Am I being paranoid? Taking a lot of heat from friends and family for this.

EastWind

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This is about a girl that's in our online gaming group (no clan, just a group of people who play online on a regular basis in their spare time, my sister is in it, her ex, her current BF, we all get along, it's fun, I know half the people personally... none of that "15yo kiddies clan" crap. We're all adults.)

We never talked much, I was always my playful self. I don't invest in any online guy-girl relationships on principle. One day I complimented a picture she put up on facebook, and I did it because I genuinely thought it was a nice picture. Just "Hey, you look great in that picture."

We got to talk a bit, but nothing special. Then we met when we had another meet-up of a few people in our group, and we met, got along just fine, even great, she seemed into me. My views on long-distance relationships are well-known in that group (they don't exist). Some kissing but she wouldn't even go for the tongue and kept saying "that's all you'll get" in a playful tone. Ground up against me a lot after she had a few drinks in the club, but still no tongue.

Now, for a while now and due to all the crap I've had to deal with from women, I've adopted a no-bull**** approach to all this, and when a girl pulls that one on me, I just drop the **** out.

She "fell into" my bed one night we'd all had a lot to drink, I woke up but just kept on sleeping because I couldn't be bothered after what she'd said.

So the meeting is over, we all drive back home, she keeps messaging me, I stay just as before, and reports get in from my sister and the other people that she's asking about me and really into me. Apparently she told a few people that for her sex outside a relationship is a no-go.

One night she wants to "talk about it all".

It's interesting how not long ago I would've not talked about these things on principle, because "talking about it all" can kill all your chances. I found that I didn't care and because I didn't care, I could just do whatever I wanted. It's not that I didn't care about it working with her specifically, just that state when you know the world is full of women and that if this one doesn't work the way you want, well, your life will be just the same...

I make it perfectly clear to her in that conversation that I a) do not want, or believe in, any kind of long-distance relationship, b) will not, under any circumstances, move to where she lives, not even close, because I love the south of Germany and this is where I want to live (she lives more in the north) and c) will not be in a relationship with a smoker.

Her comment on c) is "well the smoking bit can be changed" (it being clear that she means her smoking, not my view on it...)

She doesn't even tries to argue one bit, just sounds disappointed, I tell her it's not that easy for me because I do like her, but hey, that's life for you. We talk a bit more, and she drops "well for us to have sex you'd have to be in a relationship" and I go "Well, see, this solves our problem, because I don't enter a relationship without sex." She sounds taken aback, tries to argue, then says, quite sourly: "I have to go and meet some friends." Later, my friends tell me she told she'd gone to drown her frustration.

Ok, so, getting to the point: she asked if she could visit me, I said, weeeeell, if I can find the time... I can fit you in there (at the time it was unclear whether I'd need to have my tonsils removed). She books tickets. This is due to be next week.

Now, I'm a bit confused. She knows my views on LDR and on everything else. My sister tells me she messaged her after the "big talk" telling her how she couldn't get me out of her head, blabla, all that crap. Apparently she's thinking about joining the army, and the army has a university in Munich, where I live, so she could come live in Munich... apparently because of me. And because nothing is holding her back in her home town. She's working behind the counter trying to find a new job "behind a desk" somewhere.

All this time I'd been asking myself why this girl, who's met me for just three days, would come halfway across Germany just to see me. Everyone keeps telling me she just likes me, my sister says she did the same for her boyfriend (they are in a LDR...), bla bla yadda yadda.

We, here, know it doesn't work that way. And today it hits me: She probably just wants to get a first look at Munich and I'm being the ****ing free hotel.

I run this idea by my friend and he just calls me an idiot. What is so hard to believe about this girl just liking you, he says?

Am I just being paranoid? Not only about this broad, but about women in general? My past experiences have told me that there's no free lunch in this business, you have to work damned hard to find something good (even if "working hard" is just "filtering" a lot, which is work in itself.) So my instincts tell me there's something here which can't be good, which I need to watch out for.

Views?
 

SgtSplacker

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Youre an idiot, she just likes you man. Stop complicating things. Let love happen.... in your bed. Then let her go to her life and you to yours and stay friends until next time.... ahh the bliss! Stop being weird....
 

Desdinova

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If she wanted a free pass, she'd be buying you 5hit, using her tongue, and maybe even fvcking you.

