Being Friends With Women

[Michael Chief]

I wanted to make a new thread about this since the other one is full of weird incel sh!t that hurts my eyes to read.

It seems that some other folks here don't understand the value of having female friends, and some struggle to make female friends even if they understand the value. The former case is absolutely bonkers. Having various forms of human relationships, including friendship with various kinds of people, is important for your health and quality of life.

Being a socially well-adjusted individual is a bare minimum to be an effective seducer. That by itself isn't enough, but being a damn weirdo will dry up the panties of nearly every woman in a 5 mile radius. Normal human beings cultivate friendships with members of the opposite sex. You must do this to be one of the cool kids.

I don't just want to penetrate women. I want to penetrate the world of women.

I love everything feminine. Feminine energy in all its forms makes me feel good not just sexually, but in every way imaginable. It complements my masculine energy perfectly and I have more fun when women are around, no matter if I have any intentions to seduce them or not. I love it when women act cute in the way only they can do, I love it when they giggle and laugh, I love it when they show kindness or consideration in that way men never do, I love it when they get excited about little things, I love it when they get emotional... I could go on and on. Needless to say, I have more fun when I'm with female friends than when I'm with male friends. It also seems like my masculine energy resonates with their feminine energy, so they have more fun when I'm around, making me feel even better because I know they feel good in some way because of me.

It's not all about sex. However, if sex is all you care about, having tons of female friends is extremely advantageous for that as well. Having deep and strong friendships with a lot of women will definitely help you understand and navigate the female mind, making you a far more potent seducer than any clueless moron who thinks that mEN aNd WoMen CAn'T bE friENdS. It also gives you more of an abundance mentality, putting you in the proper mindset of a chooser. It obviously also gives you social proof and a better position to run entourage game. I can't tell you how awesome it feels to get laid with a hottie who was asking you, "Why are you always surrounded by pretty girls?" just a few hours beforehand.

Another huge advantage of befriending women that hardly anyone talks about in the manosphere is that it makes you get used to humanizing women. A significant sticking point that a lot of guys have when trying to better themselves and their dating lives is that their sh!tty mindset or inner game seeps through and manifests as subtly creepy behavior. When you internalize misogyny or view women as inherently inferior in some way, it's easy to develop habits of objectifying women rather than "subjectifying" them. And you better fvcking believe that it makes you lose out on lays. It's insanely seductive when someone seems to truly understand you and empathize with you in a way that it's like the two of you are in your own little bubble, protected from the rest of the world, a world that ostracizes you for feeling what you feel. You can only make that bubble effectively if you humanize and subjectify.

So, how do you start making more female friends? It can start the same way you tried to do pickup. You can do cold approaches with the intention of making friends rather than seduction. That's always an option. If you don't already have some female friends, I actually recommend you start doing this rather than trying to jump straight into seduction because you still might need to fix some socially awkward habits that might bite you in the ass if you try to start sexualizing things. You can join or start meetups, groups, organizations, classes, whatever. Just talk to every woman you meet like a normal human being. Use everything you learned from pickup minus the sexualization stuff. It's really not that hard if you learned all that pickup stuff already. Feel free to discuss your experiences, tips, and other ideas here.

 

[sangheilios]

I like where you are heading with this but I see a huge problem.

If a man has any degree of attraction towards the female, they can never really be friends. As I mentioned on that other thread, I've seen some papers/stats that showed women were far more likely to underestimate the degree of interest that a man had towards them. A guy could be actually quite interested in her but she perceives it as him just being friendly. The issue I see is that if the man has some degree of interest/attraction towards this woman but does not make a move is when things can go sour. If this woman has no interest in this man and it comes out later on that he has had interest she is most likely going to avoid this man or try to minimize the time she spends around him. I just don't think something like this ever really works out in the end.

