Breaking the rules of the "game" DISCUSS

[Zap]

After about a year of solid effort, I've finally gotten myself into an actual RELATIONSHIP. Yes, I have someone I'd call my "girlfriend."

Foolish me, I thought once I got this point all of the bullsh!t, or at least most of it, would disappear. For some reason I thought things would just happen, we'd just cooperate. I wouldn't have to worry about if I seem confident, needy, or whatever.

Well, as you all should know, I was wrong. Still the same crap. It's practically the same as when I'm just "seeing" someone now that I'm in a relationship. Granted, it still is early, but annoying nonetheless.

So, I'd like to have a serious, long discussion about cutting the crap and avoiding this game. Not just early in the relationship, but before it even starts, and well into it. I'm only 17, and I'm sick to death of it. I can't imagine how you guys in your 20's and 30's even cope.

I think this is more than my desperate attempt to make things easier. We're all so accustomed to playing this game. Even if it isn't our fault, even if it IS the women who bring it about, we STILL cooperate and play into their hands. If we don't cooperate, we get anxious and may very well cave in anyway.

If we don't participate we suffer because we naturally want to be with this girl. We end up waiting it out, which isn't pleasent. We get anxious and nervous, which isn't good for our health. If we DO participate, we're even worse off because she gets all the control and she's ultimately going to end things.

So... let's figure out how to AVOID PLAYING THE GAME COMPLETELY. Devise a way to call her back, even when it is her "turn," without worrying about being needy. I'm sure there are other examples, but the phone call wars are all that come to mind right now.

My idea is to simply pretend you are oblivious to any "rules" of the game. If she's supposed to call you, but you want to talk to her, call her anyway and don't even bring up the fact that she said she'd call. It doesn't matter, does it?

I don't know, that's why I'm posting this. I'm just trying to get a discussion started.

 

[Ko-B]

Zap,

Well actually, I prefer to stick to the rules of the game, but I'd bend them a little bit to make it fit my situation.

We all didn't do the rules at one point in our lives, and most of us had troubled getting the girl. Those who did probably did not last long with them.

The problem with bending the rules is we tend to f*ck it up with the girl. When we do, we can all somewhat sense it, but we just continually deny that fact and try to get them back. That's where the problem is.

Zap, I'ma use your example. Let's say you call her up when it's her turn to call. One tiny call won't change everything, but overtime, calling when she's the one supposed to call has the power to turn things around a complete 180 degrees. It's like the chinese water torture; a single droplet won't do anything to you, but 50,000 drops of water on the same spot over time can break a hole into you skull and do even more damage.

My opinion is it's okay to "break out of the rules," but be cautious not to do it too often.

 

[Bravo]

Zap,

I don't play what you would call a conventional flavor of "the game" myself. What I'm saying is, the main thing that guys should learn from dating experiences and discussion boards like this is that confidence and a good attitude will allow you to do and acheive anything you desire. Now, does a guy who spends the majority of his time at the drawing board going over his next gameplan and analyzing what went wrong with the last one have confidence and a good attitude? -- probably not. The guy with these qualities is already out there having a good time and being successful in everything that he does.

If you are tired of playing the game, then don't play it. It should be FUN. Who says you have to be a player to get a girl?? It might seem that these "players" are so much more successful and get so many more women BUT, they are also the guys who get end up with all the b|tches and never seem to have a meaningful relationship. After all, that is ultimately what we are all looking for, isn't it? A MEANINGFUL RELATIONSHIP. And you are probably NOT going to find that by playing the game constantly. At some point in time the girl who seems to like the "jerk" also wants that sensitivity and caring that the "nice guy" can give her. Therefore, the "total jerk" and the "total nice guy" are both screwed. It takes a little of both to actually keep the girl around.

The point is, if something or someone is NOT bringing you happiness and satisfaction, then eliminate it.

My idea is to simply pretend you are oblivious to any "rules" of the game. If she's supposed to call you, but you want to talk to her, call her anyway and don't even bring up the fact that she said she'd call. It doesn't matter, does it?

Exactly. It doesn't matter. It only matters if you convince yourself that it does, and when that happens, you show it and girls pick up on it. If other people do this then let them obsess over it and get ulcers. Get out, have fun, be yourself and the rest will come. I know that is extremely cliche but maybe it is because it's such good advice.