She's highly attracted to you. She's deemed you as an incredible catch, and she's trying to figure out how to be with you. Since you won't budge, she's trying to alter her own situation to be with you.

She might be a bit insecure and have LSE which is something you'll need to watch out for. Regardless, she is genuinely attracted to you.

You have control of this symphony, and you may conduct it any way you wish.
 

Zodiac

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Even if she isn't using you for the free peek at Munich she is at least either attaches quickly or as evidenced by the fact she has a "boyfriend" already she isn't above having more than one "bf" at a time if she really "likes" you which should be a red flag of how things might become. Tread very carefully man as this seems like it will get ugly REALLY fast.
 

Die Hard

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This situation is a DISASTER ZONE and you need to get out right now.

Look, this woman is clearly a nutjob and you are clearly someone with a tendency to get involved with nutjobs. Well, This is your chance to grow beyond that tendency... You need to reallize that you deserve better than these psycho bytches and this kind of sick drama.

My take is that you're projecting the unhealthy relationship and interaction between you and your mom onto bytches like these. It's time for you to grow beyond all this dysfunctional bullsh!t, my man...

Put this fvcked up situation behind you and don't look back. Then go find yourself a NORMAL woman and get into a NORMAL interaction process with her.
 

EastWind

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Die Hard said:
This situation is a DISASTER ZONE and you need to get out right now.

Look, this woman is clearly a nutjob and you are clearly someone with a tendency to get involved with nutjobs. Well, This is your chance to grow beyond that tendency... You need to reallize that you deserve better than these psycho bytches and this kind of sick drama.

My take is that you're projecting the unhealthy relationship and interaction between you and your mom onto bytches like these. It's time for you to grow beyond all this dysfunctional bullsh!t, my man...

Put this fvcked up situation behind you and don't look back. Then go find yourself a NORMAL woman and get into a NORMAL interaction process with her.
... OK, with a stance like that, you're going to need to provide a bit of explanation.

Also, the relationship and interaction between my mom and I were quite healthy, thank you...

Desdinova said:
If she wanted a free pass, she'd be buying you 5hit, using her tongue, and maybe even fvcking you.

She's highly attracted to you. She's deemed you as an incredible catch, and she's trying to figure out how to be with you. Since you won't budge, she's trying to alter her own situation to be with you.

She might be a bit insecure and have LSE which is something you'll need to watch out for. Regardless, she is genuinely attracted to you.

You have control of this symphony, and you may conduct it any way you wish.
That sounds very nice... I'm just not used to things going well, I'd even say I don't think they go well. Ever. Soooooo... it just seems fishy, all. I guess wait and see..

But, really, I was asking if I'm being paranoid. On the side.
 

Desdinova

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EastWind said:
That sounds very nice... I'm just not used to things going well, I'd even say I don't think they go well. Ever. Soooooo... it just seems fishy, all. I guess wait and see..
Sometimes you have to work for what you want, and sometimes things just go surprisingly well. There's nothing wrong with a woman being genuinely attracted to you.
 

Die Hard

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EastWind said:
... OK, with a stance like that, you're going to need to provide a bit of explanation.
I think you need no explanation at all, you are perfectly able to connect the dots by yourself. Your ability to connect the dots is not the problem, your willingness is...

Also, the relationship and interaction between my mom and I were quite healthy, thank you...
Sure, they were probably quite healthy in many regards. In other, very fundamental regards, they were quite dysfunctional. If you're not prepared to accept that, I'm afraid you will forever remain a prisoner of that inner belief you spoke of:
I'm just not used to things going well, I'd even say I don't think they go well. Ever.
You're not paranoid. You are a victim of your upbringing.
 

Slickster

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Easty you seem to overanalyze things to death here.

Other than playing Dungeons and Dragons, online, with your girlfriend, her ex, her bf, and your sister, everything is good here.

All I'm seeing are green lights.

Don't take things (and yourself) so seriously. You barely know this girl.

Having fun is ALL that is required at this point. Let the cards fall as they may.
 

