Am I coming on too strong over text? Asking too soon for the date.

[Don Dark Horse]

Recently had 2 girls put off by asking them too soon for drinks, over text.

The first one I thought was really about it and said she could not make the day I proposed and offered 2 alternate nights. Silly me was a bit too accomodating and said yeah the first night works. Had I said that I'll be busy those nights probably would've been better, even if I wasn't busy. She texted the next day to say she just wants to be friends.

Second girl offered me her number after I asked her out in person for drinks. Then a few texts back and forth after saying hi, she asked how the rest of my night went and I said "I'll tell you over our drinks". Which she has now ghosted.

I am not one for beating around the bush talking a ton before asking for a date, I'll simply get to the point. However, It seems I am coming on too strong.
Am I going about this the wrong way?

 

[Dr.Suave]

U giving a "chasing" vibe. Be patient. Wait until u have several matches on Tinder/Bumble. Plan dates u would actually enjoy regardless of company. Triple book girls. If none cancels, go out with the hottest one and bail on the other girls. Rinse & repeat. This worked for me back when I was single.

 

[SH03C]

"I'll tell you over our drinks"

My perspective - you were too direct and could have been a bit smoother. It seemed anxious as well. I tend to provide feedback or some acknowledgment of the prior text with my response.

For instance, I would have phrased your response with “Last night was great. I’ll have to tell you about it sometime.”

By doing so you’re seeding the idea of an in person interaction and it gets her thinking. Lead on but don’t fulfill her ego. At some point you will circle back to a meet up, but it takes time. And when that time comes you’ll know her well enough to phrase it with enticement.

 

[DontThinkTwice]

Recently had 2 girls put off by asking them too soon for drinks, over text.

The first one I thought was really about it and said she could not make the day I proposed and offered 2 alternate nights. Silly me was a bit too accomodating and said yeah the first night works. Had I said that I'll be busy those nights probably would've been better, even if I wasn't busy. She texted the next day to say she just wants to be friends.

Second girl offered me her number after I asked her out in person for drinks. Then a few texts back and forth after saying hi, she asked how the rest of my night went and I said "I'll tell you over our drinks". Which she has now ghosted.

I am not one for beating around the bush talking a ton before asking for a date, I'll simply get to the point. However, It seems I am coming on too strong.
Am I going about this the wrong way?

I don't know if it was so bad you took the alternative night. I'm not a fan of pretending to be busy because then that puts the date off for a week and she forgets about you if only briefly met her initially or especially for OLD.

Agree with poster. With the second girl you came off grumpy or mean. You can rephrase it as: "How about I tell you about it over drinks tomorrow night?"

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

Granted I’m pursuing women of a different generation, but after an initial back and forth I ask if we can chat on the phone, once you can talk to them and things go well you can ask about meeting. That works for me almost 90% of the time.

 

[Black Widow Void]

The first one I thought was really about it and said she could not make the day I proposed and offered 2 alternate nights. Silly me was a bit too accomodating and said yeah the first night works. Had I said that I'll be busy those nights probably would've been better, even if I wasn't busy. She texted the next day to say she just wants to be friends.

It's likely that either she met someone before making the LJBF response, or she's just after attention and nothing more. I don't see anything that you did wrong here.

Second girl offered me her number after I asked her out in person for drinks. Then a few texts back and forth after saying hi, she asked how the rest of my night went and I said "I'll tell you over our drinks". Which she has now ghosted.

Although it's better to be assertive than passive, this also requires a little finesse. I'm thinking that you could have warmed her up a little - before attempting to close the deal.

 

[derby1]

you havent done anything wrong OP,

"Princess is, and always was in other castle", considered cheating and decided against it.

youll probably see them out and about within 3 weeks. and to rub salt in your mind, he will be a beer belly, beta male with no smooth skills

 

[EyeBRollin]

You need some refinement.

Taking a counter offer is fine just nail down a direct day and time.

2nd girl did you even get the date locked in?

