A warning about getting too caught up in SS/ DJ

[bigneil]

your eating habits and daily routines don't define you as a person.

Well then what does? You are what you eat, and you are as predictable as your daily routine.

 

[Chamber36]

doesn't mean you have to live it on the dark side either to know what you're capable of.

anyone is capable of anything.

Living life on the edge is not the same is living it on the dark side.

And theoretically everyone could be capable of anything, however specifically not everyone is capable of everything. Could you defend yourself against the average man? If a man tried to choke you, would you know how to defend yourself? Would you know how to take a knife from another man's hands?

Learning martial arts isn't living life on the dark side, it's just learning skills to develop capabalities. At the same time pushing boundaries.

You have to be pushing boundaries, or else you're not making progress.

 

[nightcrawler]

Well then what does? You are what you eat, and you are as predictable as your daily routine.

nothing defines you bro...literally...nothing. The only thing that defines you is that you are a person and that's it.

honestly bro, I'm tired. Plain and simple.

Tired of being told how to be a respectable man
Tired of being told how not to be a respectable man
Tired of being told that God is good, and Satan is bad.
Tired of being told Satan is good, and God is bad.
Tired of being told I should get as many girls as i want
Tired of being told I shouldn't want to get as many girls as i want

Tired of getting laid
Tired of not getting laid.
Tired of being popular
Tired of not being popular

Tired of working out to feed my own vanity and narcissistic needs,
Tired of not working out to fill my vanity and narcissistic needs,

Tired of what the media defines as "good"
Tired of what the media defines as "not good"

Tired of getting told girls are evil *****es
Tired of not getting told girls are evil *****es
Tired of being told women are angels
Tired of being told women are not angels

The list goes on...and you know what...nothing is this damn world defines a person...and the more you try to define yourself, the more miserable you will be,

 

[danthemann]

easily one of the best and most inspiring threads ive read. just at a crucial point in my life as well. thank you.

 

[Chamber36]

nothing defines you bro...literally...nothing. The only thing that defines you is that you are a person and that's it.

honestly bro, I'm tired. Plain and simple.

Tired of being told how to be a respectable man
Tired of being told how not to be a respectable man
Tired of being told that God is good, and Satan is bad.
Tired of being told Satan is good, and God is bad.
Tired of being told I should get as many girls as i want
Tired of being told I shouldn't want to get as many girls as i want

Tired of getting laid
Tired of not getting laid.
Tired of being popular
Tired of not being popular

Tired of working out to feed my own vanity and narcissistic needs,
Tired of not working out to fill my vanity and narcissistic needs,

Tired of what the media defines as "good"
Tired of what the media defines as "not good"

Tired of getting told girls are evil *****es
Tired of not getting told girls are evil *****es
Tired of being told women are angels
Tired of being told women are not angels

The list goes on...and you know what...nothing is this damn world defines a person...and the more you try to define yourself, the more miserable you will be,

What's your point? That we're cosmic dust?

I don't know what the "self" is.... I think it's an illusion, really. But I'm willing to know what the hell you're trying to say.

my POV is that we should all push our OWN boundaries and so expand our consciousness constantly.

Here's a quote: A mind that is stretched by a new experience can never go back to its old dimensions.
Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr.

 

[nightcrawler]

What's your point? That we're cosmic dust?

I don't know what the "self" is.... I think it's an illusion, really. But I'm willing to know what the hell you're trying to say.

my POV is that we should all push our OWN boundaries and so expand our consciousness constantly.

This is a quote, I don't remember from who, and I believe I am paraphrasing, but it went something like this: "Once the mind expands beyond it's original boundaries, it can never shrink back to it's original shape."

yes, we are just that, cosmic dust.

is there a promised land? who knows...and if there is, then hopefully we have reservations there.

do not be concerned by things such as pushing your own boundaries...it comes in time. Evrything in this life comes to you (yes, that includes women...women come to you..they come to you everyday without you even realizing it)

Once you learn to see things differently, once you learn to see the face value of things, and the faces behind the mirrors, and not only will you push your own boundaries, but many a time you will be given more than you barganed for, and might even hate yourself later on for it.

 

[Chamber36]

do not be concerned by things such as pushing your own boundaries...it comes in time. Evrything in this life comes to you (yes, that includes women...women come to you..they come to you everyday without you even realizing it)

Once you learn to see things differently, once you learn to see the face value of things, and the faces behind the mirrors, and not only will you push your own boundaries, but many a time you will be given more than you barganed for, and might even hate yourself later on for it.

I honestly can't say i think all things come to you. People find what they're looking for in all sorts of places, whether they're looking or not. I'd say it's better to be on the look-out. As a man we have to be vigilant towards any opportunity. You don't want to slap yourself in the head for not approaching a girl. Whenever you stumble upon a chance you want to be able to seize that chance.

