one in there. The point is diversifying your arsenal... not having enough weapons to nuke the world surface 6 times over. But yeah, you are right about the BE part. I really want to write or read a post on the issue of identity. Whether players ever feel that there moves are making them less... themselves.


Player_Supreme:
- True, I don't know if its 80 or 60%, I heard from one of my hardcore DJ friends that about 25% of chicks don't dig the classic DJism we learn here.
- Research: to busy to look it up for you right now... all I remember, in late 80's psychologists scoped out clubs in Europe and found that chicks who were quiet and went to the back of the club were attracted to guys who did the same and that chicks who were the center of attention liked alpha-males who did the same thing (the research was more detailed but I won't go into detail). Also, in the 80's Canadian psychologists started research with newlywed canadian couples (a hundred or so, the research is still going on) and had them fill out extensive questionnaires and had them all psychologically evaluated for character typing... over the years the ones most alike were least likely to be divorced and had healthier relationships.
-

Why would you not want to follow the steps to success. Go for those that are choosing. Why swim up stream when you can float downstream to the land of Pvssy!

Because its not all just *****... there are some chicks out there that we would otherwise next who would be great to be with (and to ƒuck). I don't mean oneitis here, but at least be with a chick who means more than all these hoes. Also, sometimes there are some REALLY hot women who we just cant bang because they don't dig our game.


Deep Dish:
-

No, it's because the women didn't like them. It can be quite a blow to a overblown male ego to know that a certain woman is simply not attracted to him, so hence many guys blame 'what they did'.

But the thing is that most women don't know "him"... in classrooms or whatever people might have a chance to have you figured out a little, but at clubs its all first impressions etc. etc. However, I do notice some "external locus of control"... guys blaming their worries on wrong game, etc. etc.
-

On the surface you will end up with people who are similiar to yourself, particularly in the looks and socio-economic departments; but deeper down with your opposite, e.g. masculinity vs. femininity, etc.

I think masculinity v. femininity is a given here, so I DON'T consider that an opposite... however, research does show that similars are much more likely to succeed (see reply to P_S's post - above).


Thoroughbred:
- I don't know how often they attract and I can't guess... all I know is that similarity gives me a better shot.


GigaloDJ:
- Your Bruce Lee quotes are right, have you ever read Bruce Lee's Jeet Kune Do? Creat your own martial arts from your knowledge: take what you are good at and apply it differently for your different enemies... same with DJing... make your own styles and specialize them a little (don't go overboard tho).
-

One thing i did not agree with, though, is when you said "there is no such thing as an AFC move".

I remember this one guy who wanted advice on some date, a mutual friend of him and the girl told him she was into chivalry. The friend advised him to: compliment her a lot, be very chivalrous, be deferential, bring flowers on the first date, tell her you like her, etc. etc. (the AFC bible). Every guy on the board told him not to do it, its AFC they shouted, she'll look at you as having no balls... the next post this guy wrote was about how this girl (a minister's daughter) went down on him that night after he did all these "AFC" things. What I mean is simple, you say bringing flowers is AFC, I would agree for the most part, but it worked on that chick for Mr. See Above. Also, one girl I know was really attracted to this one guy who called 10 times a day and she is hot (and puts out to him). I also know of chicks who were attracted to guys who said they loved her. What I mean is this, its AFC when that's all you have, as in she might like that one thing you did but see you are boring and worthless other than that. However, when used with the right audience these things that you said were DEFINITELY AFC can be, in fact, DJ. It's all about having diverse game though. People can be AFC... things cannot.

 

[Mr. Fingers]

Now, I see where you are coming from Playa.

Sounds like we are actually reaching the same conclusions about the nature of the game. There really are no rules! If you have the right attitude and have an internally based reality, then you can get away with all sorts of supposedly AFC moves.

I think the biggest part of it all is your sense of INTUITION. By trying and failing repeatedly, you start to develop instincts as to what will work vs. what will crash&burn. The only way you develop these instincts is by messing up...A LOT!

I think it was DEKKA who talked about how much he loves rejection. This is an awesome attitude to have because you dont fight the process of your development and your gut intuition gets honed very quickly.

The beauty of it is that with a keen set of instincts, there is no need for rules. You are just FLOWIN and freestylin..much more attractive than the dude who nervously sweats in his seat, wondering if he just made an "AFC" comment.

So I guess there really is a universal game after all. There are just no absolute rules and you are free to either follow precedents, or set them yourself!