I'd say the important take home with what you are mentioning though is to have a well rounded social life/circle, that also includes women. I agree with your part about the benefit of having social interactions with women regularly and how it would help your "game" if you want to call it that. It's basically the idea that you learn how to interact with women more naturally to where they aren't put off. The reality is you can't socialize with women the same way you do with other men. I think a huge problem for a lot of men is that they have limited or even no social interaction with the opposite sex in some form or another. A great example of this would be men that are in the military, trade professions or a hard science field (physics, engineering, etc.). Men like this are in heavily male dominated career settings and may have almost no contact with women if they don't go out of their way for it lol.

I think a huge issue is our current culture with porn and social media essentially has created the idea that women are just sexual objects. Granted, the women that are engaging in pornography or social media attention whoring are going out of their way to create this image of themselves.

I personally wouldn't go out of my way to try to make friends with women, though I like your idea about socializing with them as much as possible.

 

[Michael Chief]

The issue I see is that if the man has some degree of interest/attraction towards this woman but does not make a move is when things can go sour. If this woman has no interest in this man and it comes out later on that he has had interest she is most likely going to avoid this man or try to minimize the time she spends around him. I just don't think something like this ever really works out in the end.

This only becomes a problem if the man makes it a problem.

If he has a scarcity mentality, he's going to feel like sh!t if the "friend" he was interested in isn't interested in him. He's going to be salty about it and she is going to feel weird about him being salty about it.

If he has an abundance mentality, he can freely tell any woman what he finds attractive about her, if he's interested in her, and if she isn't interested in him, he can take the rejection gracefully and continue the friendship without making things weird. I've been in this situation enough times to confidently tell you that this can work out perfectly fine. My female friends know how much I love women. They know they are women. They know I might get turned on by them at times. We all know it's perfectly natural.

It sounds like you're stuck thinking in the world of hypotheticals rather than speaking from real life experience. Rather than pessimistically predicting potential problems, put pickup into practice and perhaps you'll pound more pvssy lol I did not mean the start that sentence with so many alliterations but I just rolled with it halfway through

 

[sangheilios]

This only becomes a problem if the man makes it a problem.

If he has a scarcity mentality, he's going to feel like sh!t if the "friend" he was interested in isn't interested in him. He's going to be salty about it and she is going to feel weird about him being salty about it.

If he has an abundance mentality, he can freely tell any woman what he finds attractive about her, if he's interested in her, and if she isn't interested in him, he can take the rejection gracefully and continue the friendship without making things weird. I've been in this situation enough times to confidently tell you that this can work out perfectly fine. My female friends know how much I love women. They know they are women. They know I might get turned on by them at times. We all know it's perfectly natural.

It sounds like you're stuck thinking in the world of hypotheticals rather than speaking from real life experience. Rather than pessimistically predicting potential problems, put pickup into practice and perhaps you'll pound more pvssy lol I did not mean the start that sentence with so many alliterations but I just rolled with it halfway through

I disagree, I think once a man expresses interest towards a woman that is not reciprocated that is the end of the line. Most women are not going to be comfortable continuing to interact with a men like this because they know that interest will always be there. It's just an awkward place for both parties to be in. If a woman isn't interested, why would a man continue to interact with her?

This has nothing to do with a scarcity or abundance mindset, it's just basic social skills. If you are expressing interest and a woman says she does not feel the same way that is the end of the interaction. If either party goes out of their way to continue on that is displaying a lack of social skills. This is how this friend zone nonsense and other cringey social dynamics between men and women occur.

 

[alvinkels]

I recently broke up with a girl I shouldn't have dated. The pain was unbearable because it is not like I really really like her. She said she wants to be friends and all what I had to is shift my mindset that I had in the beginning; "don't date this girl".
A lot of guys these days have inadequate social skills. You need learn it.. it will take a while before you become good at it and the more you expose yourself the better. It will be better to be friends girl you don't actually find attractive or find attractive. Use that opportunity to understand female nature. The mistake I do most of the time is that the way I actually handle my woman is not the same way I handle other girls. It is like pedestalized them and guess what happens it back fires in my face. I tried to make them feel comfortable around instead being of being a little bit of a challenge to them. And women get bored very quickly.
Just lead and lead and lead no matter who the girl is lead as if she is your daughter or younger sister. That's what women want. Don't be an a***hole.

