Career advice

[Trader]

Does being a Financial advisor make you happy? Think long and hard about this. Is the work you put in worth the end result? Are there other things out there you are more interested in eg. Stocks?

YOu could well be in the wrong field of expertise, since it does seem your skills are being undervalued. I would suggest building up assets on the side, eg. stocks and real estate, taking you towards financial independence, and then you'll be able to do whatever you want.

Also disregard Trader's bullsh1t advice and God delusions.

CaptainJ - cut the crap, since you can achieve anything you want, whenever you want, how successful are YOU right now? If you have not made it yet, then STFU

If you have made it, (which I am bet you still haven't) does it scare you that you could lose it ALL due to tragedy, cancer, or a big legal lawsuit? Reality is going to hit you hard someday. Nothing is stable in this world, not your success, not even your life. Understanding that, is the beginning of wisdom.

 

[CaptainJ]

CaptainJ - cut the crap, since you can achieve anything you want, whenever you want, how successful are YOU right now? If you have not made it yet, then STFU

If you have made it, (which I am bet you still haven't) does it scare you that you could lose it ALL due to tragedy, cancer, or a big legal lawsuit? Reality is going to hit you hard someday. Nothing is stable in this world, not your success, not even your life. Understanding that, is the beginning of wisdom.

HAha, you're basically saying no one should bother with trying to achieve their ambitions, for highly improbable events can occur to dash them. Well, enjoy a relatively unsuccessful life. But for those of us who don't wait for opportunities to fall into our lap, we WORK hard, without fear of sudden death or tragedy. And even when tragedy strikes, we start over.

Why are you even on this self improvement forum if you don't believe in success through hard work? Aren't you afraid some guy with kill you for mistakenly flirting with his girlfriend?

Few things are stable in life. However, something that you can CHOOSE to be stable is YOURSELF. Understanding that, is the beginning of wisdom.

 

[Trader]

CaptainJ - cut the crap, since you can achieve anything you want, whenever you want, how successful are YOU right now? If you have not made it yet, then STFU

If you have made it, (which I am bet you still haven't) does it scare you that you could lose it ALL due to tragedy, cancer, or a big legal lawsuit? Reality is going to hit you hard someday. Nothing is stable in this world, not your success, not even your life. Understanding that, is the beginning of wisdom.

HAha, you're basically saying no one should bother with trying to achieve their ambitions, for highly improbable events can occur to dash them. Well, enjoy a relatively unsuccessful life. But for those of us who don't wait for opportunities to fall into our lap, we WORK hard, without fear of sudden death or tragedy. And even when tragedy strikes, we start over.

Why are you even on this self improvement forum if you don't believe in success through hard work? Aren't you afraid some guy with kill you for mistakenly flirting with his girlfriend?

Poor CaptainJ lacks basic logic, well actually he does use chick logic though

Re-read my previous posts. I said, there is no guarantee you will succeed, but having said that, try your best.

To Backbreaker

I agree with you that hard-work, persistence, and ambition are invaluable and every man should be equipped with these traits.

But it is the HEIGHT of arrogance to assume: 'by working hard, and with an indefatiguable will, I will achieve my goals, and nothing can stop me.'

Somehow you twist my words into: 'Since success is not guaranteed, you should not even bother try to and achieve your ambitions.'

I never said that. But you thought I did due to your chick logic.

Few things are stable in life. However, something that you can CHOOSE to be stable is YOURSELF. Understanding that, is the beginning of wisdom.

Well thank you Captain Obvious. Yes you can choose to be stable yourself, no one ever said you couldn't. Totally irrelevant to our discussion.

My point was, life is unstable, therefore it is arrogance for you to assume you will achieve your goals.

By the way, CaptainJ, are you a girl? Feels like I'm trying to discuss something intellectual with a girl, epic fail.

 

[azanon]

Julius - While they're arguing I'll see if I can help.

Do you have a college degree? If not, get one (The 4 year kind). As for what to get it in, I'd try to find a field where you can write given how well you do it. I work as a professional where i write large documents, and strong writing skills are actually more rare than you might think.

You have to go where the jobs are. Search listings and find what jobs seem to be the most needed. Then get a degree in whatever it is that you need to do those jobs. Pick something you'd enjoy, but not necessarily love.

