Caught her lying. Questions about trust. Anyone?

[Slickster]

I caught my girlfriend in a lie last night.

It goes like this. From time to time the name of one of her old friends keeps coming up. I don't know the guy, but I do know that he is a big time player with the ladies. After a few times of her mentioning him and me knowing his past I asked her straight out if she and him were ever intimate. She told me "No" right away and I believed her.

Over time whenever his name was mentioned she would emphatically make a point of saying how much of a dirty dog this guy is and how little she thinks of him.

Well low and behold it comes out last night that they did sleep together! She was caught and she knew it. So back peddle, back peddle, her story starts changing and before I know it she's telling me 2 or 3 more lies to top it off. One of them being that this guy still calls occasionally and offers her to come visit him in another city.

Well I wasn't too impressed. I know better than to get jealous but the thing that bothered me were the multiple lies and deception. I wasn't saying too much but she could tell I wasn't too thrilled about the situation.

She starts saying a bunch of stuff like:

"Why does it matter it was in the past?"
"Why would you let this affect us?"
"It didn't mean anything"
"I was just trying to protect your feelings"

Of course she attempts to turn it around and make me look like the bad guy for making an issue out of it.

The problem for me isn't the fact that she slept with the guy. Its the lies. I stated to her that the situation "Sucks". How am I supposed to believe anything she's tells me anymore. Especially when I just caught her in 4 lies in about 5 minutes. She still couldn't understand so I flipped the script on her.

She had recently asked me about a girl from my past that had been calling me. Originally I told her the truth that nothing had ever happened between us. But this morning I lied and said "Since were coming out with the truth now. Remember when you asked me about Sally? Well I wasn't honest with you. We did use to sleep together. I was just trying to save your feelings."

She was pretty hurt and I think I got my point across about how sh!tty it feels to be lied to. I told her I had to go think and left her crying in bed. I never did tell her that I didn't actually sleep with Sally.

So I'm kind of confused as to where this leaves us. Trust is obviously a very fragile thing. I'm not even sure if there is such a thing as trust. Is it really possible to trust anyone? Have any of you ever had a relationship with someone who was always honest with you? If I was in her situation I wouldn't want to hurt her either. I might have lied too. Can I really hold this against her?

So where do the lines of trust and honesty lie? (Excuse the pun) Are we only honest with the people we care about when we know that it won't hurt them? If the truth hurts do we alter it for the sake of others feelings?

I'm not really sure about any of this.

 

[iqqi]

slick, i am having problems with trust right now, as stated in these threads:


trust issues

calling all liars

maybe they will give you some perspective. check them out.

 

[Slickster]

HI iqqi,

Thanks for the response. I've read those other threads and I think that like you, I'm still confused.

If one uses the addage "Look at what they do, not what they say"

In my situation I could say that when this girl is faced with the choice of lying to me in order to save my feelings - she is going to lie.

Probably not the right thing to do but her intentions are good.

Does it seem like lying is only wrong when you get caught?

I'm sure there are things about my past that I wouldn't want her to know. If she were to ask me about them I'm not sure I could tell her the truth.

The past is the past - True. But lying about it today brings up trust issues that can't be denied.

It is so true that once trust is broken its nearly impossible to get it back.

ZZZIIIPPP

I hate to say it but that is the sound of me putting on my titanium vest I wear to protect my heart.

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

women lie most of the time -- I personally hate liars.

I tell you why she lied to you...

She called this guy a player and a dog because he played her and she was one of his victims - her feelings got hurt because she probably liked him and got dumped and now she loathes him for his rightful actions! She couldn't admit to this because how would you perceive her then - as a player also?

So you have to ask yourself - 'what did my girl see in this player?" Maybe she had the same traits as this player type and as they say "birds of the same feather flock together". Never trust a girl that sleeps around -- you are just the next in line!

She will end her sexual pursuits when she knows her looks and body cant catch men so readily and she starts aging --- i say by 27 years old they are looking for marriage and ready to settle for one final sex partner.

 

[Slickster]

Good point PRL.

She said to me once that she's glad that she didn't grow up in the area where we live. She didn't want anyone to know about her past.

While no guy likes to think about his girlfriend's sexual past I can't help it after reading your post.