 

[Michael Chief]

I disagree, I think once a man expresses interest towards a woman that is not reciprocated that is the end of the line. Most women are not going to be comfortable continuing to interact with a men like this because they know that interest will always be there. It's just an awkward place for both parties to be in. If a woman isn't interested, why would a man continue to interact with her?

This has nothing to do with a scarcity or abundance mindset, it's just basic social skills. If you are expressing interest and a woman says she does not feel the same way that is the end of the interaction. If either party goes out of their way to continue on that is displaying a lack of social skills. This is how this friend zone nonsense and other cringey social dynamics between men and women occur.

Are you still just theorizing or do you have the experience to back this up with a non-insignificant sample size? If you have been experiencing that problem over and over, you have a sticking point.

I'm friends with lots of women I've expressed interest in. Not all, of course, but enough to say what I'm saying here.

In the end the field is right.

 

[pipeman84]

I love everything feminine. Feminine energy in all its forms makes me feel good not just sexually, but in every way imaginable.

Indeed, but good luck finding feminine energy with 30+ yrs old women.
Closely related to the above is the fact that feminine women don't have male friends. What they have is a MAN. They might have male acquaintances or work colleagues, but not friends. Think about it, all the lists in the manosphere with desired traits of LTR/wife quality women have right on top - no male friends -.
That basically means you're trying to be friends with a masculine woman or one carrying a ton of baggage.

 

[CornbreadFed]

This only applies to novice men that act like Autist NPCs when interacting with women. If you are in High School or College, you need every ounce of female interaction as possible. After your first or second real relationship, this is detrimental.

One night stands and casual hookups do not give you experience with women either.

 

[kavi]

I wanted to make a new thread about this since the other one is full of weird incel sh!t that hurts my eyes to read.

It seems that some other folks here don't understand the value of having female friends, and some struggle to make female friends even if they understand the value. The former case is absolutely bonkers. Having various forms of human relationships, including friendship with various kinds of people, is important for your health and quality of life.

Being a socially well-adjusted individual is a bare minimum to be an effective seducer. That by itself isn't enough, but being a damn weirdo will dry up the panties of nearly every woman in a 5 mile radius. Normal human beings cultivate friendships with members of the opposite sex. You must do this to be one of the cool kids.

I don't just want to penetrate women. I want to penetrate the world of women.

I love everything feminine. Feminine energy in all its forms makes me feel good not just sexually, but in every way imaginable. It complements my masculine energy perfectly and I have more fun when women are around, no matter if I have any intentions to seduce them or not. I love it when women act cute in the way only they can do, I love it when they giggle and laugh, I love it when they show kindness or consideration in that way men never do, I love it when they get excited about little things, I love it when they get emotional... I could go on and on. Needless to say, I have more fun when I'm with female friends than when I'm with male friends. It also seems like my masculine energy resonates with their feminine energy, so they have more fun when I'm around, making me feel even better because I know they feel good in some way because of me.

It's not all about sex. However, if sex is all you care about, having tons of female friends is extremely advantageous for that as well. Having deep and strong friendships with a lot of women will definitely help you understand and navigate the female mind, making you a far more potent seducer than any clueless moron who thinks that mEN aNd WoMen CAn'T bE friENdS. It also gives you more of an abundance mentality, putting you in the proper mindset of a chooser. It obviously also gives you social proof and a better position to run entourage game. I can't tell you how awesome it feels to get laid with a hottie who was asking you, "Why are you always surrounded by pretty girls?" just a few hours beforehand.

