A general overview of me... and a question on how to proceed w/girl

[snowandotherjoys]

Hi,

I'm brand new to the manosphere -- sup everybody! I found these forums through the audiobook The Rational Male. In general, I have a lot going for myself. I'm 28 y.o., emotionally independent, no baggage or unresolved relationships, making six-figures a year, natural leader at work, athletic build, pretty good-looking, creative, smart, driven, whatever. In the past I've lived with a good-looking woman for 3 1/2 years and I had a good sense of holding frame and when I let things get away from me...

On the flip side, I'm working on moving out of social isolation. My immediate family is all addicted to drugs and dying so I don't talk to them. I'm introverted (though less these days) and I deal with attachment trauma and social anxiety. The Rational Male helped me realize that I'll never meet girls and change my situation by sitting alone by myself. I recently decided to begin socializing outside of work. Last night I went to a coworkers' party (went awesome, felt a thousand times better than the wallflower I used to be) and then tonight a songwriter's MeetUp group. I met this cute chick at the group, told her I wanted to get together with her and play some music, and she gave me her number. She's girl A.

There's a long history between me and a new girl (girl B). Girl B totally liked me for nine months but I was plugged into the feminine matrix and never hit on her because "she'd probably respect me more if she trusted our friendship." Anyway, even though Girl B was gooey-retard over me for so many months, I never did anything about it because I lacked confidence. The past couple weeks I could tell she was slipping away and losing interest...

My idea is to pursue Girl A and continue to attend meetups and collect more numbers. Once I get a few plates-spinning, I'll feel more confident, and then I'll shake things up with Girl B by asking her out in a romantic way. If she says no, I'll feel confident in my other options.

Anyway, I'm not sure how to date girl A? I've had so many years of being a mangina. It is difficult to overcome. I know not to fake friendship... or deny sexual tension. I know I should not reveal too much of myself to her. I know I should avoid falling into "one-itis" and giving my power awa. I tend to fall in love hard and fast and then I give all my suave away which never ends up good.

I'm not sure what you guys can offer based on solely my posting. In summary, I've been a beta my whole life because I internalized society's messages. I feel alpha in all other aspects of life. Any guidance on how to actually date this girl would be welcomed.

 

[Amer1group]

Even if I'm new here, we should make a test on the DJ bible required in order to post here.

I think you should clarify what girl you want to approach first, what it is so difficult about it.

 

[snowandotherjoys]

I've been reading the DJ Bible. I read the section on first dates. It made sense, but I'm not sure it helps me in my situation.

I feel doomed for failure. I got her number on the pretense of us playing songs together. I already met the songwriter side of her at the meetup and I think it would've been better to suggest instead a first date that was lighter and more casual (45 minute tea/lunch). That way I could've gotten to know more of her and the frame could've been reinforced -- "Gee, I'm having a blast learning about you".

In this case, we'll need a place to play, so I figured I'd invite her over to my place. But I'm not sure how I feel about having her over to my apartment for the first date. It's a nice place and I got some nice equipment I can show off... but I want her to feel comfortable. I want to feel comfortable too. Historically, I make dates way too intense, and having her come over to play music feels pretty intense. My apartment is decently small so I wonder if we'll feel kind of choked up. I'd like to be moving around more on a first date. Also I feel a little disinterested (or cautious) in sharing more of my artist side, since I feel she should get to know me better before I play more personal songs and ****. I like her music but I'm mostly interested in her.

I think I need to call her, too, so we can talk about logistics because I don't know her schedule or where she lives. Maybe that will go okay if I stick to the basics and follow the tips I've been reading about.

With all the negativity I'm generating, I feel like not even calling the number. That'd probably be a piss poor way to start off my venture into meeting girls. I actually asked a girl out today at the coffee shop. She seemed happy but said she had a boyfriend. Right now this girl is pretty much my only opportunity... but I guess you have to start somewhere

 

[Ratiocinative]

Why do you think you need to ask a woman out in a romantic way? Talk to for a few minutes, have a fun conversation, laugh, tease, then get her number or better yet schedule a date. Trying to ask her out "romantically" just screams to her that you're not good enough for her and that you need to bribe her to spend time with you.

