Can Zan Perrion's book be applied to the girls I deal with?

[ArmyStrong90]

Been reading Alabaster Girl by Zan Perrion as well as watching some of his seminars on YouTube. I noticed that his main point behind women and seduction all lies in the idea behind "submitting" and bring vulnerable while having a masculine edge. For example when you see a beautiful woman don't retreat and try to act all "cool" instead approach her with enthusiasm and curiosity. He says to have the mind set that "all women are your women" also the age old quote " a man who loves women is loved BY women" does not go unnoticed in his novel. My biggest concern is if his principals can be applied to the girls that I am typically around. I am 24 and a senior in college and the girls in my age bracket seem utterly clueless when a guy, that perrion describes to be a ladies man in his book, talks to them because he is genuinely interested. Some of them are in sororities some aren't and they range from 19-23 years old. Its as if they freeze or get scared or at times they may take it as if you are showering them with unwanted attention and validating them for no reason. This is because of the guys they have dealt with before are the type that perrion describes as "boys" I find it hard to be vulnerable simply because of the fact that i was a distraction or rebound for a girl that was having a rough time with her ex at the time. Now she is back with him and i felt like I wasted soo much time (an entire semester) now there are two girls who appear attracted to me and I am keeping them at bay even though i am interested . Went out with one of them for some drinks and the other is currently out of state on a spring break vacation.

 

[TheMonkeyKing]

I've read half the book and seen quite a few videos. From what I remember, he didn't really put a lot of emphasis on being vulnerable.

The main message that I took from his material is 'all women being your women' and treating them as such.... i.e. encouraging them in to their feminine energy.

-The girl you chat with in a bar (whether you find her attractive or not.
-The cashier at your local shop.
-Your friend's sister.
-The girl you casually hook up with one night.
-The girl you have a 6month relationship with.

The message being, you treat them all the same, while observing your own standards of how they treat you.

Understand two things further;

1. Perrion is like 50 or something. He therefore has a wealth of experience that you (and I, and many others) have yet to come by. His is not a method or technique, it's a mindset, a way of life. It's about actually becoming that person with those beliefs and that outlook toward life and other people. It takes practice and patience and isn't something you can just switch on and off.

2. Women in their early 20s will be a bit intimidated by this outlook, especially in the modern era. They will be confused because not many guys your age are mature enough to engage them properly. They also don't have much life experience and are generally all about having fun. We have to mix it up and remember to be spontaneous and be enjoyable personalities too.

Stick at it. I like Perrion's outlook. It's a positive attitude and will create the right attraction with the right people. Most of all, it will make you a happier person. Showing honestly that you value others grows your own value exponentially.

 

[ArmyStrong90]

I've read half the book and seen quite a few videos. From what I remember, he didn't really put a lot of emphasis on being vulnerable.

The main message that I took from his material is 'all women being your women' and treating them as such.... i.e. encouraging them in to their feminine energy.

-The girl you chat with in a bar (whether you find her attractive or not.
-The cashier at your local shop.
-Your friend's sister.
-The girl you casually hook up with one night.
-The girl you have a 6month relationship with.

The message being, you treat them all the same, while observing your own standards of how they treat you.

Understand two things further;

1. Perrion is like 50 or something. He therefore has a wealth of experience that you (and I, and many others) have yet to come by. His is not a method or technique, it's a mindset, a way of life. It's about actually becoming that person with those beliefs and that outlook toward life and other people. It takes practice and patience and isn't something you can just switch on and off.

2. Women in their early 20s will be a bit intimidated by this outlook, especially in the modern era. They will be confused because not many guys your age are mature enough to engage them properly. They also don't have much life experience and are generally all about having fun. We have to mix it up and remember to be spontaneous and be enjoyable personalities too.

Stick at it. I like Perrion's outlook. It's a positive attitude and will create the right attraction with the right people. Most of all, it will make you a happier person. Showing honestly that you value others grows your own value exponentially.

What I like the most about his book is how he debunks players calling them "boys" etc. For guys in my age group a player, mack etc is something we aspire to be like ignoring the fact that, in reality, we cannot attract all the women we desire. I personally am sick of the games that women play. Especially the attractive 20 something year olds that utilize social media as a way of determining their self worth. I have been the player myself but looking back at it, I have only hurt the individual in the end. Karma sucks too, as it turned around to bite me in the ass recently. You say that it will take time for the women in my age bracket to wise up and not feel intimidated by a man who sees women the way Zan does and i honestly cannot wait. But at the same time, for some odd reason, I feel like by the time they reach that level of maturity, these women will have realized that they made a mistake passing off the "right" men for the ones that left them empty. By this time these women would not be as attractive as they once were due to age. I tend to think about this a lot and wonder what it would be like when that attractive girl in college who passes me off for that "bad ass" who hasn't figured out himself yet, all of a sudden makes signals to come back to me years later because she wants to settle down since she sees that im doing well for myself. The thought ticks me off because I know **** like this happens--as if you really think I will wait for you to get your act together.

