Am I getting to that age?

[Hooligan Harry]

As I approach my thirties I am starting to see more and more people tie the knot. That has been happening for a while and its a natural progression for many I suppose. What I have found to be quite alarming though is the amount of marriages heading for divorce now.

Here are the main ones with people I am close to

Example 1: Mate emigrates to the UK with his GF. They get married after 4 years of being together. 3 years into the marriage he comes home to a Dear John letter. Packed her stuff and flew out without him even knowing. All the debt she accrued plus the mortgage has been left to him on his salary alone. Mortage slave who is going to go bankrupt before he is 30 or even had a crack at self employment. No apologies from her. She was no longer in love with him and felt trapped.

Example 2: Girl I grew up with marries a guy she knows for 3 months. Flys off to vegas to get it done. 3 years later and she has decided to file for divorce. The guy was a ****ing idiot and I never really knew what she saw in him. Still, poor fellow is heart broken.

Example 3: I was a best man at his wedding. The guy wanted to marry two girls before the 3rd one said yes. He lives to serve women. Earns peanuts and cant provide basic lifestyle. They lost a kid they were planning for. She files for divorce 4 months later citing financial strain as the reason for it. Lasted two years and now he wants to kill himself again

Example 4: Mate marries the biggest slut I have ever met in my life. Turns out she was ****ing some other guy for a year while they were engaged. Convinces him to get married in community of property. Two months later she divorces him taking half his assets. She had nothing.

Example 5: Mate meets single mom. Biggest feminist I have met in my life. Denies father the right to see the boy. My mate marries this broad, knocks her up. She says he is the perfect husband, yada nice guy yada wanted all my life. Strews ****, turns out she was banging her boss when she was pregnant. Tells husband they make better friends. Files for divorce, baby 3 months old. Former stripper and had a recent tit job. Feminist stripper. I have seen it all.

Example 6: Mate has been dating an absolute ***** for 4 years. Controls him to the point where he has to ask permission to watch TV. Not kidding. Two years into the marriage and he has been on the couch for a year of it. She files for divorce telling him that she does not love him anymore. He is shattered and does not understand why

Example 7: Mate marries broad. Says he likes her a lot, but we all know that he was just going according to plan. They guy has had his life mapped out since he could read and write. Now he feels trapped, drops thousands on hookers and strippers, does not want to go home. Never thought a married mate would be a banker for a night out. Weekdays, weekends. Dont matter. Its game on.

Now while these woman are far from ideal the picture that this paints speaks volumes. Marriages in my own social circle are falling to pieces left and right. Only two out of 9 seem to be stable.Thats almost a 70% failure rate.

The common denominator here is that while women are difficult the majority of my mates have been weaklings when it comes to women. They never lead, they tolerate way to much crap, they never really sewed their oats. While modern day women are difficult and unreliable I cannot help but think that the majority of these problems are the result of men not being men.

So a question for the older guys and those that have been/are married. As you have aged have you seen the same thing? How often are the marriages that end in divorce often the result of a guy who rushed into it or the result of a chap who really never had much control in the relationship IE: Respect? In your experience, would what I am seeing in my own social circle be congruent with what you have seen in the past?

I am actually pro marriage. Im just anti the idea of it until I have ****ed pretty much everything in a skirt and I am financially stable enough to support her and a few sprites comfortably on my own ticket. Basically not before I am 35-40.

 

[KarmaSutra]

I am actually pro marriage. Im just anti the idea of it until I have ****ed pretty much everything in a skirt and I am financially stable enough to support her and a few sprites comfortably on my own ticket. Basically not before I am 35-40.

I had hope for you until I got to this paragraph.

Damnit man, why do you have to burden yourself financially for ANY woman? You don't yearn for a woman who is self sufficient? Someone who takes pride in working hard for herself and building a life she can share with someone?

I think you do. How about revising the paragraph above so the brothers and sisters here know what you truly meant to say.

 

[Hooligan Harry]

I had hope for you until I got to this paragraph.

Damnit man, why do you have to burden yourself financially for ANY woman? You don't yearn for a woman who is self sufficient? Someone who takes pride in working hard for herself and building a life she can share with someone?

I think you do. How about revising the paragraph above so the brothers and sisters here know what you truly meant to say.

All due respect man I want a family one day. I see no point having a family only for them to be in daycare. I think a traditional family with gender roles produces healthier happier kids. I also dont believe that any marriage can ever work if there are two bread winners. It causes competition at home and women CANNOT separate work from home. Their sense of entitlement is at a maximum when they contribute to the bank balance.