Until she starts getting all sappy and emotional and texting you multiple times a week to tell you how she's been thinking about you, there's no reason to put lots of thought or money into dating. You want her to like you for you, and she wants to like you for you. Thinks like walking around downtown and checking out little shops, checking out a free play in the park in the summer, grabbing dinner and drinks at a cheap bar, etc, are the kinds of thing you should be doing. Even if you make 7 figures, the less money you spend is better. $50 or less for an activity, snacks, gas, dinner, and drinks is a good amount to aim for until she starts developing feelings for you IMO.

 

[snowandotherjoys]

Why do you think you need to ask a woman out in a romantic way? Talk to for a few minutes, have a fun conversation, laugh, tease, then get her number or better yet schedule a date. Trying to ask her out "romantically" just screams to her that you're not good enough for her and that you need to bribe her to spend time with you.

Until she starts getting all sappy and emotional and texting you multiple times a week to tell you how she's been thinking about you, there's no reason to put lots of thought or money into dating. You want her to like you for you, and she wants to like you for you. Thinks like walking around downtown and checking out little shops, checking out a free play in the park in the summer, grabbing dinner and drinks at a cheap bar, etc, are the kinds of thing you should be doing. Even if you make 7 figures, the less money you spend is better. $50 or less for an activity, snacks, gas, dinner, and drinks is a good amount to aim for until she starts developing feelings for you IMO.

Makes sense... and I'm starting to understand this. Still not sure what to do with this number. Tell her I'd rather do tea instead?

 

[Amer1group]

Make it intense and funny is the point remember? I don't think that you should betray your "pretense", you will convince her that you are Mr. Right more than trying to sell yourself to her in a classic date. You shouldn't worry about her schedule, she will make space for you if you play it right.

 

[ohrein]

First thing I notice about your posts is that you seem outcome dependent. You seem be hung up on Girl B. If you are fixated on "succeeding" you will over invest and your mental state will suffer. You definitely want to be either or with women. Yeah, it'd be nice to date you or make you my girlfriend but if not then oh well. Not only is this much better for your mental health but the abundance mentality, if you can internalize it, will automatically improve your game subconsciously.

The key from moving away from the beta mentality is to start learning what actually attracts women. Typically if it's at all romantic and you haven't been with the woman for minimum of 6 months, you're probably over-invested and killing attraction at the same time. There are always exceptions though. If you're ever unsure where you stand, simply reciprocate the attention and level of interest she gives you. The other huge thing is stop being their friend. Relationships are primarily sexual, friendship second. You need to escalate physically early on from now on.

Lastly, make sure you're having fun. Don't take dating too seriously. If you're not having fun, you're doing it wrong!

 

[RangerMIke]

First... neither of these women should be your 'target', DJ's don't have targets they attract 'women' plural.

Ask out multiple women, gauge their interest, toss back the ones that are not willing to work for you, and date the ones who are. Do this and everything works out for you. This is not being mean to women... this is actually how they prefer things.

Your frame with B is weak. You only really became interested in her when she started pulling back, you are being too needy and she will pick up on this. You need to let this one go since you likely already blew this window of opportunity, and this exercise of letting this one go will be a big step in your development as a DJ. You MUST learn that there is a world of women and when you get hung up on one for any reason or any length of time you just become a weak @ss b!tch.

You need a C, D, E ..... girl as well. NEVER stop hitting on women and making dates.

 

[snowandotherjoys]

Thanks for the thoughts everybody. I agreed with all of them. I called the musician girl and left a voicemail. I could've left a shorter one but it was good enough to get a text response. We texted back and forth a few times then I asked her if she wanted to come to my place to play. That's when the texts stopped coming.

My Typical Response: "Well? Do you have anything else you want to do? I don't want to freak you out".
What I Did This Time: "**** it, I asked my question. I'm being confrontational and I deserve a yes or no answer" I let the text sit for 24 hours. Then I started getting irritated because I didn't want to keep this block of time reserved for her.

My Typical Response: Accept she's not into me and that she changed her mind
What I Did This Time: Send her a message back, "No problem <her name>... hit me up if you want to get tea sometime." Within five minutes she sent me a text back "I'm sorry I forgot to answer! I don't want to drive to your city, maybe we could play here."

My Typical Response: Wow, she likes me! Text her back immediately, don't let her slip away!
What I Did This Time: Oh, she forgot to respond to me? That must mean she doesn't respect me. I want to date people who respect me. NEXT!

I ignored her for a full day, deleted her number and started thinking of new ways to meet more girls. Then a day later I get another message from her out of the blue. "Hey, I'd love to play with you at so-and-so, we could do X, Y and Z" Girls really do respond to this stuff!