Scaramouche

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Dear East Wind,
I guess you are very young,we need your age....You write the Queens own,as good as any native speaker,so are you an Expat?...German Women are the easiest girls to lay that I know of,very good at it too,so where are you hiding?....You are being far too introspective,probably on your own too much,intellectualising things way out of proportion...At a guess you are a lonely Student?
So Long distance Relationships?.....In general for a Man like you,who needs constant reassurrance,such situations are almost a form of torture....When you meet it is Heaven for a stolen Weekend,good stuff if you have a few Plates to provide distraction when she is absent,if you are moping and pining in her absense you will say and do rash things,that you may well regret later...Whatever you do,don't let her get her knees under your table,you hardly know her....
Learn to Dance,this is a popular recreation in Germany almost as good as England...Get your arms around a Few of these Buxom Fraulines,they are Hot Cartoffels Mate.
 

EastWind

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Scaramouche said:
Dear East Wind,
I guess you are very young,we need your age....You write the Queens own,as good as any native speaker,so are you an Expat?...German Women are the easiest girls to lay that I know of,very good at it too,so where are you hiding?....You are being far too introspective,probably on your own too much,intellectualising things way out of proportion...At a guess you are a lonely Student?
So Long distance Relationships?.....In general for a Man like you,who needs constant reassurrance,such situations are almost a form of torture....When you meet it is Heaven for a stolen Weekend,good stuff if you have a few Plates to provide distraction when she is absent,if you are moping and pining in her absense you will say and do rash things,that you may well regret later...Whatever you do,don't let her get her knees under your table,you hardly know her....
Learn to Dance,this is a popular recreation in Germany almost as good as England...Get your arms around a Few of these Buxom Fraulines,they are Hot Cartoffels Mate.
Hey Scaramouche,

no, not an ex-pat, just had the good fortune of some decent English teachers and a lot of practice. I'm actually part German and French. And I'm 24. Forgive me for not posting in the DJ Discussion forum, but that place is a wreck these days... and this forum is about the last place for some actual advice.

Keep in mind I was asking about whether I'm being paranoid here... I'm not too fussed about the whole "handling the girl" part, really. I feel that I'm on decent footing there, it's just that after a lot of crap that has happened to me I'm sometimes not sure if I'm seeing things that aren't there... good and bad.

So, thank you for your advice. You will see in my post that I'm quite outspoken against LDRs and am not considering one. I'm open to meeting this girl, but she knows the only way she'll ever have a shot at being with me is by moving to Munich. So we're getting to know each other. I have a few girls on the side, nothing too serious, but enough, I hope, to keep me from making any rash mistakes.

Also, about the whole "german girls are the easiest to lay" business: I've had the exact same experience, only with american chicks. Then again, these were american broads in Germany, I guess they're on a different MO here...

Oh, and, I've been taking dancing lessons for a year now. Easily the most fun I've had in a long time.

To the rest of the posters, thank you for your input aswell!

P.S. this chick did a cardboard model of a 1-up mushroom as an art project in school back in her days, complete with accurate green paint and yellow ? box. What's not to love about that, I ask?
 

Zunder

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The are two possible scenarios:
A) She is a nutjob - as per Diehards assertion.
B) We are so conditioned to women not showing interest in us so quick these days. She is normal, perhaps a little needy, but a decent girl.

So which is it?
Who fvcking knows. Its up to you if you roll the dice or not.
 

Die Hard

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Let me give you the bad signs:

* You’re over overanalyzing, writing all these long ass posts on here about some bytch who’s messing with your mind. Basically you are investing WAY too much energy in this situation. UNHEALTHY…

* The kissing thing, her not giving her tongue and all that... When someone takes teasing too far and overdoes it, that’s a sign of mental problems: low self esteem, emotional instability etc. Teasing, is saying “that’s all you gonna get” during a make out session, making you chase after it and then finally giving it to you, DURING THE SAME MAKE OUT SESSION. When she doesn’t finally give it to you during that make out session, the “teasing” is going beyond reasonable limits and is actually a sign of mental problems like low self esteem, emotional instability etc. It's a habit often displayed by BPD's.

* The aftermath of the kissing thing. Her “teasing” felt like a rejection to you… So when she ended up in your bed, you decided not to pursue anything out of fear to get rejected again. Basically, you were unwilling to show your desire for her, coz it would leave you exposed for another rejection by her. This situation right here is fvcked up… A woman tapping into your fear of rejection, messing with your ego, messing with your self esteem, messing with your emotions etc. TO SUCH AN EXTENT that you won’t pursue her when she’s in your bed (where the normal thing to do when a woman ends up in your bed, is try to fvck her brains out!!). That’s messed up… Situations like these, you need to pull the EJECT button and NEXT her ass right away.

