Advice on how to overcome some shi..y feelings

[Marc_zeus]

Hello to you all. I have two related questions and i would really appreciate your view and advice on how to handle failure with promiscuous lower quality girls.
First a bit of information about myself. I am 35 y.o. ,not merried, 6,2" height, i hit a gym 3 times per week so i have very athletic body ( some of my female friends even tell me that i look pretty attractive and i could easily pass as 26-27 y.o.), and i am a lawyer. I live in eastern europe so i am not some tv shows and movies insanely rich lawyer but i live ok. In last few years i was in 2 ltmr, so i am not dj buy any means but i strive to become one. Anyway, few days ago at some house party my friend introduce me to this really hot girl ( 20 y.o. ), but as i sad earlier we live in fairly small town so i know she is the "easy" girl. Yesterday i met her on the street and she stoped me and initiate a conversation. 3-4 minutes in, i sad i was in a hurry and had to go ( i really was ), but that i would like to see her again. Convo
Me: I have to go, but why dont you give me your number, so we could grab some drinks later this week?
Her: My number? Are you asking me out?
Me: (with laser eye contact and smirk on my face ) Yes i am.
Her: Why are you asking me out? I am so much younger than you, you could be my father.
At this moment my ego was shattered in milion pieces, but i remain my composure.
Me: (again with good eye contact and smirk ) lucky for me i am not your father, so how about that number? ( putting my phone in front of her )
Her: ( sounding offended ) OMG, no, i have to go, buy !!
This is the girl who sometimes go out in clubs alone, waiting for someone to pick her up. I know some of hers previous lovers ( i am not talking about boyfriends, but hook up guys ), and i know that i will sound arrogant but they are both physically and mentaly less attractive than me, and when i say mentaly i mean they have apsolutely zero game, lack in conversational skills, bad posture and body language, no sense of humor, but somehow they succeded in taking her to bed, and i get the " father" line. I must addmit that i was hurt. Like majority of male lawyers i have big ego, competitive spirit and we hate defeat in any shape or form.
This situation caused me to think that somehow i am not man enough in her eyes, i really felt emasculated, not good enough for girl who doesent have high criterion when it comes to hook up guys. How to overcome this negative feelings? I appreciate your thoughts.
Second question. Because of my job, and inability to hide it in such a small town, even sl.ts always try to put some " i am good and chaste girl" facade around me and percieve me as boyfriend or husband material. Would it be totally beta move ( to try as hail marry attempt ) to somehow convey to them that i know they are promiscuous, and that i am not interested in that "good girl" mask around me.
Thank you all in advance, all the best.
Sorry for my english if i made some mistakes.

 

[fastlife]

You're ego got in the way, but you already know that. First a breakdown of your interaction (my commentary is in bold), then we'll get into mindsets.

Me: I have to go, but why dont you give me your number, so we could grab some drinks later this week?
Her: My number? Are you asking me out? [Sh1t test]
Me: (with laser eye contact and smirk on my face ) Yes i am. [Sh1t test passed--you're not insecure about asking out a girl/your intentions]
Her: Why are you asking me out? I am so much younger than you, you could be my father. [Sh1t test--you passed the first one, so right now she's going to up the ante and try to find a weakness in your frame]
At this moment my ego was shattered in milion pieces, but i remain my composure. [Aaaand, she got you. You probably displayed your insecurity in a hesitancy or your micro-expressions or your tonality, because deep down you are insecure about your age]
Me: (again with good eye contact and smirk ) lucky for me i am not your father, so how about that number? ( putting my phone in front of her ) [You try to get back to your frame, which is good, but you probably aren't 100% grounded in your self-belief here. Remember, what you feel, she feels]

So you blew it here, but girls are doing you a favor when they sh1t test you. They are shining a light on where your insecurities are, and once you're aware of your insecurities, you can address them. You're insecure about being old...why? Why don't you feel entitled to a 19 y/o? Chances are, it's social pressure. There's a lot of "act your age," "creepy old man," shaming out there. You need to get over that. The fact that you're 35 isn't what bombed this interaction, the fact that you don't 100% own it did. Girls make emotional decisions, any logical disqualifications they use are just rationalizations.