 

[TheMonkeyKing]

What I like the most about his book is how he debunks players calling them "boys" etc. For guys in my age group a player, mack etc is something we aspire to be like ignoring the fact that, in reality, we cannot attract all the women we desire.

Well sure. There is a difference between being a player and being a ladies' man. This is what confuses women, especially young women. Many of the will only ever have been attracted to one type of guy; the cad/jock/jerkboy/musician/big mouth. Some of them (a lot of them) aren't too smart you know - dangle something shiny or fast moving in front of them and they're transfixed.

So when a true lover of women arrives, it confuses the fck out of them because they are aroused by this guy too, but he's not loud and brash, he's not trying to be something, he just is. Like I said, it takes a bunch of practice to get to this stage; this is why it is in fact beneficial to mildly flirt with all women you meet because you are honing your skills; when something you like does turn up, you won't be phased one bit because you'll just be in your natural state.

It's important to embrace a lot of material and different perspectives. Don't try to copy one guy. I like to pick and choose and try different things to find what works for me. Every man should eventually be able to write a book about seduction becuase that's just what works for him as an individual.

I have been the player myself but looking back at it, I have only hurt the individual in the end.

I was the same at your age. And I agree, treating people like sh!t is something men should grow out of. I never intentionally went out to hurt or deceive people, but I definitely broke a few hearts. Best to be up front about what you want and don't jump in to relationships too quickly. Only be romantic with women that you really want to be with; nothing half-hearted.

Equally, it's important not to go in the complete opposite direction and become the nice-guy doormat. That doesn't go well either - take that as the voice of experience speaking.

I personally am sick of the games that women play. Especially the attractive 20 something year olds that utilize social media as a way of determining their self worth.

This is just the way life is at the moment man. You either let it beat you or you use it to your advantage. Young girls are all attention-seekers; it does ease off with age, but it's still always there. That's again the art that Zan Perrion talks about. There's nothing wrong with giving women attention - though it's important in the right amount, the right way and for the right reasons.

-'You're beautiful' (on a social media post) = not an original compliment.
-'I love the way you're nostrils flare when you laugh' (in person while you talk to her) = original and slightly teasing hit (remember to stay playful as well).

I go out of my way to make genuine observations and compliments about people rather than being blurting out hackneyed cliche that she's heard a dozen times already that day. If you really mean it, it really works.

I feel like by the time they reach that level of maturity, these women will have realized that they made a mistake passing off the "right" men

Don't wish your life away man. When I was your age I was with a different woman every week. In fact it's the stage I'm trying to get back to.

I gotta be clear man, a lot of women won't mature much beyond the age of 18-20 years old. Maybe once they've had kids and traveled a bit, they're a bit more knowledgeable and worldly-wise, but emotionally, many of them remain 18 years old forever.

If you want intelligent and mature women, look for those who have undertaken difficult vocational degrees such as a healthcare profession, medicine, law, science or engineering or some such like. These kinds of girls have actually taken the time to learn and understand things about the world outside of there narrow scope of self-gratification.

all of a sudden makes signals to come back to me years later because she wants to settle down since she sees that im doing well for myself.

You're talking about being the back-up here - something you should never be. You need to look at yourself as the prize, the first choice. Your problem isn't the behaviour of women, it's your own mindset of limiting self-belief.

I will wait for you to get your act together.

And neither should you 'wait'. By the time some bird from your past turns up again want a bit, you'll be waist deep in sexy eligible women if you stay on the right path and don't let failure hold you back.

Honestly, I can probably count on the fingers of one hand the number of women I regret letting slip out of my grasp, and as of last week, I've slept with 76 women. Let that be the benefit of experience from a (slightly) older guy.

 

[zekko]

The main message that I took from his material is 'all women being your women' and treating them as such.... i.e. encouraging them in to their feminine energy.