---------------

Bravo


There is a fine line between fishing and just standing on the shore like an idiot.

- Steven Wright

 

[Adonis]

That's the problem, in our society it's the men that go after women - not the other way around.

Why do you think sites like this and a hundred others are catered towards the male of the species?

There are rules of engagements.

If it was the other way around, this site would be called the "Don Juanita Center" and a whole slew of other resources dedicated to help bag the guy.

Yeah, I hate to have to follow some set standards so I can be with her or be with some other chick.

But it's the fact of life, the only fortunate thing that comes out of this is that it's not always the case.

There are exceptions and I tend to
take advantage of these exceptions.

Sometimes you will stop to wonder why you even bother with women.

It's all the same - act like a stupid jerk and you get to keep them.

Not that I don't act like it already, but still it's predetermined and it's annoying that you have to act this way and that way.

It's hard to be yourself and truly be yourself.

This is supposed to be a 50/50 deal, but it seems like guys are doing all the hard work while the woman just sit there and determine where things should go.

Well, not anymore - that's why we are here. All the nice-guys have a fighting chance now.

It boils down to this question: "Do you really need women to make you happy?"

If yes, then you know what you have to do.
If no, then congratulations - women will be the ones doing most of the work to keep you.

There it is, my little motivational speech. Hope that helps a little...

 

[A Turtle Name Adrian]

excellent speech. I have nothing to add.

 

[A Turtle Name Adrian]

except DONT TRUST NO ONE! - unless they've proven themselves to you. peace.

4 more days till my first anniversary.

 

[BigBadJon]

This is supposed to be a 50/50 deal, but it seems like guys are doing all the hard work while the woman just sit there and determine where things should go.

This really pisses me off now that you mention it. It's not fair DAMMIT!

 

[Hidden-Danjer]

Um... Zap, I'm glad for u but things didn't... Oh ****, I'll post a new topic.

 

[Hidden-Danjer]

Okay guys,

I DID find the right one!

She lives 2 mins away from me!
Cute
Loves hugs
Lovesto talk
Kind
Trusting
Blond
Talkative

And the other day she dumped me!!!!!
There is NO OTHER that comes as close as that...

She says she just isn't ready for a relationship...

Yet I still get all the signs (LOADS of eye contact, hugs, hand holding, etc).

So I believe I found the one...
Yes she "dumped" me -she hates that word??? Saying that she isn't ready for a relationship yet....


Is I right to actually trust a girl for once?
I really think I found.
"the one"!


------------------
*Hidden-Danjer*

Stand back people I am in love with myself!

 

[Anti-Dump]

Zap,

NO RULES - NO RELATIONSHIP

How's that for being strict?
He,he,he,he,he!!!!!!!!!!

AD

 

[Zap]

I don't believe it. These rules aren't an inherent genetic thing. They are imposed by our akward American (well, Western) society. They don't make sense, and do nothing but cause trouble for the men AND the women.

It's not fair to say these rules are at the advantage of the women. They have to sit around for days and wait for the new guy they just met to call her. And she has to pretend to be coy and distant, or she'll seem needy. And he has to be a jerk, or seem like a nice guy. And she has to act like a slut, or he'll think she's prude.

It DOESN'T have to be that way. The rules are there, sure, but there's no reason we can't find a way to break them. Or at least to change them. It's way too easy to say "the rules are the rules." I'd prefer not to give up like that.

-Zap

 

[Zap]

Oh, and HD, sorry it didn't work out. But hell, you've been struggling this long so keep at it! EVENTUALLY something will work out! I promise.

-Zap

 

[Anti-Dump]

Hi Zap,

I'm glad your back. I know you like to discuss things.

I hate to talk like your grandfather but.....

The only thing that works, I have found out, after a half of a life time, is REALITY.

Reality always works. Maybe you hate doing this or that. But if you learn REALITY you can use it to your advantage.

I would like to call a woman the next day. Reality tells me she will think I am crazy. So I can't. Real men just don't do that. And women know it.

Women are different than us in their heads Zap. You do this and that and they think, this and that. They don't see the REAL you.

So I have to pretend I don't give a damn when I am drooling for her. So what? I win.

And winning feels good.

You need 'rules' more than ever now. Women don't have to get married anymore.