People are paid to do jobs because no one in their right mind would do it for free. Anyone who actually MEANS they love their job is screwed up in the head AFAIK, because jobs should be no match for un-paid hobbies in terms of fun rating. Exception being maybe if you're a professional gofler and they pay you to ... golf! But like you admitted, even doing finance - something you love - involves rejection after rejection which is a universally disliked feeling.

Use your financial skills just for your own personal life. It's actually what I do best too - better even than my occupation - but you'll get your value out of that by just using it for your personal finances.

To reiterate - no 4 year degree - then no wonder you aren't making any money. In truth, the masters usually pays for itself too. It certainly did for me, and continues to give me that edge over the masses.

 

[CaptainJ]

Poor CaptainJ lacks basic logic, well actually he does use chick logic though

Re-read my previous posts. I said, there is no guarantee you will succeed, but having said that, try your best.

Somehow you twist my words into: 'Since success is not guaranteed, you should not even bother try to and achieve your ambitions.'

I never said that. But you thought I did due to your chick logic.

Well thank you Captain Obvious. Yes you can choose to be stable yourself, no one ever said you couldn't. Totally irrelevant to our discussion.

My point was, life is unstable, therefore it is arrogance for you to assume you will achieve your goals.

By the way, CaptainJ, are you a girl? Feels like I'm trying to discuss something intellectual with a girl, epic fail.

I would respond, but I'd rather not stoop to your level of crude accusations, when it adds nothing to the debate at hand. Although it is amusing how defensive you get. It seems to be a common trait in people who try and hold others back.

 

[Duffdog]

Gents, I am 27 years old, about to be 28, and I am standing at an impasse.

For 7 years, my dream was to be a financial advisor. It first came to me when I was in the Marines, and stayed with me through college. When I initially couldn't get hired as a FA, I went into sales and did that for a couple years. I've learned alot about business, people, and life as a salesman and I wouldn't trade my experiences for anything, although I have known poverty and great adversity in my journey. All those years, I held my dream before me, at times strong and others nearly forgotten. Last year, I met a guy who was getting hired as a manager with a large firm, we made friends, and I got hired. I was in! "I have arrived!", I thought to myself.

Since that time, my life has been one of constant pain and growth. This job has made me hard. I have been nearly in poverty since I came into this job, and everyday is a herculean struggle to make ends meet. It requires great intestinal fortitude to go to work day after day and keep a positive attitude when you aren't making any money. I have absorbed the teachings of all the great prophets of success and mental game: Napoleon Hill, Zig Ziglar, Brian Tracy, Earl Nightingale, Henry Ford, Andrew Carnegie, Teddy Roosevelt, the list goes on and on. I have created a mindset of strength, faith, and perseverance. I believe that one may achieve anything he can conceive, I have seen tantalizing evidence of it in my own life, but it still eludes me.

And all the while, the clock is ticking.

Everyday is hell for me. Basically, I call business owners in the morning, visit business in the afternoon, and cold call people at home in the evening. But what I'm really doing is beating my head against a wall, trying to convince people twice my age to trust me with their retirement and investments. Rejection is my NAME. And it SUCKS. Perhaps once a day, I'll get someone to set an appointment, but EVERY APPT. I'VE SET has been a complete waste of time. Of the maybe 20% who show up, they either don't have any money or think I'm too young to be doing what I'm doing, and they don't trust me.

While I treasure the personal growth this experience has afforded me, at what point do you throw in the towel and go do something else? If I already had a big pile of money, and could afford to not make anything for a couple more years, I'd be a possum eating peach seeds. See, my quandry is that I believe in persistence, I believe in toughing it out, but GDit, I'm killing myself for NOTHING! Nothing financial, anyway.

And this journey has been full of unexpected twists too. I saw myself sitting down with people and helping them chart a financial destiny. But this industry puts you in such a regulatory straightjacket that you have to water down anything you say to a client, choose your words so carefully that you end up saying nothing at all. What I'm saying is, I had a dream, but now that I'm almost there, it's nothing like I thought it would be, and I don't want it anymore. Am I rationalizing cowardice? Every indicator in the rational world is telling me GO DO SOMETHING ELSE. But am I quitter if I do so? What happens when you realize you had the wrong dream?

I want to take my knowledge and put it to use with my own money. I love the investment world, but I hate working on the brokerage side, so I want to dedicate myself to investing in stocks. I know I can make money there, and I won't have to kill myself trying to get someone else to do business with me. My risk, my reward.