While it didn't make me feel any better I appreciate the response.

 

[jbbrain]

Slick,

A little context is needed:

How long have u been dating her?
Has she ever lied to you before?
What kind of disposition does this girl have?
What kind of relationships does she have with her friends?

I'm writing this to you becase trust was indeed an issue with me about 3 weeks ago in my relationship. Of course, I think I blew it out of proportion as I have never caught her lie about anything.

Your situation definitely rings a bell. I believe in a situation like this, you have to be rational. Meaning, for whatver stupid reason she conjured up in her mind to not tell you about this guy (when you would have been perfectly content with the truth), the fact still remains that her lie, in itself, is pretty insignificant. It was onlyneeded to protect some sort of illusion she had with this other guy, way before you came in the picture.

Contrarily, your mind gets started about the lying in general, and you can't help but ask yourself how she COULDN'T lie about everythign else when she seems so comfortable lying about the small things. I remember about a year and a half ago, I would consciously keep on testing my ex gf, by askign her the smallest things, fulling knowing the answer, to see if she would lie to me. Distrust's a bytch.

I'll be honest with you, it's an extrmely tough call. I have the feeling that no matter what, you're goign to really have a hard time ever TRULY believing this chick, as much as you'll want to if you do decide to continue seeing her. If you feel you can get by this hump in the relationship, you might want to sit her down, talk to her, and really try to communicate to her your confusion as to why she REALLY felt the NEED TO LIE TO YOU. Expose her, make her admit to what Puerto Rican Lover had said was the true reason behind her deviance from the truth.

How much does this chick mean to you anyways?

PS-By the way, I'm not writing this shyt to "mend things" between you and me like player once strangely suggested. Why he has to romanticize everyhting is beyond me. Whatver, hopefully you realized my hate mail wasnt directed to you dog..I wanted to reply to this because ive been goign through the same trust issues recently. Keep your head up.

 

[JustDoItAlways]

Slickster, she obviously lied to you to protect your feelings or to cover up a past that she is not proud of / doesn't want you to know about.

This is just one of those "little white lies." Everyone tells these kind of lies and it is not a major problem.

But you handled it right in terms of calling her on it.

If a girl thinks she can get away with telling you little white lies, then she loses respect for you. The little white lies turn into bigger grey lies and she loses even more respect for you.

Eventually, the little white lies turn into bigger grey lies and then into "big black lies." At this point, she loses all respect for you and constantly lies about everything as well as creates new big black lie situations such as cheating since she doesn't respect you.

So, I think you have to call your woman on every lie that she tries to pull on you. The punishment you dole out to her should fit the crime so that she knows lying is one of those things that you will not put up with. The benefit of no more lying from her is, in fact, doubled because her respect for you also increases proportionately. Most of the time, you only have to call her out on the first one to stop it from happening again.

But it sounds like you have already made your point in terms of fitting the crime and its time to get over it. Chicks also respect guys that dole out the right punishment at the right time and then get over it in the right way.

 

[Player_Supreme]

1. I've found that it's always best to be honest with women. I tell them about my past when they ask. I tell them about my pimping and macking women for doe.

2. By telling them the truth they can make a decision on whether they wanna hang out with me or not.

3. Women who lie to you about their past are common. I explain to them upfront that I expect the same. If I catch them in a lie, then like you I lose all trust for them.

4. I can understand ho's wanting to save my feelings. That is why I dig into their life story so we don't have any drama later on like this. My current I know she was a female player and I know all of the things she did...it doesn't bother me...the kettle can't call the pot black as they say.

5. Once trust is blown with me it's a done deal.

6. You have to decide whether or not you will have anything with a ho who lies to you that many times in 5 minutes.

7. Being who I am my outlook on women and their honesty is somewhat jaded:

Player's Rule # 1: *****es ain't ****.
"This is for the G's, and this is for the hustlers. . . "

If she is lying now about this little thing...what else is she lying about...I hope this doesn't cause you too much concern.


Player's Rule # 2: If you stare long enough, you'll see right through her.

speaks for it's self. eventually shyt will raise to the surface

Player's Rule # 6: Roll With the Punches.

