A frustrating position to be in

SteR

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I don't care how "quality" and "in demand" she is. Am I beggar that I need to qualify myself to this chick? Her disinterest is a massive turn-off. 700,800 hours in this life. Better to focus on more fruitful prospects.

It's a shame Poon King still isn't around.

"Women who don't like me are women who don't matter"

- PK
You know, there's a lot of truth to this, and you've highlighted something I was thinking about the other day:

I think growing up as men, you grow accustomed to being in the position of trying to prove yourself to the girl. It's no secret that women have the advantage when they're younger: They're in their physical prime and every guy is trying to chase them.. so as guys, we get used to that pattern of chasing. They just sit their looking pretty while we do our best to get their interest.

But really we need to reverse that role. @guru1000 actually nailed it in another thread about how women should be proving themselves to us as candidates for marriage, rather than the other way around.

The trouble is that not everyone's in the same position as guys like him. You have to have high enough value before you can have that mindset.. so I guess we've all got a lot of work ahead of us, ha. Back to work..
 

Urbanyst

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Had a day to mull it over.

Scarcity not a major issue in reality. Have a few active plates. Definitely see your point on her scarcity though...would she be as "valuable" if her attention weren't so limited? Probably not. Pedastalised this salsa chick due to the checklist I have as an "ideal". Objectively she isn't THAT much better than other girls I could get with, especially in the salsa scene.

Ego is what has driven me this far. As much as I appreciate BeExcellent's advise I think you are right on this one fastlife.

Just got out of a salsa event that I invited her to a few hours earlier. She didn't even respond to my message. Ironically I had the best dances ever since I started lesrning.

I don't care how "quality" and "in demand" she is. Am I beggar that I need to qualify myself to this chick? Her disinterest is a massive turn-off. 700,800 hours in this life. Better to focus on more fruitful prospects.

It's a shame Poon King still isn't around.

"Women who don't like me are women who don't matter"

- PK

Pour a glass for a fallen homie.
Another classic PK quote I like is "never care more about the relationship than the woman does" or something like that.

He had a lot of good lines.
 

guru1000

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Having dated about nine models in the past 10 months (only seven of those months I was single), let me share a few commonalities about these type of women (the 9/10 club, hereinafter "They"):

1) They do not show their interest overtly like other women. I'd go even further to state that you are not even sure if they are into you until you fvck them.

Seven of the nine gave me the cheek at the end of the date. Their egos are often inflated insofar as for any man to just kiss them relatively fast insults their ego. They think very highly of themselves (although they are extremely insecure which we will discuss next), so to maintain their "high-value" frame they give the ostensible appearance of not being so sexually easy. In a strange way, this makes them appear as greater "quality" as they are not so wanton in their sexual desire--but do not be fooled by this contrivance.

2) They are extremely insecure. Having been the center of attention most of their lives, thousands of men pedestal-ing them IRL, tens or hundreds of thousands of men worshiping them on social media, myriad modeling offers, the most elite and influential men across the globe pursuing them--these women understand the "value" of their looks and what kind of doors these looks will open.

Having founded an incredible life on their looks alone, many of them have not had the motivation to improve their intellect, education, character, or personality. Accordingly, they think that any rejection, let down, or noncompliance is strictly due to their having a "bad looks day." Maybe that potato they ate on Tuesday, maybe that missed cardio session, maybe that new eyeliner, maybe that new hair product" are often their contemplating factors in why they are not getting the red carpet treatment from an individual.

Different from other girls, a neg to them is a death sentence. One neg will send them on a tailspin of contemplation for the rest of the date. I find to state just one compliment at beginning of the date such as, "You look great!" works best.

3) These women have strong game, whether that "game" is consciously-derived or not. You will often hear unprovoked stories about the "billionaire" or celebrity who she shot down because he didn't have enough of X. They will often DHV with real stories in an attempt to see where your center is.