So my question is, do you think I am being a coward? Or do you see it as I want to see it, that I am removing myself from a professional beartrap I stepped in? Do you see me as "giving up on my dream"? I have invested SO MUCH of myself into this career, I wanted it SO BAD. But here in the real world, I'm fvcking MISERABLE every day and I'm not making any money, so do you think I am wise to head for greener pastures?

This experience has taxed me to my utmost. I have become an infinitely stronger man for having endured it. But I'm sick of enduring this fruitless enterprise, I'm ready for what I ultimately desire, and that is SUCCESS. I'm just having trouble trusting my judgment right now, and I welcome your thoughts.

Julius,

As a financial type person, you should know that everything comes in cycles. The success that FA's have enjoyed 7 years ago is gone. All of it. You have 2 options, either, you wait until the upswing in the economy and ride the wave, or, you find something different to do. Factually, one of the reasons that you got the job you did is because your employer does not have to pay you...unless you produce. This means that you are self employed.

In the financial industry, there are two types of people, the people who make money and people who don't. I don't care what your job title is, if you are making more than an adviser at a large firm, you are more successful.

So, find something that makes money now, and do what you want after you have a lot of money.

 

[backbreaker]

Julius,

As a financial type person, you should know that everything comes in cycles. The success that FA's have enjoyed 7 years ago is gone. All of it. You have 2 options, either, you wait until the upswing in the economy and ride the wave, or, you find something different to do. Factually, one of the reasons that you got the job you did is because your employer does not have to pay you...unless you produce. This means that you are self employed.

In the financial industry, there are two types of people, the people who make money and people who don't. I don't care what your job title is, if you are making more than an adviser at a large firm, you are more successful.

So, find something that makes money now, and do what you want after you have a lot of money.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvICN8DNMpY

this **** still gets me going

 

[Julius_Seizeher]

Trader and Captain- You're done.

Backbreaker- Boiler Room is full of good ones, but you have to see Alec Baldwin's sales speech in Glengarry Glen Ross. THAT is the greatest sales meeting ever.

To all- I appreciate your input. I have decided to resign my commission. I have taken so much from this job: I pushed so far past my comfort zone that I'm not sure I have one anymore, I put my balls on the line, and I now know more about managing money and risk than 99% of the population. I'm going to get another job, and take steps towards becoming a full-time daytrader. Why kill myself to earn 1% on someone else's ETFs when I can use my own money and keep it all for myself? Luckily, I am in a position to exercise extreme discipline with my money while I am getting it going; I live for free on a farm my family owns, I eat at my grandmas house, and I can squeeze my belt in order to get capital invested and begin flipping.

It's awesome to see how far I've come. The old me would be a worrying, depressed mess right now; now, I am emboldened to never ever give up, and I will see myself become wealthy, I have foreseen it.

 

[CaptainJ]

Trader and Captain- You're done.

Backbreaker- Boiler Room is full of good ones, but you have to see Alec Baldwin's sales speech in Glengarry Glen Ross. THAT is the greatest sales meeting ever.

To all- I appreciate your input. I have decided to resign my commission. I have taken so much from this job: I pushed so far past my comfort zone that I'm not sure I have one anymore, I put my balls on the line, and I now know more about managing money and risk than 99% of the population. I'm going to get another job, and take steps towards becoming a full-time daytrader. Why kill myself to earn 1% on someone else's ETFs when I can use my own money and keep it all for myself? Luckily, I am in a position to exercise extreme discipline with my money while I am getting it going; I live for free on a farm my family owns, I eat at my grandmas house, and I can squeeze my belt in order to get capital invested and begin flipping.

It's awesome to see how far I've come. The old me would be a worrying, depressed mess right now; now, I am emboldened to never ever give up, and I will see myself become wealthy, I have foreseen it.

It's good that you've made a choice, it seems like the right one for you too. Are you going to move into full-time investing? Or will you be getting another job to work on other skills?

 

[Trader]

I would respond, but I'd rather not stoop to your level of crude accusations, when it adds nothing to the debate at hand. Although it is amusing how defensive you get. It seems to be a common trait in people who try and hold others back.

You should respond to my *crude* accusations, because they are spot on the money.

And if you respond, please employ logic, and no, chick logic does not count

Also, based on what you have shared regarding your 'inner game' when it comes to success, I'm looking to short the underlying stock CAPTAINJ (listed on the pink sheets)

And to get max value, I am buying deep out of the money put options on CAPTAINJ with a 2020 expiry.