This is the girl who sometimes go out in clubs alone, waiting for someone to pick her up. I know some of hers previous lovers ( i am not talking about boyfriends, but hook up guys ), and i know that i will sound arrogant but they are both physically and mentaly less attractive than me, and when i say mentaly i mean they have apsolutely zero game, lack in conversational skills, bad posture and body language, no sense of humor, but somehow they succeded in taking her to bed, and i get the " father" line. I must addmit that i was hurt. Like majority of male lawyers i have big ego, competitive spirit and we hate defeat in any shape or form.

Stop comparing yourself to other guys. Totally irrelevant. When push came to shove, they probably didn't feel insecure or unentitled. This is your ego fvcking with you.

This situation caused me to think that somehow i am not man enough in her eyes, i really felt emasculated, not good enough for girl who doesent have high criterion when it comes to hook up guys. How to overcome this negative feelings? I appreciate your thoughts.

You're not man enough in her eyes, because you caved to the impressions of a 19 y/o girl. You'll only start feeling better when you start taking ownership of who you are and start addressing your insecurities. Meditation can be hugely helpful for this (did a thread on that a couple years ago here). In the meantime, you can also start taking correct action externally, until your internals catch up. Recognize sh1t tests when they happen and have responses ready in advance. If you're insecure about age gaps, then you'll get that one a lot.

When a girl calls me old, I just have fun with it. Like, "Yeah, I know. In a few years I'll be that creepy dude in the club, popping viagra, and hitting on young b1tches" [agree and amplify] or "No it's cool. At least you know I know what I'm doing and won't start following you around like a puppy dog" [reframe it as a good thing]. Basically, reframe, and then get back to business: "So anyway, what's your number?" But it's better to get rid of that insecurity to begin with so that you don't need to rely on externals.

Second question. Because of my job, and inability to hide it in such a small town, even sl.ts always try to put some " i am good and chaste girl" facade around me and percieve me as boyfriend or husband material. Would it be totally beta move ( to try as hail marry attempt ) to somehow convey to them that i know they are promiscuous, and that i am not interested in that "good girl" mask around me.

First, for the bold: don't do that lol. Basically, just realize that your status will be working against you and that girls will try to slot you into the provider role. It'll be up to you to disqualify yourself (not the girl) as being relationship material and proactively set the frame that you're looking for something more casual. Things like, "You're not the jealous type, are you?" Or, "That's cool that you're chaste and stuff. But all that stuff is weird to me. Like, life is short and I don't think we should have to limit yourself based on other people's perceptions." Or, "You're way too innocent. I'd feel like I was corrupting you. I want a girl to corrupt me, not the other way around." Or, "I'm not relationship material. I'm too selfish." That'll give them permission to drop their facade without you attacking it or without them feeling judged negatively. But you'll probably have to reiterate those sentiments and stick to your guns and not start acting like a boyfriend.

Your ego wants to show them that you're smart and know the deal, but that's not going to get you the results you want. Focus on conveying your personality, your desires, your frame, and then let the girls operate within that instead of trying to attack their frames. Also, it's important to remember that even the most promiscuous girls are still just people who are living their lives the best way they know how--you may not want to wife them up or whatever, but you need to stop treating it like it's a big deal.

 

[Marc_zeus]

You're ego got in the way, but you already know that. First a breakdown of your interaction (my commentary is in bold), then we'll get into mindsets.



So you blew it here, but girls are doing you a favor when they sh1t test you. They are shining a light on where your insecurities are, and once you're aware of your insecurities, you can address them. You're insecure about being old...why? Why don't you feel entitled to a 19 y/o? Chances are, it's social pressure. There's a lot of "act your age," "creepy old man," shaming out there. You need to get over that. The fact that you're 35 isn't what bombed this interaction, the fact that you don't 100% own it did. Girls make emotional decisions, any logical disqualifications they use are just rationalizations.



Stop comparing yourself to other guys. Totally irrelevant. When push came to shove, they probably didn't feel insecure or unentitled. This is your ego fvcking with you.



You're not man enough in her eyes, because you caved to the impressions of a 19 y/o girl. You'll only start feeling better when you start taking ownership of who you are and start addressing your insecurities. Meditation can be hugely helpful for this (did a thread on that a couple years ago here). In the meantime, you can also start taking correct action externally, until your internals catch up. Recognize sh1t tests when they happen and have responses ready in advance. If you're insecure about age gaps, then you'll get that one a lot.