Stay alert cause women are great actors. Keep your eyes open she might be playing you. Actions speak louder than words. I am a master of words. That is my education. I've learned to use words to motivate or destroy. So I usually take what people say with a grain of salt.


I am always ready to walk away at the drop of a hat. Stay loose slick.

 

[InLawsHateMe]

Originally posted by Slickster
While it didn't make me feel any better I appreciate the response.

LOL! ...Hey Slick, if you like this chic, let it roll. Forget about it, and move on, for real. Obvioulsy, she still has some feelings for this person, why else would his name keep popping up? If I were you, well.... I'd do things a bit different, like not care, because there are other interested women in my life.. but that's me...life's too short to dwell on unhappiness, and drama. It's just best to keep that confident, happy feeling going, you know?.... now, if you really like this chic, drop it and just forget that you ever brought it up. It's a bit embarrassing ain't it? You feel embarrassed. The pride is hurt.. that you feel seond fiddle to this guy... well, don't. Tell her 'Hey I like you, and I like you more than some of the other women in my life ...but everytime you bring this chump up, it makes me feel like I'm getting his seconds, because he didn't want you, and I do... well I don't look at you as leftovers, unless you want me to eat you. ...but seriously.... enough about this guy already.. he's history, how about you and I take it from here?'


*Shrugs* .....when all else fails, result to sex.

One more thing.. drop the jealous crap bro... you are a man, you don't need to be jealous....

 

[NewMan]

Haven't we all lied like this? I know I have lied about some of my past, because I felt the woman I was with would not be able to handle it.

I was caught to - and had to deal with the ramifications - and now, it's not something I would ever do again - but sometimes you need to get caught in order to figure that out.

I think the question should be her motivation for BSing you.

Did she lie because she's still fvcking/seeing this guy? - sounds like this is not the reason.

Did she lie, because she wanted to protect your feelings? - maybe, but I seriously doubt this is the real reason.

I think the real reason is because she wanted to protect herself. As others said, she probably got played by this guy - Or she found out that he's a player and is pissed off at him - and is protecting her feelings by calling him an A##, a player, a Dog etc.

Next - how does she treat you? well? has she lied about other things - and Slickster you would know if she's BSing you about other things - how do you feel about that - her morals - when she talks about her friends - or her family. Is she loyal? or does she trash talk and lie to her friends?

These are all things you must way up - and in the end only you can make the determination and decision.

Finally - if you decide to continue this - how are you going to deal with his phone calls to her, and him asking her to visit him in another city? If she's still taking these calls - that much disrespect to you - and I'd say dump that b#tch. I would not stand by, whilst some ex F'buddy of my Girlfriend calls up inviting her to another city so her can fvck her.

Good luck - keep us posted.

 

[jbbrain]

Originally posted by Slickster

She starts saying a bunch of stuff like:

"I was just trying to protect your feelings"

Do you know I would say to this?


Don't flatter yourself so much.."honey". Save your fukkin pity!

 

[chlywly]

lol soon as she starts trying to be defensive and asking questions like well why does it matter bla bla, give her the boot.

 

[Befuddled]

Slick. Here's what you need to do. calm down, go for a walk, listen to music, or just go hang out with your friends. just mellow out for sometime, take your mind off this matter.

Then, just try reflecting on it.

Beleive me when i tell you.... there's a good deal of guys out there who are, or have been, in exactly the same situation.

And while someone earlier in this thread pointed out..."birds of a feather flock together" and "shes a player, etc"... which could be true. i think you aught to analyze YOUR specific situation. I agree shes dissing this other guy cause he probably played her and left her.

So now comes the tough part:
-why does she seem to mention him so often ? i dont know the answer to that, but it's probably something you want think about.

-to me, personally, trust is the foundation of a good relationship. I usually trust ppl until they give me reason not to....after that it's up to them to earn it back, which in my little world, is preety hard to do.

-The fact that this is quite an issue to you, only leads me to beleive that the relationship is not gonna work.... this is quite a major blow to the foundation, and.... well you n her might descide to overlook it, but after sometime, you have a little quibble and it comes back....it's not gonna go away.