I decided to go on the date because it's better for me to practice spending time with girls. The date went really well. She gave me a lot of those gooey eyes when I was talking, and she really enjoyed the attention I gave her. At the end she stammered a few times that we could get together again. I didn't want to make the second date on the first date, so I just kind of laughed it off and told her that I'd get back to her.

I struggle with the idea that her IL in me is very high. I don't want to see it taper off, but I feel like that's the natural flow of things. I might wait for her to text me and follow up with a second date proposal. At some point I feel like I'd need to show interest back, but maybe right now it's wise to let her want and ask. Perhaps it's like a little game of catch where we toss the interest and initiation back and forth to each other. I want her to send me gooey-retard text messages because then I know she's really interested.

I'm also not really sure how not to get friendzoned. I am legitimately a male who enjoys sharing sex after commitment and trust has been established. That may be controversial, but it's what I truly prefer. With these post-feminist chicks who are into free sex and ****, the risk that I get friendzoned seems high because I don't have sex as quick as I'm "supposed to". Also, I'm not sure how to keep her wanting me but also letting her know that I'm interested in her. If I act too disinterested, I'm afraid I'll get friendzoned.

I'm probably in a good position to spin some more plates, and if I take the advice of the postings in this thread, I'd probably not spend too much time thinking about her or investing myself in a particular outcome. Again, I'm the prize... right?

 

[parkthebus]

Well done for going on the date. Regardless of her interest level, you're on a learning curve at the moment so the experience will help. Wait just over a week and if she hasn't text you then hit her up. Do something fun and then go for evening drinks. If you're in your city you can say "let's go play some music at mine".

 

[snowandotherjoys]

So I ended up going to one of her concerts. After the concert I hugged her and we chatted for a bit I sent her some feedback on her performance. Pretty quickly she sent this message back:

"You are absolutely awesome. I don't know anyone that would take the time to write all of that and make tabs!!!! Seriously it just makes me want to hang out with you again fast! I wonder what you thought of Mindys stuff. When can you hang out again and be musical with me?"

I have no idea what to do now that her IL is so high. I think, "Of course it's high, I've showered you in attention" I've also been pretty in-control of myself with this woman. Then I think, "Maybe it's a good time to defer her music request and ask her to do what I want to do -- which in case is yoga and tea." I also think, "Gee, I'm glad she likes me and all, but I wouldn't mind using the attention that I'd give her to try and get more plates spinning."

I also think maybe I should keep the ball rolling while things are hot, and practicing some kino on her on our next date (this weekend maybe?) I think the alpha thing to do is to do whatever the **** I want to do. And I'm just not really sure what that is. I think she wants to be a Mom someday, and kids are out for me, so I think maybe I should not get sexual with her. Maybe that's a buffer to protect myself from rejection. I am looking for a dual-income, no kids type of relationship more than I am a good ****. But then again maybe I could **** her anyway.... or atleast practice kino.

The game seems too easy right now, until she irrationally changes her feelings and the plate drops and breaks.

 

[Tictac]

I also think maybe I should keep the ball rolling while things are hot, and practicing some kino on her on our next date (this weekend maybe?) I think the alpha thing to do is to do whatever the **** I want to do. And I'm just not really sure what that is. I think she wants to be a Mom someday, and kids are out for me, so I think maybe I should not get sexual with her. Maybe that's a buffer to protect myself from rejection. I am looking for a dual-income, no kids type of relationship more than I am a good ****. But then again maybe I could **** her anyway.... or atleast practice kino.

Your're way in your head here and doing the Jekyll and Hyde thing. I guess that's normal when you're learning.

You've been on one date and you are living in a dual-income-no-kids non-existent future, telling yourself not to get 'sexual' and thinking about 'practicing kino'.

Women don't do this, not for a couple of months anyway. If you play it right, she might go out with you again and that's about all she's thinking about - the next (maybe) date. She is not thinking about a relationship right now and won't be for a while. And this will be true whether you make your move or whether you have sex the next time you see her or not. And you should.

I know it isn't easy. But you've got to relax and stop with alpha 'tactics'. Make them part of who you are not something to think about and apply. And drop the 'practice' kino thing. This isn't practice.

Corey Wayne has a saying - 'hang out, have fun and hook up'. Like him or hate him that's all you've got to do for now. If you do anything else, you're doing it wrong.

 

[snowandotherjoys]

Alright, so her email is not a big deal, and I just proceed comfortably but confidently.