Also I believe in really living on the edge, like Bruce Lee. Really taking 100% out of life. Sucking life dry. Milking it to the bone.

I'm not saying I'm 100% dedicated to martial arts. I am making a gradual change in my own consciousness through gaining knowledge and experience.

IMHO you got to work for the things you get. Arnold Schwarzenegger didn't just get California thrown into his lap you know.

 

[nightcrawler]

I honestly can't say i think all things come to you. People find what they're looking for in all sorts of places, whether they're looking or not. I'd say it's better to be on the look-out. As a man we have to be vigilant towards any opportunity. You don't want to slap yourself in the head for not approaching a girl. Whenever you stumble upon a chance you want to be able to seize that chance.

Also I believe in really living on the edge, like Bruce Lee. Really taking 100% out of life. Sucking life dry. Milking it to the bone.

I'm not saying I'm 100% dedicated to martial arts. I am making a gradual change in my own consciousness through gaining knowledge and experience.

IMHO you got to work for the things you get. Arnold Schwarzenegger didn't just get California thrown into his lap you know.

in a way you are right i suppose...slavery to a certain conformity in life can teach you a lot of things.

 

[Serg897]

Lot of good stuff in this thread. Once again I find myself resonating with a lot of what Jariel has said.

However, when it comes attracting women and building healthy relationships, majority of DJs and PUAs are complete failures - myself included.

I fit this description also. Im almost 25, and I’ve never had a relationship last more than one year. The longest one is still a record 10 months, and that one started in high school and ended up with a heartwrenching breakup and oneitis. I’ve dated many, many women since then. Most of the time they end up as short relationships, flings, one night stands. Nothing ever seems to last too long. Im not exactly sure why I seem to follow this pattern and others don’t.

As much as I appreciate this forum for helping me improve myself and my life, I'm starting to realise that if you want advice on relationships, then single guys with commitment issues, insecurities and a history of failed relationships are not the best people to go to, and unfortunately that's exactly what the seduction/PUA community consists of.

Lately, I'm looking at videos of Mystery and his like, desperately seeking approval, overanalysing and deluding themselves, and I'm realising that these are sad, pathetic men. And yet when I look at the average guy who most of us would consider unenlightened "AFCs", they are maintaining long, healthy relationships and leading contented lives with no effort and no analysing.

One of my good friends went on okcupid last year and found himself a girlfriend. He is an intelligent guy, but has almost zero experience with women. No knowledge of this website or any of the principles here. It was therefore surprising to me how easy he made it look – he hasn’t complained about games or sh!t tests, she treats him well and it seems he couldn’t be happier. We’ll see what happens down the road, but it seems evident that there really are quality women out there and they aren’t just some monolithic group with the same hypergamous traits that this forum makes them out to be. Its also possible that this forum leads you to a mindset that makes it more difficult to actually establish real emotional connections with someone.

One of my favorite orators and public intellectuals is Christopher Hitchens. He just died in December. Whatever you may think of him, he was certainly not boring and made a real impact on the world stage – the kind of man I aspire to be. Reading his memoir, there is one thing that is absolutely startling. He includes many details of many members of his family, particularly his mother and father. The one person he hardly mentions at all is his wife. I think the omission is startling and very telling – it probably means that in the end she simply wasn’t that important.

This is why I agree with Jariel that all of these PUA clowns don’t really have much to be proud of. Seduction is not something to devote your life to. All these guys are doing is running a successful conjob feeding on the insecurities of the men willing to pay for their advice. In the end, the most important thing to remember is that women should be always secondary to other pursuits and doing more in this life. Having sex and reproducing is not an achievement – you aren’t unique if you do it and it certainly doesn’t make you any more special than the billions of other males who have done it before you.

However, having said all that, OnTheWayUps post also rings true in a lot of ways. This website does have some golden advice to offer on a lot of common, ****ty situations. Its just important to keep it all in perspective.

Thats the end of my rambling...

 

[zekko]

I fit this description also. Im almost 25, and I’ve never had a relationship last more than one year. The longest one is still a record 10 months, and that one started in high school and ended up with a heartwrenching breakup and oneitis. I’ve dated many, many women since then. Most of the time they end up as short relationships, flings, one night stands. Nothing ever seems to last too long. Im not exactly sure why I seem to follow this pattern and others don’t.

I bet there are more people following that pattern than you realize.
It's hard to build a good relationship at your age because a lot of people aren't looking to settle down yet. They're still focusing on building their lives and getting their career in order. And sampling what the other sex has to offer, of course.