I like the sound of this. Thanks to you guys for bringing this up, I'll have to read it. Sounds like a refreshing and mature philosophical outlook. A lot of the PUA stuff seems to be coming from a place of being butthurt, and being fearful that somehow, some way, some chick might manage to get one over on you at some point.

 

[devilkingx2]

What I like the most about his book is how he debunks players calling them "boys" etc. For guys in my age group a player, mack etc is something we aspire to be like ignoring the fact that, in reality, we cannot attract all the women we desire.

sounds pretty lame

 

[zekko]

I read the first chapter of this, and thought there were a few interesting ideas. We'll see if anyone is interested enough for a discussion:

1. He says that many women are hot, but few are beautiful.

2. He says that beauty has a sense of gratitude. Not sure what he means by this. Maybe this is how he's differentiating "hot" and "beautiful", by the inner person. A woman can be a b!tch and still be hot, but that may disqualify her as beautiful.

3. He says that what women find beautiful in men is the passion that they follow in their life. Their life mission, basically. I find this interesting. I know on this forum I've read a lot of comments about how men are just as, if not more good looking than women. Personally, I find that to be nonsense. Women are the gender that appeals to the eye. What makes men appealing is what they do, and who they are. I've always suspected this, and Perrion seems to agree.

4. His general point in the first chapter seems to be that women possess beauty, and that beauty needs an observer, which is where men come in. Women need men so that their beauty can be appreciated. The man who truly appreciates women are the ones who will be successful with them. Of course he takes time to differentiate that from the "boy" who puts the emphasis on himself and worries about how the girl feels about him, as opposed to the "man" who puts the focus on her. It's a bit like the difference between taking value and giving value.

 

[ArmyStrong90]

I read the first chapter of this, and thought there were a few interesting ideas. We'll see if anyone is interested enough for a discussion:

1. He says that many women are hot, but few are beautiful.

2. He says that beauty has a sense of gratitude. Not sure what he means by this. Maybe this is how he's differentiating "hot" and "beautiful", by the inner person. A woman can be a b!tch and still be hot, but that may disqualify her as beautiful.

3. He says that what women find beautiful in men is the passion that they follow in their life. Their life mission, basically. I find this interesting. I know on this forum I've read a lot of comments about how men are just as, if not more good looking than women. Personally, I find that to be nonsense. Women are the gender that appeals to the eye. What makes men appealing is what they do, and who they are. I've always suspected this, and Perrion seems to agree.

4. His general point in the first chapter seems to be that women possess beauty, and that beauty needs an observer, which is where men come in. Women need men so that their beauty can be appreciated. The man who truly appreciates women are the ones who will be successful with them. Of course he takes time to differentiate that from the "boy" who puts the emphasis on himself and worries about how the girl feels about him, as opposed to the "man" who puts the focus on her. It's a bit like the difference between taking value and giving value.

1) when he says "many are hot but few are beautiful" he is really talking about the inner aspect of the woman as well as the beauty she radiates. Fyi, an average looking girl (in my eyes) is stunning if she has personality because this is what will trump her looks--she is going to age overtime so what is it that keeps her around

2) this caught me too, everyone says as a man you must follow your path or purpose in life and BAM you get a woman. Zan makes this make sense because he really goes in depth about this by stating that women, even though your woman may want you to focus on her, SHE KNOW for damn sure that you, as a man do not feel good until you make **** happen in your life. What I like about his expalination is how he straight up tells you that a woman will resent you overtime if you are not on your own grind. Truthfully speaking, in my situation, I don't think a wholesome and genuine relationship with a woman will occur JUST YET until I meet a woman that is on the same track as I

 

[zekko]

Truthfully speaking, in my situation, I don't think a wholesome and genuine relationship with a woman will occur JUST YET until I meet a woman that is on the same track as I

I like my women to have their own interests, sometimes I can learn something from them or find new, different activities to enjoy. They don't have to be a carbon copy of myself, that would probably be boring. But I find that for a successful LTR, they have to have similar views to me in areas that are really important to me, and the relationship process. Basically, they have to have the same moral outlook that I do (and be high interest, of course). For me, that's how I know we're on the same "track".

I know some will say women cannot be moral, they are evil succubuses, etc etc. And there may be some truth to that, but it's also definitely true that some women are more moral than others. And men also, for that matter. I like a girl who has SOME measure of self control.

 

[TheMonkeyKing]

Blue

I read the first chapter of this, and thought there were a few interesting ideas. We'll see if anyone is interested enough for a discussion:

I think many men do think along these lines, at least to an extent, but the one thing with Zan Perrion's work (or at least the book), it doesn't give many practical real world examples, which will render it inaccessible to many male readers. Otherwise it's just too abstract and hypothetical for many guys to grasp.