 

[Squid]

I remember this one guy who wanted advice on some date, a mutual friend of him and the girl told him she was into chivalry. The friend advised him to: compliment her a lot, be very chivalrous, be deferential, bring flowers on the first date, tell her you like her, etc. etc. (the AFC bible). Every guy on the board told him not to do it, its AFC they shouted, she'll look at you as having no balls... the next post this guy wrote was about how this girl (a minister's daughter) went down on him that night after he did all these "AFC" things. What I mean is simple, you say bringing flowers is AFC, I would agree for the most part, but it worked on that chick for Mr. See Above. Also, one girl I know was really attracted to this one guy who called 10 times a day and she is hot (and puts out to him). I also know of chicks who were attracted to guys who said they loved her. What I mean is this, its AFC when that's all you have, as in she might like that one thing you did but see you are boring and worthless other than that. However, when used with the right audience these things that you said were DEFINITELY AFC can be, in fact, DJ. It's all about having diverse game though. People can be AFC... things cannot. [/B][/QUOTE]

I agree, the delivery is everything, when you give the flowers, is it with confidence or staring at your feet? I don't think it is what you do (i.e. flowers) so much as how you do it. I think the key to DJ is conducting yourself with confidence, and not being afraid to do or act however you want.

 

[Deep Dish]

But the thing is that most women don't know "him"... in classrooms or whatever people might have a chance to have you figured out a little, but at clubs its all first impressions etc. etc.

On thing which took me awhile to realize is that women are just as "superficial" outside of clubs as they are inside of them, with the only difference of the whole process being more compressed in clubbing. Women who do not go clubbing are inherently no different than the hoochie mamas who hit downtown every Friday and Saturday night, but only in the perception that they are different. They are all women and subject to the same human nature.

Outside of clubs and into the classrooms, there is still the same importance on looks and status. The window of opportunity to get placed into "to fvck or not to fvck" is still the same, a few seconds. It really doesn't matter what a guy does or not; if the woman likes him, he gets her despite whatever his "skills" and despite whatever screw-ups he makes; the higher the woman's interest based from those few precious first seconds, the higher the tolerance for his errors; and if the woman does not like him, he's screwed no matter what "game" he throws down. There are plenty of guys who think that certain techniques "creates" or "raises" a woman's interest in him, but the truth is that while a woman's apparent, observable, interest may certainly rise, her interest level does not; all that any guy's seduction does is guide the woman's decision making process to whether she should take action on her interest. No one get me wrong, there certainly is such a thing as throwing down game, which does yield results, but that the actions are secondary. The woman liked him from the first few seconds.

Who you are. How you do. What you do.

Things are not always as they seem. A dork can dress all GQ and go through his 'arsenal' of neghits and kino, but what the women still see is a dork. While the dork will experience what will seem like greater success with women; for while wearing the GQ, women will seem warmer and more receptive to him, perhaps even play along with his facade for awhile; the women will still reject him, the dork. The root cause is not his "game" but him.

It is true that women have different "types" of men they like. What I see is you saying the difference is a result of game rather than of men, whereas I say it's the opposite.

 

[B9]

Originally posted by Mr. Fingers
Interesting post.

I agree for the most part. There is no ONE approach to anything in life. As I have said before, there may be one goal, but there are many paths to reach it.

However, I am not so sure I would want to embody all of these approaches. It is simply too much work to adopt them all, and for the sake of what? Screwing more girls? I really don´t have time for this! Bills need to be paid and my dreams are not going to happen by themselves!

So I think rather than trying to become this Uber-DJ who changes his style for every woman he meets, it´s much more practical to just pick an approach that suits your personality and gets you the type of woman you are looking for. For this you must ask yourself.

1) Who am I? What is my natural state of being?

Are you introspective? Fun-loving? Profound? Adventurous? Shy? Write down a list of adjectives you would use to describe yourself when you are with your friends and not thinking about seduction. Also define yourself when you are alone. What are the things that you love doing? Where do you enjoy spending time?

2) What kind of woman do I want? What do I want from her? Where can I find this woman? What does she respond to?

If you are lookin for young, sexy women just to get your rocks off, then hit the clubs, bars, etc. and be the Alpha male with your crazy social proof, negs and whatever else you have adapted to suit your personality.

If you are looking for a hottie who can get into stimulating conversations and accompany you to yoga class, then you know exactly where to go and how to approach her. (Bookstores, yoga classes, etc)

3) How do I convey who I am and attract this woman?