To be honest I make a lot of money. My income will continue to grow. By the time I am 45-50, a professional woman is going to have to work an entire year to bring home what I do in a month.

I EXPECT her to give up her career and profession. Its a deal breaker for me. If I expect that of her she needs to have the security of knowing she is looked after if the **** hits the fan. I have no problems with that. We both gamble, although Ill admit Ill probably be gambling a little more from a financial point of view.

I find it ironic that people despise feminists and pro woman viewpoints yet are convinced that a woman needs to be an equal earning partner for her to be considered worthy of your time and efforts. I think that stems from two things in particular.

1. The fact that people dont want their standard of living to take a knock which happens on one salary. Materialism has become more important then family and quality of life

2. Western indoctrination that suggests a woman who does not work and contribute financially is a drain on the household and lacks independence. Marriage is about co dependence. You putting the food on the table and a roof over your heads. Her looking after the kids and managing the home. You cannot despise feminism in one breath while lauding "womens independence" in another. They day she has kids is the day she stops work if she can.

I have no desire to get married unless its for children. There would be absolutely no reason to ever consider it for anything but that. I have also learned that career women are some of the worst **** on Gods green earth. I have had very few positive experiences with western career women. From a romantic and professional point of view.

My experiences suggest that while a womans expectations of her man are unrealistic I cant help but feel the majority of this **** could have been avoided in the first place if friends had qualified the women better and actually had a pair of balls in the relationship. I am hoping some of the more experienced guys could relate to that and tell me if I am seeing it correctly or if the state of marriage in the west really has deteriorated into what I am seeing.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

I have no desire to get married unless its for children. There would be absolutely no reason to ever consider it for anything but that. I have also learned that career women are some of the worst **** on Gods green earth. I have had very few positive experiences with western career women. From a romantic and professional point of view.

My experiences suggest that while a womans expectations of her man are unrealistic I cant help but feel the majority of this **** could have been avoided in the first place if friends had qualified the women better and actually had a pair of balls in the relationship. I am hoping some of the more experienced guys could relate to that and tell me if I am seeing it correctly or if the state of marriage in the west really has deteriorated into what I am seeing.

Most people get married for the wrong reasons, IMO. Just like you said, if you seriously consider WHY you want to get married, for YOUR reasons, exactly what you WANT your relationship to be like, and SCREEN APPROPRIATELY for a woman that fits YOUR CRITERIA, then you can't go wrong.

Here is the problem with marriage today:

People get married for the same reaons they did a hundred years ago, womans clock is ticking, man doesn't have enough game to play the field, so he settles, she hooks him in, all to the cheering social pressure of society.

But TODAY the social pressure doesn't exist like it did 100 years ago to FORCE couples to stay together. People (women) had a lot less options then, so they really had no where to go. The quality of women is not deteriorating, it's just that society is such that being an AFC (like most men have always been and will alwasy be +/- 10,000 years) isn't good enough anymore.

However, if you are a MAN, and decide what kind of life you want, and SCREEN/QUALIFY PROPERLY, you got nothing to worry about.

More power to ya....

 

[jophil28]

A man still need a woman for a guaranteed supply of sex BUT a woman no longer needs a man to provide for her financial security. That is why most of the women in Harry's story above walked out when their relationship with their husbands deteriorated - they left or bailed because they could, without any painful consequences.
UNfortunately, financial independence for women has revealed how flimsy many women are when the going gets rough in their marriages. They no longer NEED to stay and work it out.

 

[Mr. Me]

Harry, I think you have it almost right but there's another factor about these guys you mentioned. Yes, some of them rushed into marriage with a person they didn't really know. Yes, some of them may have married the wrong person, turning a blind eye to the flags when dating or being too naive to know the difference. Yes, many get married for the wrong reasons.

But we can sum all that up in one sentence: These guys weren't the right person first and foremost to themselves. If they were they wouldn't get hitched to the wrong person or for the wrong reasons. They wouldn't come home to a Dear John letter because they would know how to keep a woman in love with them. And if the relationship failed, they wouldn't be clueless as to why it happened.

Nurturing a relationship is a skill. Learn it before you get into a marriage.

 

[Colossus]

All due respect man I want a family one day. I see no point having a family only for them to be in daycare. I think a traditional family with gender roles produces healthier happier kids. I also dont believe that any marriage can ever work if there are two bread winners. It causes competition at home and women CANNOT separate work from home. Their sense of entitlement is at a maximum when they contribute to the bank balance.