And lastly, here's a question for you:
WHY on earth did you ask her about her past boyfriends/relationships !?!?!? you dont do that, unless youre prepared to accept it. you can tell us over and over again about how it dosent bother you and that the fact that she lied actually does, but i for one cant beleive it.
Why ? imagine she hasnt slept with this guy for a second. so when you ask her for the first time, she tells you yeah shes slept with him. then later on she tells you she hasnt. i'm sure it would be a LOT easier to swallow the scenario above.

Now....remember.....
youre not out to make this chick cry or to hurt her. explain to her that the fact that she had a fling with him and then lied to you about it, has really effected the relationship. and tell her what you descide to do (break up/ try to work it out,etc)

personally id just play it cool, explain to her that i want to break up and then just LJBFs her.
keep us posted.
Cheers.

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

Never, never, never, try to rationalize a lie, like people are doing on this thread.. There is no such thing as a white lie! And not liking a lie does not make one 'jealous'.

What you want to do is get at the underlying reason of why the lie became into existence! And never, never, take the girls word wholeheartedly as to the reason why she lied - this is for you and only you to figure out and to ponder, through observation and in silence. Hhhhhmmmmm, why would she lie, why is she talking about this guy to me for the last few months, and let alone why is she bringing him up in my face knowing that she had sex with this dirty player and I'm listening to her with the belief that she did not have sex with him, all the while she is demeaning him in my face. Well shouldn't her own statements be applicable to her also since she was party to the act and part of his player lifestyle?

Now ask yourself -- Would she ever bring this guy up in a conversation again with her knowing that you now know the reality of things? Of course not! Why not? Nothing has changed! All details are the same! Your knowing, doesn't take away the fact that it happened!

I tell you what did change…

The only thing different is that now you know the truth and you can judge her accordingly and decisively and on the basis of truth, and not on her words but on her actions - and to liars these two things often contradict one another. She can no longer fashion a lie into shape and make it smell of a sweet aroma, because you already know the truth and you know of its’ rotten stench and now you have the power and not her to determine a things validity!

Women know men judge them by the number of sex partners they engaged with, and who in particular, they done it with - because no fool wants to walk down the aisle when half of the male ‘friends’ in the audience screwed your bride and you are in ignorant bliss of their little dirty secret! This same situation applies regarding your circle of friends and acquaintances.

This pretending not to know or care is so true nowadays – its pathetic - chumps don’t care because they get to keep the ho for keeps and get to watch her age and grow plump like a raisin to a prune – and then he becomes disillusioned a few years within his marriage and then and only then does he brings up her past and all her wrongdoings!

Why? You ask. Because he wants out of the relationship, because she is no longer that young beautiful bride with the lovely figure she once had before the 3 kids and before all the demands and strains that providing for a household brings. You see, he made allowances for her indiscretions and her cheap affairs in the past because he desired her so in all her glory that graced her at that time.

But this glory has now since faded and so has his interest and thus he tolerates less from her and now makes more stringent demands upon her and has higher requirements for her to fulfill in marriage than he did in the relationship – he should have qualified her before marriage and not after the envelope has been sealed. It is too late to undo what has been done without paying a heavy toll on your mental, emotional and financial health! So he endures his pain in silent suffering until he can bear it no more!!

We all do this – the pretty women can do no wrong – at least not enough wrong to justify leaving her! But let the ugly woman just look at you cross-eyed once and you drop her like a ton of bricks! KIRPLUNK!!!! Would you treat this girl the same and would the information you just found out have the same bearing if you weren’t so attracted to her and if she was waning in her beauty and along in her years?

If she lied to you because she was throwing a surprised birthday for you and wanted to keep you blinded of this fact, then I say, for all intents and purposes and for all the things that matter to you in life, then this is quite insignificant in the total spectrum of things, is it not? Shouldn’t we consider this a ‘white lie’ for its’ lack of consequences. Obviously we should not take her ‘values’ of what makes her the person that she is and thus who you care about, and equate this with the surprise gathering of friends. Should we? Nonetheless Slickster, this is for you to decide, and not us.

Damn, I just realized I’m giving advice and I wrote this long winded post on the significance of a lie and lying, to a man named Slickster whose name in slang terminology implies deceitful cunning!! No?

Does anyone else, besides me, see the irony here? JJJ

Oh well, I hope I brought a little insight to some of you younger DJ’s – stash this away for a few years and see my words come to life.