 

[RobbyDog]

I think you’re overthinking this OP. There could be a thousand reasons why these chicks went cold…another dude came along, she wants attention, has a boyfriend…. Men tend to think it’s always our fault in these situations but it’s not always. Remember it’s a numbers game, so put your energy into meeting more women instead of analyzing to death what you might have done wrong.
I usually call first to help build connection and comfort, then ask her out. I find if I can’t even get her on the phone, it’s usually useless to try asking her out.
I tend to ask out pretty early in the interaction. Women tend to appreciate a man who is direct and decisive, who pursues what he wants. Also this weeds out LI attention wh*res early in the process so they don’t waste your time.

 

[Barrister]

Recently had 2 girls put off by asking them too soon for drinks, over text.

The first one I thought was really about it and said she could not make the day I proposed and offered 2 alternate nights. Silly me was a bit too accomodating and said yeah the first night works. Had I said that I'll be busy those nights probably would've been better, even if I wasn't busy. She texted the next day to say she just wants to be friends.

Second girl offered me her number after I asked her out in person for drinks. Then a few texts back and forth after saying hi, she asked how the rest of my night went and I said "I'll tell you over our drinks". Which she has now ghosted.

I am not one for beating around the bush talking a ton before asking for a date, I'll simply get to the point. However, It seems I am coming on too strong.
Am I going about this the wrong way?

It is hard to know whether you coming off too strong just based upon what you are saying. As far as your belief that your acceptance of her counter was somehow detrimental - I wouldn't think that way. This is one those rules here that is in place for beginner's who are too eager with women - for them it is smart to help curb some enthusiasm with a black and white rule such as "never accept the first counter-offer." But I highly doubt your agreement to her counter-offer suddenly drastically changed how she felt about you.

 

[Don Dark Horse]

For instance, I would have phrased your response with “Last night was great. I’ll have to tell you about it sometime.”

By doing so you’re seeding the idea of an in person interaction and it gets her thinking.

This would've been a lot better. Thanks mate.

I don't know if it was so bad you took the alternative night. I'm not a fan of pretending to be busy because then that puts the date off for a week and she forgets about you if only briefly met her initially or especially for OLD.

Agree with poster. With the second girl you came off grumpy or mean. You can rephrase it as: "How about I tell you about it over drinks tomorrow night?"

I was thinking the same regarding the first girl. And she seemed like she was interested until the following day when she claimed she did not have time this semester to pursue anything romantically. She said she was still keen to go for a yoga class with me tho, and I said sure that sounds great, and to let me know when. She texted back that she was glad I'd still like to go and that she will let me know in the next week or 2 (i left this message on read). I personally am of the mind to not text her until she texts me, but I dno. Some girls are interested and still wait for that text from the guy regardless. This girl is no stranger to me and we met up for coffee the week prior to these texts.

Btw, girl 2 I just left it after she ghosted.

It's likely that either she met someone before making the LJBF response, or she's just after attention and nothing more. I don't see anything that you did wrong here.

Although it's better to be assertive than passive, this also requires a little finesse. I'm thinking that you could have warmed her up a little - before attempting to close the deal.

Yeah, it's possible. She could've met someone the weekend after we had coffee, who knows. Yet she studies actuarial science and genuinely is concerned about her time. I spoke about that above.

I do agree, the other convo required a little finesse that was not there.

 

[Don Dark Horse]

you havent done anything wrong OP,

"Princess is, and always was in other castle", considered cheating and decided against it.

youll probably see them out and about within 3 weeks. and to rub salt in your mind, he will be a beer belly, beta male with no smooth skills

haha thank you derby, always enjoy your responses.

You need some refinement.

Taking a counter offer is fine just nail down a direct day and time.

2nd girl did you even get the date locked in?

2nd lady ghosted after that text. I could see it coming as soon as got no response within the first few mins. We were going back and forth for a few mins. She had sent a VN to me and I sent that text back.

I think you’re overthinking this OP. There could be a thousand reasons why these chicks went cold…another dude came along, she wants attention, has a boyfriend…. Men tend to think it’s always our fault in these situations but it’s not always. Remember it’s a numbers game, so put your energy into meeting more women instead of analyzing to death what you might have done wrong.
I usually call first to help build connection and comfort, then ask her out. I find if I can’t even get her on the phone, it’s usually useless to try asking her out.
I tend to ask out pretty early in the interaction. Women tend to appreciate a man who is direct and decisive, who pursues what he wants. Also this weeds out LI attention wh*res early in the process so they don’t waste your time.