Another huge advantage of befriending women that hardly anyone talks about in the manosphere is that it makes you get used to humanizing women. A significant sticking point that a lot of guys have when trying to better themselves and their dating lives is that their sh!tty mindset or inner game seeps through and manifests as subtly creepy behavior. When you internalize misogyny or view women as inherently inferior in some way, it's easy to develop habits of objectifying women rather than "subjectifying" them. And you better fvcking believe that it makes you lose out on lays. It's insanely seductive when someone seems to truly understand you and empathize with you in a way that it's like the two of you are in your own little bubble, protected from the rest of the world, a world that ostracizes you for feeling what you feel. You can only make that bubble effectively if you humanize and subjectify.

So, how do you start making more female friends? It can start the same way you tried to do pickup. You can do cold approaches with the intention of making friends rather than seduction. That's always an option. If you don't already have some female friends, I actually recommend you start doing this rather than trying to jump straight into seduction because you still might need to fix some socially awkward habits that might bite you in the ass if you try to start sexualizing things. You can join or start meetups, groups, organizations, classes, whatever. Just talk to every woman you meet like a normal human being. Use everything you learned from pickup minus the sexualization stuff. It's really not that hard if you learned all that pickup stuff already. Feel free to discuss your experiences, tips, and other ideas here.

But imo current women cannot be friends with high-value guys because they are too weak and insecure. The thing is is if you are a high-value guy then you are always putting sexual tension alpha energy out there so women find it hard to be friends with you. I have this problem with women, its like women can only be friends with low-energy guys or have guys as simps or orbiters but if your a normal guy whose always holding his attraction level high then women being so insecure and weak will start to feel intimidated and try to game you one way or another.

This is why I dont think men and women can currently be friends for real. Cos the women are just too insecure and weak.

I always have this problem of tension. Men who bring no tension or attraction tend to get more straightforward behaviours frm women but they have no value to them, and me bringing tension or attraction it causes the woman to become unstable and do stupid **** like blocking, taking things too persoinally, getting into their emotions etc but the problem is they kinda enjoy it too so thats what pisses me off but at the end of the day its all unproductive and they need to improve their game cos its all coming from insecurity and weakness from women.

 

[NealIRC]

And if women don't pursue for dating or relationships, will they pursue for friends?

I feel like more friends are cases where there is some inherent incompatibility for a relationship. 1 particular example is age gap. Usually a 20-year age gap. Another could be if 1 were like a vegetarian or vegan.

I have tried experimenting with large age gaps now that I am 35, but still no luck.

It all started from an incident when I was 20-21 years old, I was out in the park picking up garbage, and a girl who appears to be in middle school saw me and just said hi. I just replied sup back, continued picking up garbage or left.

This got me excited thinking women in their early 20s could start talking to me when I'm in my 30s but that hasn't happened yet.

-

Most of my attracting-women stories happened in my Facebook years when I had a Facebook. I tried pulling girls in gangs when their bf got arrested for murder. 1 such cases are when Latin Kings are arrested for murder, I try to find who their gfs are and msg them.

1 such case happened a few years ago when a 16 year-old Latin King gang member was arrested for murder and only like 1-2 days I found out who his girl's Facebook was, a 17 year-old girl. When I msg'd her she opened up within seconds... But I suspect she may have seen my profile before.

When I msg'd her, it doesn't show her inactivity time, and when we view each others profile, we don't show up in the People You May Know List.

Then half a year goes by, it shows her inactivity/activity time, and so I thought that means she turned 18. Then when I viewed her profile, profile desc said 18. Then if we viewed each others profile, we show up in each others People You May Know List.

This was my last year for my real-life Facebook. I shut it down at the end of the year.

I had started a new Fb, using a police 15-year-old Black boy sideways mugshot for profile pic, of a gang member that is life in federal prison. And I use this Fb to mostly talk about White people killed by Chicago police. Then 1 day I msg'd a fake-account Latin King, 1 who provides me info on his gang, and he had set up another fake account full of Latin Kings and their girls. Since it was my 1st friend on that account, then all the People I May Know list were some on his friends.

