bulking and cutting at the same time?

[hb]

Do you guys think that this is a good idea?
im going to go on a mainly protein diet with no rice, no bread(2 slices of whole wheat a day) no potatoes, no pasta, no fried foods. I'll do this while lifting heavy..........
I was just wondering if this is a good idea, a good way of bulking up and cutting up at the same time?

another thing is, my uncle told me that im too young to go on a protein diet and that im going to hurt myself, I am 16 turning 17 in january. He said that it'll mess up my kidneys.
He told me to just eat normally because i am still growing.

he added that if im going to be takin the protein shakes, i should drink a gallon and a half of water a day.


what do u guys think?

 

[blackbirdbeatle]

If you try to do both at the same time, your diet has to be perfect for it to work, and even then your gains will be very slow. Seeing as how it's winter and you live in NYC you won't have to worry bout going to the beach with a little extra fat. Now is the time to bulk up. Do this for a few months and then after you are satisfied with your weight and muscle mass, you can start cutting down for summer. You will get to your ideal body size faster this way.

 

[hb]

i need to be ready by april and the cuts are veryyyyyyy important.

theres a body building show in my school in april.

what would u suggest?

and how long is a good cut cycle going to take?

 

[Templeton]

It's very difficult to give you much of an answer with such limited information. How long have you been training? What are your stats? What's your metabolism like - do you put fat on easily or do u find it easy to stay lean?

With the limited info you have supplied, I would opt to bulk up as much as possible by eating reasonably clean but I certainly wouldn't go so low on carbs at this stage, keep the potatoes, long grain rice and even some pasta now and again if you like. You won't put size on without these good quality carbs. You can cut up from about February or even at the start of March if you find it easy to get lean. This will give you at least a good 2 months solid training and eating before you have to concern yourself with dieting.

Also make sure your post workout nutrition is 100% nailed. A whey or a blended protein post workout then a good high protein and carb meal of solid food soon after.

You could perhaps use some creatine when trying to put on size. Don't be too bothered about your kidneys although it is a good idea to drink large amounts of water anyway. A gallon a day minimum.

It really depends how serious you are. If you are then you will note the above, you will also make sure you eat regularly, every three hours or so day on day. Not a few days here and there but all the time. Get plenty of sleep too.

If you follow this kind of approach you should be able to look half decent at your comp, but remember, it's only a few months, you won't progress THAT much unless you are very gifted.

 

[hb]

I have always been kinda slim, once i hit the second half of my sophmore year (funny how this is around the first time i started working out) (im a junior right now). I started bulking up like crazy. Then i went on vacation for 2 months, DID ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. No weights no running. Due to this i gained a huge belly, i never had that before in my life. As soon as i came back i started working out as much as i could. When i went to play bball, i'd come back drenched. Sweat coming outa places they never went been before, and alot of sweatttt.

Now my body is gettin back into shape. I weight 175 but most of it is muscle. I HATE the fact that i still have some what of a stomach. My abs seem to be the hardest thing to get ready.

I bulk up pretty fast. I eat alott of food and a whole lot of junk food. I've been on this diet for less then a weak and i see my stomach sliming down already.

I've given up alot of things I like. Choclate, yesterdays chicken parmegean with spaghetti and sauceeeeeeee. I see my whole family eating all the things i love, i havent even drank sodaaa until today, i couldnt help it so i just went out and bought a pepsi one (tastes like crap)

So my thing is, if i dont cut up now, im going to have to do it later, so why not just do it now. From less then one weak of this diet im already seeing results. So I think i should continue this diet.

 

[elvis aint dead yet]

Bulking and Cutting usually mean different things.


Say you weigh 180 pounds and want to BULK up to 200 pounds.


If you eat right, eat healthy, train hard, you can BULK up to around 200 pounds and put on a good amount of muscle. Of coruse their might be a little fat involved with gaining 20 pounds, but it doesn't have to be that much if you train and eat and rest right.


IF you weigh 220 pounds and want to CUT down to 205, then you have to cut out certain foods, do more cardio, and the like to lose the weight and keep the muscle. You might lose some muscle, but nut much if you eat right, train right and rest right.


People don't BULK and CUT at the same time because it rarely works. If you want to GAIN 20 pounds and Lose 15 pounds, it doesnt make sense.


IF you eat right, train right, and so on, you can gain weight and not gain much body fat.

If you eat right, train right and so on, you can lose minimal weight and lose body fat, yet not lose much muscle.

Decide what you want to do?

Most people who say, I WANT TO BULK AND CUT at the same time, are the same people who want a quick fix.


Bodybuilding and Fitness are a lifetime committment, not a one time thing for April. Because if it is a one time thing, that's what usually makes people get injured and burnt out. Don't wish for a quick fix.

Bulk up for a couple months, then CUT for about a month or so until the Show.

 

[hb]

i already got some muscle on my body.

Dont you guys think the more definition and cuts you got, the better off you are.

I'm not really worried too much about body fat, my stomach is all that im worried about.

My stomach isnt crazy big but its not good either.

Plus i need to do cardio since i play alot of sports.

What somebody told me was fat does not turn into muscle, muscle builds from protein. Fat has nothing to do with it.

so what i dont understand is, if I lost my body fat (i will still have my muscle) and i became all cut up and still lifted heavy at the same time, I can pull it off........