Could not agree more with you Robby. That day I was definitely overthinking it, a pointless exercise. I am also of the mind to ask out early on to weed out time-wasting attention seekers, of which there are loads.

It is hard to know whether you coming off too strong just based upon what you are saying. As far as your belief that your acceptance of her counter was somehow detrimental - I wouldn't think that way. This is one those rules here that is in place for beginner's who are too eager with women - for them it is smart to help curb some enthusiasm with a black and white rule such as "never accept the first counter-offer." But I highly doubt your agreement to her counter-offer suddenly drastically changed how she felt about you.

Thanks for this response

 

[2Rocky]

Don't get in your head about it. I think women have so many options that they overschedule themselves out of FOMO.

 

[Anti-Simp Equation]

I guarantee you these 2 chicks you’re writing about aren’t thinking about this. They could care less. The “texting too much” topic has been talked about to the point of exhaustion.

To answer the question though, I don’t think you scared them. Getting to the point is what a man should do. All these cookie-cutter Q&As with a chick is predictable and boring. They heard it all before. You getting to the point didn’t scare them, they probably just weren’t digging you to begin with. If Steph Curry would’ve did the same as you, they would’ve replied before he put his phone down.

It’s all good though. Don’t chase, attract.

 

[Bigpapa]

I guarantee you these 2 chicks you’re writing about aren’t thinking about this. They could care less. The “texting too much” topic has been talked about to the point of exhaustion.

To answer the question though, I don’t think you scared them. Getting to the point is what a man should do. All these cookie-cutter Q&As with a chick is predictable and boring. They heard it all before. You getting to the point didn’t scare them, they probably just weren’t digging you to begin with. If Steph Curry would’ve did the same as you, they would’ve replied before he put his phone down.

It’s all good though. Don’t chase, attract.

the only thing that he did wrong was being too direct , when he should have been not direct about his intentions and warm them up

Mainly because the girls were not as hooked into him , as he was into them

this is the Main thing that guys get wrong , they are blunt

bluntness only works when she is hooked , otherwise this will happen most of the times , and I guarantee that some of them would have had their ass tapped by the op

 

[darksprezzatura]

Keep your options open.

Investment low and numbers high.

Anything other than a yes is a NO.

Ghost for a few weeks if they say they're busy.

If they ghost, block and next.

Plan your own activities, invite whoever you find interesting/vibe with.

Invite multiple women and flake on all but the highest enthusiasm one.

My conversion rate is abysmal, I approach indirectly like a hundred girls, sleep with 5-7.

Once they sleep with me, they orbit me for years.

I have availability of 5-7 every week and have a stable rotation. If they all crash, I'll approach a hundred more.

I have limited time so I call over 2-3 girls a week, the rest need to wait their turn.

Better yet, I'll focus on getting leaner, fitter, richer and acquire more skills/hobbies.

Sometimes I'm sick of sex and just wanna read a book. Take it easy mate.

 

[RobbyDog]

haha thank you derby, always enjoy your responses.


2nd lady ghosted after that text. I could see it coming as soon as got no response within the first few mins. We were going back and forth for a few mins. She had sent a VN to me and I sent that text back.


Could not agree more with you Robby. That day I was definitely overthinking it, a pointless exercise. I am also of the mind to ask out early on to weed out time-wasting attention seekers, of which there are loads.


Thanks for this response

Happens to us all. Women will keep talking at first, stringing a guy along for attention or for a backup plan only to poof! disappear when she finally locks down the dude she REALLY wants. I am still learning to recognize the signs of this myself. I believe the important thing is to immediately remove attention at the first sign of non compliance

 

[DontThinkTwice]

@Don Dark Horse Why are you carrying on as friends with the first girl? Men and women can't be real friends. And it's even worse off when you start off on a romantic note with the girl. She loses respect for you because you are giving up your want for sex (that she knows you have) to be just friends.

Another note is sometimes you swing and you miss with a girl, but if you stick to your guns you want something romantic, she respects you more. Then you meet her at a party or a bar, again, or she sees you on Tinder, and you get a second up to bat to show your value. This happened to me recently and I hooked up with a girl for a couple months that had previously rejected me.

Here's Rollo's take on male-female friendships. https://therationalmale.com/2011/11/30/intergender-friendship/

 

[SW15]

Granted I’m pursuing women of a different generation, but after an initial back and forth I ask if we can chat on the phone, once you can talk to them and things go well you can ask about meeting. That works for me almost 90% of the time.

