At what point do YOU start calling HER?

[jnMissouri]

I'm not really much of a caller. Women I've dated in the past or been in relationships with early on often joke that they had a dream that I finally called them. When I have started calling we were so far along into the relationship (months) and had arguments over text that we were past the point of awkwardness. It's one of those things where you are comfortable with each other. That said most of the time when they would call me you could tell they were nervous.

So is it ever a good idea to start calling HER? Current girl has called me 3 times, I've never called her. Perhaps that works in my favor in creating mystery (why doesn't he call me)? Or should I start calling her ONCE in a while?

My thing about not calling is the awkwardness of her not answering. I've also never been much of a phone person, preferring texting so I can think about responses. We've had a couple of roughly hour long conversations that were funny/flirty. But still, I feel like it's best NOT to call until you are more comfortable with each other?

 

[Ohso-Phresh]

I'm not really much of a caller. Women I've dated in the past or been in relationships with early on often joke that they had a dream that I finally called them. When I have started calling we were so far along into the relationship (months) and had arguments over text that we were past the point of awkwardness. It's one of those things where you are comfortable with each other. That said most of the time when they would call me you could tell they were nervous.

So is it ever a good idea to start calling HER? Current girl has called me 3 times, I've never called her. Perhaps that works in my favor in creating mystery (why doesn't he call me)? Or should I start calling her ONCE in a while?

My thing about not calling is the awkwardness of her not answering. I've also never been much of a phone person, preferring texting so I can think about responses. We've had a couple of roughly hour long conversations that were funny/flirty. But still, I feel like it's best NOT to call until you are more comfortable with each other?

My presence is a gift, that includes my attention and awareness on her. That is experienced by her as a spectrum. My physical presence is at the highest, next is my voice then attention via text. Generally I give the gift of my voice after they have invested and are earning it with good behavior. When I do want to give the gift of my voice, generally a text exchange then in the context of the convo, I initiate a call for I know they are at their phone. I never leave messages, the fact that I called is the message.
I don’t spend much time texting, nor being on the phone. When I do give the gift of my voice, I’m spiking her emotions and at times giving her a sensual and at other times a sexual experience.

Since this is long distance for you, it’s supportive of you to give her tasks that give her direction for the time you spend apart and not in communication. It can go in the direction of creating games, or lists or old skool as directing her to write letters composed around themes.

The more she is thinking about you (arousing and positive ways), the more she gets invested and the greater the attraction.

Your questions are still around details and there is much inner work there for you to do.

The various things that I described are congruent with my frame which is in alignment with my identity and made whole by my integrity.

A facet of my identity is being a trained hypnotist, thus my voice has tremendous power. I can give women orgasms with my voice, by what I say and how I say it.

The above might not work for someone with a different identity.

 

[Serenity]

So is it ever a good idea to start calling HER?

Don't overthink it, the act of calling matters less than the interaction of the call.

Current girl has called me 3 times, I've never called her. Perhaps that works in my favor in creating mystery (why doesn't he call me)?

Nope. If anything it will make her insecure about your interest in her, it's a double edged sword. It may work in your favor if she's the type that tries to get what she can't have, it will work against you if she's the type who simply assumes you're not interested in her. The idea of "mystery" from such lack of interaction is a myth created by the PUA community.

Or should I start calling her ONCE in a while?

Ultimately YOU should do as YOU do, although you could just tell them you simply don't like talking on the phone.

My thing about not calling is the awkwardness of her not answering.

This is your own insecurity and fear of rejection, a pessimistic assumption about why she's not picking up when it could be any other benign reason. Your reason is irrational.

I've also never been much of a phone person, preferring texting so I can think about responses

This is a fair reason, I happen to be the same, although I don't fear calling someone. I'll call if doing it on text will take up a lot of time, if I know it will be a short conversation I stick to text. If I do call then I'll usually find a way to end the conversation before 10 minutes, because I just don't like conversing on the phone.

But still, I feel like it's best NOT to call until you are more comfortable with each other?

Why not? I'm curious about your reasoning behind it, but I suspect the "?" ending your statement means you have no reasoning behind this, it's just a feeling.

 

[jnMissouri]

Nope. If anything it will make her insecure about your interest in her, it's a double edged sword. It may work in your favor if she's the type that tries to get what she can't have, it will work against you if she's the type who simply assumes you're not interested in her. The idea of "mystery" from such lack of interaction is a myth created by the PUA community.