* Her being so crazy over you after barely getting to know you. What the fvck? She’s actually considering to move to your part of the country to be with you after 3 meetings? ENORMOUS RED FLAG.

* Two people totally getting ahead of themselves in some ridiculous conversation. You actually discussed with her whether you’re prepared to move to where she lives! WHO IS THIS GIRL??? Some nutjob you met over playing World of Warcraft (or whatever game you play). You barely know each other! And you actually discussed the option of being in an LTR…after meeting her 3 times? Seriously?!


Like I said in my earlier post, this situation is a DISASTER ZONE. She has lots of issues and to be honest, you have issues too. I’m not being judgmental, just stating my observations…

People with issues often tend to “find” each other and get involved in unhealthy, dysfunctional relationships together. Ending up in such relationships will not make you happy, it will keep you from growing as a person, it will keep your issues alive, basically keep you from all that good sh!t that SoSuave is all about.

Your mind got caught up in this unhealthy situation way too deep already. Get the fvck out.
 

Alle_Gory

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EastWind said:
All this time I'd been asking myself why this girl, who's met me for just three days, would come halfway across Germany just to see me. Everyone keeps telling me she just likes me, my sister says she did the same for her boyfriend (they are in a LDR...), bla bla yadda yadda.

We, here, know it doesn't work that way. And today it hits me: She probably just wants to get a first look at Munich and I'm being the ****ing free hotel.

I run this idea by my friend and he just calls me an idiot. What is so hard to believe about this girl just liking you, he says?
Answer: When people like you and when they want something from you they can act almost the same. Now how do you separate the two? How can you be sure she's not using you? You give her the opportunity and see how she reacts.

Take her to dinner/supper/someplace a couple of times, a more expensive place is ideal but cheap enough that she should be comfortable putting up the cash. See if she offers to pay. Don't explicitly ask her out, just say "I'm hungry/bored/whatever and I'm going out, want to come along?"

And then observe, does she offer to pay or will she take advantage of your charity?

Am I just being paranoid? Not only about this broad, but about women in general? My past experiences have told me that there's no free lunch in this business, you have to work damned hard to find something good (even if "working hard" is just "filtering" a lot, which is work in itself.) So my instincts tell me there's something here which can't be good, which I need to watch out for.

Views?
That's a good stance to take, don't take anything for free or anything for granted. Now you just have to separate the truth from the bull without scaring off the girl, it must be done in a subtle manner. Like women "test" men, but in a more passive and laid back way.
 

Masculinity

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Don't feed the troll.
 

Alle_Gory

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Die Hard said:
* You’re over overanalyzing, writing all these long ass posts on here about some bytch who’s messing with your mind. Basically you are investing WAY too much energy in this situation. UNHEALTHY…
Yes.

* The kissing thing, her not giving her tongue and all that... When someone takes teasing too far and overdoes it, that’s a sign of mental problems: low self esteem, emotional instability etc. Teasing, is saying “that’s all you gonna get” during a make out session, making you chase after it and then finally giving it to you, DURING THE SAME MAKE OUT SESSION. When she doesn’t finally give it to you during that make out session, the “teasing” is going beyond reasonable limits and is actually a sign of mental problems like low self esteem, emotional instability etc. It's a habit often displayed by BPD's.
Maybe.

* The aftermath of the kissing thing. Her “teasing” felt like a rejection to you… So when she ended up in your bed, you decided not to pursue anything out of fear to get rejected again. Basically, you were unwilling to show your desire for her, coz it would leave you exposed for another rejection by her. This situation right here is fvcked up… A woman tapping into your fear of rejection, messing with your ego, messing with your self esteem, messing with your emotions etc. TO SUCH AN EXTENT that you won’t pursue her when she’s in your bed (where the normal thing to do when a woman ends up in your bed, is try to fvck her brains out!!). That’s messed up… Situations like these, you need to pull the EJECT button and NEXT her ass right away.
Maybe.

* Her being so crazy over you after barely getting to know you. What the fvck? She’s actually considering to move to your part of the country to be with you after 3 meetings? ENORMOUS RED FLAG.
No. I completely disagree with this. We don't know enough about the situation or about the girl and the OPs relationship so far. We need to know more before assuming this.