 

[CaptainJ]

You should respond to my *crude* accusations, because they are spot on the money.

And if you respond, please employ logic, and no, chick logic does not count

Also, based on what you have shared regarding your 'inner game' when it comes to success, I'm looking to short the underlying stock CAPTAINJ (listed on the pink sheets)

And to get max value, I am buying deep out of the money put options on CAPTAINJ with a 2020 expiry.

I'm sorry, but your accusations hold a closer truth to your own arguments, which is why this quote springs to mind:
"Don't argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience."

 

[Bible_Belt]

To all- I appreciate your input. I have decided to resign my commission. I have taken so much from this job: I pushed so far past my comfort zone that I'm not sure I have one anymore, I put my balls on the line, and I now know more about managing money and risk than 99% of the population. I'm going to get another job, and take steps towards becoming a full-time daytrader. Why kill myself to earn 1% on someone else's ETFs when I can use my own money and keep it all for myself? Luckily, I am in a position to exercise extreme discipline with my money while I am getting it going; I live for free on a farm my family owns, I eat at my grandmas house, and I can squeeze my belt in order to get capital invested and begin flipping.

I was a "financial adviser" who went through the same crap. The only people young enough to trust me were the ones who had no money. Then I was a day trader. That was a lot of fun, and I at least made money for the company, but never much for myself. Then the companies kept going out of business. Now I live for free on a farm.

If you really want to trade, scrape up money that is all your own. You can start an e-mini futures account and trade the s&p futures for I think about $500 bucks. You're not going to make money for a while, but the point is to be in there and trading live with real money.

 

[backbreaker]

You should respond to my *crude* accusations, because they are spot on the money.

And if you respond, please employ logic, and no, chick logic does not count

Also, based on what you have shared regarding your 'inner game' when it comes to success, I'm looking to short the underlying stock CAPTAINJ (listed on the pink sheets)

And to get max value, I am buying deep out of the money put options on CAPTAINJ with a 2020 expiry.

the most ironic part to all your posts, is that napoleon hill was an extremely devote christian who in his book routinely urges people to use the power of prayer. lol, his "golden rule" comes straight out of the new testament. it's funny how you say "put down think and grow rich and pick up the bible" when they are in fact based on the same principles.

but you wouldn't know that, becuase you speak of somethign you know nothing of.

 

[synergy1]

Trader and Captain- You're done.

Backbreaker- Boiler Room is full of good ones, but you have to see Alec Baldwin's sales speech in Glengarry Glen Ross. THAT is the greatest sales meeting ever.

To all- I appreciate your input. I have decided to resign my commission. I have taken so much from this job: I pushed so far past my comfort zone that I'm not sure I have one anymore, I put my balls on the line, and I now know more about managing money and risk than 99% of the population. I'm going to get another job, and take steps towards becoming a full-time daytrader. Why kill myself to earn 1% on someone else's ETFs when I can use my own money and keep it all for myself? Luckily, I am in a position to exercise extreme discipline with my money while I am getting it going; I live for free on a farm my family owns, I eat at my grandmas house, and I can squeeze my belt in order to get capital invested and begin flipping.

It's awesome to see how far I've come. The old me would be a worrying, depressed mess right now; now, I am emboldened to never ever give up, and I will see myself become wealthy, I have foreseen it.

I am having a second round interview for the same position you had resigned from. On one hand, it looks interesting compared to my past employment as an engineer, but on the other, selling stuff seems like it might be more trouble than its worth. What I think they want are risk takers who know how to sell themselves. Cold calling specifically does NOT appeal to me at all.

My question to you is this; would you recommend this career path for someone from a technical background? In the past , I mostly engross myself within my own work, but also collaborate on teams and have successfully dealt with outside vendors/clients etc. It also seems like a somewhat large upfront risk in regards to income as a FA with no clients will not be earning much.

Any supplemental information to this original post would be helpful. Part of me is strongly considering it, but re-evaluating it in one year. Thanks again for your input! It means a lot.

 

[synergy1]

I'm not sure that cold-calling appeals to ANYONE...rest assured that if you become a FA, then you'll be cold-calling...lots of phone calls, for lots of months...anyone who tells you differently is lieing...the recruiter will sugar coat.