To be honest I make a lot of money. My income will continue to grow. By the time I am 45-50, a professional woman is going to have to work an entire year to bring home what I do in a month.

I EXPECT her to give up her career and profession. Its a deal breaker for me. If I expect that of her she needs to have the security of knowing she is looked after if the **** hits the fan. I have no problems with that. We both gamble, although Ill admit Ill probably be gambling a little more from a financial point of view.

I find it ironic that people despise feminists and pro woman viewpoints yet are convinced that a woman needs to be an equal earning partner for her to be considered worthy of your time and efforts. I think that stems from two things in particular.

1. The fact that people dont want their standard of living to take a knock which happens on one salary. Materialism has become more important then family and quality of life

2. Western indoctrination that suggests a woman who does not work and contribute financially is a drain on the household and lacks independence. Marriage is about co dependence. You putting the food on the table and a roof over your heads. Her looking after the kids and managing the home. You cannot despise feminism in one breath while lauding "womens independence" in another. They day she has kids is the day she stops work if she can.

I have no desire to get married unless its for children. There would be absolutely no reason to ever consider it for anything but that. I have also learned that career women are some of the worst **** on Gods green earth. I have had very few positive experiences with western career women. From a romantic and professional point of view.

My experiences suggest that while a womans expectations of her man are unrealistic I cant help but feel the majority of this **** could have been avoided in the first place if friends had qualified the women better and actually had a pair of balls in the relationship. I am hoping some of the more experienced guys could relate to that and tell me if I am seeing it correctly or if the state of marriage in the west really has deteriorated into what I am seeing.

Great post Harry.

You've noticed the dichotomy here. As you said so eloquently, you cant rail against feminism in one breath and then praise independent women without being contradictory.

This is NOT a dicsussion about feminism, because that misses the point. It's all too easy to blame these failed marriages on women, when in reality it seems pretty clear to me your mates never grew a sack and critically examined their motivations for marriage. No offense man, but that really is a sad lot of mates you have, at least in regards to women. Tragic, tragic stories.

I hope sosuavers can realize that there is not one Gold Standard Wife model that we all should strive for. Some of us may never want to get married. Guys like you and me are looking for a traditional-type wife, should we choose to get hitched. I value intellectual independence MUCH more than I value financial independence. In fact, like you, I would EXPECT my future wife to quit her job and care for the home and children. I'm not saying once children are in the picture she is forbidden to work, but her PRIMARY focus in life should be the keeper of the home and emotional well-being of the family. This is not an adversarial relationship, it's a TEAM. I want her to do things like accounting, shopping, caring for the children, and just day-to-day logistical stuff that frankly im not that good at!! I think it's an even, complementary trade. I WANT to be the breadwinner. I want to get up and go to work and be a respected member of my profession. I think it is totally reasonable for her to expect security from me in return.

The problem, I think, can be summed up in two parts:

1. Women want to have their cake and eat it too these days. Not only that, they EXPECT it. They expect to be able to be super-driven in the career world and for you to shoulder what are traditionally female roles, yet at the same time they expect YOU to work as well, and dont you dare question it. Which leads to point #2---

2. Men are AFRAID to put their fvcking foot down. They are AFRAID of offending, of displeasing, of qualifying a woman. They are AFRAID of feminine disapproval. They are AFRAID to say NO MA'AM. And, perhaps at the root of it, they fail to critically examine WHY they believe and act in such shameful ways with women.

It's not about big-ball macho-ism. It's about recognizing that there is a balance and men are SUPPOSED to be leaders. There is no shortage of women in this world. You may not be able to change the way one behaves, but you can always find another.

 

[ketostix]

The common denominator here is that while women are difficult the majority of my mates have been weaklings when it comes to women. They never lead, they tolerate way to much crap, they never really sewed their oats. While modern day women are difficult and unreliable I cannot help but think that the majority of these problems are the result of men not being men.

So a question for the older guys and those that have been/are married. As you have aged have you seen the same thing? How often are the marriages that end in divorce often the result of a guy who rushed into it or the result of a chap who really never had much control in the relationship IE: Respect? In your experience, would what I am seeing in my own social circle be congruent with what you have seen in the past?

I think these women and most women are bad apples. And no matter what one man does or doesn't do, these women will still be bad apples. One man cannot overturn what a whole society has done to create worthless women.