1. He says that many women are hot, but few are beautiful.

This is very true. Loads are bang material, very few are GF material. I bumped in to a hot young thing in the club a few weeks ago. She was one of the best looking birds in there, but when I got talking to her, she was easily one of the most boring people I've met for a while.

2. He says that beauty has a sense of gratitude. Not sure what he means by this. Maybe this is how he's differentiating "hot" and "beautiful", by the inner person. A woman can be a b!tch and still be hot, but that may disqualify her as beautiful.

I'd say that once you see beauty in anything, you can always appreciate that beauty; like seeing the good in people, no matter what happens. A bit like Einstein said, "Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better."

 

[zekko]

I'd say that once you see beauty in anything, you can always appreciate that beauty, like seeing the good in people, no matter what happens

That makes sense, but the author seemed to be suggesting the gratitude comes from the beauty end. Maybe it just means that a "beautiful" woman appreciates being appreciated.

I started reading the second chapter, and there are a few examples given, a few stories from his life that demonstrate his approach. I really find his attitude refreshing, so different from a lot of the PUA stuff, which seems to be about hiding your interest. He comes across as more "authentic", you might say.

 

[TheMonkeyKing]

That makes sense, but the author seemed to be suggesting the gratitude comes from the beauty end.

To clarify what I mean; the gratitude, that is shown by observed beauty, is perpetuity to the observer. That is, so long as we observe genuine beauty, it will return the favour by remaining. That's just my own slightly abstract interpretation though. I can't really explain any better.

 

[BeExcellent]

I'm reading his book presently. It's something I will give my son. The biggest take away I see is that success with women is not about technique or looks or wealth or anything else per se...

I think the gratitude comes out of being truly seen. It springs from genuine appreciation.

It's about appreciation. Genuine appreciation not transactional appreciation where there is expectation of this for that. I see this in managing people and in all my interactions with human beings. If at your core you appreciate others and choose to look for ways to appreciate others life opens up a sort of joy that is wonderful. People naturally reciprocate and are drawn toward someone around whom they feel valued; around whom they feel seen.

Life becomes more effortless.

We all have our own issues and insecurities if that is where we choose to focus. I could become terribly insecure reading here for example. Every other post says young women are the holy grail, old women have hit the wall, women only have looks to offer and on and on.

But none of that narrative reflects truth as I live it. None of that narrative is consistent with my self belief and experience in the world.

As a woman who has always been considered beautiful I can tell you the part of the book where he talks about beautiful people being lonely is very true. I would put it this way:

Being beautiful (or rich or famous) has a tangential effect of being an isolating presence in one's life. Why? You must be careful whom you trust because so many have an agenda that at once is self serving and disingenuous. Everybody wants something from you, everyone has a tendency to objectify such people. In order to avoid this fate of isolation you must become expert in reading the motivations in others.

You have such abundance that you sort for the authentic. This is why I always say characteristics a., b., and c., are givens for me. I have so much choice that I have to narrow the field somehow. Authenticity in combination with sexual attraction is the critical thing beyond abc that I sort for. In combination these two parameters narrow the field substantially.

Few are motivated in authenticity. Those who are; are refreshing and comfortable. These are people with whom to cultivate something. These are people capable of intimacy and connection; of love. It is at its core a giving energy as he talks about in the book.

But it begins with appreciation. Appreciate yourself and what you offer the world. Appreciate others. Gratitude is an appreciation of your recognition.

Focus on others and become a man who lifts others up...

Abundance will flow to you.

 

[ArmyStrong90]

I'm reading his book presently. It's something I will give my son. The biggest take away I see is that success with women is not about technique or looks or wealth or anything else per se...

I think the gratitude comes out of being truly seen. It springs from genuine appreciation.

It's about appreciation. Genuine appreciation not transactional appreciation where there is expectation of this for that. I see this in managing people and in all my interactions with human beings. If at your core you appreciate others and choose to look for ways to appreciate others life opens up a sort of joy that is wonderful. People naturally reciprocate and are drawn toward someone around whom they feel valued; around whom they feel seen.

Life becomes more effortless.

We all have our own issues and insecurities if that is where we choose to focus. I could become terribly insecure reading here for example. Every other post says young women are the holy grail, old women have hit the wall, women only have looks to offer and on and on.