 

[Alonso]

It's a tough call. You're going to have to determine whether you trust her or not, rather than wondering every time. But that's easy to say -- "If you trust her, don't always be jealous and suspicioius; if you have reason not to trust her, get rid of her now." How do you get to the point, though, of knowing whether or not she's basically trustworthy, without seeing and knowing the details of at least a couple of examples?

There <are> innocent explanations for contact with exes, other people of the opposite sex -- we've probably all done it once, if only to simplify things (a nutty ex of mine e-mailed me a while back wanting to talk, and I did not tell the current gf, b/c (a) I didn't plan to respond to the ex anyhow and (b) my history with her (which I'd still never told the new one) was embarrassing enough (in terms of her nutty behavior and my excessive tolerance of it) that I didn't want to have to go into the details, and women generally demand details). Another girl I was dating met up with a former interest while traveling abroad, but never told me she was going to lunch with him (I found this out because her mom innocently mentioned it). I was mildly concerned at the time, but later came to (I think correctly) trust her pretty thoroughly, and wrote this episode off to the same sort of it's-no-big-deal-so-let's-not-make-it-one-by-telling-her/him-about-it phenomenon).

Having said that, I've also taken non-jealousy and non-inquisitiveness to an extreme, I think. It all depends on the girl. Almost any time I've been burned, the girl turned out to have been telling half-truths. Partly this is because fibbers often like to include a kernel of truth in their intentional fibs so as to have plausible deniability if you catch them, partly it is because women believe in creating storylines that cast them in a positive light (which they're then capable of believing). So in my experience you're less likely to catch her with Sergio the Italian Gigalo, whom you've never met or heard of, than you are to find that her "lunches" with her ex, or her after-work drinks with "some friends from work," or her references to "Joe, who my friend Sally is kind of interested in," or "this one bartender at the place we hang out who was really cool to us" have morphed into your getting dumped and her hooked up within a week with the guy who was ostensibly just a casual social contact, and who you were big enough and mature enough to just say "that's nice" when she previously mentioned hanging out with him, because you took her word for it that they were just socializing. If you complain that she went behind your back she can just remind you (and has convinced herself) that she told you all about their "platonic" hanging out, and that the fact she and he have "become friends" in the five days since she dumped you is none of your business, you psycho. Hell, she may even go out of her way to tell you that she dumped you <because> you didn't exhibit any jealousy when she tried to hint that this guy was interested in her, or vice versa, thus proving you didn't care enough. Yep, they're perfectly capable of saying something like that without shame.

Again making me re-consider my non-jealousy position, or at least try to provide some safeguard so it doesn't burn me, is the fact that many guys who aren't intrinsically jealous (and who aren't themselves scammers) are just oblivious to the amount of attention their gfs get from the scammers of the world on a daily basis (this isn't surprising given that a somewhat-above-average guy might go weeks or months between strange girls showing overt interest in him, whereas a correspondingly-attractive girl will get, if not hit on, drawn into exploratory conversations, etc. on an almost daily basis). So even if the guy and his gf are of roughly equal morality, she is just going to be presented with more opportunities to stray than he is. I remember an internal security officer giving a seminar at some job I had once, talking about employee theft/embezzlement; his comment was that if he left his watch on the table and left the room, 15% of people would be totally honest and would never think of stealing it even if they could get away with it, 15% would always steal it, and 60% of people would be "mostly honest" but <would> at least consider stealing it in some cases, depending on the circumstances, how likely they were to get caught, etc. -- the point being that the 60% in the middle were the only ones they could really persuade or try and give incentives to make the right choice. I don't know how accurate those numbers are, or exactly how this corellates to girls being approached by rival guys, but you have to assume <some> guy is always going to be going after your girl, and <some> girls (even after you weed out the 15% who would always cheat) are dumb enough, subject enough to flattery, bored enough, etc. to go either way. This being so, it's not irrational, even with a gf who's "mostly honest," to think that putting herself in situations -- even when they are on their face "platonic" or "social" or "harmless" -- where there's a high chance that active pursuit by other guys, and lack of resistance by her, will lead her to deviate from her "mostly honest" ways.