* Two people totally getting ahead of themselves in some ridiculous conversation. You actually discussed with her whether you’re prepared to move to where she lives! WHO IS THIS GIRL??? Some nutjob you met over playing World of Warcraft (or whatever game you play). You barely know each other! And you actually discussed the option of being in an LTR…after meeting her 3 times? Seriously?!
I agree with part one, but again we don't know the depth and length of their relationship to one another.

Your mind got caught up in this unhealthy situation way too deep already. Get the fvck out.
I'll agree this isn't the way to start out things or continue them. It might not be too late but the guy really has to realize his mistakes and change course before he causes more damage. This is NOT the way to handle either a short or a long term relationship with a girl. If things ever degrade to this point it's because of you, or it's because of her or both. Someone is broken and someone fvcked up. It doesn't help to blame, but you need to remove yourself and have a healthy stable relationship with a normal girl... the closest you can get to normal.

1) Don't ever over analyze. You have contingency plans. If she's crazy you pull out, if she's normal you visit her parents for dinner next week. A man has a backup plan because you can never know. You shouldn't act on your plan without facts first.

2) Don't ever verbalize your intentions with anyone for anything. Women, work, sports, chess.... it's the dumbest thing and ruins the surprise and people have a chance to act against you before you do anything. DON'T EVER TALK ABOUT YOUR PLANS.

3) Don't ever get so swept up in all this nonsense. Let the woman react and vent, she will tell you more if you're relaxed and observant than if you're trying to extract information from her. Women talk to anyone who will listen and let their guard down. You can see people for who they really are if you make them comfortable and allow them to be themselves. If she's crazy, let her show you that and just how much. Just give her a chance to.

Take her out to dinner, do some nice things for her maybe a massage, give her a glass of wine and have a nice place to sit down and relax. Ask some open ended questions like "oh how come?" and "oh wow, i didn't realize, why is that?" and "how did that happen?"... like that. And then prepare for the garbage to come out of her mouth. It might not happen the first time, so patience and don't ever judge.
 

EastWind

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Die Hard. You will find this hard to believe because you sound like someone who makes up his mind quite fast and then sticks to it:

I did not make a move on her not because I was afraid of rejection, but because I couldn't be arsed. Girl rejects my advances in no uncertain terms only to drop into my bed? Sleep is my priority then, and sleep I did. I felt no regret, no shame and no fear. Believe it or not.

If you will notice, I was NOT asking "DO YOU THINK SHE REALLY LIKES ME?" or "WHAT DOES IT MEAN IF SHE ACTS LIKE THIS?". I don't really care about the answers to those questions. I'm not listening to what she says, I'm looking at what she does, which is message me all the time, write me sweet things and try to visit me. And I will see what happens. I can damn well deal with whatever will happen.

My original question related to whether or not I was being paranoid about a girl wanting to meet up across half a country after meeting me once. Discussion the finer points of this girl's behaviour is a nice plus, but really, I'm not worried about that too much.

As for "discussing the option to be in an LTR" with her; she is part of a larger group of people I enjoy spending time with, so it was in my best and honest interest to defuse a probable trainwreck situation in which she built up unrequited feelings and expectations by being bloody upfront and honest about everything and FRAMING THE SETTING. I see no harm in that.

It is not my usual MO to discuss LTR options with girls I just met. It is, however, to prevent bull**** from blowing up my relaxation circles. I would behave no different to a girl in person, except maybe I'd show more through my actions than my words, which is difficult online.

As Zunder said, we are all so used to having to wade through wave after wave of girl's bullcrap that when something works out our way we feel something is wrong.

Part of being a DJ, I'm told, is filtering out time-wasters and dramaqueens before they cause us any harm.

A further part, I'm told aswell, is taking chances.
 

joverby

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A normal healthy chick wouldn't need a boyfriend that she had to travel across the country to see, you shouldn't need a chick like that either. I only met one chick(I met at training from work) who wanted me to go move over there after barely knowing me, and described all the nasty things she'd let me do to her, and she was fvcked up in the head.

What were you trying to get from this chick? You were really throwing a fit over her not giving you tongue so you didn't fvck her? That seems stupid to me. I would much rather fvck her than make-out with tongue.

You seem to know a lot yourself and already have your own mind made up, so why come here and share this? I personally think it's not a good idea to have one and would rather have a chick that lives < 30 minutes away from me.

But if you want to try it, do it. What do you have to lose?
 

Die Hard

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Well, can't help someone who doesn't want help... So I'll just answer your original question and wish you all the best.

No, you're not being paranoid.
 
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