When a girl calls me old, I just have fun with it. Like, "Yeah, I know. In a few years I'll be that creepy dude in the club, popping viagra, and hitting on young b1tches" [agree and amplify] or "No it's cool. At least you know I know what I'm doing and won't start following you around like a puppy dog" [reframe it as a good thing]. Basically, reframe, and then get back to business: "So anyway, what's your number?" But it's better to get rid of that insecurity to begin with so that you don't need to rely on externals.



First, for the bold: don't do that lol. Basically, just realize that your status will be working against you and that girls will try to slot you into the provider role. It'll be up to you to disqualify yourself (not the girl) as being relationship material and proactively set the frame that you're looking for something more casual. Things like, "You're not the jealous type, are you?" Or, "That's cool that you're chaste and stuff. But all that stuff is weird to me. Like, life is short and I don't think we should have to limit yourself based on other people's perceptions." Or, "You're way too innocent. I'd feel like I was corrupting you. I want a girl to corrupt me, not the other way around." Or, "I'm not relationship material. I'm too selfish." That'll give them permission to drop their facade without you attacking it or without them feeling judged negatively. But you'll probably have to reiterate those sentiments and stick to your guns and not start acting like a boyfriend.

Your ego wants to show them that you're smart and know the deal, but that's not going to get you the results you want. Focus on conveying your personality, your desires, your frame, and then let the girls operate within that instead of trying to attack their frames. Also, it's important to remember that even the most promiscuous girls are still just people who are living their lives the best way they know how--you may not want to wife them up or whatever, but you need to stop treating it like it's a big deal.

Hey fastlife, really appreciate your answer. Great analysis on whole situation. You are totally right about not compering myself to others, but that's my comeritive nature messing up with my head. I know that's something i have to work on. That is why we are here, to better ourselves. But in this concrete situation it bothers me that some guy ( one of her hook ups that i know personaly through to some periphery of social circle ) who has nothing going on for him, i mean zero game, bad manners, lack of social callibration etc. somehow succeded to bed her. We are here, splitting hairs and nit-picking every possible error of mine, maybe i looked away for a second, maybe my body language was just a bit off, or my voice tremble for a second, maybe i didnt "vibe" my enitlement to young pu..y, etc. And yes all of these are valid points and something to be aware of, and try to master. His "tactic" is to be totally sexualy aggresive, but i am not talking being sexualy aggresive in some calibrated and suave way of conveying your intentions and desires ( ex. James Bond ), but i am talking about some hill-billy type of aggresion - "yo baby you are so fine, what would i do to you, when you are free to get together"? You would think that this type of guy would never be your competition in sexual marketplace, but somehow not only that he is, but actually beats you.

 

[andreihaha]

Hello to you all. I have two related questions and i would really appreciate your view and advice on how to handle failure with promiscuous lower quality girls.
First a bit of information about myself. I am 35 y.o. ,not merried, 6,2" height, i hit a gym 3 times per week so i have very athletic body ( some of my female friends even tell me that i look pretty attractive and i could easily pass as 26-27 y.o.), and i am a lawyer. I live in eastern europe so i am not some tv shows and movies insanely rich lawyer but i live ok. In last few years i was in 2 ltmr, so i am not dj buy any means but i strive to become one. Anyway, few days ago at some house party my friend introduce me to this really hot girl ( 20 y.o. ), but as i sad earlier we live in fairly small town so i know she is the "easy" girl. Yesterday i met her on the street and she stoped me and initiate a conversation. 3-4 minutes in, i sad i was in a hurry and had to go ( i really was ), but that i would like to see her again. Convo
Me: I have to go, but why dont you give me your number, so we could grab some drinks later this week?
Her: My number? Are you asking me out?
Me: (with laser eye contact and smirk on my face ) Yes i am.
Her: Why are you asking me out? I am so much younger than you, you could be my father.
At this moment my ego was shattered in milion pieces, but i remain my composure.
Me: (again with good eye contact and smirk ) lucky for me i am not your father, so how about that number? ( putting my phone in front of her )
Her: ( sounding offended ) OMG, no, i have to go, buy !!
This is the girl who sometimes go out in clubs alone, waiting for someone to pick her up. I know some of hers previous lovers ( i am not talking about boyfriends, but hook up guys ), and i know that i will sound arrogant but they are both physically and mentaly less attractive than me, and when i say mentaly i mean they have apsolutely zero game, lack in conversational skills, bad posture and body language, no sense of humor, but somehow they succeded in taking her to bed, and i get the " father" line. I must addmit that i was hurt. Like majority of male lawyers i have big ego, competitive spirit and we hate defeat in any shape or form.
This situation caused me to think that somehow i am not man enough in her eyes, i really felt emasculated, not good enough for girl who doesent have high criterion when it comes to hook up guys. How to overcome this negative feelings? I appreciate your thoughts.
Second question. Because of my job, and inability to hide it in such a small town, even sl.ts always try to put some " i am good and chaste girl" facade around me and percieve me as boyfriend or husband material. Would it be totally beta move ( to try as hail marry attempt ) to somehow convey to them that i know they are promiscuous, and that i am not interested in that "good girl" mask around me.
Thank you all in advance, all the best.
Sorry for my english if i made some mistakes.