There was 2 girls, where, 1 new girl, she showed up on the People I May Know list every day for 3 whole weeks. After that, she quit viewin my profile. And then the same girl I mentioned, was showing up on the People I May Know List every day for 4 weeks, then permanently quit. Basically, they knew who I was...

So basically, these girls kept viewing my profile because they wanted something in return... And once that window expires, it cannot be forgiven, even though they would be about half my age...

A few weeks after the new girl stopped viewing my profile, I decided to msg her from 2 different fake accounts, GangA and GangB. Since she is from GangA neighborhood, I decide to msg her about GangB 1st. The opening line is "okay today I'm going to talk about GangB" and with photos and description on the history of that gang... Every Saturday morning.

Well she blocked that account, so then I msg'd her from GangA about GangA, every Saturday morning, so then she unblocked gangB, and so every Saturday morning I continue msging her from GangA and GangB account. But then, she ain't viewing my headquarter-account back.

As for the previous girl who viewed my profile every day for 4 weeks in a row then permanently quit, thing is I already msg'd her from my real account, as well as GangA and GangB account. So I created a new Science account, where I talk about stuff like expensive gemstones and jewelry, cars, expensive flowers, etc.

But, even for being double both these girls age, msging them is only 1-way, I msg them but they don't msg me.

 

[SW15]

Being a socially well-adjusted individual is a bare minimum to be an effective seducer. That by itself isn't enough, but being a damn weirdo will dry up the panties of nearly every woman in a 5 mile radius. Normal human beings cultivate friendships with members of the opposite sex. You must do this to be one of the cool kids.

I'd say the important take home with what you are mentioning though is to have a well rounded social life/circle, that also includes women.

I wouldn't go out of my way to try to make friends with women, though I like your idea about socializing with them as much as possible.

Game is some combination of looks, money, status, and personality. Being socially well-adjusted falls into personality. Personality requirements are lessened for a man who is 6'0"+ and fit/has big muscles.

Agree that social skills alone typically aren't enough to seduce, but being a damn weirdo will dry up panties.

It's good to have a well rounded social circle that has women in it. This can be done with women as acquaintances and not one-on-one friends. A man who relocates to a new city and knows no one at age 25, 30, or 35, isn't likely to randomly start making close female friendships. It's entirely possible he will have female acquaintances from his jobs or possibly an activity like a co-ed sports league.

The types of guys I know with actual female friendships are guys who made those friends during school years and retained them post-graduation. Relocations like what I described in the text block above have a way of reducing platonic female interactions.

I don't just want to penetrate women. I want to penetrate the world of women.

I like this saying.

clueless moron who thinks that mEN aNd WoMen CAn'T bE friENdS.

A lot of the blue pill, Average Frustrated Chump, beta males think men and women can be friends.

If you don't already have some female friends, I actually recommend you start doing this rather than trying to jump straight into seduction because you still might need to fix some socially awkward habits that might bite you in the ass if you try to start sexualizing things. You can join or start meetups, groups, organizations, classes, whatever. Just talk to every woman you meet like a normal human being. Use everything you learned from pickup minus the sexualization stuff. It's really not that hard if you learned all that pickup stuff already. Feel free to discuss your experiences, tips, and other ideas here.

I don't think a man needs female friends to be an effective seducer. A man having a younger sister or a similarly aged female cousin living in the same city is far more valuable than any female friend in terms of providing introductions that can lead to sex/LTRs. Older sisters are useful for female interactions but usually not for introductions.

Most men can get enough female platonic interactions from working a job or participating in a few life activities. Most men will also have male friends with girlfriends/wives, so they can get in a few female interactions that way.