 

[Templeton]

Then why ask the question? You have already decided your approach and it may work well for you. Good luck with it.

 

[madgame]

I think bulking and cutting is something that cant be done at the same time. Maybe there is a way to pull it off somehow or whateva, but I dont really think so. The theory says if u wanna get muscles u will have to take in more calories than you burn, if you wanna cut down ull have to burn more than you take in. I know theres always a difference beetween theory and praxis, but from my experience its true that you definetly have to eat more when u try to bulk up than you can eat if u wanna cut down.

 

[B.A.]

Lean bulk is an oxymoron, just like military intelligence.

- B.A.

 

[hb]

guess what guys, a former body builder whos about 51 right now told me what to do.

This guy showed me pictures of when he used to body build, this guy was deisel and cut up. He told me that there is no real trick to it. He gave me an example of what he did for a competition where he had to be 150 in 8 months, he was 205 at the time.

this was his diet, 7 days a week for 8 months.

12 egg whites, bread, 3 steaks in the morning.

5 chicken breasts,big bowl of rice, 3 baked potatoes.

No carbs, mainly fish and/or meat at night.

with this diet he lost all the weight he wanted, he worked out about 6 days a week and he did 30 minutes cardio everyday.

He told me to take in 1 gram of protein per lb a day.
cardio 30 minutes a day.
Eat carbs for breakfast and lunch and alot of carbs before working out, nooooo junk food, no fried foods, no sweets.
AND LIFT HEAVY.

He said that with this, i'll get all the cuts and size i want.

 

[balengar]

you can bulk and cut at the same time.....the problem is that simultaneously it is the LEAST EFFICIENT.

It depends on how cut you want to get really.

If you want to only get to 8% body fat, then 1 month will be fine.
If you want to get serious looking and get down to 5 or 6% then 2 to 3 months of cutting.
This timing depends on how much fat you start out with of course.


If you had 4 complete months (120 days), i would bulk for about 2/3 of it, using volume training for fastest hypertrophy (size).

Then the last 40 days or so, use to get cut up, and here is where you do cardio 2X/day and LIFT HEAVY (you body has to NEED to keep the muscle).

Eat protein in every meal.

 

[hb]

okayy, let me get this straight, Muscle builds from PROTEIN NOT FAT. RIGHT?

then what are you guys talkin about with bulking up. U need high calories? Why not just eat HIGH PROTEIN low on fat low on carbs. WONT IT STILL BUILD THE MUSCLE THE SAME WAY SINCE PROTEIN BUILDS MUSCLE AND FAT HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH IT?

 

[madgame]

sounds pretty reasonable, but..Im not a scientist or anything but I guess, it just dont work as well as bulking and cutting at different times, because you just need high calories in general to bulk up. Lets say you only nourish on protein, but no carbs and no fat at all. Your body would still need energy and thus would have to burn a lot of the protein. get my point?
Anyways if youve been lifting weights for quite some time uve probably tried different methods and realized that you couldnt really put on any muscle if u did too much cardio/other sports and only got your protein from powders, but had a low calorie intake in general.

 

[B.A.]

No.

Just because you decide to eat 200 or 300 or 400 grams of protein per day, that doesn't mean it will all be used for "building muscle".

Protein is like carbohydrates and fats (It is also made from carbon, hydrogen and oxygen). The only exception is that it also contains Nitrogen. Any excess protein/ amino acids that you ingest that the body doesn't need for anabolism, will be broken down (catabolised) in the liver by a process called oxidative deamination (where the nitrogen/ ammonia is removed from the amino acid, combined with carbon dioxide, and excreted through the kidneys as urea in the urine). Afterall, the body can't store amino acids/ protein like it can with glucose (glycogen in the muscles/ liver) or fat (neutral fats/ triglycerides in the adipose tissues), as nitrogen/ ammonia is actually toxic if held in the body for too long.

What you have left are CHO compounds/ acids, some of which can be converted into glucose for organs such as the brain and eyes, some of which can be converted to a form of cellular fuel/ energy (Kreb' cycle intermediate), and the rest if not needed can be converted ultimately into triglycerides/ neutral fats within the adipose tissues.

Seeing as the people here are not on a form of ketogenic dieting, if you eat a low amount of carbohydrates, your body will convert a significant amount of the protein that you ingest into glucose and Kreb's Cycle intermediates (This is a process called gluconeogenesis, where other foods such as proteins and fats are catabolised to make glucose and other energy substrates).

Aside from this, the purpose of eating at least moderate amounts of fats and carbohydrates, is so that you can provide your body with essential vitamins and minerals which are not found within protein foods. Fat soluble vitamins such as A and D, and other minerals found only in fats, you need these vitamins to function properly, otherwise deficiencies will severely inhibit performance etc. You need fibre and particular B vitamins from starchy carbohydrate sources, which is why you should eat your wholemeal and wholegrains.

- B.A.

 

[hb]

makes sense to me thanx.
so what ima do is stay on a mainly protein diet and eat just enough carbs and fats to get me through the day.

 

[balengar]

bulking diets have high intake of carbs/protein/fat.

to lean bulk, eat high protein/moderate carb/zero fat.

to cut eat high protein/normal fat/low carb.