If I were you, I'd forget about her.

Next time you meet her, ask her if she wants to call you daddy again(with your classic smirk on face).
No more asking for a phone number, act like you're making fun of a young 20 year old. (which you should do in this situation).
She will either give her number to you eventually or she will be uninterested. You will have no doubts about her anyway.

As to the second question, don't be afraid to get sexual if she wants it too. You don't have to say anything, women feel it.

Good luck with your life. Women are always a secondary goal, unless you're looking for a wife.

 

[andreihaha]

Hey fastlife, really appreciate your answer. Great analysis on whole situation. You are totally right about not compering myself to others, but that's my comeritive nature messing up with my head. I know that's something i have to work on. That is why we are here, to better ourselves. But in this concrete situation it bothers me that some guy ( one of her hook ups that i know personaly through to some periphery of social circle ) who has nothing going on for him, i mean zero game, bad manners, lack of social callibration etc. somehow succeded to bed her. We are here, splitting hairs and nit-picking every possible error of mine, maybe i looked away for a second, maybe my body language was just a bit off, or my voice tremble for a second, maybe i didnt "vibe" my enitlement to young pu..y, etc. And yes all of these are valid points and something to be aware of, and try to master. His "tactic" is to be totally sexualy aggresive, but i am not talking being sexualy aggresive in some calibrated and suave way of conveying your intentions and desires ( ex. James Bond ), but i am talking about some hill-billy type of aggresion - "yo baby you are so fine, what would i do to you, when you are free to get together"? You would think that this type of guy would never be your competition in sexual marketplace, but somehow not only that he is, but actually beats you.

Aggressive sexuality is a MANLY thing. No matter if he's a hillbilly or a suave ladies man.
And women want a man.
The dude you're talking about is not your competition, he's the predator. You can be the predator, the prey or a tree.
And right now you're the tree, the only one not having sex. Don't be the tree.

 

[AttackFormation]

His "tactic" is to be totally sexualy aggresive, but i am not talking being sexualy aggresive in some calibrated and suave way of conveying your intentions and desires ( ex. James Bond ), but i am talking about some hill-billy type of aggresion - "yo baby you are so fine, what would i do to you, when you are free to get together"? You would think that this type of guy would never be your competition in sexual marketplace, but somehow not only that he is, but actually beats you.

Did you think about it yet that this is not "bad game" at all but simply that the women want to fvck and don't need more than this? They are at the same level. It doesn't take some kind of cerebral effort for women to want sex, rather the opposite, it will more typically inhibit and undermine you. They just want to fvck too. Looks, emotions and simple sexual assertion are what make women wet, not refined "intellectualism".

@Black Widow Void tends to highlight this problem some men have too. You are far from alone with having it, it's a recurring issue with more I guess you could say intellectually inclined men.

 

[fastlife]

His "tactic" is to be totally sexualy aggresive, but i am not talking being sexualy aggresive in some calibrated and suave way of conveying your intentions and desires ( ex. James Bond ), but i am talking about some hill-billy type of aggresion - "yo baby you are so fine, what would i do to you, when you are free to get together"? You would think that this type of guy would never be your competition in sexual marketplace, but somehow not only that he is, but actually beats you.

This isn't bad game. It won't work for every girl in every situation, but he's showing intent, entitlement, and he probably doesn't cave when he gets pushback. Just because it doesn't "logically" make sense based on your value system and social beliefs, doesn't mean girls won't respond to it. But the bottom line is, like others said, I wouldn't worry about her or him; I'd focus on taking what you learn about your own reactions and optimizing them so that you don't run into this kind of situation in the future.