A great example of this would be men that are in the military, trade professions or a hard science field (physics, engineering, etc.). Men like this are in heavily male dominated career settings and may have almost no contact with women if they don't go out of their way for it lol.

This is true. These are the men where the last sentence doesn't apply. However, a lot of military men and trade professionals have an impressive enough physique where they don't actually need to have very sophisticated social skills.

If a man has any degree of attraction towards the female, they can never really be friends. As I mentioned on that other thread, I've seen some papers/stats that showed women were far more likely to underestimate the degree of interest that a man had towards them. A guy could be actually quite interested in her but she perceives it as him just being friendly.

Yes, this is true.

One time, one of my friend's wives claimed she'd never been hit on in a grocery store. She said this within the first year of their marriage. Neither my friend nor I believed it. We both thought that at least one guy at some point started a conversation with her in a grocery store but she was too socially inept to realize it/underestimated his interest and motivations. The only way in which her statement would have been is if no man ever started a conversation with her in a grocery store. In her early to mid 20s prime, she was around a 7. Definitely in the cute range.

I think once a man expresses interest towards a woman that is not reciprocated that is the end of the line. Most women are not going to be comfortable continuing to interact with a men like this because they know that interest will always be there. It's just an awkward place for both parties to be in. If a woman isn't interested, why would a man continue to interact with her?

This has nothing to do with a scarcity or abundance mindset, it's just basic social skills. If you are expressing interest and a woman says she does not feel the same way that is the end of the interaction.

True

 

[kavi]

I disagree, I think once a man expresses interest towards a woman that is not reciprocated that is the end of the line. Most women are not going to be comfortable continuing to interact with a men like this because they know that interest will always be there. It's just an awkward place for both parties to be in. If a woman isn't interested, why would a man continue to interact with her?

This has nothing to do with a scarcity or abundance mindset, it's just basic social skills. If you are expressing interest and a woman says she does not feel the same way that is the end of the interaction. If either party goes out of their way to continue on that is displaying a lack of social skills. This is how this friend zone nonsense and other cringey social dynamics between men and women occur.

This is a big problem though. Because imagine living in communities or stable social groups. Men may make the mistake of outright expressing interest without clear signals and get rejected. If there is now an issue one of them has to leave the community, tribe or social group. This doesnt work does it. Men and women need to be able to interact and socialise without akwardness even after one of them got rejected. The major issue here is women are not putting the work in to work on their own social and psychological shortcomings, in this case getting over their own awkwardness. Women are just not putting the work in, instead they deal with it by acting like the guy is a creep and putting him down ignoring him etc basically acting like a stupid c*nt.

Whether in business, in a team, a social group, a community, a tribe or nation, women cannot just run away to another group because some guy asked her out and she rejected him, she cant leave or make him leave so she is gonna have to learn to overcome these issues.

Most guys here and out in the world dont really understand the shortcmings of modern women. Ofcourse men and women need to be able to be friends without sexual dynamics cos otherwise how do men and women work together to do stuff like business, building communities, nations, tribes etc.

 

[Dr.Suave]

Female platonic friends? No thanks.

Rollo said it in his 1st books. Girls have girlfriends and guyfriends. If you are not banging her, you are her girlfriend.

 

[SmoothHendrixPS2]

Only time I condone this theory is If you're in college and you got groups of hot girls to meet up with at parties or events. My time is valuable. I don't waste my time fun clubbing with women in the hopes of giving off social proof to outsiders. If you enjoy being a girls play brother then to each is own...

I'd rather be the dude that girls feel slightly intimidated by and tell their friends "Watch out for him, he's a bad boyyy" not "OMG Jonny is so sweet... he loves spending time....he's so safe and polite.... he doesn't try to hook up with us....buys us drinks... talks about our problems...he's so fun!"

Miss me with all that

 

[NealIRC]

I'd rather be the dude that girls feel slightly intimidated by and tell their friends "Watch out for him, he's a bad boyyy"

Yea, and girls could want to be friends with that too.