- Having the confidence to approach and initiate things
- Having the detachment to let go and make her chase you
- TRIAL and ERROR! For knowing the fine line between the two
- Figuring out what you want out of life in general and the type of man you want to be. Then treating these women like they are not really high on your list of priorities.
- Watch other guys who are successful with the type of women you are after. What is it about them?

Ultimately, there are too many systems out there to learn them all.

Find your niche and follow the path with heart, because at some point you have to let go of your complex games and simply BE!

Monsieur Fingers,

Concise, to the point, thorough. In conclusion:

Absolutely fantastic posts. Deserves a thread of its own.

 

[IrReSiStIbLe]

Another great post by the MVP!

 

[ArnZ]

I think this very point has been touched by a few other people before. Notably, Pook (e.g., There is NO Philosophy!, As you think, you shall become!) and David DeAngelo ("Know and master the inner game first, techniques/outer game will come automatically").

 

[MVPlaya]

Fingers:
- Bingo, that's exactly what I tried to convey. The first line, there is no universal game is only intended to make it clear to people that the skills they are being taught don't work every angle. But what is "universal game" is the knowledge that ultimately we are on top no matter how others judge our 'play' (internal reality); instead, what we need to see is that once we have built ourselves up to a certain degree of confidence its time for US as OURSELVES to take the next step and move on. Its like being a music major, sure, you spend years studying music theory and learning from the great, but once you want to earn for yourself you need to develop your own style. You understand the game, now use your knowledge, Bach's music has already been made so leave it to him. Now you make yours and someone else might study that 20 years from now.


Squid:
- Delivery is so key I can't even begin to explain it. However, if you look at the part where I get into the techniques advised for Female Hunters you see its counterintuitive again. Rather than looking confident and in control you want to look at your feet... pretend to be nervous, show a little bit of nervous body language. Of course, this is ALL delivery... you're not nervous, you ain't sweating this hoe on bit, she's chasing you and all you need to do is keep things rolling and she'll try to bed you. However, its just not the classic DJ delivery... delivery does not mean show confidence externally, NO! Confidence is internal. Instead, delivery means play the part and play it right, no matter what it is.


Deep Dish:
- You're right, the hoe you meet at a club could just as easily been the hoe you met at a record shop. In the club it is perception and people tend to be more judgmental, etc. etc. Then again, clubs aren't the best place to judge people for who they are.
-

Originally posted by Deep Dish
The window of opportunity to get placed into "to fvck or not to fvck" is still the same, a few seconds. It really doesn't matter what a guy does or not; if the woman likes him, he gets her despite whatever his "skills" and despite whatever screw-ups he makes; the higher the woman's interest based from those few precious first seconds, the higher the tolerance for his errors; and if the woman does not like him, he's screwed no matter what "game" he throws down.

Deep, I agree that there are chicks who tend to throw guys into one of two categories "ƒuck and don't ƒuck," however, this ain't all of them. I know plenty of girls and some of them are definitely the shotgun type, within 20 seconds of meeting you they don't want you or are all over you (figure of speech, they can be subtle about it). However, not all chicks are like that. I know plenty that don't follow this pattern and, although they keep 1st impression in account, keep a fairly clear head throughout the rest of the time they see you. Furthermore, you say "if the women likes him, he gets her despite whaterver his 'skills and despite whatever screw-ups he makes." Deep, how does she "like him." Is she psychic? Did she meet his mom? Read his autobiography? His diary? Dog, its first impressions like you stated and being a DJ doesn't start the moment you open you're mouth and start to convo. Its the moment any chick is around you. Therefore, her liking him is dependent on the skills he has because what else does she know about him? NOTHING! SHE JUST MET HIM! Not even that, she only SAW him! Therefore, her impressions are based on what he does and what he does is based on his skills. Furthermore, I disagree that the first seconds are absolute. Plenty of guys can ƒuck up after having established a solid 1st impression + HIGH IL. I agree that you have more room for error if she likes you and less if she doesn't, however, you can still change the game. I've seen chicks look the other way but after throwing some game their IL did raise. Why? Because I am such an unbelievable pimp? Did I travel back in time to make a second first impression? No, silly. I just showed them I wasn't who they thought I was and that got to them. So, learn this lesson from Deep Dish, MAKE GOOD FIRST IMPRESSIONS. Its like oiling you're engine. Your car doesn't drive on it... but it drives a lot smoother if you oil your engine and breaks down quickly if you don't.
-

Originally posted by Deep Dish
Who you are. How you do. What you do.