Of course, that's a diagnosis without much of a solution -- doesn't tell you exactly how to figure out if she's "mostly" or totally honest, doesn't tell you how to influence the "mostly honest" not to put themselves in temptation's way, etc.

 

[Alonso]

Originally posted by Alonso
15% of people would be totally honest and would never think of stealing it even if they could get away with it, 15% would always steal it, and 60% of people would be "mostly honest" but <would> at least consider stealing it in some cases,

Er . . . pardon my math. "70%". But you get the point . . . .

 

[Slickster]

Update on this situation

First off I'd like to say thank-you to all of you who took the time to respond.

Iqqi, PuertoRican Lover, Player Supreme, JBBrain, JustdoitAlways, InLawsHateMe, Befuddled, Newman, Chlywly, Drixsa, and Alonso.

Thanks everyone. I really appreciate the advice. At times like this I feel very lucky to have friends here. I don't like talking about personal matters with others who know me in real life. You people and this place give me a chance to get stuff off my chest. THANK YOU!

Well on to my update.

I let her think about things for a day. I got a call from her late last night. She was bawling her head off. She said she couldn't take it (my silent treatment) anymore and wanted to resolve things asap.

As advised by many of you I tried to get down to the reason why she lied about this. She started off by saying that she wanted to save my feelings but later admitted that she didn't want me to think less of her. My question then was, why go out of your way to express how much of a dog she thought this guy was, when she had slept with him all along. It just didn't make sense. She didn't really have an answer but I think its safe to say she was trying to build herself up in my eyes. Make me believe that she was above all the player BS. Its also obvious she never thought that she would be caught.

Not that I believed her but she went on to explain how she had been in an abusive relationship with another guy for quite some time. She wanted out for awhile and when they finally split she fell into the players arms/bed. Not really a great excuse to me. Kind of raised some red flags in my mind too. Hmmm. But as someone said its not a good idea to think about your girlfriend's sexual past. Believe me its hard not to imagine some deep dark sh!t after hearing about past abusive BF's and her sleeping with dirty dog player guy.

Anyhow she went on and on crying and saying sorry. She couldn't understand how I could let something from the distant past affect us now. Well I explained its the lying in the present that affects our relationship now. Big Time. How am I supposed to believe anything else she tells me?

I can understand her wanting to lie about it. I'm sure I wouldn't be readily revealing any dark secrets I have either. If asked outright about something though, I think it really is a good idea to tell the truth. Just for the plain reason that it makes it way worse to get caught after the fact. Better to tell the truth, take your lumps and not have to think about it again.

I took your responses to heart when deciding what to do here. I weighed the positive traits she has against the fact that she is obviously able to lie to me easily without any remorse (except when busted). Before this incident I believed her to be a great girl. She had all the qualities for an LTR. Admittedly I was quite surprised to hear about her and the player. She is a very timid girl in the bedroom. I always thought of her as a "nice girl".

She was absolutely devastated when I told her that our relationship has taken a big step back. She is well aware that I don't qualify women for LTR's very easily. She knows I'm not an easy catch. She knows I've had trust issues with gf's in the past
and it takes a long time for me to build trust. Like JustdoitAlways said calling her on any lie makes her know that I won't put up with it and possibly builds respect. I'm pretty sure she'll think twice about lying to me in the future. (If she wants to be with me anyway)

I didn't want to end the relationship based on this issue. However my eyes and ears are wide open. I really like Player Supreme's point about "If you stare at her long enough you'll see right thru her. Eventually her sh!t will come to the surface."
I can't help feeling right now that she may have some deep dark past that she is hiding behind her very innocent exterior. All I can go on is what I see of her now. Which is a great girl who is absolutely crazy about me and would probably lie to me so I wouldn't think any less of her.

As for the player calling her and inviting her to stay. I can't really help him calling. He conducts business at her place of employment and I can't really stop that. Whether she would tell me about his calls I don't know. Does it really matter if its him or any other guy trying to pick her up and f*ck her? All I can do is play the game and keep her interest level for me sky high so that no other guy can come into the picture.

Iqqi I hope you get your trust issues worked out. If theres anything I could, do let me know.

PuertoRican Lover Wise words. I appreciate your wisdom and experienced view.

Player Supreme As always much respect for you and your no BS style.