For example one model said to me: "My last bf was a hedge fund manager but he relied solely on his family's money. He never built who he was on his own." A direct money-feels throw. I responded with, "eh, sweetheart, there comes a point when money affords you all the luxuries that you need and want, and then you look for more beyond money. His family's affluence does not impress me at all." Notice I negged her character indirectly, not her appearance which would have crushed her. Now this has to be combined with DHVs of your status too so she doesn't think you lead a life of asceticism (they do not desire such LT) having formally renounced her past, but "stories" rooted in your "nobility" not ego. For example, " I pioneered--XYZ--which has helped many across the globe ..."

I know much of this will have little relevance or applicability to some of you, but I wanted to share for those of you who truly desire these type of women.
 
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fastlife

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I'm just relating what I see in any number of healthy, happy, satisfied marriages between a quality man and quality woman.

I agree one should vet for a while...I think at least two years.

And for fast life's question...I'd still find a nightclub owner appealing. It was about him being a fellow business person and entrepreneur. It was never about the cache of "nightclub owner". That's a false assumption. I had doctors, lawyers and other successful professionals to choose from. Nightlife happens to be something I enjoy and always have so that was a natural choice for me. It still would be. I might back my ex one day in a bar or club venture. Time will tell. ;)
Fair enough. Forgive my assumption.

Having dated about nine models in the past 10 months (only seven of those months I was single), let me share a few commonalities about these type of women (the 9/10 club, hereinafter "They"):

1) They do not show their interest overtly like other women. I'd go even further to state that you are not even sure if they are into you until you fvck them.

Seven of the nine gave me the cheek at the end of the date. Their egos are often inflated insofar as for any man to just kiss them relatively fast insults their ego. They think very highly of themselves (although they are extremely insecure which we will discuss next), so to maintain their "high-value" frame they give the ostensible appearance of not being so sexually easy. In a strange way, this makes them appear as greater "quality" as they are not so wanton in their sexual desire--but do not be fooled by this contrivance.

2) They are extremely insecure. Having been the center of attention most of their lives, thousands of men pedestal-ing them IRL, tens or hundreds of thousands of men worshiping them on social media, myriad modeling offers, the most elite and influential men across the globe pursuing them--these women understand the "value" of their looks and what kind of doors these looks will open.

Having founded an incredible life on their looks alone, many of them have not had the motivation to improve their intellect, education, character, or personality. Accordingly, they think that any rejection, let down, or noncompliance is strictly due to their having a "bad looks day." Maybe that potato they ate on Tuesday, maybe that missed cardio session, maybe that new eyeliner, maybe that new hair product" are often their contemplating factors in why they are not getting the red carpet treatment from an individual.

Different from other girls, a neg to them is a death sentence. One neg will send them on a tailspin of contemplation for the rest of the date. I find to state just one compliment at beginning of the date such as, "You look great!" works best.

3) These women have strong game, whether that "game" is consciously-derived or not. You will often hear unprovoked stories about the "billionaire" or celebrity who she shot down because he didn't have enough of X. They will often DHV with real stories in an attempt to see where your center is.

For example one model said to me: "My last bf was a hedge fund manager but he relied solely on his family's money. He never built who he was on his own." A direct money-feels throw. I responded with, "eh, sweetheart, there comes a point when money affords you all the luxuries that you need and want, and then you look for more beyond money. His family's affluence does not impress me at all." Notice I negged her character indirectly, not her appearance which would have crushed her. Now this has to be combined with DHVs of your status too so she doesn't think you lead a life of asceticism (they do not desire such LT) having formally renounced her past, but "stories" rooted in your "nobility" not ego. For example, " I pioneered--XYZ--which has helped many across the globe ..."

I know much of this will have little relevance or applicability to some of you, but I wanted to share for those of you who truly desire these type of women.
Cosign. However, negs are still useful--but they have to be subtle and indirect and indicative of the fact that you're privy to the ins and outs of the world she lives in. Hot girls have stronger frames and if you confront those frames directly, it will be far, far easier to disregard you than it would be to reexamine the lifetime of validation on which her worldviews are based. So while negging her appearance will get you blown out, reframing her past suitors as being lower relative value (like in the example above) implicates her in the process & introduces doubt. Doubt, not certainty, drives hypergamy.