These women screen for guys they can use and manipulated though. So in a sense if you are "being a man", I think you might well avoid marrying this types of women because for the most part they won't settle down with a man who they know isn't going to be their sucker. You might not ever find a suitable wife but at least you won't become one of these divorced suckers.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Hooligan Harry,
I like your posts,mainly for their humility,their lack of arrogance,there is hope for you Harry.......You ask the question as to whether your experience with friends relationships is unique....I must say your experience does seem a little extreme,do you think that Blue Blues quote is relevent here?...My own experience:I came to Australia from Scotland 54 years ago.For three and a half years my Family lived in a Squalid Migrant Camp with about 90 other Families,I have lost contact with most of these people,but for twenty years or so their doings fuelled most conversations with my parents....Obviously keeping 90 such entities in your cortex is an impossibility,but scandal was so much relished and enjoyed in those days before television that juicy events such as divorce and affairs rarely went unnoticed,and believe me it is hard to keep your doings secret when only two sheets of Asbestos sheeting separate you from your neighbor....Can I say,as far as I remember,I think of those relationships only about five ended in divorce....having said that,maybe a third were in varying degrees unhappy,even miserable....looking at the last twenty years maybe slightly more than half the marriages and committed relationships,known to me have failed....that's about the National average...Interesting though,the survivors are all very happy,or at least contented,few have any sex life,but they muddle along with their hobbies and interests........Only marry for children or for support in failing health...If you find a good Woman,keep the relationship fresh and vibrant by not seeing overly much of her.

 

[Warrior74]

Yah dood. Totally getting to that age. When all those perfect marriages and shyt are finally falling apart. The first round of divorces begins. I know a lot of girls who picked a lot of weak men so they can control them. I got friends starting on their second marriage.

 

[Victory Unlimited]

Marriage, just like any other serious relationship commitment. is just like a see-saw: It needs both people involved to do their part to honor, nurture, and respect the commitment to keep it going.

All it takes is for one person to jump OUT of the relation-SHIP for it to capsize-----and as Hooligan pointed out in his original post, it's mostly the MEN who are caught by surprise.

The saddest news is that these types of torpedo hits sometimes occur long before men even get married. Many men ignore, or just entirely out of ignorance, FAIL to recognize the signs that they haven't properly "vetted" their relationship choices.

Most of the men I've known have allowed lust, loneliness, or hubris to blind them to the fact that they are walking directly into the line of fire. And because of that, many have lost their homes, their futures, and even their very lives. That what my whole thread: The Man Who Could Cheat Death! was all about.

A few quick things that I would recommend for men to help them avoid the kind of fate that Hooligan has spoken of (outside of choosing to NEVER get married), is to slow the fukk down...vett each woman you meet thoroughly before you even decide to DATE her exclusively...and NEVER make a marriage commitment while either one of you is still in the infatuation stage of the relationship.



Peace...one day.

 

[STR8UP]

You are correct in assigning blame to men as well as women. We can't blame women across the board for what's happening. Human nature is to see how much you can get away with. Men are supposed to be the "keepers of the gate". If the woman tries to overstep her bounds it is up to the man to put her in check.

That said, with the divorce laws favoring them, it's no wonder women have sense of entitlement and use it to their advantage.

 

[ketostix]

I absolutely could not take a woman's life savings and be able to live with myself while she went to go live in a sh1th0le. But women do it on a regular basis to the guy they once "loved." I still count as people the people that I don't love. Women don't seem to.

Some things you just decide for yourself. It isn't all society. It isn't all upbringing. Sometimes you just say hey this is what i think and this is the way i'm doing it and i don't care what anyone says because you have this big monkey brain that is able to perceive and think about all kinds of things it has never even experienced. Women are choosing to forego the 'right' thing or choose to not use their brain or are incapable or SOMETHING.

I'm not going to blame the victim.

I completely agree. If law and order broke down tomorrow, that doesn't give anyone a justification to suddenly start to loot, steal and kill. And you wouldn't blame the victim for being looted or what have you because they didn't stand guard 24/7 with an AR-15. You'd blame the perpetrator(s) and the society and system that broke down.

What is kind of amazing though is the percentage of women who choose not to do the "right" thing or even ever admit it.

 

[STR8UP]

Well, unfortunately for us men, we live in a society where it is accepted for a woman to "loot" and "steal". Doesn't mean that it's right, but that's the way it is.

 

[puma183]

Check out the following recent article about Lifetime Alimony on the American Bar Association Journal. Look at the reader-comments. Do you see a single female poster saying "yeah it is wrong"?

http://www.abajournal.com/magazine/til_death_do_us_pay/

That said we can hardly blame women for not walking away from this free-money being made available to them courtesy of modern-day Family Law. When free/consequence-free money is put in a platter in front of you, stolen or not, would you walk away from it?