Assessing Tom Torero's Death Two Years on

Isildur1

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Sorry the actual Title of the post is meant to be Assessing Tom Torero's death two years on* I ****ed up the title of the post - my apologies

https://mindful-masculinity.org/2024/06/08/assessing-tom-toreros-death-two-years-on-thoughts/

Wrote a blog post about Tom Torero's death and it's impact two years on and what it means for the future of pick up artistry and the community - As someone who really genuinely enjoyed his content and saw him as one of the pivotal leaders in the dating and self development space I wrote this piece to both celebrate his impact and ridicule some mistakes he might have made
 

BaronOfHair

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Not familiar with Torrero, nonetheless after Googling his name, I discovered this remarkably infuriating and enlightening article


The last portion, regarding the necessity of enduring when cancel-happy activists come for us, is something all of us are wise to photo copy and hang on our walls
 

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This guy is The Man! Thanks to him I got my first cold approach success recently.
 

BaronOfHair

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Wrote a blog post about Tom Torero's death and it's impact two years on and what it means for the future of pick up artistry and the community -
What happened to Torrero goes beyond PUA Jump to 13:30-14:17



His fate is exactly what's described in that time stamp. Which makes The Manosphere's fair weather support for free speech all the more disconcerting
 

BaronOfHair

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I can see that people keep on confusing 'Freedom of Speech' with 'Free Speech'.
Presumably, these are the same folks who also believe that saying "Toe-Mah-Toe" makes what they're referring to something other than a tomato
 

BaronOfHair

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So, you give credence to the author of Girlschase.com? The moron who claims to have a 'lay count' of 10,000? Check your sources.
INo idea how many broads he claims to have boffed, nor do I care, given that dude's finesse with the ladies isn't the subject I was discussing. His words on what to do when one finds themselves targeted by cancel happy activists (And make no mistake; These bottom fishermen and women ARE coming for us all, sooner rather than later)are right on the money:

Endure and don't back down. Our social climate wouldn't be as woefully constricted as it is today, had so many of us not been f-cking cowards, when both The Preferred Pronouners and Red Pill True Believers started screeching "That's problematic!!!"/"That's Blue Pill!!!", back in '16
 

Isildur1

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What happened to Torrero goes beyond PUA Jump to 13:30-14:17



His fate is exactly what's described in that time stamp. Which makes The Manosphere's fair weather support for free speech all the more disconcerting
dating coaches have been under ridicule for years now- Tom Torero's was the first time someone actively destroyed all modes of his income simultaneously though . Agree with Bahron - the bottom of the barrel women do seem to have envy over pickup artists and men who seemingly date "out of their league"
 

Isildur1

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So, you give credence to the author of Girlschase.com? The moron who claims to have a 'lay count' of 10,000? Check your sources.
don't think 10,000 would even be possible mathematically lol - I had around a 0.87 percent every 100 approaches - close rate so for me to reach his figures would require 1 million cold approaches lol
 

BaronOfHair

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The guy 'Chase Amante' is a grifter. I don't trust his opinion on anything.
So if Amante says "It's overcast and raining outside", you'll retort "There's not a cloud in the sky, nor is there so much drizzle as a drizzle happening", even if the sky really is pissing tidal waves down upon you both. That's the most sensible thing I've heard this week, more so than even The Browning School naming Brian Peck their new headmaster
 

Isildur1

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The whole thing doesn't add up, but it probably 'sounds impressive' to anybody who doesn't have common sense or a basic understanding of primary school grade level arithmetic. People should stop being so incredibly gullible.
once people actually do some daygame or approaching - they realise the numbers are lower than the fantasies that are sold to them project them to be and reality hits - marketers aren't the most honest people of course
 

Create self-fulfilling prophecies. Always assume the positive. Assume she likes you. Assume she wants to talk to you. Assume she wants to go out with you. When you think positive, positive things happen.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

characternote

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don't think 10,000 would even be possible mathematically lol - I had around a 0.87 percent every 100 approaches - close rate so for me to reach his figures would require 1 million cold approaches lol
well the thing is, 'chase' would tell you that his 'hit rate' is basically 100% which changes the maths! haha
He's from the oldschool PUA group of 'coaches'/writers etc, still trying to pander to the most gulible and desperate aspiring PUA's who will still believe that you can use verbal magic (in the forms of negs and NLP etc) in order to basically brainwash any girl into want into wanting to bang you. Even if you are 100 years old, 500lbs, broke, with no legs. Just use his lines and techniques and none of that matters. She's yours!