JustdoitAlways, InLawsHateMe, NewMan, Befuddled, Alonso, Drixsa Great insight. Gave me alot to think about and alot I will remember for the future.

And JBBrain I was surprised to see your response after the flaming on your other thread. I was also relieved that you were giving good advice instead of more flames. I sometimes find myself saying things I regret when I come to the forum. I'm not sure why. Weird mood, bad day, I don't know. I hope it may have been "one of those days" for you. I didn't mean to get involved that way but I guess I took offense and also didn't like the way you were flaming Player Supreme. I know you two don't see eye to eye. And I do understand the flaming. At times Player's advice may come off as harsh and in your face but that is his style. Whether you like it or not I think you'll find most of what he has to say - true. I have. Anyways that is between you and him. As far as you and I go - no hard feelings here. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Player_Supreme]

Thank you for the respect. Full respect is returned. Good luck!

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

Slickster,

This is good that this happen to you now because it has only opened your eyes to the fact that so-called 'innocent' girls rarely exist. She has blinded you by her portrayal and curtain of so-callled 'innocence'. Take it from me dude, I know the so-called innocent types - the reason that she is so 'innocent' with you is because she really really really likes you and don't want to lose you (you are probably the most decent guy she had) as evident by this setback and her hurt feelings. She knows you are the kind of man that doesn't likes a player ho and that is why she kept trying to distant herself and try to act like she was the polar opposite of player dude.

So she did admit and finally confessed, as stated in my first post -

"Hhhhhmmmmm, why would she lie, why is she talking about this guy to me for the last few months, and let alone why is she bringing him up in my face knowing that she had sex with this dirty player and I'm listening to her with the belief that she did not have sex with him, all the while she is demeaning him in my face. ------------------------------ Well shouldn't her own statements be applicable to her also since she was party to the act and part of his player lifestyle?-------------------------------

You'll then see her as a player too!

She did not want you to know who she really is because then she could make you believe what she wants you to believe by formulating your opinion of her, not from her past but from her present actions on how she treats you. Always consider this - to determine the genuineness and worth of an individual, never base this on how they treat you or how much they like you, rather base it on how they trreat others. Why? , you ask. Because they have selfish reasons (they seek your approval) and thus selfish motives to treat you nice. On the other hand, there is nothing at stake or for her to benefit from (personally and romantically speaking) for going out of her way to help others that she does not know or have any connection with.

The past is extremely important if you want to know her inner being and how she will do things in the future and how she truly thinks! As a (wo)man thinketh, so is she! Think about it for a second - if she is 26 years old how much of her life is the past and how much the present and how much is the future - I have the answer so that you don't have to calculate it yourself - 99.999999999999999999999999 % is her past! Now you know why chicks tell you to think about the future together and forget about the past - yeah rrrrrrriiiiiiiiiggghhhtttttt!!!!

Didn't you state that dhe was avoiding and hiding her past in your original post? Hhhhhhmmmmm - I wonder why. I advise you to check out her past with more vigor now and with double the effort. Liars hate this and will scorn you for seeking truth - this means that they are hiding something and do not want to be exposed - this exposure will be the end of their lies and the end of them having control in the relationship and eventually lead to their dismssal! Trust me on this!

So thinking less of her was the answer of why she lied and it had nothing to do with hurting your feelings - she tried to take focus away from her corrupt behaior by telling you she was sparing yours feelings -- aha, another lie in and of itself!

I Don't mean to be talking badly about your girl just being honest with the little I know. Slickster, If I didn't know better, I think you are dating my last 2 ex's

Man - this was suppose to be an one sentence post.

If I know it though, I have to tell it!

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

Slick,

I'm going to take a stab at it - is this girl in her mid 20's or older and is ready to 'settle down' with a 'nice' guy and is determined to put her past behind her and look towards the future?

This is the kind of thinking that hos possess who had a mired past and screwed around to only have 'fun' without any thought to the consequences.

Now she wants to be loyal to only one guy that loves her for who she is, and she knows that she can't 'get' him if she shows her wild side, so she must portray an air of innocence inside and outside the bedroom. She wants to 'trap' a man into marriage!
I used the word 'trap' in place of 'lies' - same thing!