 

[SmoothHendrixPS2]

Yea, and girls could want to be friends with that too.

yea. Friends with benefits

 

[sangheilios]

This is a big problem though. Because imagine living in communities or stable social groups. Men may make the mistake of outright expressing interest without clear signals and get rejected. If there is now an issue one of them has to leave the community, tribe or social group. This doesnt work does it. Men and women need to be able to interact and socialise without akwardness even after one of them got rejected. The major issue here is women are not putting the work in to work on their own social and psychological shortcomings, in this case getting over their own awkwardness. Women are just not putting the work in, instead they deal with it by acting like the guy is a creep and putting him down ignoring him etc basically acting like a stupid c*nt.

Whether in business, in a team, a social group, a community, a tribe or nation, women cannot just run away to another group because some guy asked her out and she rejected him, she cant leave or make him leave so she is gonna have to learn to overcome these issues.

Most guys here and out in the world dont really understand the shortcmings of modern women. Ofcourse men and women need to be able to be friends without sexual dynamics cos otherwise how do men and women work together to do stuff like business, building communities, nations, tribes etc.

I'm referring to more one on one, person to person interactions. If you express interest in a woman and she is NOT interested it's natural for her to distance herself from this man. It would be odd if she continued to be very personal with him, in fact there would be no reason for it.....again this is how this friend zone nonsense happens.

We really can't compare our modern society to living in some small, tight knit tribe. Those people interact with each other every single day and would have known one another for their entire lives. They also would have had very specific mating rituals and social standards that are different than what we have. Something else you need to factor in is that historically arranged marriages were quite the norm.

 

[Barrister]

Once you are an adult, a man and a woman are never truly "friends" in the true sense of the word. For a couple reasons. One, a woman will never sacrifice anything for you. As men, we share a code of respect and integrity. If my best friend does me a solid in any way, I know that I owe him and will be there for him in return and vice versa. Not so for women who only function in the vacuum of their emotions.

Second, a man and a woman's relationship is never strictly platonic no matter how much you or her say it is. On some level, there is always a pull to get each other naked and have sex. It is natural and the facts of life. We each have parts that the other wants. Even if you are implicitly agreeing not to do that and just be "friendly," this pull always exists on some level. Usually, it is some simp male that agrees to be the little buddy, but players also have sub-HB women who we are very friendly towards and who wish they could bed us but will never get the chance.

Now, you can certainly socialize with women in a non-sexual way. You can also have women within your social circle and use them to create strong social proof. This is essentially what OP is referencing. But are these women truly your "friend"? Of course not.

 

[NealIRC]

But imo current women cannot be friends with high-value guys because they are too weak and insecure. The thing is is if you are a high-value guy then you are always putting sexual tension alpha energy out there so women find it hard to be friends with you. I have this problem with women, its like women can only be friends with low-energy guys or have guys as simps or orbiters but if your a normal guy whose always holding his attraction level high then women being so insecure and weak will start to feel intimidated and try to game you one way or another.

This is why I dont think men and women can currently be friends for real. Cos the women are just too insecure and weak.

1 of the research I do, are do attractive girls, care to get rejected by incel men? So 2 ways to do this. The 1st is to start threads asking incels, the women you find 10/10, if you rejected them, would they even care?

Then the other way around, is asking attractive women in webcam sites, on their self-esteem, asking them if they are any man's greatest fantasy / dream woman.

 

[SW15]

Now, you can certainly socialize with women in a non-sexual way. You can also have women within your social circle and use them to create strong social proof. This is essentially what OP is referencing. But are these women truly your "friend"? Of course not.

If you're hanging out with them one-on-one fairly regularly in a non-sexual way, that's friendship.

If it is a friend's girlfriend/wife who you see somewhat often, it's possible that's a friend. If interactions are infrequent, that's an acquaintance.