A little more background. She traveled across the country braving the virus fears to meet me (she was really worried about it) and was chastised by family and friends after since she didn't tell them before her trip because she knew they would stop her traveling to meet some guy she met online. She messaged ME on the dating site (not your average dating site, not a lot of girls like her). We slept together and are now in a relationship (yes I know, it's quick). She called me her boyfriend, I hinted that she is special when she asked me, she took down her profile, I took mine down. She likes guys who are focused on financial goals, have their eyes on the prize so to speak. So with that said, do you think it hurts not calling her or helps? We texted for about 3 weeks before meeting, I never called her then yet her interest was high enough to travel all that way to meet me. She is HOT AF and well off financially, young, etc. She could have ANY guy, literally. She didn't travel all this way just to have sex with me and I'm going to see her in a couple weeks. She gave me a date to go down and before she left she tried to take a couple items and told me if I want them back I have to go see her. She called me ONCE prior to her trip here to plan the flight and the first 2 days after she got back.

The LAST call she gamed me. All of a sudden she called me on an app, not the phone. She hung up right when I answered, then when I tried to call her back (I almost always miss her call, not on purpose though) she was on another call on the app...then 20 minutes later she called me back and was like, oh sorry, I was talking to my friend Felicia. Note that she had to go INTO my contact in the app AND click a button to dial me. This wasn't an accident or a but dial. My friends and I think she did this on purpose knowing I'd try to call her back and she would be "busy". Then she called me after her call with her friend. We also think she gamed beyond that. She has two phones. After she called me she had 2-3 calls come in on her other phone and she answered and told them she'd call them back tomorrow. It was her work phone. We think she was trying to make herself seem busy, etc. Funny thing is not once prior to this has she ever received a phone call while we were on the phone and the entire weekend she was here no one called her. We think it was staged.

Why not? I'm curious about your reasoning behind it, but I suspect the "?" ending your statement means you have no reasoning behind this, it's just a feeling.

I figure when in doubt it's best to err on the side of caution. And my past pattern of dating and relationships was always one where I never called. They would begin to call after a few months. Then by the 4-6 month mark we were having regular phone conversations even video chats almost daily, especially when we couldn't see each other. At that point I never had to think about it, it was just a natural progression and never worried about them not answering. They always answered. Or if they called me and I missed the call I'd call them back and vice versa.

 

[jnMissouri]

My presence is a gift, that includes my attention and awareness on her. That is experienced by her as a spectrum. My physical presence is at the highest, next is my voice then attention via text. Generally I give the gift of my voice after they have invested and are earning it with good behavior. When I do want to give the gift of my voice, generally a text exchange then in the context of the convo, I initiate a call for I know they are at their phone. I never leave messages, the fact that I called is the message.
I don’t spend much time texting, nor being on the phone. When I do give the gift of my voice, I’m spiking her emotions and at times giving her a sensual and at other times a sexual experience.

Since this is long distance for you, it’s supportive of you to give her tasks that give her direction for the time you spend apart and not in communication. It can go in the direction of creating games, or lists or old skool as directing her to write letters composed around themes.

The more she is thinking about you (arousing and positive ways), the more she gets invested and the greater the attraction.

Your questions are still around details and there is much inner work there for you to do.

The various things that I described are congruent with my frame which is in alignment with my identity and made whole by my integrity.

A facet of my identity is being a trained hypnotist, thus my voice has tremendous power. I can give women orgasms with my voice, by what I say and how I say it.

The above might not work for someone with a different identity.

Yeah the part about calling only when in a text conversation already knowing she is on her phone is what I was looking for. I had thought about that as well.

 

[Ohso-Phresh]

Yeah the part about calling only when in a text conversation already knowing she is on her phone is what I was looking for. I had thought about that as well.

You’re focusing on picking up the penny as you step over the Benjamin.

 

[jnMissouri]

I just called her. I responded to one of her earlier texts from the day and she happened to be up still. I kept the conversation short, she seemed disappointed that I was getting off the phone so quickly (3 minutes). But better short than too long. She was getting sleepy anyways and watching a movie.

The point of the call was to balance uncertainty with signs of further interest. I have this book that talks about how attraction is built with a balance of certainty and uncertainty. Too much certainty kills it. But so does too much uncertainty. It's the concept of hot and cold. Keep them wondering, keep them analyzing your feelings, he loves me, he loves me not. The more you are on her mind the better, she'll feel that tension. But you must release the tension once in a while. So while I did want to actually talk to her on the phone, I also wanted to give her a continuing sign of interest and "escalation" in the relationship. Over time with her and I calling back and forth it will become more natural and comfortable with each other.

 

[jnMissouri]

You’re focusing on picking up the penny as you step over the Benjamin.