Same goes with the validity of her profession & the value on which that profession is based. So something like, "Oh, you're a model. So we can smoke cigarettes and do coke and sleep in bunk beds ten-to-a-room together" or "There's a really great burger pla--...Sorry. Never mind...Tofu. A really great tofu place" ties her profession to stereotypes & limitations. Same goes with qualifying her: "You know, a lot of models are just stuck in their head--worried about how they look or if they're good enough or whatever--stiff, robotic. I like how you're so genuine/spontaneous/present."--even if she's not those things they introduce higher value behavior for her to aspire towards while implicating her more likely default behavior as lower value. People will live up to the expectations you place on them.

Totally jealous of the access you have to these girls BTW. Might be a biannual occurrence for me--pure luck/volume.
 

SgtSplacker

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Just walk away man, you already lost this one. Anytime you catch yourself making excuses for a woman like you are doing in the original post it's game over. You have absolutely no frame in this one and are destined to loose.
 

resilient

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...creates a constant feeling of instability...for good reason because there isnt any room for error with them anyway.
Probably the same way some guys feel with an iron frame, natural, jacked, money/finances tight, high overall SMV, and abundance in full motion. Odds are stacked on their side so they can screen and drop fast like its not big deal... Women would feel intimidated in their presence and feel they have to qualify hard to keep his attention.
 

BeTheChange

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Cancelled my plans with her in favour of hitting salsa with a few mates on Friday. If she hadn't been so ambiguous in her interest I would have kept my word. Told her she was welcome to come along. See if she bites.

Can't complain too much. It's been fairly effortless sex with an attractive woman who is probably thinking the same thing. Let's put things in perspective.

First date with a HB8 the night after. Got to keep the ball rolling.

@fastlife actually nailed it. It makes no sense to reward negative manipulation (disinterest, flakiness, long waits between responses, etc). All that does is simply reinforces poor behaviour. You might have to accept some of that from the offset, when she doesn't know you yet. But that's not the case here. Even if I did see potential in this chick it would be disrespectful to myself to continue on this basis.
 
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guru1000

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BTC, when I was 28 I had only three 9s under my belt over my lifetime, the rest were 6s, 7s and 8s. Your life with women really begins after 35, after you had the chance to develop your career, social acumen, and status. I have never had the ability to attract 9s and now 10s so easily and consistently in my life. I literally feel like I'm on another planet, where all dreams come into fruition. But make no mistake about it, I had to transcend many challenges to get here, both personally and in business.

I earnestly believe that every DJ can get to this place of transcendence with enough desire and hard work.

All the best.
 

BeTheChange

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Invited her out for some dancing on Friday. Said she was too busy and we'd catch up when she's back from Japan in a few weeks. Assumed she must have been busy until she leaves at the end of the month.

A few days later she makes a facebook status saying she's looking forward to the "Pizza Festival on Sunday". Pizza? PIZZA! This puta is choosing Pizza over me??!!!

I actually had to laugh when I saw that! When you know cheese, tomato and bread rank higher on her list of priorities than you do it's time to fold your hand and cash in your chips.

I won't bother to reach out again unless she does, and given her history I doubt she will. I need to get at least one or two stable plates underneath my belt again before bothering with this one.

Law 36: Disdain Things You Cannot Have: Ignoring Them is the Best Revenge


I'm done.
 
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BeTheChange

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Been grinding hard at work / on the business and a couple of booty calls have kept the need for sex satiated so not really thought too much about this one.

I messaged her when she got back from travelling. Mentioned a few weeks ago that she was performing at a salsa event and told me I should come along. The last couple of times she discussed it I told her I'd go and never turned up. Didn't feel like being a groupie as she was even being coy about sex at the time. Translation: zero return for my attention - not a risk I was willing to take. Now that we've fvcked a few times since I'm not as bothered by the idea.

She brought it up again and asked if I was going. Then when I told her I'd probably make it there she went back to cold fish non-response mode. I'm going with some mates because it's a big club night and I'm half intrigued to see her actually perform. I've invited a few potential plates in my phone book so should be funny.

I'm shagging someone tonight - it's either this Italian NFG chick or someone else.
 
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