Many, many, many, women are only dating for 'entertainment' and fun and relaxation.

Technically they are not dating at all!

Dating is for getting married down the road. If it's not for getting married, it's NOT dating.

You have to know now if a woman is interested in YOU or is just seeking entertainment.

A girl dating you nowadays doesn't mean she loves you like
it did years ago.

You must WEED them out Zap. You can't ignore what's going on. You can't close your eyes.

AD

 

[Leo]

Zap-

Welcome to "reality". The reality is that these little rules only attract a certain type of woman. It shouldn't be a surprise that if you get a woman with these rules, you can expect to be chained by the rules for the rest of your time with her. It is unreasonable to expect anything else.

A long, long time ago, there was a discussion about why people come to this forum and suddenly disappear without a trace. In my case, it's because "reality" hit. Did the DJ rules help me get dates? Yes. Did I like any of the women I dated this way? Not really. The DJ rules are a pretty strong filter, and you reap what you sow.

Leo.

------------------
Success lies on the far side of failure. - T. J. Watson

 

[Marauder]

Originally posted by Anti-Dump:



Hi Zap,

I'm glad your back. I know you like to discuss things.

I hate to talk like your grandfather but.....

The only thing that works, I have found out, after a half of a life time, is REALITY.

Reality always works. Maybe you hate doing this or that. But if you learn REALITY you can use it to your advantage.

I would like to call a woman the next day. Reality tells me she will think I am crazy. So I can't. Real men just don't do that. And women know it.

Women are different than us in their heads Zap. You do this and that and they think, this and that. They don't see the REAL you.

So I have to pretend I don't give a damn when I am drooling for her. So what? I win.

And winning feels good.

You need 'rules' more than ever now. Women don't have to get married anymore.

Many, many, many, women are only dating for 'entertainment' and fun and relaxation.

Technically they are not dating at all!

Dating is for getting married down the road. If it's not for getting married, it's NOT dating.

You have to know now if a woman is interested in YOU or is just seeking entertainment.

A girl dating you nowadays doesn't mean she loves you like
it did years ago.

You must WEED them out Zap. You can't ignore what's going on. You can't close your eyes.

AD

AD...I couldn't agree more....The dating scene has evolved into a minefield over the years....Zap, the "Rules" were made not to make things difficult for us, but to protect our hearts!


------------------
Marauder

What that don't kill me only
makes me stronger...

 

[BigBadJon]

Bottom line.....it's not 1950 anymore. If I thought I could make things work bypassing protocol and cutting straight to the point I would do it in a heartbeat. This is a good way to go if you wish to live your life alone. Not a good way to go if you are out to find a mutual care and respect from a loving partner.

But for anyone interested, if you wish to move to the cornfields of the midwest(where I am originally from), I am sure you can get by without having to follow so many of these damn rules. As long as you don't mind your parents choosing your bride to be and negotiating a dowry.....

 

[Zap]

No, no, no. This isn't reality. This isn't how people NORMALLY work. This is a fabrication of reality. A game is just that; a game. It's NOT a necessary part of any relationship, and doesn't help it. But I'm too tired to argue now. But wait and see, I'll find a way, I will! And when I do I'll let you all know. It make be many, many years though.

-Zap

 

[Bravo]

The only thing that works, I have found out, after a half of a life time, is REALITY.

Reality always works. Maybe you hate doing this or that. But if you learn REALITY you can use it to your advantage.

Hmmmm... it would seem, though, that the whole game based on NON-REALTIY. It is REALITY that you would like to call a girl whenever you f*ckin well please, but you're not supposed to -- NON-REALITY. Kind of contradictive dontcha think?

-----------
Bravo

 

[Anti-Dump]

No Bravo, it's not a contradiction.

A woman's IMAGINATION is a real thing. It's imaginary that she thinks you are needy. But the act of imagination IS A REAL THING.

And you use it to your advantage SINCE you can never change it.

AD

 

[Cecil]

I don't know guys I think the whole FUN of dating is the hunting part. Its bizarre once i get into a serious relationship I start missing all of the phone I used to have hunting for women. And I know its not for sex, since I don't do until I know the girl for at least a month. So I think Its the game that keeps me going sometimes. Now that I have broken up with my girlfriend, I can't wait to start hunting again.

But maybe I am some kinda freak, which history dictates

-Cecil