Things are not always as they seem. A dork can dress all GQ and go through his 'arsenal' of neghits and kino, but what the women still see is a dork. While the dork will experience what will seem like greater success with women; for while wearing the GQ, women will seem warmer and more receptive to him, perhaps even play along with his facade for awhile; the women will still reject him, the dork. The root cause is not his "game" but him.

It is true that women have different "types" of men they like. What I see is you saying the difference is a result of game rather than of men, whereas I say it's the opposite.

- Deep, what is a dork? Is it genetic? Did they have the dork gene and the dork look from "Revenge of the Nerds" and the dork glasses? Of course not... they were dorks for the way they acted. I know pretty boys who were dorks... muscular guys who were dorks... and some "classic dorks." However, them being dorks is how they act. I know super-ugly guys who could look like dorks but have major game. Now, being a DJ is not all about neg-hits... its about charisma and confidence. So, if a dork doesn't have that, then the package is incomplete. However, even a dork can learn game and improve on the impression he gives off. Deep, what I am saying is game is not something that is on and off... it is with you always. So when you say its men not games, keep in mind that if your game is with you the whole time then what is the man? The person she sees is, to quote Chris Rock, "your representative"... not the real you. People are not psychic... there is no magic karma... and women don't KNOW YOU. They know a name, a face, and have a limited amount of clues to gather information from, if you're a player... your face is friendly and the clues are exactly what you want her to know.


ArnZ:
- I looked for the post you talked about by Pook. Couldn't find it... please post the link. Besides, no idea is truely original, I'm sure someone said something along these lines and "There is NO Philosophy" sounds like what I stated. But either way, this forum has been around for years and I'm sure there's other bright guys posting here.

 

[PEACEDJ]

I think with this tip you really have to work with your instincts... this is why we have "get to know her first" part before take her out on a date and put your moves on her.

 

[Deep Dish]

MVPlaya:
I know plenty of girls and some of them are definitely the shotgun type, within 20 seconds of meeting you they don't want you or are all over you (figure of speech, they can be subtle about it). However, not all chicks are like that. I know plenty that don't follow this pattern and, although they keep 1st impression in account, keep a fairly clear head throughout the rest of the time they see you.

When a woman first meets a man, she will hide her true feelings. This is why women who are 'very confident' around men are not interested in romance, but rather sex, they have no emotions that are out dangling on the line. So, while at first she may not make the outwärd appearance of liking him, she secretly does, and over time, as the guy throws down his 'game' -- and it doesn't matter what that is, so long as it's something; all that is doing is telling the woman 'I like you', and that, then, alleviating her worries, she 'warms' up to him. But the important part of this discussion is that she liked him from the very beginning.


"Deep, how does she "like him." Is she psychic? Did she meet his mom? Read his autobiography? His diary?"

It's not about 'you'. It's never about 'you'. It is all about what role you play in a woman's life, about what she gets in return from you. There is the wallet role, the dildo role, the court jester role, etc. This role nature is inherent of all human relations, of families and even the best of friendships, with people only 'caring' about what you provide them. Everyone 'uses' everyone else, even if that usage is 'good company'.

So when that woman meets that guy, she knows what roles are up for vacancy in her life, and she categorizes what roles, if any, she'd allow him to have, and of course she knows what role the guy wants. By mere fact a guy is talking to a woman, she knows what he is after.


"Therefore, her liking him is dependent on the skills he has because what else does she know about him? NOTHING! SHE JUST MET HIM! Not even that, she only SAW him! Therefore, her impressions are based on what he does and what he does is based on his skills."

Women are no less 'superficial' than men. Women are just somewhat slower in taking action on their interest, being a little more cautious. His actions only speak "I like you" to the woman.


"I disagree that the first seconds are absolute. Plenty of guys can fvck up after having established a solid 1st impression + HIGH IL."

In the precious few seconds the woman decides if there is a window of opportunity. And, of course, at any time the window can be shut closed.


"The person she sees is, to quote Chris Rock, "your representative"... not the real you. People are not psychic... there is no magic karma... and women don't KNOW YOU."

And the ultimate truth is no one cares about your inner 'you', only what role you play in their life. If one really wants to use the terms player and game, then it is this: everyone is a player, everyone has game, it's only a matter of how good you play your role.