In a way, you're fortunate. I'm guessing you are dealing primarily with Gen X women. You're also likely dealing with the first half of Gen X (1965-1974 births).

I'm an early Millennial and deal mainly with earlier Millennials. For the past decade or so, I've been dealing with 1983-1990 born women.

Women born from 1983-1990 are difficult to get on the phone initially but it's possible. During the 2010s, I learned to eliminate the smartphone as much as possible from interactions, particularly in the early stages. I ask women out in person and only get their numbers after they've agreed to a date. I see no point in having a number if I don't have a date already.

@Pierce.Manhammer -- Your tactic would work well if you got a number without an agreed upon date.

Second girl offered me her number after I asked her out in person for drinks. Then a few texts back and forth after saying hi, she asked how the rest of my night went and I said "I'll tell you over our drinks". Which she has now ghosted.

It's good you are doing in-person approaches, asked someone out in-person, and got a number in-person. Ghosts/flakes will happen from that. I've had that happen. It stinks but it is a part of it. You do want to have active strategies to reduce ghosting percentages but it can't fully be eliminated.

Men and women can't be real friends. And it's even worse off when you start off on a romantic note with the girl. She loses respect for you because you are giving up your want for sex (that she knows you have) to be just friends.

Another note is sometimes you swing and you miss with a girl, but if you stick to your guns you want something romantic, she respects you more. Then you meet her at a party or a bar, again, or she sees you on Tinder, and you get a second up to bat to show your value. This happened to me recently and I hooked up with a girl for a couple months that had previously rejected me.

Here's Rollo's take on male-female friendships. https://therationalmale.com/2011/11/30/intergender-friendship/

I agree that men and women can't be real friends. It's possible to have female acquaintances and be on good terms with them. Female friendships are generally a bad idea, especially when forming them in adulthood and after college graduation (for those that attend college). The best female acquaintances are the ones you've known since before puberty and this only happens when you stay in the same geographic area for decades. I moved to my current city in my late 20s.

I may have done a lot of things wrong over the past 20+ years, but the one thing I've not done wrong is female friendship. Simply put, I have no female friends in my local area. Right now, I have legitimate female friend but she lives in another city and I've never been physically attracted to her. I rate her a "5".

The downside of not keeping female friends is that you will have fewer opportunities for social circle setups. As I have shown before, social circle setups have been declining since ~1990 but they still comprise a decent amount of longer term relationships. I've known men who have lived on their social circle setups for most of their dating lives. These types of men typically aren't on SoSuave because they don't need to be. The men I know who fit this description barely ever have approached strangers to get dates.

Social circle is tough. It takes years to develop a social circle that is capable of producing introductions for dates. Some men simply aren't capable of having one for a variety of reasons and some reason aren't at all a reflection of his level of social skill. Frequent relocations are a common reason for not having a good circle.

I agree to not budging from desires for romance with a particular woman. In most instances, it will kill off the interaction but there is the occasional instance that @DontThinkTwice brings up where it can benefit you.

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

Obviously, I do not discriminate, but most women I deal with are 40-55 - my days of working over coeds are pretty much done, but not long gone. As far as "getting the number" in OLD (which is mostly what I'm speaking of) it's done well before "the date" and is part of the vetting process for me. I'm able to weed out the non-compliant this way as well. My time is precious to me and I can multi-task while dealing with multiple potential targets this way. If I get a woman to "the date" using the process as described I stand a 95% chance of an FNL or SNL. Thank you for your reply.

In a way, you're fortunate. I'm guessing you are dealing primarily with Gen X women. You're also likely dealing with the first half of Gen X (1965-1974 births).

I'm an early Millennial and deal mainly with earlier Millennials. For the past decade or so, I've been dealing with 1983-1990 born women.

Women born from 1983-1990 are difficult to get on the phone initially but it's possible. During the 2010s, I learned to eliminate the smartphone as much as possible from interactions, particularly in the early stages. I ask women out in person and only get their numbers after they've agreed to a date. I see no point in having a number if I don't have a date already.

@Pierce.Manhammer -- Your tactic would work well if you got a number without an agreed upon date.