One of my good friends went on okcupid last year and found himself a girlfriend. He is an intelligent guy, but has almost zero experience with women. No knowledge of this website or any of the principles here. It was therefore surprising to me how easy he made it look – he hasn’t complained about games or sh!t tests, she treats him well and it seems he couldn’t be happier.

One thing I really hate about the pickup community is the way guys get into it, and then look down on everybody around them. Like they should be superior because they know the "secrets" and everybody else is fumbling around blindly in the "matrix". But the fact is, men and women have been getting together just fine for thousands of years without having Mystery around to show them how.

Your friend is probably being real with this girl. If you find a quality girl and you take this approach, you don't have to deal with all these BS games. It seems like the more games you play, the more you are inviting the girl to play her games. I prefer to form an honest connection and skip all the drama.

This is why I agree with Jariel that all of these PUA clowns don’t really have much to be proud of. Seduction is not something to devote your life to. All these guys are doing is running a successful conjob feeding on the insecurities of the men willing to pay for their advice.

And they're also running a conjob on the women they're trying to seduce. If you're really a man of value, you don't have to run these cons.

I agree devoting your life to seduction is kind of a waste. There are better things to do with your time, and your life. It's never been my ambition to be a big "player". I just wanted to be good enough with women to get the kind of girls I like. I never wanted to spend five days a week in the club. That's fine for some guys, but for me I would consider it a pathetic waste of my time.

 

[HalfAddict]

We are cosmic dust.

So **** it, go have a good time.

 

[Trump]

In my part I'm not the greatest of DJ's. Heck even my 'progress' has stalled as I now do what makes me happy; furthering myself professionally, setting myself up for the future while going out and doing other hobbies. I'm even envious of the woman my mate gets and kick myself sometimes wishing I'd gotten a girls number I met or why I'm still single. Yet deep down, I'm content.

So this comes to the last part of my thread and that is to the budding DJ's reading this. Take PUA, DJ etc for it's face value. To make you a better person. Don't focus so much on woman. Woman will come when you look after yourself. Balance is essential in life as it is here. Remember to focus just as much on your career or education and other hobbys and persuits. Don't focus entirely on woman because when you do, you'll find yourself one day wondering those countless hours spent dating, messaging or even all night partys waking up next to a HB you don't know and was it worth it.

I dont believe you are content without a woman and I think you are trying to convince yourself otherwise. You are correct that we shouldn't place so much value on them,but all things considered, taking the good and the bad, men are generally happier married or in a relationship, its better for their health too.

The only issue that can come up when focusing on career and hobbies, and not women, is time and biological clock. People have time to make millions, learn a hobby, play sports, so on and so forth at almost any age, yet to get married or find a girl the same age as yourself, gets more difficult with each passing day.

 

[perseverance]

I'm starting to have my doubts lately too. The self improvement advice and motivation that this forum offers is truly invaluable and I think a lot of guys here give great advice when it comes to overcoming rejection and break ups.

However, when it comes attracting women and building healthy relationships, majority of DJs and PUAs are complete failures - myself included.

I have often credited DJ/PUA techniques and behaviours for my ability to attract women and have sex, but in reality, this is just down to being decent looking, in good shape and confident. I've got the same results without neg hitting and ****y and funny, and without push/pull and all the rest of it. In fact, the more natural and less PUA I act on a date, the better it turns out to be.

As for relationships, the sad fact is that there are only a handful of guys on this forum that have succeeded in this area.

As much as I appreciate this forum for helping me improve myself and my life, I'm starting to realise that if you want advice on relationships, then single guys with commitment issues, insecurities and a history of failed relationships are not the best people to go to, and unfortunately that's exactly what the seduction/PUA community consists of.

Lately, I'm looking at videos of Mystery and his like, desperately seeking approval, overanalysing and deluding themselves, and I'm realising that these are sad, pathetic men. And yet when I look at the average guy who most of us would consider unenlightened "AFCs", they are maintaining long, healthy relationships and leading contented lives with no effort and no analysing.

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Jariel again."

Sorry, bro! If I could, I would. I agree with all of your points which is why I seldom bother with this forum nowadays.

I will always be grateful to this forum for opening my eyes and for helping me bring about important changes in my life, but a lot of the material on here is the result of overanalysing and hysteria more than anything else.

 

[Jariel]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to perseverance again.

It's strange how some people go full circle on this forum. I started out in the seduction/PUA community with delusional optimism, willing to try everything (even speed seduction!), but there comes a point where you just realise how fake and unnatural it is.

Or like Perseverance pointed out, when you read other people's posts, PUA videos and see them overanalysing and writing huge disertations and science papers about a vague text message from a girl or how to talk to women, and you realise these guys are not so different to your average Sci-Fi or Dungeons and Dragons nerds.