Yeah I guess this would make sense. I brought it up at the first interview and I was told that a lot of clientele would be found at various events and the like. They said they would prefer if their FAs didn't cold call, but it seems like it would be a lot of follow up. 30+ calls per week. 30 calls is maybe what I did in a few months as an engineer

My financial situation is in need of a job, so I am keeping this in mind too. Julius mentioned he had to go through the dregs for a while , and I am not sure I can handle another few years of this ( I lost my job in 09, worked in my own business in 2010). It would be nice to get back on financial track, buy a condo, and make ground on investments, but this isn't possible when a job makes you break even. None of my jobs within my field are panning out for one reason or another. I had one interview where the firm said I was inexperienced for the position, and another interview said I was overqualified. ha ha, how do you win that?

I know this thread is somewhat derailed, but this kind of information is a heck of a lot more meaningful than a sales pitch. He seems like he has a pretty good work ethic and intelligence, but the sales thing seems to be a certain type of personality.

 

[backbreaker]

I never had a problem cold calling. That's how I sold about 80% of my cars at the car lot. I rearley left my desk. I would either get the phone book and just start calling people up or go get the service log from the service department. I'd sale 20-25 a month. lots and lots and lots of no's. But you get some yes's. I even got so bold as to start to send out my own flyers, i'd have people coming to the car lot bringing my fyers to the car lot looking for me lol.

 

[Jamo]

Because you are scared, scared to admit that some things are out of your control. That your world is not as stable as you would like to admit.

This passage sums you up perfectly

James 4:13-14 Now listen, you who say, "Today or tomorrow we will go to this or that city, spend a year there, carry on business and make money." Why, you do not even know what will happen tomorrow. What is your life? You are a mist that appears for a little while and then vanishes."

Work hard? Yes.

Be persistent? Most definitely.

Hope for the best? Always.

But again, it is the height of arrogance to proclaim: 'I can achieve anything I want, nothing can stop me.'

You will be humbled, just like Icarus who believed he could fly higher and higher, until the bright hot sun started to melt his wings.

The only thing you are in control of is yourself (that in itself is a huge achievement). The rest does not matter...the past and the future. In believing that you can achieve anything is a powerful motivator. Whether you do or not is secondary, because with that mindset you will find the passion in what you are doing...and that in itself would most likely lead to that achievement. If you don't believe that you will achieve at the end, then you will never give 100% to anything in life and then your chances of "not achieving" go higher....nice catch 22.

However, it is arrogance to believe you will get whatever you want just because you ask for it or demand it. Self entitlement is arrogance. Icarus became greedy (you have to be happy with what you have too), and that ultimately lead to his downfall. But believing that you can achieve anything through hard work, passion, and perseverance is only a good thing.

 

[L B]

strong bump people. Can't believe this thread is almost a year already.

Any updates op?

 

[Quiksilver]

You're doing work but you're not being paid ... Why?

 

[synergy1]

You're doing work but you're not being paid ... Why?

not sure if you are referring to my post or another one , but ill take a stab at it. From what I gather about these types of positions is that you make your money based on the number of clients you pick up and how much money you are managing. For people who know what they are doing, its actually a pretty good way to make a living, it seems like a client building. Some companies will give you a monthly stipend to make ends meet, as well as draw which allows you to make money on months you overachieve in case you have a bad month. If the experts care to elaborate, than by all means since my point of view is admittedly limited.

basically it comes down to a company providing the structure, but you working for very little with the potential to earn a lot.

I never had a problem cold calling. That's how I sold about 80% of my cars at the car lot. I rearley left my desk. I would either get the phone book and just start calling people up or go get the service log from the service department. I'd sale 20-25 a month. lots and lots and lots of no's. But you get some yes's. I even got so bold as to start to send out my own flyers, i'd have people coming to the car lot bringing my fyers to the car lot looking for me lol.

I have read a lot of your posts in the past year, and you are a strait up hustler. In a way, taking this kind of position would force me out of that comfort zone and maybe ( key word) advance me to becoming more like you. As it is right now, I am no where near what you are. My life has been limited to academia, than professional technical companies with only a year as a business owner. you on the other hand have been doing this **** since you were a kid, with the modded systems and what not. Pretty badass to be honest. I wish I knew you as a kid because I was big into video game systems and would have helped you mod them and all that. instead I took the easy path and worked in a cube

so my question to you is this, can being a hustler be learned or is it ingrained into our personalities? do some people have it and others do not?