I hear you on some of the inner game stuff, but I think a lot of people don't focus enough on strategy and tactics. I liken this to gun fighting. Inner game doesn't win gun fights. Fire and maneuver, fire and movement, cover and concealment, tactical movement and training as well as planning wins gun fights. Yes in dating inner game is part of it. But much like we have ****y/funny from David D and cold approach tactics, these are valuable tools. Merely having inner game alone isn't enough IMO.

I didn't over think or give any real thought to what I was doing with her until AFTER she left here. Prior to that for about 3 weeks I just randomly texted her, skipped a day here and there, ended conversations first like I usually do, but wasn't that invested because we hadn't even met. After she flew here and we ****ed, had a great time together for the weekend, it was different. I will say though she is still more invested in me than I am in her. She put a lot of time and money in to come see me. I'm about to do the same to go see her, but for now, she has put the most effort in. In any case I'm a planned person, and David D. has even said that one mistake guys make is that they have no plan for dates, communication, etc. They just wing it with no thought. That's dangerous as well, more so than overthinking.

In any case, yes, we all have inner game work to do. I appreciate your input. Keep it coming.

 

[Serenity]

Note that she had to go INTO my contact in the app AND click a button to dial me. This wasn't an accident or a but dial. My friends and I think she did this on purpose knowing I'd try to call her back and she would be "busy".

You want to know what I do when I know I'm going to make 2 calls and the first one doesn't pick up? I start calling the next person hoping the first one I tried to call will be available after.

She has two phones. After she called me she had 2-3 calls come in on her other phone and she answered and told them she'd call them back tomorrow. It was her work phone. We think she was trying to make herself seem busy, etc. Funny thing is not once prior to this has she ever received a phone call while we were on the phone and the entire weekend she was here no one called her. We think it was staged.

Maybe she doesn't get that many calls on her work phone, but something important came up.

I figure when in doubt it's best to err on the side of caution.

Assuming the worst is just as bad as assuming the best, I personally prefer to assume the most likely and most mundane scenario if there's no further evidence supporting anything else.

I hear you on some of the inner game stuff, but I think a lot of people don't focus enough on strategy and tactics. I liken this to gun fighting. Inner game doesn't win gun fights. Fire and maneuver, fire and movement, cover and concealment, tactical movement and training as well as planning wins gun fights. Yes in dating inner game is part of it. But much like we have ****y/funny from David D and cold approach tactics, these are valuable tools. Merely having inner game alone isn't enough IMO.

I will argue that inner game certainly does matter in a gun fight, if you understand the psychology of who you're fighting you'll have a massive advantage. Knowing how to fire, maneuver and cover yourself doesn't do sh!t if you lack the sense to read the situation as it unfolds and know when to do what, THAT is inner game.

Strategies and tactics are easy to learn, using them appropriately is hard. I'm past simple strategies and tactics, I'm way up in the meta game of when to use them. Like literally playing a video game, knowing which button does what doesn't take you that far, mastery is using the correct button at the correct time in the given situation to produce the preferred outcome.

Merely having outer game alone isn't enough, I would go so far as to say it's almost utterly useless without inner game. You get farther with inner game than outer game, sometimes the simpler tools are better. While you're looking into your toolbox with a billion tools in it I have already fixed it with a simple screwdriver, because I know how to effectively apply the tools I have.

Anyways, I digress. You are absolutely overthinking this phone thing and you're being irrationally paranoid about mundane events., possibly because of your extreme bias towards the external. You'll likely self-sabotage if you continue down this path, been there, done that.

 

[Stoic]

Damn OP, I thought I was analytical. Curious, feel free to ignore, disregard, but what is your profession?

 

[Stoic]

You've set this long complicated game of chess up. Her moves, your moves, feints and fake moves by her. You are worried about her gaming you. This doesn't even need to be a checkers game. KISS

 

[bcude]

4th thread and counting about a woman you've met exactly once who's long distance.
Coming off this needy and insecure in front of us makes me wonder how all the women around must feel.

You're looking at details when you should be looking at the big picture. You can only fake it for so long.

 

[Glassguy]

The first post you made about this beta ass bullshyte was enough to make my eyes bleed. Now another?

Do you really need to tell everyone the play by play on your beta moves?

I am just waiting on the "she ghosted me" or "She was BPD" thread to follow.

Making all of these thread about some random chick that you got in a relationship with in 54 minutes.........totally beta priceless.

 

[dustmuffin]

Didn’t have the patience to read all of your posts but from what I read you are overthinking. Get a few more plates to take your mind off her