But none of that narrative reflects truth as I live it. None of that narrative is consistent with my self belief and experience in the world.

As a woman who has always been considered beautiful I can tell you the part of the book where he talks about beautiful people being lonely is very true. I would put it this way:

Being beautiful (or rich or famous) has a tangential effect of being an isolating presence in one's life. Why? You must be careful whom you trust because so many have an agenda that at once is self serving and disingenuous. Everybody wants something from you, everyone has a tendency to objectify such people. In order to avoid this fate of isolation you must become expert in reading the motivations in others.

You have such abundance that you sort for the authentic. This is why I always say characteristics a., b., and c., are givens for me. I have so much choice that I have to narrow the field somehow. Authenticity in combination with sexual attraction is the critical thing beyond abc that I sort for. In combination these two parameters narrow the field substantially.

Few are motivated in authenticity. Those who are; are refreshing and comfortable. These are people with whom to cultivate something. These are people capable of intimacy and connection; of love. It is at its core a giving energy as he talks about in the book.

But it begins with appreciation. Appreciate yourself and what you offer the world. Appreciate others. Gratitude is an appreciation of your recognition.

Focus on others and become a man who lifts others up...

Abundance will flow to you.

"Being beautiful (or rich or famous) has a tangential effect of being an isolating presence in one's life. Why? You must be careful whom you trust because so many have an agenda that at once is self serving and disingenuous. Everybody wants something from you, everyone has a tendency to objectify such people. In order to avoid this fate of isolation you must become expert in reading the motivations in others"


You really spoke to me on this one. I see this all the time amongst my peers in college however being a senior and a bit older in age I have grown tired of seeing girls i would assume are worth cultivating something with leave me emotionally drained and NUMB to the feelings of others (because who cares right?) to add more gasoline to the fire, I am also involved in greek life (social fraternity) and as the oldest "active" brother in my chapter and greek community I am easily able to see through all the bs. Recently there was a girl that i really liked and i thought the feelings were mutual we were always together. I spent an entire semester with her only to realize that she was using me as a distraction to get over a guy that she has always had history with (i wish i had known) now she is back with him. When we spoke about this whole ordeal she was acting as if she was innocent when she knew what I was all about and tried to tell me that she wasn't trying to lead me on "blah, blah" now im a single male (25) and she is 24. You would think someone of that age would get over a significant other that hurt them but that's not the case (I wasn't even being the proverbial "Nice Guy") stuff like this is why I ask if Zan's novel applies to my generation and people in my age bracket. Incidents like this is why I have a hard time being vulnerable and showing my true self because eventually I will like the person due to the signals I get, but then I will realize that that's not the case.

 

[BeExcellent]

Understand completely. I was in a national sorority and was in a leadership role both at my chapter and in student government at a major university. I commend you for your status there.

Lots of women (lots of people in fact) have little to no self awareness at that age and life stage. Obviously this complicates matters. But I have no idea if your girl who used you did so consciously or not...women are famous for living moment to moment motivated by how they feel at a given time. Women can be manipulative too. Impossible to discern in your situation.

Look at it this way. This woman's behavior does not equate to ALL womens' behavior, however there are jaded men that would have you believe it does.

That is a lie that robs you of hope and encourages you to relate to women from a place of self preservation, protectionism and fear. Joy cannot arise from fear. Nor can love. So be mindful of how your attitudes can steal joy and love from your life.

Rather if you approach all women with an attitude of possibility and appreciation you remain open to the potential for both joy and love.

To do this requires great personal courage and strength.

To do this you acknowledge that your wounds from this particular individual remain with and assigned to your relationship with that particular individual and you leave that baggage behind with the severed relationship. Don't cart it around with you.

Few people do this. Few people have the maturity and awareness to do this. But those who can do this have an ease about them, a lightness of spirit, a purity and a grace that is as magnificent as it is unusual. Older people who work to develop healthy self awareness and self esteem get better and better at this as life progresses.

At the same time you observe and calibrate your behavior based on what you observe. My guess is this girl in your post gave you clues along the way that you missed or chose to ignore.

Not everyone is deserving of your investment. You must discern who is an who isn't but you must start from a place of possibility rather than a place of fear. You must give the innocent the benefit of the doubt for a while until they show you who they are.

People always in time show you who they are. The rate at which they are revealed depends greatly on your ability to listen and observe.

Love involves pain eventually. People you love will break your heart, disappoint you, die on you in your life. But your life is made rich for having loved. Do not close off your ability to love.