In fact, Chase even implied almost exactly that in a thread over at 'skilledseducer' a year or so back (can't be bothered to search for the post) in a big debate about the power of 'game', it's limitations, 'yes girls vs no girls' etc

He's not the only one selling that snake oil, although tbf, in general the PUA coaching community have slightly shifted towards something at least SLIGHTLY more realistic in terms of success and the 'power' (limitations!!!) of 'game' in the last decade or so. It's just too hard for them to continue this lie when things like youtube came about. Basically it made people prove it! ''Prove that you can bang any girl you want!!' Go out with your gopro right now with a live chat on. We'll tell you what girls too approach. I expect each interaction to lead to sex or at least a makeout etc''. Good luck with that!! lol. The best PUA coach in the world (assuming he's maybe a little worse than average looking and hitting on the hottest 18 year old girls about) would have to approach like 250 girls until he got lucky. And they know it!!

They don't seem to realise how ridiculous what they're claiming actually is (ps - these guys also typically have zero infields etc) - the gift they claim would inevitably find themselves as famous as Elvis. Journalists would be writing 'Who is this man who has slept with margot Robbie, adriana Lima and all top 10 victoria secret models in a week??' with pap snaps of him making out with them all at different times and leaving their hotel rooms. The same magic gift would surely mean they'd be able to become amazingly wealthy in a short time using the same 'seduction' and mind control skills. It's all hilarious to me and always has been, but there ya go.
 
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BaronOfHair

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No, if 'Amante' says something about the weather, I go up to check the weather to verify his weather forecasting claims
Lord Of Light be praised that you and he aren't both on staff at a junior high together then. If Amante were to notice a
squirrely 13 year old walking down the hall toting an HK416 before you did, you'd insist on walking up to the lad to verify that both he and the rifle were real, rather than optical illusion Chase had created :eek: :p
 

BaronOfHair

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I'd probably use the lad for kyudo target practice while 'Chase Amante' cowers in the janitor's closet, but it's obvious that you put a lot of faith in this grifter's character
I have no opinion on Amante either way. That article I linked above is the only thing of his I've ever read. I'm curious as to why he triggers you so. Did he knock your granny through a window with a haymaker, drop kick your kitten off The George Washington Bridge, etc etc ?
 

BaronOfHair

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dating coaches have been under ridicule for years now- Tom Torero's was the first time someone actively destroyed all modes of his income simultaneously though
Yeah, this went beyond simple ridicule and into full blown cancellation. Card Carrying Red Pillers will interpret this as "proof" that we live in A Blue Pill Gynocentric Social Order, which has been set up for the express purpose of screwing over men. That argument doesn't hold up, once one also recognizes that women who consider themselves in some capacity(Debbie Soh, Laura Kipnis, Meghan Murphy, most recently Lindsay Ellis)have also been targeted for Cancellation, after they dared to utter heretical thoughts one too many times in public

The real problem here: Free Speech is on the ropes, in EVERY corner of our civilization, and disconcertingly few of us are willing to champion it openly
 

Do not be too easy. If you are too easy to get, she will not want you. If you are too easy to keep, she will lose interest in you. If you are too easy to control, she will not respect you.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

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Most Tate, et al PUA readers:

 

Isildur1

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well the thing is, 'chase' would tell you that his 'hit rate' is basically 100% which changes the maths! haha
He's from the oldschool PUA group of 'coaches'/writers etc, still trying to pander to the most gulible and desperate aspiring PUA's who will still believe that you can use verbal magic (in the forms of negs and NLP etc) in order to basically brainwash any girl into want into wanting to bang you. Even if you are 100 years old, 500lbs, broke, with no legs. Just use his lines and techniques and none of that matters. She's yours!