But I don't want to sound totally critical of this site because of the amazing self improvement philosophy among many of the members who encourage learning and improving natural socials skills, true inner confidence, composure, pride and physical appearance. I've gained so much from that path and recommend it over short term trickery.

For example, if you're being walked over and treated badly, instead of walking like The Terminator or impersonating James Bond in the hope of looking like an alpha male, you may want to stand up for yourself when the need arises. If you're nervous or awkward talking to women, just keep practising until you start to feel comfortable. And so on. All this adds up to natural intrinsic improvements that won't fall apart when tested.

 

[JohnChops]

I'm starting to have my doubts lately too. The self improvement advice and motivation that this forum offers is truly invaluable and I think a lot of guys here give great advice when it comes to overcoming rejection and break ups.

However, when it comes attracting women and building healthy relationships, majority of DJs and PUAs are complete failures - myself included.

I have often credited DJ/PUA techniques and behaviours for my ability to attract women and have sex, but in reality, this is just down to being decent looking, in good shape and confident. I've got the same results without neg hitting and ****y and funny, and without push/pull and all the rest of it. In fact, the more natural and less PUA I act on a date, the better it turns out to be.

As for relationships, the sad fact is that there are only a handful of guys on this forum that have succeeded in this area.

As much as I appreciate this forum for helping me improve myself and my life, I'm starting to realise that if you want advice on relationships, then single guys with commitment issues, insecurities and a history of failed relationships are not the best people to go to, and unfortunately that's exactly what the seduction/PUA community consists of.

Lately, I'm looking at videos of Mystery and his like, desperately seeking approval, overanalysing and deluding themselves, and I'm realising that these are sad, pathetic men. And yet when I look at the average guy who most of us would consider unenlightened "AFCs", they are maintaining long, healthy relationships and leading contented lives with no effort and no analysing.

Dude, Honestly I've been thinking the same way and then I realized that this forum does give great information on how to be confident in yourself/ motivate yourself/ and all other sorts of great things to add to your personality. I admit I have relationship issues, I cant talk to a girl for more than 1-2 months because at that point ill just end up getting bored and want to explore new women. Eventually youll find someone you clique with and if not your ****ed aha just kidding just have no worries. And as for the AFCs leading these relationships half of them are whipped. For example my friend always jumps to the heels of his girlfriend no matter what. Is that what you really want? Obviously as being a man **** no we want to be in control as it should be.

 

[loveshogun]

For all the guys "getting tired of it" and feeling frustrated.

You're doing well. You're on your way. If you're making strides in your life, you'll get where you need to be sometime. Keep plugging at it.

Now for some truth.

At some point, you made the grave mistake of thinking that doing all of those awesome things you're doing is about getting women.

I did the same thing. I learned how to dance, how to write, how to be interesting, how to have dreams, how to achieve them, because at the beginning, I was thinking "man, I'm gonna get laid."

At some point during all of that - and I got REALLY lucky in the sense that I stumbled into my dreams... a lot of guys take up jobs and things they hate to impress girls - I realized I was happy doing the things I loved, with or without women.

Sure, there were ups and downs, but overall life is going up, and there's no stop to that in sight. I feel in control of myself, and like I can handle anything life throws at me. That's happiness.

Looking back, I was an idiot for making this about the women.

This was always about me. And about how unhappy I was about myself. It takes an unhappy man to look at a woman and think "she's the answer to my problems."

So stop pinning your fulfillment on someone else, and start doing things for you.

Really think about it. Are you happy on your own? I feel like if you were, then you wouldn't be posting here about how women are jading you.

 

[stephen_dedalus]

This has been one of the best threads I have read recently on the site. Great work guys!

 

[Man of Awesome]

Indeed. I really appreciate the discussion of these topics. Feels like I've just emerged from some kind of a feminine cave and suddenly, there are people who just understand how I feel. Thanks bros.

 

[coochieman]

I thought i'd become a beast..... until last Friday, now i'm about to kill more nerves in me as I speak.

He knew the deal when you started incorporating juanism in your crude, socially developed chumped state!

Yes, it does take that ignorant boy out of you. Now, you dont live in the fantasy of my soon to come one perfect girl in conjunction with conflicting notions and doubts on marriage knowing you want your kids to grow up under the same roof with mummy and daddy.

I dont thinking becoming a niceguy back could be that hard, though i dont think theres a way you would return to a total one after being a dj for long.

Be careful what you wish for!

 

[bigneil]

As loveshogun alludes to, your purpose in life is not to be with another person. Rather, relationships are about two people - each with their own purpose - who still manage to compliment and supplement oneanother on their journeys. This is why couples often grow apart.