In fact, Chase even implied almost exactly that in a thread over at 'skilledseducer' a year or so back (can't be bothered to search for the post) in a big debate about the power of 'game', it's limitations, 'yes girls vs no girls' etc

He's not the only one selling that snake oil, although tbf, in general the PUA coaching community have slightly shifted towards something at least SLIGHTLY more realistic in terms of success and the 'power' (limitations!!!) of 'game' in the last decade or so. It's just too hard for them to continue this lie when things like youtube came about. Basically it made people prove it! ''Prove that you can bang any girl you want!!' Go out with your gopro right now with a live chat on. We'll tell you what girls too approach. I expect each interaction to lead to sex or at least a makeout etc''. Good luck with that!! lol. The best PUA coach in the world (assuming he's maybe a little worse than average looking and hitting on the hottest 18 year old girls about) would have to approach like 250 girls until he got lucky. And they know it!!

They don't seem to realise how ridiculous what they're claiming actually is (ps - these guys also typically have zero infields etc) - the gift they claim would inevitably find themselves as famous as Elvis. Journalists would be writing 'Who is this man who has slept with margot Robbie, adriana Lima and all top 10 victoria secret models in a week??' with pap snaps of him making out with them all at different times and leaving their hotel rooms. The same magic gift would surely mean they'd be able to become amazingly wealthy in a short time using the same 'seduction' and mind control skills. It's all hilarious to me and always has been, but there ya go.
I never liked Ross Jeffries for that reason- he always had ****ty NLP tactics which never made sense to me - looking back at my daygame successes had I used Ross Jeffries NLP lines I think it would have ****ed up all those dates rather than achieved anything substantial - Ross himself doesn't appear to be in great shape or look after himself particularly well so im always weary when a dating coach fails to look after himself whilst peddling the secrets to have sex with beautiful women

the only way people can free themselves from the marketing bs is just to go out and do their own approaches - that way you will understand its alot more complex than it is and there are alot more variables at play- what I liked about Tom was that he was at least pro active in this regard , something which a lot of red pill coaches like a Rollo Tomassi or a Richard Cooper are not
 

Isildur1

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well the thing is, 'chase' would tell you that his 'hit rate' is basically 100% which changes the maths! haha
He's from the oldschool PUA group of 'coaches'/writers etc, still trying to pander to the most gulible and desperate aspiring PUA's who will still believe that you can use verbal magic (in the forms of negs and NLP etc) in order to basically brainwash any girl into want into wanting to bang you. Even if you are 100 years old, 500lbs, broke, with no legs. Just use his lines and techniques and none of that matters. She's yours!

In fact, Chase even implied almost exactly that in a thread over at 'skilledseducer' a year or so back (can't be bothered to search for the post) in a big debate about the power of 'game', it's limitations, 'yes girls vs no girls' etc

He's not the only one selling that snake oil, although tbf, in general the PUA coaching community have slightly shifted towards something at least SLIGHTLY more realistic in terms of success and the 'power' (limitations!!!) of 'game' in the last decade or so. It's just too hard for them to continue this lie when things like youtube came about. Basically it made people prove it! ''Prove that you can bang any girl you want!!' Go out with your gopro right now with a live chat on. We'll tell you what girls too approach. I expect each interaction to lead to sex or at least a makeout etc''. Good luck with that!! lol. The best PUA coach in the world (assuming he's maybe a little worse than average looking and hitting on the hottest 18 year old girls about) would have to approach like 250 girls until he got lucky. And they know it!!

They don't seem to realise how ridiculous what they're claiming actually is (ps - these guys also typically have zero infields etc) - the gift they claim would inevitably find themselves as famous as Elvis. Journalists would be writing 'Who is this man who has slept with margot Robbie, adriana Lima and all top 10 victoria secret models in a week??' with pap snaps of him making out with them all at different times and leaving their hotel rooms. The same magic gift would surely mean they'd be able to become amazingly wealthy in a short time using the same 'seduction' and mind control skills. It's all hilarious to me and always has been, but there ya go.
well John Anthony is similar in that regard in that he claims to have 1500 lays and can get newbies good real quick

the reality is no coach can fix a low smv man overnight - there needs to be some degree of inner work done , which is where the market bs ends and the graft begins- get smv and do the approaches and remain consistent has worked for me but maintaining that work ethic and that drive to improve smv has been an issue in the past (before I met my girlfriend from daygame)
 
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